Shadow Debt Event Mods Should Be End Of Mission Rewards Instead Of Dropping Mid-Mission

[EinheriarJudith]

All these replies of "But improve the drop chances!" misses the point.  This is like Eyes of Blight.

 

The point is to wear down the Acolytes until they die, not to run them until you get your rare drops and then just stop playing the event.  If you want your rares you have to work for them.  5 waves of defense or 5 minutes of survival or one round of intercept won't kill you.

There seems to be a division. i personally dislike anyone who joins a mission helps kill a acolyte then leaves. at the same time events are supposed to be fun and exciting not filled with grind because while some of us are used to grinding MANY of others don't care for it at all, you witnessed that with the fomorian assault. I'm all for making the mods end of mission rewards but will also agree that this should be less grindy on the ground of the acolytes HP being too high.

[NEONOVUS]

All these replies of "But improve the drop chances!" misses the point.  This is like Eyes of Blight.

 

The point is to wear down the Acolytes until they die, not to run them until you get your rare drops and then just stop playing the event.  If you want your rares you have to work for them.  5 waves of defense or 5 minutes of survival or one round of intercept won't kill you.

And yet, why?

The issue here is there is no reason for me to waste my time.

 

All stuff like 

 

why dont you create penalties for aborting missions?

Says is that they are the ones with the issue that needs fixing, their desire to tell other people how to play.

You guys need to come up with a now reason to why aborts shouldn't occur, not demand that aborters be punished or forced to stick around you.

Seriously, if aborts bother you, just run solo.

They die nice and easy, and if you are knowing how to actually play the game, all tiles can be soloed.

So, is it then that the issue is people who are complaining of aborts can't play and won't abort themselves?

[baron1357]

All these replies of "But improve the drop chances!" misses the point.  This is like Eyes of Blight.

 

The point is to wear down the Acolytes until they die, not to run them until you get your rare drops and then just stop playing the event.  If you want your rares you have to work for them.  5 waves of defense or 5 minutes of survival or one round of intercept won't kill you.

i've been farming this  event since it started on monday and i have yet to see a rare, the drop rates are S#&$. I understand the point of the event however warframe is a loot based game and i couldn't care less if hunhow enslaves the entire solar system, i just want my loot and  because the drop rates are S#&$ i will do what ever is efficient in order to get my loot in an  event that was already grindy and boring to begin with 

[AncienDraak]

All these replies of "But improve the drop chances!" misses the point.  This is like Eyes of Blight.

 

The point is to wear down the Acolytes until they die, not to run them until you get your rare drops and then just stop playing the event.  If you want your rares you have to work for them.  5 waves of defense or 5 minutes of survival or one round of intercept won't kill you.

The simple answer to this is stated above this post.

 

The hard one is more of an issue of time. People that play this game have school, college, or work to go too, we can't always be on to get these rewards, and we really don't know if these rewards will be implemented, or how long we will have to wait. Further more, we have enemy-specific-drops, void, original rare mods, warframe parts from bosses, kubrow mods, corrupted mods, nightmare mods, and so much more mods that require grind, which takes time. So yeah, 5 minutes in a survival  or 5 waves of defense (though admiringly that is MUCH shorter then survival with a good team) is x minutes you could be spending continuing this event grind, something that is supposed to be fun. Honestly if there was no rewards for this most people would probably look at Alad, laugh, and go back to looking whatever they were originally after. Most are here for those rewards, nothing more.

 

So when your reward system is based on time, grind, and 1~2% drop rates, yes, it gets  little excessive. Lord knows what is actually going to kill these things isn't us bloodthirsty tenno, but our bloodthirsty rage induced insanity born form "DROP THE DAMN MOD!"

 

Would be nice if the mod drop for them was just slightly tweaked - find a means to lower the drop rates of mods that commonly drop, while increasing the ones that do not. Once the rare drops, reset the rate after a short while? I don't know, just something better then hoping an already poor RNG system handing a TIMED event.

[EinheriarJudith]

Says is that they are the ones with the issue that needs fixing, their desire to tell other people how to play.

