[Update 21.4.0] Hydroid Revisited Feedback

[FoxFX]

3 minutes ago, Chopx said:

Yea but theres not that many dmg dealing frame abilities that scale into late game. If his kit is not designed around dmg why push for it.

 

I is as you have said before:

13 minutes ago, Chopx said:

 

Because undertow and tentacle swarm CC's arent well designed. 

 

Their CC leaves much to make Hydroid a "teamplayer." Many of the commenters here have felt annoyed as to how Undertow and Tentacle Swarm make Hydroid a "selfish" character that doesn't even do enough damage to get the job done quickly.

 

There is room to have Hydroid's Undertow and Tentacle swarm to be total CC Abilities and removing the damage ability, but the ragdoll effect and the enemy isolation of the puddle is a key problem. If we want those 2 abilities to be total CC, they will have to be abilities similar to Vauban's ability kit: Really low damage but with CC that keeps the enemy in place and not flailing around.

[Trentiel]

3 minutes ago, Violet_Xe said:

well at a slower rate obviously, i see him as a cc right now, noi reason for him to be the tank of all tanks, i am talking like a 100 armor cap

oberon can have like what 750 extra? lol even just a little would help players. i would like him to gain more than the teammates of armor and hp regen but teammates less, still way lower than oberon though. i don't want him to be broken or resemble another frame completly.

Granted, Augments tend to make frames more like each other. The heal is fine as is. It's a good tool for low-mid level stuff. My point was to show that this is all it is, without starting to completely copy other frames abilities. This mechanic would be too identical to Oberon.

I say leave the Curative Undertow as is, but consider ways to make Hydroid scale. Increasing their elemental damage and status vulnerability, and some slow down to boot. Which is thematically and mechanically in line with getting everything wet. Water weighs down armor, water makes you more vulnerable to things like Electric, Cold... really any element.

1 minute ago, Chopx said:

Yea but theres not that many dmg dealing frame abilities that scale into late game. If his kit is not designed around dmg why push for it.

I'm really not. He was saying either Hydroid needs to CC in a cooperative way, or he needs to do major damage. I support the former. But this is the struggle around re-designing his kit. The best dmg dealing frames that scale into late game are the ones that amplify damage from other sources. Banshee's Sonar and Nova's Molecular Prime come to mind. Debuffs are essential.

My ideas are all about making his CC powers more team-friendly. Simplifying his 1 and 4 into one power, because they are the same ability with slightly different aesthetics around how they CC. And giving him a truly fun 4th power.

http://i.imgur.com/KVgMA2W.png

I'll just post the link again. It's short, simple and solves a lot of problems people complain about.

[Chopx]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Skylar McCloud said:

like for example cast undertow saryn throws in spors for toxin damage Frost freezes it them it's procing toxin and viral damage. 

too complicated to be viable. You'd have to set your whole teams weapon elements. then frames who dont use elemantal dmg abilities would not synergize. Cool idea though

[(XBOX)Skylar McCloud]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Skylar McCloud said:

like for example cast undertow saryn throws in spors for toxin damage Frost freezes it them it's procing toxin and viral damage. 

 I like this a real discussion with out Trolls.  I thought about this with damage in mind it has High damage potential and crowd control staus procs on top of can you imagine the enemies getting eaten by sharks

[Strexze]

or just make Tentacle Swarm stay in 1 place and SQUUEZE enemy hard till dead.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Edited August 14, 2017 by Strexze
add pic ( ° ʖ °)

[Chopx]

1 minute ago, Strexze said:

or just make Tentacle Swarm stay in 1 place and SQUUEZE enemy hard till dead.

or just knock them down

[Violet_Xe]

1 minute ago, Strexze said:

or just make Tentacle Swarm stay in 1 place and SQUUEZE enemy hard till dead.

something alot of people want, more damge and having it NOT GO 200MPH.

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Violet_Xe

[Trentiel]

Can we lay down some baseline observations that we can all agree on?

