[Spoiler]Ghosts on the moon?

[MaiNeym]

Since the new update 18.5, the moon got some interesting new things to show us. And one of them where these 'ghosts'? I couldn't interect with them in any way (neither could I scan them) They where just floating around and there was a faint but notable sound they make.

 

Anyone know more about them? Are they different beings? Or could they be spirits from the previous occupants of this orokin tower?

Edited March 6, 2016 by MaiNeym

[EmptyDevil]

1 hour ago, BornWithTeeth said:

We know that Ballas, in the flesh, was beautiful, an example of engineered Orokin perfection. A big blue projection ain't quite the same, really.

If Ballas is alive, he might be hidden in a transference-capable pod. I base this speculation on words from Mynki in one of the art team devstreams. Mynki said something like he envisions some of the Orokin becoming detached from their humanity, so they stay in these pods and interact with their surrounding by using them. It sounds like transference but without being able to use powers.

With Mynki's vision in mind and now the knowledge of Transference, it inspired my headcanon about what the highest echelon of Orokin may have used. The following picture is unused concept art by Sean Bigham called "Diplomatic Androids".

Spoiler

I believe it's possible that some of them may have used these when appearing to colonist or other individuals, to give themselves a god-like and beyond human appearance. My only issue is that they were obsessed with symmetry and these aren't symmetrical but, they are concepts after all. It'll be cool to fight an Orokin boss donning something similar.

[Dreadwire]

Maybe its just a glitch

[MaiNeym]

Just now, Dreadwire said:

Maybe its just a glitch

I doubt that, there where 6 of them floating around. In a room I hadn't seen before. The room had lots of these white trees.

[Grobbus]

Looks like an http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Oculyst

[Shoelip]

2 minutes ago, Grobbus said:

Looks like an http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Oculyst

They actually have clearly humanoid hands and feet, and the right hand appears to be clenched like it's holding something, though there's nothing in it.

[Lankander]

i think they are void imprints of past operators, the body proportions look alike and the fact that they are near pods in the moon could mean they were also part of the reservoir

[Shoelip]

1 minute ago, Lankander said:

i think they are void imprints of past operators, the body proportions look alike and the fact that they are near pods in the moon could mean they were also part of the reservoir

I've never seen one near a pod.

[MaiNeym]

1 minute ago, Lankander said:

i think they are void imprints of past operators, the body proportions look alike and the fact that they are near pods in the moon could mean they were also part of the reservoir

yea, I was thinking about that too. And although it's hard to discribe, the sound you could hear sounded childish.

[NightmareT12]

I've seen them on a series of pods on an Orokin Test that sings a choir. Really spooky honestly.

[Shoelip]

Is that the so called 8th test?  The one that drops an empty Rare Container?

[clemza]

There is even a room with a platform that activate a sort of comunication thingy that show a huge head talking.

[Insizer]

1 hour ago, MaiNeym said:

I doubt that, there where 6 of them floating around. In a room I hadn't seen before. The room had lots of these white trees.

So, should we start a meme and name them?

 

[Blakrana]

So far, I've observed the following (names are personally given, not official):

• Groups of 'echoes' floating between White Root pylon things on one of the new tilesets for MD.
• Workers in the 'Opera House/Organ' room (also, the cylinders in that room play part of the Void ambience itself. Very quaint touch).
• Watcher on a Rescue mission, standing in front of the direct entry panel.

Barring the Pylon echoes, every other instance of these echoes just fade away when you approach, then return when you move away from them. The Pylon workers don't seem to notice you're there, and if they do they just plain up don't care. And nothing bothers them either...Even Oculysts ignore them.

Are they non-entities, or do only we see them? Wonder if they'll play a role in future quests...lot of weird work if they're just decoration. Though they do make the Luna tiles extra creepy. 

[NightmareT12]

47 minutes ago, clemza said:

There is even a room with a platform that activate a sort of comunication thingy that show a huge head talking.

What? That surely might be Ballas (or its ghost anyway). Where did you find that?

7 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

So far, I've observed the following (names are personally given, not official):

• Groups of 'echoes' floating between White Root pylon things on one of the new tilesets for MD.
• Workers in the 'Opera House/Organ' room (also, the cylinders in that room play part of the Void ambience itself. Very quaint touch).
• Watcher on a Rescue mission, standing in front of the direct entry panel.

Barring the Pylon echoes, every other instance of these echoes just fade away when you approach, then return when you move away from them. The Pylon workers don't seem to notice you're there, and if they do they just plain up don't care. And nothing bothers them either...Even Oculysts ignore them.

Are they non-entities, or do only we see them? Wonder if they'll play a role in future quests...lot of weird work if they're just decoration. Though they do make the Luna tiles extra creepy. 

They're surely echoes of the past. We see them, but because the Tenno *might* be remembering something.

