Why Nidus Prime will NEVER be a thing

[Chewarette]

You didn't give us a valid reason for Nidus Prime to have never existed.

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

2 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

And Nidus was perfect for them aswell, because they could further study the Infested.
It's just an assumption the Orokin would not have liked Nidus. (If we can even call it liking)

The Orokin could already grow entire bodies out of Infestation and kept it as a potted plant. The Orokin wouldn't like the way he looks, they've probably executed people for pettier things.

1 minute ago, Myscho said:

First thing first - we dont even know who is Helminth and what is his connection to Orokin era, Margulis or Ballas. Maybe there is some deep mystery which allow work Infested strain Nidus kind with Orokin tech, because in every warframe is infested strain, but on Nidus is alot more

Helminth is probably the janitor/ life support/ other systems on board the Orbiter. While Ordis is the intelligence, the brain, Helminth is what actually pumps the air, maintains the Warframes, etc.

[redeyedtreefrog]

nidus prime WILL exist. 

Sources cited: DE (every warframe will eventually recieve a primed version)

Even if nidus WAS made by the corpus (not even alad V!) it would recieve a prime based on the same lore that helios did: the corpus followed a battered, beaten, half-corrupted, half-reconstructed blueprint with the materials that they had on hand, to create something that, miracle of miracles, still worked, and still performed its main function properly.

And let's face it. What reason would any corpus, discounting alad V, have to create a warframe from scratch? who would even have the KNOWLEDGE (discounting alad V) to even attempt to do that? No. Chances are, the myconians found this blueprint as an artifact, and knew it was signifigant. They clearly never actually built a nidus, because they have no way of controlling it, and if they did build a nidus, realizing it was just a really expensive statue for them (or worse, an unbound golem of writhing infestation), they would have definitely given the whole thing to the tenno as a reward for completing the quest. It's questionable as to whether they even knew it was a warframe, but I'd assume they did.

[Dark_Chroma_Prime]

Till nidus prime come it will take about 2-3 years, until this there will be sure lore corrections so nidus can be primed

[TrickshotMcGee]

34 minutes ago, (PS4)Ch1b1N1njaGam1ng said:

Nidus was made after the events of The Glast Gambit

No he wasn't lmao

There hasn't been ANYONE who's been able to replicate Orokin Tech, let alone create a new Warframe. That'd be like saying Jordas made Atlas, or Baro created Inaros. It's utterly wrong. I don't think you're nearly as much of a loreax as you think you are, certainly not if you think Ergo Glast or the Myconians made Nidus. Especially considering that using such logic would dictate that every boss that drops Warframe parts was the one who created said Warframe, and we know that isn't true.

Just because the Myconians were in possession of the BP does NOT mean they made it. 

 

And judging by the fact that you don't actually know how the Warframes work, I'd say you either haven't finished the main cinematic quests, or simply didn't pay attention when you did. 

22 minutes ago, WhiteMarker said:

Maybe this Myconian-thing was made from a blueprint the Orokin left? Maybe there was a Nidus when the Orokin were still around.

This is exactly what is implied. Myconians found it and kept it for god knows how long (it's implied that their culture has had it for MANY generations), and then gave it to you for saving their people and the girl, Neewa, which effectively saved their entire culture. 

Edited June 8, 2017 by TrickshotMcGee

[KirukaChan]

Ha ha ha oh wow.

DE caring more about lore than money?

Yeah, no. Nidus will absolutely be Primed.

[Wrum]

you could spin nidus prime as the original prototype that all frames were built off of( and yes i know excal prime was the first warframe but nidus prime would be a prototype for excal prime or a failed attempt) or make nidus prime a mutation due to exposure to certain orokin tech so nidus prime would be a next step instead of a precursor like the other primes.

[Blakrana]

22 minutes ago, ScorpDK said:

Let's talk once Zephyr gets her turn. Because she was literally created by the Lotus after we got Oxium from the Corpus.