-Undertow and Tentacle Swarm interrupt team play. They keep team mates from attacking or easily attacking enemies.

-Hydroid has little to make him scale into the late game.

-Hydroid is wet-vauban. Undertow is a Vortex you have to manually click enemies to pull in. Tentacle Swarm is a Bastille that does light damage, and in exchange keeps enemies from being fired on by all non-explosive weapons. Hydroid needs his own characteristics that aren't just inferior Vauban abilities.

[Trentiel]

3 minutes ago, Strexze said:

or just make Tentacle Swarm stay in 1 place and SQUUEZE enemy hard till dead.

 

2 minutes ago, Chopx said:

or just knock them down

 

1 minute ago, Violet_Xe said:

something alot of people want, more damge and having it NOT GO 200MPH.

 

http://i.imgur.com/KVgMA2W.png

What if, his 1 and his 4 were the same power? and it repeatedly spawned canon balls and tentacles for its full duration for an AOE knock-down, tentacle choke, non-flailing good time?

[RikerWatts]

I have been saying hydroid is awful for a year. He still is and DE refuses to make the pirate a contender with vauban, the current best area denial frame in the game.

[(XBOX)Skylar McCloud]

4 minutes ago, Strexze said:

3 minutes ago, Trentiel said:

Can we lay down some baseline observations that we can all agree on?

-Undertow and Tentacle Swarm interrupt team play. They keep team mates from attacking or easily attacking enemies.

-Hydroid has little to make him scale into the late game.

-Hydroid is wet-vauban. Undertow is a Vortex you have to manually click enemies to pull in. Tentacle Swarm is a Bastille that does light damage, and in exchange keeps enemies from being fired on by all non-explosive weapons. Hydroid needs his own characteristics that aren't just inferior Vauban abilities.

 

2 minutes ago, Trentiel said:

 

 

http://i.imgur.com/KVgMA2W.png

What if, his 1 and his 4 were the same power? and it repeatedly spawned canon balls and tentacles for its full duration for an AOE knock-down, tentacle choke, non-flailing good time?

or just make Tentacle Swarm stay in 1 place and SQUUEZE enemy hard till dead.

That would be would be great too I looked at the link you posted That would be  tough enough set up.  What we can both agree on ih his passive. and too many tentacle move all basically doing the same thing. One tentacle move hoolds them in place while barraged with a volley of cannon balls. is a great Idea cause Hydroid is a Pirate frame and none of the aspects of piracy are used except for pilfering but thats the only and a minimal degree at that

  The kraken chomping enemies Sounds pretty kool. I'm a shark man myself " Jaws marathons and Shark Week" Koolest thing ever to me anyway. so that's where that Idea came from.

[Trentiel]

3 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Skylar McCloud said:

That would be would be great too I looked at the link you posted That would be  tough enough set up.  What we can both agree on ih his passive. and too many tentacle move all basically doing the same thing. One tentacle move hoolds them in place while barraged with a volley of cannon balls. is a great Idea cause Hydroid is a Pirate frame and none of the aspects of piracy are used except for pilfering but thats the only and a minimal degree at that

  The kraken chomping enemies Sounds pretty kool. I'm a shark man myself " Jaws marathons and Shark Week" Koolest thing ever to me anyway. so that's where that Idea came from.

I think it's worth pushing for. Hydroid's water-ness needs more attention though, IMO. Water needs put out fires and make things wet, heavy, and susceptible to elemental damage and status. To me the pirate thing was just flavor and style, water powers are more interesting than pirates. Pirates are just guys with guns on a boat who will kill to get what they want. Warframes are just guys with guns on a spaceship who will kill to get what they want.

The Kraken would use Golden Maw mechanics, it would swim underwater... underground? most the time. Coming up to either do strafing tentacle attacks or rush an particular enemy, pull them under and chow down. They wouldn't even need to do anything with the model, like add biting animations. No mouth or biting animations needed. Just pull them under as it dives back down.

