Login Rewards kind of unattainable for new players

[Tesseract7777]

2 minutes ago, Malakam said:

They can always buy these mods with plat if they're desperate and want to fork out the money for plat. otherwise they can wait like the rest of us.

Login reward mods are, unfortunately, not tradeable. 

I believe Primed Fury was at first, and DE quickly put a stop to that. 

Mainly because people with alt accounts would farm extras to sell (very much against the ToS, but DE didn't want people to even have the option to try to circumvent those rules) to people who didn't want to wait for login reward -- as people didn't want to trade their only copy they could obtain anyways. 

 

Edited July 25, 2017 by Tesseract7777

[eksby]

7 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

I understand some people have that collectors mentality, but at least they will be able to get it eventually, unlike stuff like founders stuff which is locked from them forever. No non-founder will ever be able to collect everything mastery or mod related for that reason. 

But yeah, a login reward frame? I might honestly quit. 

Edit: Personally I think veterans should have been given some initial leg up into the new login rewards system, but for some reason DE's decision at the time was to make everyone start on a level playing field. I'm probably close to where you are, I'm at around day 375 I think, and while I haven't been playing as long as you have, as you have a founders badge, I had been playing for what felt like a very long time before the new login rewards system -- although I have never bothered to go check when my actual start date was. 

I guess, but I feel like the system can be better. (About founders items though, I kind of wish they could release Excal Prime and all that to everyone...it really is too bad they said they will never rerelease them. I'm not a fan of exclusivity, especially since pretty much everything else in the game is something everyone can get.)

I kind of actually like that they leveled the playing field, but I'm just not a fan of how they lock the things they do behind the login milestones. Exclusive sigils or something is fine with me, but weapons and primed mods? Weapons count for mastery, and sometimes those primed mods are kind of nice. 

3 minutes ago, NinthAria said:

This is gonna sound harsh, but you just described almost every reward mechanic in the game. First mission bonuses, sorties, crafting times, and even just general gameplay--there's very little that a daily player won't get before a less frequent player. That's just the way of things.

I don't know what other games you've been playing, but just because a lot of games have bad reward mechanics doesn't make it good. That's like saying "smoking is fine, because everyone does it." GW2 has a pretty good login system in place there, they have a 28 day repeat cycle (if I'm remembering correctly).

It's not "just the way of things," and that shouldn't be an excuse for having a poor login system anyway.

[dmantacos]

Believe me i understand the collector mentality. I am MR 23 and have been playing as long as the game has been out. I have collected every single arcane helmet in the game and I have close to 10 pyrana rivens alone. People in Warframe like to get the best stuff, after all, that is a main point of the game. I would argue that there is a severe difference between making login rewards available before crazy amounts of daily logins. If they made founders stuff, arcane helmets, primed chamber etc. available again, they would SEVERELY hurt the in game economy and devalue tons and tons of money/time collector have put into the game; however, Items like primed mods from login rewards are not even tradable anyways. Neither are the weapons. Making these Items available within say 2 months or 3 months time of constant gameplay would not hurt the ingame economy in any way at all. They are not tradeable so people who already have the items wouldn't have spent tons of plat getting them therefore a new system would not undercut anybodies hard work or money spent. 

[dmantacos]

I also get the mindset of people who think "well ive logged in 500 days, why should other people get the same stuff as i do???" This already happened with the very inception of the new login system. People like me had already played for literally years and thousands of hours and now we are all all of the sudden on the same level with people who made their accounts the same day. In game mechanics change constantly, we as a community have to accept change even if it means we wont have advantages under the old system" It helps the game grow and more players means more reason for DE to keep putting out cool S#&$ like POE. We all win in the end :) Anyways thats my soapbox let the poll speak for itself

Edited July 25, 2017 by dmantacos

[Eric1738]

It seems current login reward stops at the 600-day milestone. I would say let future reward be cosmetics and boosters only. 600 days of  login for the full benefit is already pretty huge imo.

[Legion-Shields]

"High Mastery-locked content is kind of unattainable for new players"

Edited July 25, 2017 by Legion-Shields

[Tesseract7777]

25 minutes ago, Eric1738 said:

It seems current login reward stops at the 600-day milestone. I would say let future reward be cosmetics and boosters only. 600 days of  login for the full benefit is already pretty huge imo.

I agree. From this point forth it should be cosmetics and boosters, and stuff that you can repeatedly buy from the shop (like maybe vets would appreciate a pack of forma's for 50 increment rewards and a booster, instead of a sigil they will never use, and the seemingly random potatot's or exilus adapters we get now). 100 increment rewards could be sundial themed cosmetics, like syandanas and armor pieces. 

