Baza feedback

[ShikiRen]

So... I jumped into the game yesterday after the patch to take a look at the new weapons. Started the clan research, left the dojo, and someone had gifted me the bundle. So I took the Baza (whose design I absolutely love) into a mission to see how it performs. And...well, I like the supressed playstyle as it fits the "ninja" theme of the Tenno quite well, and it can almost rival the soma P, which is really good... below 22 metres, that is.

Look, I get why it has a fall off range. It is an smg (well, the Grakata is too, but it has the rifle fall off ranges), and it is innately silenced... but for the love of all that is holy, at least make the fall off 100-150 or 150-200 metres compared to the drop off starting at 300m for other weapons. 22 metres is WAY too low, you can slide that distance and onehit a group of enemies with a melee weapon faster than you can kill them with this thing. With at least 100 metres before the fall-off happens, this would be a really good weapon, but with the range as it is now? I'm better off sliding with an Atterax without maiming strike, has about the same range (slightly exxagerated, but if you count the slide distance...).

[Giantconch]

Agree 100% about damage falloff on this weapon. Distance needs to be increased by at least 4-5x before I could really consider using it beyond ranking and forma'ing a few times to get a decent build for it.

 

Otherwise its a fairly nice addition.

[Szilvia]

This weapon is not a shotgun so that fall is seems like not an intended thing or just a misstyped number but it is really bad for an smg. Make it 100-150 meter the falloff and it will be fine.

[13QZXXTTX]

Shotgun SMG? 

Kohm/Kohmak anyone?

 

Yeah Friend told me the Silence is nice addition. I thought so too, no need for Ability or Mod.

I saw the Fire Rate, and thought most SMG with lower than 20.0 Fire Rate is not worthy. Or is the Stats wrong.

[BiancaRoughfin]

So far i liked this weapon but yeah, Damage falloff is one of the issues i encountered. I feel that the Reload is too long and its clip size is way too small, they should double the clip and half the reload time.

Also, this is a weapon i would love seeing it made Dual wielded like the Twin Grakatas. <3

Edited November 24, 2017 by BiancaRoughfin

[Gunslinger]

Must be a typo. Really, 22m? You can get 20m on Scoliac with a riven and Primed Reach. This is funny.

Edited November 24, 2017 by Void-Gunslinger

[Fallen_Echo]

2 hours ago, ShikiRen said:

So... I jumped into the game yesterday after the patch to take a look at the new weapons. Started the clan research, left the dojo, and someone had gifted me the bundle. So I took the Baza (whose design I absolutely love) into a mission to see how it performs. And...well, I like the supressed playstyle as it fits the "ninja" theme of the Tenno quite well, and it can almost rival the soma P, which is really good... below 22 metres, that is.

Look, I get why it has a fall off range. It is an smg (well, the Grakata is too, but it has the rifle fall off ranges), and it is innately silenced... but for the love of all that is holy, at least make the fall off 100-150 or 150-200 metres compared to the drop off starting at 300m for other weapons. 22 metres is WAY too low, you can slide that distance and onehit a group of enemies with a melee weapon faster than you can kill them with this thing. With at least 100 metres before the fall-off happens, this would be a really good weapon, but with the range as it is now? I'm better off sliding with an Atterax without maiming strike, has about the same range (slightly exxagerated, but if you count the slide distance...).

I dont know why this weapon has falloff at all. Its an smg but that does not mean its useless when used for a bit more range than two corridors.

[ShikiRen]

1 minute ago, Fallen_Echo said:

I dont know why this weapon has falloff at all. Its an smg but that does not mean its useless when used for a bit more range than two corridors.

Propably because of the inherent supressor and judging from the sound, subsonic ammo, which are far slower and have a lot less penetrating power than normal, as well as lower effective range. If you want to compare it to RL guns. But 22m is bullS#&amp;&#036; nonetheless.