[GecepeMJMan]

I repost what I post in the Hydroid Revisited Feedback, the reason why is because a lot of people are presently argumentating in that section, and my post just disappeard in a flash in the flow of comments, The reason I decided to repost here is because I think those ideas are worth reading, and shared in the objectif of a possible 2nd little rework. A quick review on Hydroid if I may say. Hope you enjoy. 

 

To be honest, I kinda like the rework but i'm a bit disapointed.

His passive ability. Useless, won't help in any ways. Since Hydroid needs energy more than ever, shouln'd you think about a passive giving him a way to find some more?

Tidal Surge: Can't really get the point of this spell... Not really usefull even with his augment Tidal Impunity. Going faster and put some damage when charged at enemies is a good start, but the fact that you can't move after launch and that you'll mostly finish your way out the map or into a wall make the spell unworthy to use. Could be really nice though if you'd change the spell for a big wave that Hydroid could surf to go faster and control, the wave could trap a certain amount of enemies inside it.

Tidal Surge while using Undertow: Also useless! All you do is ironically burn your energy. Even though you can now move while using undertow, you can't keep the enemies you've captured! Why using it, if it's just for losing your precious preys? Could he, at least, keep his victim inside his undertow while using this ability?

 

Undertow: I know that spell is a bit troublesome, because it have the ability to troll other players. Why don't you simply making that spell like a quicksand trap? A pundle of water putting enemies in a crowd control stade while drowning, allowing allies to kill them while they're trying to swim. I personally dont mind at all the way that already is, even that I actually enjoy it myself. But if it causes players to hate the frame and makes the rework hard to do just because the spell would be too strong with a synergys between other spells, guess would be better to change that spell too.

 

Tentacle Swarm: ...Why is there a little floppy thingy coming out your 4? Really nice looking, really! But could it do something at least? For example, eating some enemies from time to time, healing you back or giving you energy while it does? It could be when foes's healthbar are lower than 15% or something like that. And the tentacles... I still think they're kinda useless. They spawn, attack one enemy, do nothing the rest of the spell duration. Since now there is a kraken, could the kraken attack the enemies in it range instead of randomly spawn tentacles? With that Hydroid could have a way to get more energy or getting tankier in the battlefield, the spell could actually be more usefull, and would make that marvelous creature actually worth it! 

 

I said a lot against Hydroid, but like I said, I'am still thankful for your hardwork with that rework! Thank to alway make the game better and news!

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Shrekislove-Shrekislife
Quote box

[PsiWarp]

If we're keeping the passive, can it be bumped to 100%? We can't spawn more than 3 tentacles using the passive anyway.

[RikerWatts]

  I HAVE BEEN SAYING THIS FOR A YEAR NOW. A. YEAR.  HYDROID NEEDS ALL-NEW ABILITIES, HE NEEDS A LIMBO SCALE REWORK, NOT ALTERATIONS TO HIS ABILITIES.
Hi, I'm Riker, I made a pessimistic critique on Hydroid's existence for over a year. I may not be the absolute most experienced warframe mogamu out there (no he is not good mogamu, stop it.) Hydroid has been in one of the lowest spots for a long time, I had hopes for his update that came to pass. As it turned out... this update was a massive nerf to a large part of his entirety, with small buffs. SO LET'S START WITH THOSE, THE BUFFS. WHAT DID DE DO "RIGHT"?