You guys need to come up with a now reason to why aborts shouldn't occur, not demand that aborters be punished or forced to stick around you.

Seriously, if aborts bother you, just run solo.

They die nice and easy, and if you are knowing how to actually play the game, all tiles can be soloed.

So, is it then that the issue is people who are complaining of aborts can't play and won't abort themselves?

excuse me but warframe is an online multiplayer coop shooter with parkour that rewards people who are in groups above all. you dont get to tell people what to do after telling someone else they shouldn't tell people what to do.

[Nurmetya]

It is definitely very turbulent right now with the aborts. Work is in progress for the next Hotfix that will present the Mods on Mission Complete.

 

Sorry but players aborting the mission isn't even half of the problem the main part is that the common mods these guys have are too damn common I can understand having to do some heavy grind work for a rare mod but for having to grind heavily an uncommon mod? That ain't right and its down right cruelty. I lost track of the sheer # of aborts I pulled while solo just trying to get a single stinkin Laser Sight offa Torment and it looks like I'm gonna have to waste more time waiting til the end to see what I get if you go and do this. If you really wanna fix this issue then yeah sure go ahead and set it so you need to see the mission complete screen but up the friggin drop chances of the uncommon and rare mods as well or its gonna piss everyone off even more than it already has.

[nickelshark]

Welp, at least I got all the mods before this incoming change. Looks like I dodged a bullet.

Edited January 27, 2016 by nickelshark

[Spell]

Can we get some kind of tokens (to purchase the item in the shop) instead of random drops? I've quit numerous games due to RNG, don't want to add Warframe to the list.

[TARINunit9]

Not to mention it would solve the issue of an Acolyte not dropping any mod at all.

If Alad V says something about "the hard way" and the Acolyte drops nothing, that's actually a failure state, not a bug. It means you took too long and the Acolyte got bored

 

If Alad V DOESN'T use the words "the hard way", then it is a bug

Edited January 27, 2016 by TARINunit9

[baron1357]

excuse me but warframe is an online multiplayer coop shooter with parkour that rewards people who are in groups above all. you dont get to tell people what to do after telling someone else they shouldn't tell people what to do.

yet everything can be done solo if you're competent enough and know  game meachanics so you could run the  event and not deal with aborters but if you want your hand held you could run with pubs and deal with aborters, the choice is yours, I choose to run it solo because more often than not pubs will only slow me down

[TheOlright]

Welp, I was overhyped, hoping, that this operation gonna be as usual "do some not easy stuff, grind for a day and get good stuff". And as long as my first mod was rare one for shotguns I thoght that this is true, I was soooo wrong... Bodycount, bodycount and bodycount... Grinding operation again, bringing back memories about Gradivus

[Ziegrif]

As a dood who whooped them 62 times solo without a rare drop.

 

I'd rather not waste time by completing the mission to see that what I got was just a common mod I have 10 of.

 

A friend of mine rage quit outta frustration yesterday, being swamped by commons ain't too fun.

 

Least I got 2 Blood Rushes so we've got the essential one for melee for both of us at least.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Ziegrif

[EinheriarJudith]

yet everything can be done solo if you're competent enough and know  game meachanics so you could run the  event and not deal with aborters but if you want your hand held you could run with pubs and deal with aborters, the choice is yours, I choose to run it solo because more often than not pubs will only slow me down

if soloing is your thing then good on you but you dont get to pass judgement on people who like playing with others in a MULTIPLAYER game. there is no hand holding because everyone pulls their weight. ive killed them solo just like stalker and G3 but when it comes to rewards you get more with more people in your squad FACT. 

Edited January 27, 2016 by EinheriarJudith

[--Sensei--]

I think you guys should be asking "why are people aborting missions?" rather than "How can we force people to complete the missions?". I did the abort mission on single tile missions to get the rare mods, i freely admit it. It still took way too long and was not fun at all, and I probably wouldnt have even bothered if i didnt take the time to understand the spawn mechanics, the frankly abysmal and ludicrous drop rates, and then put 2 and 2 together on how to effectively use my time to get what i wanted: The rare mods.