[GinKenshin]

I don’t see why this is a problem tbh 

 

 shotguns have fall off and everybody is ok with that. It’s suppose to be a very close quarter combat SMG.....I personally feel like a swat member while using this, it’s why this wep is silent in the first place imo 

 

 plus, the fact that it’s suppressed may be a reason. I’m not a gun expert but when you suppress a gun you basically decrease the distance the bullet will travel due to friction 

 

 the wep just came out, use it and get used to it first. It’s really not that bad

[Cicasajt]

This weapon would make a decent secondary i guess. Unfortunately we are still lack of crit mods and u need a riven for this one. I would love a crit/punch through mod or something

[Fallen_Echo]

1 hour ago, GinKenshin said:

I don’t see why this is a problem tbh 

 

 shotguns have fall off and everybody is ok with that. It’s suppose to be a very close quarter combat SMG.....I personally feel like a swat member while using this, it’s why this wep is silent in the first place imo 

 

 plus, the fact that it’s suppressed may be a reason. I’m not a gun expert but when you suppress a gun you basically decrease the distance the bullet will travel due to friction 

 

 the wep just came out, use it and get used to it first. It’s really not that bad

So you are telling me that considering all the micro smgs and uzi looking weapons this is the one what should get shotgun level falloff?

Even if we take in supression and say it cuts the effective range of the weapon in half that still means its original range would be 44m which is still too small.

[ShikiRen]

2 hours ago, GinKenshin said:

I don’t see why this is a problem tbh 

 

 shotguns have fall off and everybody is ok with that. It’s suppose to be a very close quarter combat SMG.....I personally feel like a swat member while using this, it’s why this wep is silent in the first place imo 

 

 plus, the fact that it’s suppressed may be a reason. I’m not a gun expert but when you suppress a gun you basically decrease the distance the bullet will travel due to friction 

 

 the wep just came out, use it and get used to it first. It’s really not that bad

I said it having fall off is fine. BUT the fall off starting at 2 meters longer than a whip with primed reach is BULL.

[Keltik0ne]

It's a nice fun weapon. The silence is pointless since it does so little damage you wont be doing any stealth kills but it's a decent 0 recoil bullet hose.

 

[(PSN)Cyotis]

Compromise with DE perhaps. Let's say 50 meters for starting fall off.

[GinKenshin]

18 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

So you are telling me that considering all the micro smgs and uzi looking weapons this is the one what should get shotgun level falloff?

Even if we take in supression and say it cuts the effective range of the weapon in half that still means its original range would be 44m which is still too small.

40m is Ignis range I think. You’re looking at numbers and assuming it’s short. It really isn’t, Warframe barely has any maps that big (besides Poe and some endless mission maps) 

 

 

18 hours ago, ShikiRen said:

I said it having fall off is fine. BUT the fall off starting at 2 meters longer than a whip with primed reach is BULL.

 I mean, a few weps and shotguns have falloff or very small limited range, and they’re still pretty awesome. And I really don’t see why that matters, that a wep has falloff compared to a specific melee class with a rare-ish mod 

 

 

 really think you guys are making too big of a deal of this falloff thing :/ 

[Mudfam]

7 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

40m is Ignis range I think. You’re looking at numbers and assuming it’s short. It really isn’t, Warframe barely has any maps that big (besides Poe and some endless mission maps)

The ignis is a flame thrower used for killing crowds (preferably of infested) this an accurate single target rifle. Not sure what you're saying about map size, but if you think 20m isn't that small you need to check your numbers, put some waypoints on enemies and see how far away they actually are. There are many, many tiles that span hundreds of meters.

 

13 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

I mean, a few weps and shotguns have falloff or very small limited range, and they’re still pretty awesome. And I really don’t see why that matters, that a wep has falloff compared to a specific melee class with a rare-ish mod

Shotguns are awesome. They are generally the highest damage, best scaling, most ammo efficient weapons in the game. They allow you to focus on movement and taking down any target with a single shot, they don't require you to walk up to somone and spray bullets at them for several seconds.

 

18 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

really think you guys are making too big of a deal of this falloff thing :/ 

The falloff is just too short for what this weapon is and how it can be used. Just like the silent feature is uselss with the current stealth mechanics.

[ShikiRen]

26 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

40m is Ignis range I think. You’re looking at numbers and assuming it’s short. It really isn’t, Warframe barely has any maps that big (besides Poe and some endless mission maps) 

 

 

 I mean, a few weps and shotguns have falloff or very small limited range, and they’re still pretty awesome. And I really don’t see why that matters, that a wep has falloff compared to a specific melee class with a rare-ish mod 

 

 

 really think you guys are making too big of a deal of this falloff thing :/ 

Yeah but, *gasp* shotguns have massive damage in the first place, so much so that for most you'd still oneshot lvl 60+ grineer from a massive range. This weapon already has really low base damage. And it is NOT a shotgun. Most shotguns can take out relatively high level enemies in one shot while below fall off range, some even beyond. Bu this? This already needs a ton of bullets while below fall off.