Argument is likely that Zephyr class Warframes existed during the Orokin era, but without a modern source of Oxium then R&D of decent approximations of Zephyr remained elusive. Once the Corpus cracked the Oxium question, the rest essentially followed suit once it could be analysed.

Doesn't contradict anything, at most re-contextualises what she meant by 'new research'; it'd have been more appropriate to say reverse engineering, but that isn't as punchy. And may have begged questions over if she had access to a Prime or so on.

[NeithanDiniem]

There is no reason at all for there not to be a prime version. Ergo Glast did not create Nidus, nor was Nidus a natural evolution of the infested. Nidus was created, like all Warframes were, by the Orokin. Ergo Glast gave us the artifact, he did not create the artifact. Nothing at all even suggests that Nidus was created after or that he was not around before the Glast Gambit.

Edited June 8, 2017 by NeithanDiniem

[NeithanDiniem]

35 minutes ago, ScorpDK said:

Let's talk once Zephyr gets her turn. Because she was literally created by the Lotus after we got Oxium from the Corpus.

Will she get a Prime? Wouldn't make sense lore-wise... she could be the first official Umbra, we'll have to wait and see.

You didn't pay attention to the Operation Oxium Espionage event text when they introduced Oxium to the game:

Tenno,

Weeks ago we received intel about a Corpus raid on a little-known independent research facility near Eris. The Corpus made off with a scientific jackpot, the formulation of a rediscovered experimental Orokin alloy called Oxium. This lighter than air alloy has already been deployed in a new drone dubbed the Oxium Osprey which forgoes its support role in favor of dynamic attacks.

The Orokin had Oxium, the Corpus only rediscovered and stole it.

[(PSN)theelix]

Not substantiated: There's no proof Nidus isn't just the eventual mutation of another frame. 

Valkyr was just like Nidus, discovered through some random boss who we assumed "made" them. She got primed, and was reverted to her "original" skin. Through the lore, it should dictate that her powers make no sense. 

Possibility 1. The torture changed her Warframe's powers to make them what they are currently, which means the prime shouldn't have them.  

Possibility 2. Her powers have always been this, and both the snippet of lore on the original Valkyr's Codex entry and the torture itself was essentially entirely pointless and adds no substance besides a reason for her skin.

 

TL;DR it doesn't matter, Nidus Prime already exists through the existence of Nidus himself, meaning this entire thread is nonfactual. 

[Trichouette]

58 minutes ago, (PS4)Ch1b1N1njaGam1ng said:

The reason why is: It wont make sense in the lore.

It made no sense to have valkyr prime either, and DE said "screw that" and released her.

I still think nidus prime won't ever exist, but that's only because I think "warframe will be dead before it's his turn to be primed"

[Stonehenge]

57 minutes ago, (PS4)Ch1b1N1njaGam1ng said:

We all love primes. Trinity Prime, Frost Prime, Valkyr Prime and SO much more! However people are more wanting of Nidus to be a prime frame, however I will explain why that will NOT happen.

 

The reason why is: It wont make sense in the lore.

Valkyr would like to speak to you pal.

 

 

[NeithanDiniem]

Just now, Stonehenge said:

Valkyr would like to speak to you pal.

Hers makes sense if people stop going off of fan speculation as fact about her. Nidus also makes sense if people again pay attention to what is actually said about him in the game.

[(PSN)Ch1b1N1njaGam1ng]

Just now, Stonehenge said:

Valkyr would like to speak to you pal.

 

 

Valkyr was already a frame in the Orokin era. She was kidnapped and experimented on by Alad V for his Zanuka Project.

[Stonehenge]

4 minutes ago, NeithanDiniem said:

Hers makes sense if people stop going off of fan speculation as fact about her. Nidus also makes sense if people again pay attention to what is actually said about him in the game.