 

This game is loot driven. Fighting the stalker mimics the first time was FUN. Fighting them the 174th time was not. Forcing me to stay to the end of the mission means im not doing anything except capture, deception, and sabotage.

 

Currently, It seems DE is taking a stance against the player base rather than that of co operation. If the loot drops were more like 50% common, 35% uncommon, 15% rare, i'd say its rough but it means i only have to run about 7-8 missions per stalker type for the rare mods. 6 x 8 = 48 missions. Still a lot.

 

Lets break it down further, if some of these datamined drop tables are to be believed ( and i do believe them based on personal experience), a less than 1% drop rate on some rare mods means over 100 mission runs per rare mod you want. So 6 stalkers (lets take out the sixth because he drops all, apparently) so 5 x 100, 500 missions @ 1% drop rate. And if its lower? Eff that, no ones got time for that. That's a straight up middle finger from whoever does loot, straight to the playerbase. Not to mention I do specifically remember Sheldon stating that they would never do a 1%> drop rate in WF, something that has been done before (When's the last time someone got a vermillion storm drop?).

 

A good event doesnt mean it makes me play WF for 400 hours to complete. A good event is enjoyable, even if its short. The second dream was a blast, it didnt need me to run a mission over and over, it was just an experience that i enjoyed, and i felt better about warframe the next day. When you set up this mountain of a loot treadmill it alienates me as a player, and i assume others (some not all, some people will call me a whiner for complaining that i have to grind to get event rewards) feel the same way as I do.

 

This, this so much x100

 

Have a like.

 

Don't force us to complete the mission, especially those that run it solo, rather fix the drop rate to encourage finishing the mission rather than forcing us to grind. The grind is painful.

[WolfTitan]

I agree with the above. Make the drop rates the same for all of the event mods. The grind is the sole reason behind all of the aborts. It keeps players in the event, but it isn't very enjoyable.

[Temragon]

I think you guys should be asking "why are people aborting missions?" rather than "How can we force people to complete the missions?". I did the abort mission on single tile missions to get the rare mods, i freely admit it. It still took way too long and was not fun at all, and I probably wouldnt have even bothered if i didnt take the time to understand the spawn mechanics, the frankly abysmal and ludicrous drop rates, and then put 2 and 2 together on how to effectively use my time to get what i wanted: The rare mods.

 

This game is loot driven. Fighting the stalker mimics the first time was FUN. Fighting them the 174th time was not. Forcing me to stay to the end of the mission means im not doing anything except capture, deception, and sabotage.

 

Currently, It seems DE is taking a stance against the player base rather than that of co operation. If the loot drops were more like 50% common, 35% uncommon, 15% rare, i'd say its rough but it means i only have to run about 7-8 missions per stalker type for the rare mods. 6 x 8 = 48 missions. Still a lot.

 

Lets break it down further, if some of these datamined drop tables are to be believed ( and i do believe them based on personal experience), a less than 1% drop rate on some rare mods means over 100 mission runs per rare mod you want. So 6 stalkers (lets take out the sixth because he drops all, apparently) so 5 x 100, 500 missions @ 1% drop rate. And if its lower? Eff that, no ones got time for that. That's a straight up middle finger from whoever does loot, straight to the playerbase. Not to mention I do specifically remember Sheldon stating that they would never do a 1%> drop rate in WF, something that has been done before (When's the last time someone got a vermillion storm drop?).

 

A good event doesnt mean it makes me play WF for 400 hours to complete. A good event is enjoyable, even if its short. The second dream was a blast, it didnt need me to run a mission over and over, it was just an experience that i enjoyed, and i felt better about warframe the next day. When you set up this mountain of a loot treadmill it alienates me as a player, and i assume others (some not all, some people will call me a whiner for complaining that i have to grind to get event rewards) feel the same way as I do.

 

Pretty much this.