PROS
 -Undertow has ramping damage that can hit upwards of 3k or more.
 -You can make tempest barrage last longer than 9 seconds (OH BUT LOOK AT CONS)
 -You can finally do something in undertow

Alright! three pros! I've got a good feeling about hydroid now! Undertow does damage for its lack of your existence? Nice! What about the co-

CONS
 -UNDERTOW. IS STILL. THE SAME.
 -UNDERTOW HAS LESS RANGE NOW BY A F*** TON
 -UNDERTOW STILL NEGATES YOUR EXISTENCE ON THE BATTLEFIELD
 -VAUBAN IS STILL A BETTER AREA DENIER WITH ONE ABILITY THAT HE CAN SPAM
 -TENTACLE SWARM GAINS PREWORK AMOUNT UPON CHARGING THE ABILITY
 -TENTACLE SWARM IS SMALLER OVERALL
 -KRAKEN DOES NOTHING AT ALL??
 -CHARGING. ABILITIES.
 -IN A FAST PACED GAME.
 -WHAT THE F-
 -TIDAL SURGE IS STILL TIDAL SURGE.
 -NOW YOU CAN ACCIDENTALLY WASTE MORE ENERGY BY PRESSING IT MULTIPLE TIMES
 -AND GO JUST AS FAST NOWHERE
 -TEMPEST BARRAGE NOW SUFFERS BY HAVING A FIXED RANGE FORCING YOU TO GO POSITIVE RANGE WHICH:
 -IN TURN MAKES TENTACLE SWARM WORSE BY BEING SO FAR SPREAD OUT
 -UNDERTOW. IS. STILL. THE. SAME.
 -TEMPEST BARRAGE ONLY INCREASES IF YOU CHARGE THE ABILITY.
 -CHARGING ABILITIES LIKE THAT ARE BAD
 -DON'T DO THIS DE
 -HIS PASSIVE IS USELESSLY UNCHANGED
 -WHY HAVE A FORCED MELEE REQUIRED PASSIVE?
 -RIFLE, PISTOL, BOW ONLY SORTIES SAY HELLO.
 -AN AUGMENT DOES NOT JUSTIFY HIS EXISTENCE, LOOKING AT YOU PILFERING SWARM.
 -REST OF HIS AUGMENTS OUTCLASSED BY NUMEROUS OTHER FRAMES.

As you can clearly see, some of these are the pessimistic Canadian coming out in me, but I wouldn't be this in depth if I didn't enjoy this game so much. I love this game a lot, but when it comes to very VERY clear ability mismatch and incohesion, you know, fundamental issues, it just goes to show that just adding a few tweaks does NOT fix the issue. Hydroid is still suffering the majority of issues I had pointed out.

TEMPEST BARRAGE
Tempest barrage is massively RNG and relies NOW on high &#! range to hit a target, sacrificing damage on something that does very little damage is the equivalent of taking your nerf gun and deciding you wanted the aerodynamics of your bullets to NOT fly straight but to instead swerve in a random direction. It doesn't work as it should, hitting a target is damn near impossible when the splash AOE is so small. My recommendation for (rather balanced compared to other frames) this ability was a complete replacement, and after seeing the sudden slew of people bringing to attention their own change ideas, I still stand firmly on mine aside from the augment, which could be the same as the current one that causes corrosive procs, that's perfectly fine and- in fact- works FLAWLESSLY with the ability I made up on the spot.


TIDAL SURGE
Now- I get the appeal of tidal surge. With high duration, you're fast as all effin hell. Great, wonderful. But you're unable to control where you go. You are a tsunami wave, which is what they want to get at. But a frame that is DESIGNED to LOOK like a PIRATE is NOT POSEIDON. Controlling the tides to his crew's advantage should be him, not becoming it. He should be casting the tides that turn, and even with the augment this STILL works JUST AS FINE! If they want to reutilize assets and just use the mesh model and animation of tidal surge, etc. Take the animation of Tempest barrage for Hydroid, take the animation set of hydroid's waves from tidal surge and apply it to a forward knockback wave instead of the chains and stun that harrow has. That's right, just take harrow's 1 and do minor recoding.