Edited July 25, 2017 by Tesseract7777

[K0bra]

Till today everyone in this game lived(some play the game more than 4 years) without Primed Shred so can a new player do this for 2 years also.

There is absolutely no problem.

PS: You forget that EVERYONE had to log in for such long time to get Primed Shred.They didnt earn it with no efford.Its a fair system because everyone started at the same point only diffrence is the date.

Edited July 25, 2017 by K0bra

[Zanchak]

7 minutes ago, K0bra said:

Till today everyone in this game lived(some play the game more than 4 years) without Primed Shred so can a new player do this for 2 years also.

There is absolutely no problem.

This.. ^

Why do people need everything right now, just because someone else has it, or just because it exists. "Someone else" will have consistently played something they love playing and be rewarded at the end of that long journey (it could be any number of the mods in login tables, not just the latest).

It's getting really old newer people wanting everything right now "just because" tbh. Wanting to change things to make life easier (for themselves, always)

Earn it like everyone else does. Pretty much everything is spoon fed to new players now.

[Tachibana_Hibiki]

14 minutes ago, Zanchak said:

This.. ^

Why do people need everything right now, just because someone else has it, or just because it exists. "Someone else" will have consistently played something they love playing and be rewarded at the end of that long journey (it could be any number of the mods in login tables, not just the latest).

It's getting really old newer people wanting everything right now "just because" tbh. Wanting to change things to make life easier (for themselves, always)

Earn it like everyone else does. Pretty much everything is spoon fed to new players now.

I was going to make a bad joke about proud citizen of certain northern american country and demanding their right to have everything right now, but it sounded a bit rude, so I won't. 

[Lysander26]

As a Founder who's taken sometime off, and came back to a days logged in counter at zero, I can definitely feel the frustration of having to log on consistently for 2 or 3 years to 'catch up' with what people have now. And even then, I will always be 600 days behind the curve, since there will be more "Primed Shreds" in the Future.

My solution would be to have a max possible the absolute number of days since implementation, then have some catch up mechanism for devoted, but newer players, such as "Log in for a Week straight, get an extra Week added to your count" and/or "Log in for a Month Straight, get an extra Month added to your count."

Or maybe have it tied to Mastery Rank, Starting at MR 11, you get an extra part of a day added to your count every time you log in, at MR 11, you'd get 1.1 days, MR21 players get 2.1 days for every they log in at, etc. That way, still a grind, a long, soul-crushing, "why don't I quit this stupid game" grind, but there would be a light at the end of the tunnel.

[Zanchak]

3 minutes ago, Tachibana_Hibiki said:

I was going to make a bad joke about proud citizen of certain northern american country and demanding their right to have everything right now, but it sounded a bit rude, so I won't. 

I mean, Id just say north of the equator lately

[Zanchak]

2 minutes ago, Lysander26 said:

As a Founder who's taken sometime off, and came back to a days logged in counter at zero, I can definitely feel the frustration of having to log on consistently for 2 or 3 years to 'catch up' with what people have now. And even then, I will always be 600 days behind the curve, since there will be more "Primed Shreds" in the Future.

My solution would be to have a max possible the absolute number of days since implementation, then have some catch up mechanism for devoted, but newer players, such as "Log in for a Week straight, get an extra Week added to your count" and/or "Log in for a Month Straight, get an extra Month added to your count."

Or maybe have it tied to Mastery Rank, Starting at MR 11, you get an extra part of a day added to your count every time you log in, at MR 11, you'd get 1.1 days, MR21 players get 2.1 days for every they log in at, etc. That way, still a grind, a long, soul-crushing, "why don't I quit this stupid game" grind, but there would be a light at the end of the tunnel.

Time played (prior) should definitely be considered.. my disagreement is simply with anyone who has put little hours in, wanting to fast track the process.

*By time played I should clarify that I mean "in-mission" time

Edited July 25, 2017 by Zanchak
cause Im slo

[Lysander26]

2 minutes ago, Zanchak said:

Time played (prior) should definitely be considered.. my disagreement is simply with anyone who has put little hours in, wanting to fast track the process.

At this point, its probably too late for that, and a corner case anyways. I've made my peace with it. Assuming my system (+.1 Day per MR more than 10), it would still be 250 days at Max MR atm to get to "even" assuming its implemented today. That's not "little hours," but it is hope.

[Zanchak]

4 minutes ago, Lysander26 said:

At this point, its probably too late for that, and a corner case anyways. I've made my peace with it. Assuming my system (+.1 Day per MR more than 10), it would still be 250 days at Max MR atm to get to "even" assuming its implemented today. That's not "little hours," but it is hope.