[Fallen_Echo]

1 hour ago, GinKenshin said:

40m is Ignis range I think. You’re looking at numbers and assuming it’s short. It really isn’t, Warframe barely has any maps that big (besides Poe and some endless mission maps

Have you ever tried to take out a group of enemy on hieracon while staying on the top of the extractor with an ignis?

40m is a good range for a flamethrower or a beam weapon but not for gun.

[SriJayawardenapuraKotteX]

The way I see it this is like one of those "precedent-setter" weapons to help introduce a limiting stat, to test the waters or whatnot. Who knows, maybe we could get a retroactive falloff stat applied to every weapon in the game to make snipers more viable or something? Hmm, imagine doing 50% damage with AkStilettos at 30m since they're short-range SMGs according to the "lore" of the gun or whatever. Would add a whole new level of usefulness and weapon diversity!

[EnemyST4ND]

Honestly, I thought that ridiculous falloff was a glitch.

[ShikiRen]

1 hour ago, SriJayawardenapuraKotteX said:

The way I see it this is like one of those "precedent-setter" weapons to help introduce a limiting stat, to test the waters or whatnot. Who knows, maybe we could get a retroactive falloff stat applied to every weapon in the game to make snipers more viable or something? Hmm, imagine doing 50% damage with AkStilettos at 30m since they're short-range SMGs according to the "lore" of the gun or whatever. Would add a whole new level of usefulness and weapon diversity!

There is one, it is 300m for normal weapons. Only comes into play on the plains (there are no 300m LoS in tilesets), but it is there; which is why my suggestion is giving the Baza 100-150 or 150-200 m reange, as that would be about a third (half) of every other weapon in the game (except snipers and shotguns, obviously). 22m is stupid.

Edited November 25, 2017 by ShikiRen

[bubbabenali]

Unlike the other "SMGs" in the game the Baza is pinpoint accurate tho.

Can't have it all, deal with it.

[Siekier]

1 hour ago, bubbabenali said:

Unlike the other "SMGs" in the game the Baza is pinpoint accurate tho.

Can't have it all, deal with it.

Other SMGs, such as...?

Only Grakata / Prisma Grakata comes to mind as a SMG primary, and it's still fairly accurate (can pop heads without problems) while retaining normal range.

[bluespart]

So, anyone else get that delay before the reload actually starts when you empty your magazine? Makes the whole weapon feel sluggish to me.

[DreamsmithJane]

19 hours ago, ShikiRen said:

I said it having fall off is fine. BUT the fall off starting at 2 meters longer than a whip with primed reach is BULL.

Scoliac with Primed Reach and the best range riven you can find still won't quite get to 20 meters. No other whip comes close. So yeah, that's bull in the sense that it's not true. If you're using a range riven on your whip, you can use a flight speed riven on your Baza, too. And it's also pretty easy to build Jet Stream Zephyr to triple the max-damage and falloff range, at which point it has equal or better burst damage compared with Soma Prime or Prisma Grakata anywhere closer than 80 meters (and with better accuracy and basically no recoil).

4 hours ago, ShikiRen said:

There is one, it is 300m for normal weapons. Only comes into play on the plains (there are no 300m LoS in tilesets), but it is there; which is why my suggestion is giving the Baza 100-150 or 150-200 m reange, as that would be about a third (half) of every other weapon in the game (except snipers and shotguns, obviously). 22m is stupid.

Not only is there no 300m line of sight outside the Plains, but there's no 150m either, and even on the Plains, most fighting takes place inside that range. Your suggestion would make the stat irrelevant.

3 hours ago, Siekier said:

Other SMGs, such as...?

Only Grakata / Prisma Grakata comes to mind as a SMG primary, and it's still fairly accurate (can pop heads without problems) while retaining normal range.

With that spread and recoil? You're not going to be popping heads with a Grakata at ranges where Baza's falloff matters, anyway. Sure, you can do it at 20 meters, but at 34, your chances are quite a bit lower.