Edited March 6, 2016 by NightmareT12

[clemza]

A new room on Spy mission on Moon.

It remind me of that

[Misgenesis]

My guess is theyre Tenno spirits. Wouldnt surprise me if something like this happened due to their contact with the void.

Bunch of them were floating around 'open' cryopods, observing them.

[Blakrana]

2 minutes ago, NightmareT12 said:

What? That surely might be Ballas (or its ghost anyway). Where did you find that?

They're surely echoes of the past. We see them, but because the Tenno *might* be remembering something.

RE: Possible Ballas, here is a thread with a picture.

As for the Echoes...maybe. Right now, here's the best stuff can hazard as to why they are around at all:

• Void responds to psychic elements: this is supported by Transference, the Mirage Quest, Inaros Quest (as Baro notes he holds the Tenno responsible for hearing the voices at all) and of course, the Margulis and Ballas dialogue in Second Dream.
• The Void does not necessarily observe Time and Space as relativity would suggest: This is suggested by the Spy tiles and these phantoms. Alternatively the Void isn't so much as defying time and space conventions, but these continuity errors are actually this 'Echo' phenomenom on a massive scale. It's not time travel and more...stepping through the mirror, if you will, to a different perspective of that same place.
• The Void is hostile to anything not appropriately shielded.
• The Void has a distinct energy signature (Tenno energy residue), Void related stealth being tracked by 'Void Echoes'

Naturally, this is conjecture, but it at least seems consistent with what we've come to understand of the Void so far. For now, just need more information. I sincerely hope these aren't the fates of the dead...that's hardly an existence I'd find appealing, damned forever as some abstract apparition of the Void...

[Xolot]

I found the judgement place, but I couldn't see any face, probably because of my graphic settings that are on low could only see a plain blue energy square , maybe i haven't found any ghost because of the graphics too?

[BETAOPTICS]

Spoiler

http://imgur.com/oxeanCJ, http://imgur.com/hNfDcJs, http://imgur.com/tm2ucBu

In the spoiler tags there is are two ghosts that were sitting right next to that crate. Basically how I activated it was trough a puzzle where I had to activate console, listen or observe the order in which sound plates activated and then repeat the tune that it sang. Once done, I heard a noise and found out one crate there and one on top of that structure but neither dropped any loot one broken. Go figure what that is all about.

[BornWithTeeth]

We know that Ballas, in the flesh, was beautiful, an example of engineered Orokin perfection. A big blue projection ain't quite the same, really.

[NightmareT12]

59 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

We know that Ballas, in the flesh, was beautiful, an example of engineered Orokin perfection. A big blue projection ain't quite the same, really.

Actually...

 

Everyone might remember this image, which somehow didn't make it into the Second Dream. Well, there it is.

I'm starting to think all we're seeing are actually Orokin and the Moon was the Empire's palace, so as to speak. The center of operations, government, name what you wish.

I also got a room in which a projection of the Earth was on the ceilling. And then there's that one full of Orokin banners that doesn't have anything special but a hole in the ground, that leads to an endless void.

[Blakrana]

8 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said:

If Ballas is alive, he might be hidden in a transference-capable pod. I base this speculation on words from Mynki in one of the art team devstreams. Mynki said something like he envisions some of the Orokin becoming detached from their humanity, so they stay in these pods and interact with their surrounding by using them. It sounds like transference but without being able to use powers.

With Mynki's vision in mind and now the knowledge of Transference, it inspired my headcanon about what the highest echelon of Orokin may have used. The following picture is unused concept art by Sean Bigham called "Diplomatic Androids".

  Hide contents

I believe it's possible that some of them may have used these when appearing to colonist or other individuals, to give themselves a god-like and beyond human appearance. My only issue is that they were obsessed with symmetry and these aren't symmetrical but, they are concepts after all. It'll be cool to fight an Orokin boss donning something similar.

Now that line about the Orokin being 'hands off'...

Is that Margulis' Apostasy for which she was executed? Not just the fact she resisted the Orokin 'they're not human anymore' towards the Tenno, but she basically created a situation which put these children and ultimately lower class individuals (Not human, no rights...if that even meant anything to the Orokin any more) to be in the same powerful position as the Orokin Executor's, removed from the human condition in some manner.

Of course. The Orokin Executor comments we've had for Ballas and the like seems to imply a seemingly conventional human form...puts an interesting twist if they're a bunch of secret post-humans using that technology to evade the usual concerns of power. Also explains the symmetry obsession; if you're making a body, the aesthetic impulse to artistic symmetry makes sense, whilst hitting uncanny valley for the natural human form as, really, we're not symmetrical creatures.

And well...if the Orokin really were using some kind of Transference parallel...they really hate the Tenno as they'd also gotten incredible personal power out of it through the Void, something that so far, the Orokin haven't been demonstrated to possess beyond their raw tyrannical 'We say who lives or dies' liberties.