Nope. The way she is and her skills in prime don't make sense, at all, if you read what is written in vanilla lore and even deluxe description. All of this is just a clusterball of nonsense. Period, thank you. It's not fanboyism, raging or anything, it's just logic vs bad faith.

As for Nidus, dont' know his lore, will read it again when i craft him.

Edited June 8, 2017 by Stonehenge

[NeithanDiniem]

Just now, Stonehenge said:

Nope. They way she is and her skills in prime don't make sense, at all, if you read what is written in vanilla lore and even deluxe description. All of this is just a clusterball of nonsense. Period, thank you. It's not fanboyism, raging or anything, it's just logic vs bad faith.

No, its people assuming that her skills needed to change when Alad V experimented on her. Literally all that is said that is causing this was that Alad V's experiments left her " scarred, angry and frighteningly adept at killing." Nothing there even alludes to her skills changing or being different than they were before the experimentation. Her deluxe skin is purely descriptive that "Before Alad V, before the experiments, there was the Gersemi Valkyr." Thats it. Nothing at all for anyone to use as a means of justifying that her skills changed or that it doesn't make sense. She was still Valkyr, exactly as how Frost is still Frost even though he is using his deluxe skin. He wasn't a different Warframe, neither was she with her Gersemi skin. Gersemi is the name of the skin, thats it. Its the skin of her non-primed form. She is still Valkyr. It is in fact fanboyism that caused the problem and everyone else jumped on the bandwagon because they didn't want to sit down and think about it.

[(PSN)KawaiiOctopi]

Valkyr and Helios say hi ...

[NeithanDiniem]

1 minute ago, (PS4)VoodooRose78 said:

Valkyr and Helios say hi ...

As explained above, Valkyr has no reason why to not have a prime. Helios? Really now? The Corpus take Orokin tech and recreate it, they even have Moas based off of Orokin tech, and Helios doesn't make sense to you?

[(PSN)KawaiiOctopi]

4 minutes ago, NeithanDiniem said:

As explained above, Valkyr has no reason why to not have a prime. Helios? Really now? The Corpus take Orokin tech and recreate it, they even have Moas based off of Orokin tech, and Helios doesn't make sense to you?

Just going by wiki and what it states on Helios

But the lore seems all over the place on certain things to me its rather hard for me to follow

[Birdframe_Prime]

Alright alright alright.

Calm down. There's a lot of argument here, and a lot of false conjecture going around.

So. DE have stated, as in we can actually go back and find it on their recorded streams, that all frames can be Primed. The order of that is up for debate, but they all can. There are no 'new' warframes, everything we have is just bad copies of the original blueprints, which we now find by opening relics using reactant.

Apparently the reason we are given new frames is simply because we are progressing through the current 'timeline' and each quest or find reveals more and more of the Orokin era tech. A fair point to consider is that the Orokin experimented quite a long way as they found out what Void energy could do when run through the right frameworks. Excal was the first, a simple, clean frame that has one purpose, combat, and the means to fulfil it. As time for the Orokin went on, more and more refined and experimental frames were created, working with elements like fire and water, the difference between 'sound' and 'music' and 'air', frames that had unique and different purposes depending on what their creators wanted.

But enough of the story-crafting there.

Let's go over things as it's actually been written in the quests and codex:

Nidus' blueprint was taken from the Myconian Old War Relic (as in, relic of the old war, the Orokin era). Quite apart from that the orbiter has a room you can only enter using Nidus or a frame infected with his strain of mutation, the Orbiter was around before the fall of the Orokin. Nidus was created before the fall of the Orokin and therefore must have a Prime variant.