UNDERTOW
Stop.
Stop trying to make undertow work, it's not going to work.
Making hydroid be negated physically from the battlefield is bad, you remedied this by having it do ramping infinite damage scaling- which is great, that's a step in the right direction for a WRONG ability. TENTACLE SWARM should have ramping damage to kill the targets attached to them. Now, undertow could have this too, but undertow needs to stop removing hydroid. Having the ability to place these puddles down instead would be better. And for curative undertow, it is even better. if hydroid has one placed down, allies can find where it is and just retreat to it.
Here it is again: Make. Undertow. A hitscan-to-place-trap.
It can still be undertow, just not removing hydroid from existence anymore and letting him compete with vauban for area denial and trapping. Now the best part of this is you can use enemies IN the puddle as a priority target for tentacle swarm, which I can explain after this.  Casting a location to be an undertow trap would be great. Having the puddles be a little smaller and limiting them to like five would be amazing. Keep their ramping damage to prevent the old hydroid issue of enemies not dying in it, and then add the cross functionality with tentacle swarm.
Also unless you make enemies in undertow take more damage from tempest barrage, the functionality between those two is redundant by the fact that tentacle swarm throws enemies up and away from the impact zone of tempest barrage.


TENTACLE SWARM
Now as much as I loathe this ability for its counter-gunplay, I see WHY you want to and HAVE to keep it. It is relatable to the mythological creature of the depths that swallowed ships whole, Hydroid is a pirate, aquaman, yadda yadda. Look, if you just made tentacle swarm prioritize enemies IN undertow and rip them out from it viciously, to do %TOTAL HP DAMAGE, you'd make a lot of people happy. They can still have their cool new AI, but the constant slamming into surfaces for little bits of damage is harsh which is why I believe it should ramp up like undertow does.
Honestly, it'd be perfect.


Compared to a year ago, the only tweaks I had were a new augment for hydroid that came out between then and now, and ramping damage on his ult. my number suggestions for damage and everything is in my previously linked thread above, but Digital Extremes, look. I know you want to make sure your hydroid primes will sell, but the only way you're going to hit profit margin is by LIMBO REWORKING HIM, not stat tweaking and visual overhauls. The water isn't even able to color like juice anymore, I can't wait for disappointment moistboy prime.

In short: Hydroid is STILL bad. This rework did him NO justice, no resolution, he is STILL a second hand nekros from an augment, a worse vauban/any other CC frame, and a poor man's healer through augments rendered obsolete by three other characters in the game.
 

Edited August 14, 2017 by RikerWatts

[Senketsu_]

100% agree with this thread. Hydroid needs limbo lvls of touchups

Edited August 14, 2017 by Senketsu_

[NoLife]

Both this and his previous thread deserve massive applause and attention.

[1tsyB1tsyN1nj4]

I say just make Hydroid completely CC, since really, he's only a pirate in looks, more of a sea monster and by extent the sea itself. Ever seen an entire harbor shut down because of a bad storm? That'd be Hydroid, the storm from the depths that shuts down his enemies.

Tempest Barrage would be ok if it wasn't RNG to hit your enemies spread out over a giant area. Actual cannons are not that inaccurate. Instead of an adjustable area, don't have power range affect the ability at all, only duration and strength to control how long and how damaging the pounding is.

I don't really see the problem with Tidal Surge as it is now, it's a mobility power that damages enemies and drags them along, sounds a lot like Rhino's Charge

Undertow is unique. It's a cool idea, but it needs more. Why not add an Anglerfish style lure that draws enemies into it? Then enemies get damaged, and Hydroid gets healed for a percentage of that.

Tentacle Swarm and Hydroid's passive need to stop trying to flail at enemies, instead, wrap around and trap them in place for the duration of the ability, while also choking them for DoT.

[BlueberryIsWar]

Shocked to notice that my rank 23 Hydroid is now performing better at clearing out enemies than my Ember Prime with the World on Fire Augment.

Simply build for Efficiency and Power Strength, spam his 1 that no costs 6 energy in every direction you see an enemy, don't even bother to charge, mobs cleared.