Hope is never a bad thing

[Sziklamester]

I partly agree with both sides with on these rewards are additional but once the players know what they could get they will be just bored or frustrated either minor part have more patience and stronger will so they probably will see as a challenge. I personally don't care just log in and play when have a mood to play that is too bad if you just log in for the daily log in rewards. Another problematic thing this is a not needed loyality thing from the devs because with this they probably wish to keep players log in every day while I agree the idea of hooring peoples with log in rewards but the other side is that is can be frustrating when peoples cannot progress because this is not a progressive thing just a fixed process if you log in enough then you get that X-Y-Z.

They once reworked the reward system already because the past version was not enough honoring and the rewards were terrible. If they rework someday this again maybe they have some better ideas how to do it for honoring peoples and not frustrate them. They have a feedback section so they can get enough options what and how they should do in order to make the costumers happy.

I personally not sure where I am because now I am typing from my work place but I am also around 350-400 day and also playing the game from the beginning. That rifle looks cool when I reach that day I will test it. Also they could add more items and more bp as reward. 

[SilvaDreams]

Soooo.... It's not fair that a new player has to wait 600 days to get Primed Shred.

But it's perfectly fine that >I< had to wait 600 days.

Me thinks some one's logic is broken.

[beercritch]

primed shred is just around the corner for me - I am up to maybe 580 days of logins.

 

I've logged in to almost 2 years to get this reward - so why should any other player get it quicker?

[Obviousclone]

I'm past the zenith (don't know how many days specifically) and enroute to primed shred

 

personally I'd rather they scrap all the rewards for login and redistribute them somewhere else, like as a questline reward or as a very high-ducat cost baro offering. and instead do something simple like every 30 days logged in you get to pick an orokin catalyst/reactor/forma.

I don't think anyone really cares about the sigils or bothers using them. personally I hope one day we get fully transparent sigils since i like the look of a clean, vanilla warframe.

[Leqesai]

One of the core problems with the current login system is that it requires you to actually log in.

It shouldn't be a matter of logging in, it should be a matter of account creation. If you have an old account you should receive perks. This also incentivizes players who tried it long ago to come back down the road without feeling totally screwed over.

 

Especially since the rewards are not able to be traded. There's no reason to force people to log in every day (except trying to get concurrent active player numbers up each day. But this is a shady way to go about that).

 

The current system works like this:

Player A logs in religiously because they don't want to miss out on special gear. This person doesn't have a problem doing this. They are happy/satisfied. (The most hardcore gamer is this type)

Person B tries to do like Person A but misses days here and there and thus feels a progressively larger disconnect with people like Person A and feels less inclined to continue logging in frequently. They are not satisfied with this system. (Anyone from casual to moderately hardcore can occupy this type)

Person C is new and wants to get into the game. There are already so many systems in place that they see the ever growing separation from their low login count with the max currently available and can literally never catch up to the hardcore gamers when it comes to exclusive rewards. (Casuals and new players occupy this type)

 

The bottom line is this:

Every 100 days there is a very special item given to players. This item is a nice little perk to being a 'loyal' player. But in reality what this does is cater exclusively to the hardcore crowd and slowly disconnect all of those that new/moderately hardcore from feeling as invested in the game as the people with huge login counts.

 

 

System should either go away completely or be changed to tie into account activation dates so that those who feel ostracized have an incentive to come back to the game a year from now.

[Chity]

6 hours ago, Malakam said:

Hey while we're add it lets just add prisma items and arcanes to the standard market. baro comes every week, and new players get to pick a free syandana. Lets make easyframe happen

Additive things will always be arduous and inevitably useless. It's silly to have a 600 day lock on it when it is starting comp, getting on, logging in. I don't have the time to boot this thing up every day, yet I've been here consistently since a good bit before Volt Prime. There needs to be a way to modify additive systems. 

[Lysander26]

43 minutes ago, beercritch said:

I've logged in to almost 2 years to get this reward - so why should any other player get it quicker?

 

1 hour ago, SilvaDreams said:

Soooo.... It's not fair that a new player has to wait 600 days to get Primed Shred.

But it's perfectly fine that >I< had to wait 600 days.

Me thinks some one's logic is broken.

The problem with this logic is that Warframe has a GREAT catch-up mechanic already, and its platinum. When I came back, I dropped an embarrassing amount of platinum picking up the Primes I wanted that lived their entire life cycle from release to vault when I was gone. Any new player can do the exact same thing if they decide they want the shiny guns I have. And that's good for the game too, since the buying of platinum is what keeps the game in business. Want a Gun or Frame NOW? You can spend platinum on it, no questions asked.