Valkyr (and I'm looking at a lot of people here); why do you think that regular Valkyr looks the way she does? She was a warframe before Alad V took her apart to find out how she ticked. The statement in the codex is: 'Forged in the labs of the Zanuka project, the original Valkyr was subject to cruel experiments, leaving her scarred, angry and frighteningly adept at killing.' meaning there was an original Valkyr that he tormented, likely with a Tenno pilot too, and this is why she looks the way she does. A lot of people will point at the Gersemi premium skin, and say 'this is what she looked like before' to which I will respond with; the Codex says 'Before Alad V, before the experiments, there was the Gersemi Valkyr.' This only implies that this variant of Valkyr existed too, it does not state that this is what the original Valkyr looked like. The Prime variant is her original look, just like Oberon's fat neck is how he looked, despite his Feyarch variant, the premium skins are variants too, not the originals.

Zephyr did not come about because of Oxium from the Corpus, how is that even a thing? Oxium was not invented by the Corpus.

And for people that don't understand what the Sentinels are, here, from the Memory Fragments: 'On the border of chartered space, an enclave of small, strange, seemingly intelligent creatures was discovered by Tenno explorers. They are mechanical entities, almost organic in appearance, with a precarious resemblance to the fearsome Sentients that had decimated human civilization. However, these creatures showed no signs of aggression, and they immediately began carrying out helpful tasks in peculiar alliance with the Tenno.' Sentinels are actually tiny sentient-alike robots from possibly even before the Orokin era, since Tenno explorers found them during that time, which were given armour and precepts by the Orokin, which is why Prime variants can exist of them.

There. Lore.

Anyone with questions?

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

6 hours ago, (PS4)theelix said:

Possibility 2. Her powers have always been this, and both the snippet of lore on the original Valkyr's Codex entry and the torture itself was essentially entirely pointless and adds no substance besides a reason for her skin.

That's called exposition. Plus Valkyr's base skin is her after being skinned alive. It's implied that the original died after being experimented on and that the only blueprints of her aside from the lost Orokin ones for the Prime where the notes Salad V took

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

6 hours ago, Wrum said:

you could spin nidus prime as the original prototype that all frames were built off of( and yes i know excal prime was the first warframe but nidus prime would be a prototype for excal prime or a failed attempt) or make nidus prime a mutation due to exposure to certain orokin tech so nidus prime would be a next step instead of a precursor like the other primes.

Exactly what I'm saying. Excalibur is the first working Warframe, Nidus is just a prototype gone wrong, or maybe they were still adjusting how much Infestation to put onto the robotic skeletons they'd made.

6 hours ago, Blakrana said:

Argument is likely that Zephyr class Warframes existed during the Orokin era, but without a modern source of Oxium then R&D of decent approximations of Zephyr remained elusive. Once the Corpus cracked the Oxium question, the rest essentially followed suit once it could be analysed.

Doesn't contradict anything, at most re-contextualises what she meant by 'new research'; it'd have been more appropriate to say reverse engineering, but that isn't as punchy. And may have begged questions over if she had access to a Prime or so on.

Except the Orokin ruled the entire system and easily could have access to Oxium, which is said they even made

[peterc3]

Fact: All frames can/will be primed. As DE makes the game, this is rather incontrovertible.

It isn't DE's fault people are unimaginative and cannot read into the use of words like forged and think Valkyr Prime was some heinous retcon. Righteous fury becomes uncontained rage, Valkyr Prime -> Gersemi -> Valkyr, by way of Alad V and his extreme interest in how frames tick.

Myconians find degraded plans of one of the Orokin's more interesting designs for a warframe. No mention of this being the "only" copy and nothing saying that any Prime blueprints have been destroyed and are unobtainable.

And the Sentinels are friendly bits of Sentient-type beings that, while they look like they are Grineer/Corpus/Infested/etc, their appearance does not inform their ability to be Primed or not.

[Diarmut]

Nidus was made originally from the infestation that all warframes are made of, just unleashed in a more virulent form and able to grow, the Grineer queens refer to warframes as "Infested puppets" of the Tenno, so yes Nidus can be primed. Nidus, normal nidus is based on the older Nidus Prime model, as all base warframes are because the Prime actually precedes the normal version. Nidus can be primed because he is, and was, as all warframes are, an Orokin creation, that's also why Valkyr prime can exist.