I assume this falls of like ember past lvl 40 enemies, it is pretty amazing to see nonetheless. Because he has the added knockdown without an augment, he also can spam pilfering swarm or mod his 1 to apply corrosion, which makes him more useful for higher lvl armored targets.. yeah, pretty good.

And his one even works reliably on just 1 or 2 enemies now. Pretty big buff in my book.

 

Thanks DE.

[Maqabir]

Having played a few regular missions and sorties as well as ran a few simulations with lvl 120 enemies I really like the new Hydroid revisit, he's much more mobile and so far I've found a use for all of his abilities.

I do agree with others though that his 3rd and 4th ability can be a bit of a nuisance in team play.

Letting teammates damage enemies caught in Undertow or Tentacle Swarm by firing into the puddle or at the tentacles could help Hydroid work better as a team player.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Maqabir

[DeathGold]

On 8/12/2017 at 4:00 PM, Lyravain said:

Because Hydroid NEEDED a rework? Most of the community didn't touch him, but there are people who genuinely liked him. And they deserve an update on a frame they like. Besides, they did this with Ash's rework, and all the complains were because he stopped auto-killing everything.

 

What about the 'new one' do you NOT like? It's LITERALLY what he did before, EXACTLY, only now there's more synergy. They removed NOTHING and added a bit of quality of life. So, what, precisely, is there about the new Hydroid that you don't like, that wasn't an issue with the old hydroid? It's literally the same with the Limbo players complaining about how the 'old Limbo' was better than 'new Limbo' despite the Limbo rework removing absolutely NOTHING, and only adding benefits.

it's not "exactly" what he was before it is a low range low efficiency variant when i said i liked the old one i meant i liked the mechanics and all but not the results you get like the low damage numbers for me they didn't solve anything with this rework some people say he is more "fun" but having fun in a farming game really get hard when you do the same thing over and over for me having fun in warframe is doing random stuff and getting results like huge nukes or high single target damage ... hydroid have none of these the old one was good at cc the post rework version is just too low range to do anything like "oh use your puddle to trap a group ".... your 5meters puddle yeah nice idea "use your 1 to knock down an area and stunlock them .... yeah with 5meters range and random targeting oh and a big number of the community tried hydroid they didn't like it coz he was weak so they said "meh nvm i'll go back to any other frame" coz every frame is better than him that why he needed a rework to make him more usable vs the other frames to make you get results from using his abilitys not the "10damage /sec increase" on his undertow this is not scaling i'm pretty sure DE don't know if they want to make him a damage dealer or cc frame they tried to mix both but for "balance issues" set the values too low so he can't deal damage or cc enemies

On 8/12/2017 at 11:39 AM, (Xbox One)Knight Raime said:

 DE with reworks/revisits always aim to add synergy and make lesser used powers more used.

this is what's wrong with reworks now "forced synergies" isn't good for the frame Oberon is a proof (i really like oberon a lot even more after his rework) but you can feel how the game force you to use your 2  to do any thing with your other powers it's an easy way to make you use it not necessarily liking it :/

On 8/12/2017 at 10:25 AM, potiisbest said:

I see that peapole have argue with the rework , because who used hydroid for farming that is a bit pain of the range nerf , i think there will be a very good solution for this , make it an abbility like embers 4. , you running ion the map and the tentacles will apear and murder the enemies , sound like a bit op  but ember isnt op too , and it will be a duration based skill unlike the world on fire , what do you guys think ?