Login Rewards have no such mechanism, and if I decide that I really like whatever the 700 day gun is, well, I'm pretty much SOL. There is nothing I can do on my end to make this go faster. No amount of Platinum or Prime Access will get me that gun in a reasonable amount of time. So really, in order to prevent these feel bad moments, the Login Rewards almost NEED to suck, and that's not great either. You cannot be jealous of something you do not want. Playing the game for 600 days straight is amazing and should be rewarded, but giving something of no value is its own sort of frustration. Shred is wobbling on the line on the too good side, hence the new player frustration. Nothing will become insanely broken with a Primed Shred on it, but I could imagine times that I would want to use it. The Weapons are wobbling on the too bad side, since I know that the Zenith is not the best I can do and can much more easily acquire just as good if not better gun. That doesn't exactly make me want to log in ever-day. But knowing that I can NEVER catch up to what the people on the bleeding edge have, that is the type frustration that actually undermines the loyalty system in the first place, since it gives me a psychological out to just up and quit the game, since I will ALWAYS be behind. No other acquisition systems in the game have this much of a "feels-bad" mechanic to it.

Edited July 25, 2017 by Lysander26
grammar

[SilvaDreams]

47 minutes ago, Lysander26 said:

 

The problem with this logic is that Warframe has a GREAT catch-up mechanic already, and its platinum. When I came back, I dropped an embarrassing amount of platinum picking up the Primes I wanted that lived their entire life cycle from release to vault when I was gone. Any new player can do the exact same thing if they decide they want the shiny guns I have. And that's good for the game too, since the buying of platinum is what keeps the game in business. Want a Gun or Frame NOW? You can spend platinum on it, no questions asked.

Login Rewards have no such mechanism, and if I decide that I really like whatever the 700 day gun is, well, I'm pretty much SOL. There is nothing I can do on my end to make this go faster. No amount of Platinum or Prime Access will get me that gun in a reasonable amount of time. So really, in order to prevent these feel bad moments, the Login Rewards almost NEED to suck, and that's not great either. You cannot be jealous of something you do not want. Playing the game for 600 days straight is amazing and should be rewarded, but giving something of no value is its own sort of frustration. Shred is wobbling on the line on the too good side, hence the new player frustration. Nothing will become insanely broken with a Primed Shred on it, but I could imagine times that I would want to use it. The Weapons are wobbling on the too bad side, since I know that the Zenith is not the best I can do and can much more easily acquire just as good if not better gun. That doesn't exactly make me want to log in ever-day. But knowing that I can NEVER catch up to what the people on the bleeding edge have, that is the type frustration that actually undermines the loyalty system in the first place, since it gives me a psychological out to just up and quit the game, since I will ALWAYS be behind. No other acquisition systems in the game have this much of a "feels-bad" mechanic to it.

Here is the flaw with your argument.

These are login rewards not age rewards. They are rewards for playing and being active, you don't play you are at a standstill. Just be glad they didn't go the horrid MMO route of requiring consecutive days to get rewards.

And no you should not be able to pay your way to catching up because that defeats the purpose of rewarding you for being an active player.

[Sziklamester]

2 hours ago, Leqesai said:

One of the core problems with the current login system is that it requires you to actually log in.

It shouldn't be a matter of logging in, it should be a matter of account creation. If you have an old account you should receive perks. This also incentivizes players who tried it long ago to come back down the road without feeling totally screwed over.

 

Especially since the rewards are not able to be traded. There's no reason to force people to log in every day (except trying to get concurrent active player numbers up each day. But this is a shady way to go about that).

 

The current system works like this:

Player A logs in religiously because they don't want to miss out on special gear. This person doesn't have a problem doing this. They are happy/satisfied. (The most hardcore gamer is this type)

Person B tries to do like Person A but misses days here and there and thus feels a progressively larger disconnect with people like Person A and feels less inclined to continue logging in frequently. They are not satisfied with this system. (Anyone from casual to moderately hardcore can occupy this type)

Person C is new and wants to get into the game. There are already so many systems in place that they see the ever growing separation from their low login count with the max currently available and can literally never catch up to the hardcore gamers when it comes to exclusive rewards. (Casuals and new players occupy this type)

 

The bottom line is this:

Every 100 days there is a very special item given to players. This item is a nice little perk to being a 'loyal' player. But in reality what this does is cater exclusively to the hardcore crowd and slowly disconnect all of those that new/moderately hardcore from feeling as invested in the game as the people with huge login counts.

 

 

System should either go away completely or be changed to tie into account activation dates so that those who feel ostracized have an incentive to come back to the game a year from now.

Pretty much this.

[Imniscor]

Simple solution : make login rewards tradable.
It will still take 300 days for Zenistar.
Let people sell.