 

The first and second stages of this event were enjoyable. (And the neurodes were a bit dumb, but hey)

 

The third stage of this event is not fun. It's barely tolerable because we can reroll the acolytes. That is, of course, under the assumption that we are pressed to get these mods before the event ends. If that isn't the case and they'll be in normal drop tables once it's over, then you should probably tell us now and avoid this whole issue.

 

Otherwise, locking the rewards to the end of the match is obscene. Don't get me wrong, I'm not for people abandoning pub missions, that sucks. But that would suck worse. We'd be far better off with another complete N acolytes to get each 4-pack of mods, and then a bonus (Chance of cores? whatever.) for each acolyte that encouaged continued pursuit.

[Zagrax]

DE. Please address the issue that is causing behavior like aborts.

 

I've run literally hundreds of these acolytes, and have gotten exactly 1 of the three rares available right now, and piles and piles of hydraulic crosshairs. With how quickly the enemies vanish and must be relocated, doing it normally there is usually only time for 1-2 runs before you sit there and wait doing nothing again, or pluck away at random nodes for the 3/240 something chance you actually find one, and hope one doesn't pop up while you're doing that. 

 

TL;DR:

Too much downtime and uncertainty. 

Drop rates are too low.

Methods for finding them in mission are extremely time consuming depending on which closet they're hiding in.

With this change, doing endless mission nodes they are on will be completely pointless.

Time invested is too large just to get literally nothing or a copy of a common you have 50 of.

 

 

Please consider your history of re-releasing mods (some literally go 2+ years without being re-released) and as such with the information we have, we are forced to farm in the most brutally efficient way possible until we get our copies or run the risk of not having these without paying exorbitant amounts of platinum to traders.

 

When playing an event, should a players mindset be "Drop the mod I want so I can stop playing for a little bit?"

 

Absolutely not. There is no satisfaction or fun in how this event has been setup, any that might have been had was sapped when -someone- decided to set the drop chances at less than 2 percent.

[Sunder]

It is definitely very turbulent right now with the aborts. Work is in progress for the next Hotfix that will present the Mods on Mission Complete.

 

I'm sorry but I think this is a horrible idea with the current drop rates.

With the time I have to play I'd rather not spend 5 minutes per run in survival or defense for 5 rounds only to get some "body count" mods.

Aborting the mission is very annoying, however it's sadly the quickest way to obtain the mods given their drop rates.

That being said I've resorted to solo'ing these missions in efforts to not be a #$&(% to people who join my squad.

 

These acolytes are limited. In both time and mission seeing as how they only appear once.

When they're killed I've ONE more chance of getting the mods I desire from whichever Acolyte drops them all (I'm assuming final boss?)

If the decision is to change the event mod rewards then I'm truly hoping DE has enough sense to just go with the usual method of,

"Kill x acolyte y amount of times to get z reward"

 

Not everyone can sit around all day farming these guys over and over.

[baron1357]

if soloing is your thing then good on you but you dont get to pass judgement on people who like playing with others in a MULTIPLAYER game. there is no hand holding because everyone pulls their weight. ive killed them solo just like stalker and G3 but when it comes to rewards you get more with more people in your squad FACT. 

You can do all that solo and farm more efficiently solo than running with people , your way forces people to stay in squad and  increase the grind also  not everyone pulls their weight in pubs  because in co-op  MULTIPLAYER there's always someone to hold your hand but in solo you actually pull your own weight. im  also not judging anyone based on how they play im just saying all your problems can be  circumvented by playing solo and you dont get to pass judgement on people who are trying to be efficient in an already grindy event 

[MiraiSekai]

The first 2 stages were definitely fun, I like how things are set up.

 

I generally like the event, I'm not against grinding. After all I'm still playing Warframe, ain't I?

 

But man. First gold mod drops after 87 runs? and one of them is already below 40% health?

How do you expect most of the player base to have an actual chance to get all the mods if the rates are so low?