 

having the same ability but with a reskin ...never a good idea "the fire one does fire pillars under enemies" "the water dude summon tentacles under enemies " kind of the same thing

Edited August 14, 2017 by DeathGold

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

4 minutes ago, DeathGold said:

it's not "exactly" what he was before it is a low range low efficiency variant when i said i liked the old one i meant i liked the mechanics and all but not the results you get like the low damage numbers for me they didn't solve anything with this rework some people say he is more "fun" but having fun in a farming game really get hard when you do the same thing over and over for me having fun in warframe is doing random stuff and getting results like huge nukes or high single target damage ... hydroid have none of these the old one was good at cc the post rework version is just too low range to do anything like "oh use your puddle to trap a group ".... your 5meters puddle yeah nice idea "use your 1 to knock down an area and stunlock them .... yeah with 5meters range and random targeting oh and a big number of the community tried hydroid they didn't like it coz he was weak so they said "meh nvm i'll go back to any other frame" coz every frame is better than him that why he needed a rework to make him more usable vs the other frames to make you get results from using his abilitys not the "10damage /sec increase" on his undertow this is not scaling i'm pretty sure DE don't know if they want to make him a damage dealer or cc frame they tried to mix both but for "balance issues" set the values too low so he can't deal damage or cc enemies

this is what's wrong with reworks now "forced synergies" isn't good for the frame Oberon is a proof (i really like oberon a lot even more after his rework) but you can feel how the game force you to use your 2  to do any thing with your other powers it's an easy way to make you use it not necessarily liking it :/

Honestly you'll get no where with me with that.  I don't care if the synergy feels forced or not.  Oberon was lack luster pre rework.  feels amazing now.  that's all I care about.

[DeathGold]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Knight Raime said:

Honestly you'll get no where with me with that.  I don't care if the synergy feels forced or not.  Oberon was lack luster pre rework.  feels amazing now.  that's all I care about.

oberon wasn't a luck luster pre rework he was "average" and people didn't wanted to use him (the 2 augment build was a very high DPS but people never tried the magic carpet build) hydroid is bad forcing synergies isn't fun in a game where you want to feel free with your movement and where you decide how you play your frame let's take oberon case again : you have only 1 way to play it now .... [rage] renewal and always casting your 2 then your 4 2 times to remove armor from enemies or don't touch them if you don't play vs grineer .... hydroid will end like that too the mechanics they added are great but people will just still use his tentacle swarm and forget the rest ... use puddle for afking and never move with it coz that energy drain for the speed you get... DE just nerfed the ranges because he was an afk interception guy now he's not even good at that anymore

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

Just now, DeathGold said:

oberon wasn't a luck luster pre rework he was "average" and people didn't wanted to use him (the 2 augment build was a very high DPS but people never tried the magic carpet build) hydroid is bad forcing synergies isn't fun in a game where you want to feel free with your movement and where you decide how you play your frame let's take oberon case again : you have only 1 way to play it now .... [rage] renewal and always casting your 2 then your 4 2 times to remove armor from enemies or don't touch them if you don't play vs grineer .... hydroid will end like that too the mechanics they added are great but people will just still use his tentacle swarm and forget the rest ... use puddle for afking and never move with it coz that energy drain for the speed you get... DE just nerfed the ranges because he was an afk interception guy now he's not even good at that anymore

Lack luster doesn't mean bad.  just didn't feel good.  he feels good to me now.  all the people they've revisited for the most part I didn't enjoy and post rework I do now.  Mag is the biggest example here.  I already love hydroid as is.  but couldn't justify him end game.  now with the new changes I feel like I can.  so i'm pumped to get ahold of the rework.

[DeathGold]

Just now, (Xbox One)Knight Raime said:

Lack luster doesn't mean bad.  just didn't feel good.  he feels good to me now.  all the people they've revisited for the most part I didn't enjoy and post rework I do now.  Mag is the biggest example here.  I already love hydroid as is.  but couldn't justify him end game.  now with the new changes I feel like I can.  so i'm pumped to get ahold of the rework.

"mag" isn't better post rework it's useless and only good with the "lanka" by usebuging so people that say "oh look at the damage you get from magnetize now" ........ you have weapons and a bullet attractor  the damage you see is your weapon damage the damage of magnetize is the little 1 and 10 you see at the bottom so they changed the focus of the people from her polarize to her magnetize ..... same thing overall