Liking the designs there, all the same. Certainly points my mind to the more ornate Synths you get in Eclipse Phase, the Galatea specifically. (I apologise for referencing Eclipse Phase yet again but hey...if a comparison works...)

Still. If it's an Orokin face waiting for a deserved pummelling, I eagerly anticipate the opportunity such a scenario presents~

[EmptyDevil]

33 minutes ago, Blakrana said:

Now that line about the Orokin being 'hands off'...

Is that Margulis' Apostasy for which she was executed? Not just the fact she resisted the Orokin 'they're not human anymore' towards the Tenno, but she basically created a situation which put these children and ultimately lower class individuals (Not human, no rights...if that even meant anything to the Orokin any more) to be in the same powerful position as the Orokin Executor's, removed from the human condition in some manner.

Of course. The Orokin Executor comments we've had for Ballas and the like seems to imply a seemingly conventional human form...puts an interesting twist if they're a bunch of secret post-humans using that technology to evade the usual concerns of power. Also explains the symmetry obsession; if you're making a body, the aesthetic impulse to artistic symmetry makes sense, whilst hitting uncanny valley for the natural human form as, really, we're not symmetrical creatures.

And well...if the Orokin really were using some kind of Transference parallel...they really hate the Tenno as they'd also gotten incredible personal power out of it through the Void, something that so far, the Orokin haven't been demonstrated to possess beyond their raw tyrannical 'We say who lives or dies' liberties.

Liking the designs there, all the same. Certainly points my mind to the more ornate Synths you get in Eclipse Phase, the Galatea specifically. (I apologise for referencing Eclipse Phase yet again but hey...if a comparison works...)

Still. If it's an Orokin face waiting for a deserved pummelling, I eagerly anticipate the opportunity such a scenario presents~

That is a very interesting take on why Margulis was murdered. 

I can definitely imagine the Orokin using it to avoid power issues. It could be possible the higher ups 'wore' something similar when approaching Grineer as well? I always thought it was strange in the very first synthesis imprint, that the Grineer being attacked by an unknown entity first questions if it's Orokin but recalls the Orokin being gold instead(Disregarding Grineer intellect debate for sake of musing). He might have met or seen an Orokin utilizing something similar at some point.

The Orokin may have definitely took a blow to their ego with the Tenno becoming god-like in power and form, if this headcanon has some truth.

I would love to personally beat down an Orokin as well.

[Blakrana]

Just now, EmptyDevil said:

That is a very interesting take on why Margulis was murdered. 

I can definitely imagine the Orokin using it to avoid power issues. It could be possible the higher ups 'wore' something similar when approaching Grineer as well? I always thought it was strange in the very first synthesis imprint, that the Grineer being attacked by an unknown entity first questions if it's Orokin but recalls the Orokin being gold instead(Disregarding Grineer intellect debate for sake of musing). He might have met or seen an Orokin utilizing something similar at some point.

The Orokin may have definitely took a blow to their ego with the Tenno becoming god-like in power and form, if this headcanon has some truth.

I would love to personally beat down an Orokin as well.

Well, Apostasy is the "abandonment or renunciation of a religious or political belief or principle" according to Google. All we know of Margulis' actions at this point is that she fought for Tenno being treated with basic human decency and helped with the whole 'Void' thing that afflicted them. It seems...odd to think resisting the Orokin aims to dispose the Tenno (till they found a use for them later on in twisted irony) was enough for that word to apply.

Look at it as scratching a hidden secret...well...Margulis becomes a dangerous political risk, yet likely oblivious of it.

Still...as you say, it seems suitably Orokin (IE Arrogant to the n^th degree) to use some kind of stylised shell (much like Warframes are described) to intimidate their vassals. Just a question of how they did it without making the common people get suspicious...though that assumes the civilians would have had the power to do anything about it. Void-vaporisation ahoy and all that, potentially. Or that the shells used for commoners or Grineer would be the same ones.

If what we've got in theory here is at all accurate...We're looking at some significant impacts if that truth ever got out. Could be that the whole affair at Terminus was the Tenno waiting for that one chance to strike the Executors in their true, natural bodies. Although then again...metaphorical how it is likely meant...Stalker's description of them as 'Breathless'...changes a bit with this in mind. Would be an interesting if it was a) Destroy the surrogate bodies and b) strike the Executors when they make a break from their safe spots. I sincerely doubt the Tenno rebellion wasn't especially meticulous and thorough if that's how it played out. Izvara (or however it's spelt) Syandana is even noting how there were Tenno bodyguards for the Executors. What's the saying?

Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.

Apologies. A lot of conjecture here sadly, but does make for a very interesting 'what if' or 'assuming that' scenario of possible explanations.

[NovusNova]

Moved to Players Helping Players subforum.