 

When you take in consideration the very low drop rate, PLUS all the random bugs ( so far, I got 2 runs with no drops at all, it's not a big amount, but man, you are definitely mad when it happens.), the objectives that bug out on you ( Sabotage, I'm looking at you.), the unexpected DC, Host migration fest, it's a very, very tiresome event. Especially running maps you have little to no interrest in doing it, beside the event and the mods. If I'm playing in group, why would I stay here until the end if I got my 50th bronze mod?

It serves no purpose to play as a group, even with your friends, since it achieve nothing but makes you lose time. They disappear too fast on a tileset, leaving you very little time to "farm" them if you are properly doing the mission.

 

Also I think the NPC are definitely not a real threat. You can very easily solo them, you don't need end tier god like weapons or a good warframe.

 

I did most of my runs entirely, no matter the mission, though I have to say that I'm aborting the mission if I don't get the mod I want -while playing solo- since a couple of runs. Makes things SO much easier.

 

So yeah. Really cool event, on the paper. But the grinding is a tad too much.

I can't wait on the 3rd part of the event, but I'm afraid it'll be more of the same.

[Reifnir]

It is definitely very turbulent right now with the aborts. Work is in progress for the next Hotfix that will present the Mods on Mission Complete.

 

How about... You know, a more event-like way of obtaining mods? 

As in, kill enough acolytes (and complete the missions you killed in them, I wouldn't mind that), accumulate points, earn every mod this event has to offer? Because right now, it's frustrating to say the least. 

 

People are not aborting because they're evil and want to ruin the game for others. Well, for the most part, anyway.

It's because getting 5 common drops in a row is frustrating. Events shouldn't be like this. Ever. 

[EinheriarJudith]

You can do all that solo and farm more efficiently solo than running with people , your way forces people to stay in squad and  increase the grind also  not everyone pulls their weight in pubs  because in co-op  MULTIPLAYER there's always someone to hold your hand but in solo you actually pull your own weight. im  also not judging anyone based on how they play im just saying all your problems can be  circumvented by playing solo and you dont get to pass judgement on people who are trying to be efficient in an already grindy event 

you seem to be confused about something. my way is always to finish the mission as it is intended. also its more efficient in some cases to be in a full squad ex: people who xp farm on interception(let me see you do it as efficiently solo) people who are farming materials(which require there to be alot of mobs which also requires a full squad since squad capacity = mob count increase) im for both sides and the only unsatisfactory part of this event for me is how long its taking to get to the final stage.

 

you want to know what grind is play lineage 2 or any serious korean MMO. as i stated in my previous comment about the division there are people used to grinding like myself(though it wouldnt hurt to not have it) and people like you who dont care for it and since there are more of you than there are of me DE shouldnt be trying to make anything grindy

Edited January 27, 2016 by EinheriarJudith

[SaucyTuckermax]

It is definitely very turbulent right now with the aborts. Work is in progress for the next Hotfix that will present the Mods on Mission Complete.

Oh...Are you kidding me??? Not that I don't agree with EVERYTHING the thread starter said, but if I have to play a whole 5 rounds of defense to find out if I was rewarded something other then a common mod that drops 99.999999% of the time, then I'm done with this event. you guys can have it back.

[tehgreg]

It is definitely very turbulent right now with the aborts. Work is in progress for the next Hotfix that will present the Mods on Mission Complete.

 

That's terrible news.

 

This change will only make more players frustrated and stop them from playing the event. In the past we used to get all event mods after reaching a certain score but with RNG based rewards like these people just want to get them as quickly as possible.

 

Acolytes pose no threat at all and they are killed in less than 10 seconds so repeating the same missions over and over again gets very boring after few runs.

Edited January 27, 2016 by tehgreg

[SaucyTuckermax]

All these replies of "But improve the drop chances!" misses the point.  This is like Eyes of Blight.

 

The point is to wear down the Acolytes until they die, not to run them until you get your rare drops and then just stop playing the event.  If you want your rares you have to work for them.  5 waves of defense or 5 minutes of survival or one round of intercept won't kill you.

Yes it will. There after alad V anyway. I vote we let them kill him. I know the event is over for me as soon as acolyte mod drops are rewarded at mission completion.