PoE sortie change, adding unneeded extra grind + reward table

[PakkiTheDog]

Why was there a need to change one sortie mission, one objective in the PoE into 3? First time PoE was implemented into sortie it was nice, one objective and some scenery change, but now DE just added more unnecessary grind. If i want to do the bounties i'll go to Konzu and also get rewards from that drop table!!!

 

Also there is a god damn time to remove the @(*()$ build forma from the sortie. One forma is in no way comparable to any of other rewards on the drop table...well maybe with an exception of a 3 day drop chance booster, as useful as water in your shoe. Better of getting the 2x resource booster.

And kuva and riven rerolling have to change! Again, the players have been repeatedly very vocal about this, the re rolling of rivens is to RNG based!!!! You spend hours farming for kuva and in the end you get 0 on the gambling shaped system. And it's even more infuriating when you get 6k kuva in a sortie, JUST SO YOU WAIST IT IN 2 @(*()$ ROLLS!!!!! "Thank you for waisting your time, come again."

 

---End of rant---

[BlackCoMerc]

Have Bounties finally become so unpopular that their inserted into Sorties for the ten people left with the patience for THAT godawful system?

[Yuri_Doujinshi]

On top of this, I just encountered a tusk command dragyn assassination in the melee only PoE sortie. Needless to say, we failed. I feel like that's a rather obvious oversight on DE's part.

[INight00]

"rant"

Any suggestions?
You know, some proper feedback?

The sortie is fine, the three missions go by quickly without pause. Unless you are unlucky and get a defend the target/ area kind of thing.

Some people benefit from the forma drop, just because it affects one, doesn't mean everyone is negatively affected.
The drop chance booster helps those who need argon... should they need/ use it.

I used 6k kuva in a few rolls since the riven was unrolled... situational.
Yeah, kuva does need some change. Maybe kuva on the kuva fortress will solve some problems. Or increase the sortie drop to 9k.
The reroll RNG does need some work, omitting negative stats on already poor weapons etc.

@Yuri_Doujinshi

Maybe your warframe abilities could have helped?

[Syvarin]

PoE Bounties were designed to be shorter than normal missions. The team decided a single bounty shouldn't count as a full sortie mission so they bumped it up to three.

[Radagosh]

i for one felt like this one was way better than the very first, where you had to look for 3 caches and then were done. However, I think there shouldn't be certain objectives if one is using melee only.

Also yes sorties suck and we should have gotten the damn token system like two years ago. Also rivens suck and not being able to lock stats is $&*&*#(%& but hey it's DE they like RNG and making their playerbase suffer through hours on end of repetitive content to achieve what could be done in 20 minutes with better fleshed out systems.

[Yuri_Doujinshi]

8 minutes ago, INight00 said:

 

@Yuri_Doujinshi

Maybe your warframe abilities could have helped?

Yeah, my rhino prime has so many ranged damage capabilities.

Honestly, I can think of very few warframes that would be able to take out a level 80 command dragyn in a reasonable amount of time without using any primary or secondary weapons. Saryn maybe? EV trin would work. Ash prime might work, but I have no idea how well. Titania would probably work in razorwing form. Thing is though, I don't want to use any of those warframes in bounty missions, and I don't feel like I should be required to use them because of an obvious design oversight on DE's part.

Incidentally, I just got the command dragyn again on the 2nd run. If it happens a 3rd time, I guess I'll bite the bullet and use my EV trin.

Edited January 19, 2018 by Yuri_Doujinshi

[IceColdHawk]

vor 17 Minuten schrieb PakkiTheDog:

JUST SO YOU WAIST IT IN 2 @(*()$ ROLLS!!!!! "Thank you for waisting your time, come again."

I wish i could actually roll twice with this reward.

[Thrymm]

Getting a flying enemy mission probably ought not happen on a melee sortie(even though you can use the operator+warframe abilities to beat it), since it's directly against the melee only aspect, but other than that(and it's random, I didn't get that particular thing) I didn't really think it was too bad.  It wasn't long, nor particularly difficult.

The one thing I'd like to see different would be a little clarity in it---I didn't really know what my objective was so I wandered around and after three randoms it just ended.  Perhaps I missed the read somewhere, but just the same a little clarity from within the mission would have been welcome.

As far as Sortie rewards.......I'm always going to think the table is messed up until it includes the thing we're doing it for and only that....Rivens, but outside of that bit of stubbornness from me 6000 kuva was a fairly welcome reward when I got it because it's ten normal missions worth that I didn't have to do the craptastic operator driven hentai killer for.  I would, however, really appreciate seeing a few less of the Ayatan Sculptures and more Riven mods, though, the thing is still heavily biased toward endo income to a degree that it's far more endo than we could really need.

[Ecliptix]

I was fine with the three part PoE in sortie but not okay with the melee only sortie getting swarmed by dragyns. Warframe abilities do help but the levels of the enemies can cause issues since a lot of frames do not have abilities vs flying enemies that are useful for killing them. That said it wasn't brutal just really annoying.

Kuva and rerolling rivens does need an overhaul but thats well documented by the community.

[Chipputer]

3 minutes ago, Yuri_Doujinshi said:

Thing is though, I don't want to use any of those warframes in bounty missions, and I don't feel like I should be required to use them because of an obvious design oversight on DE's part.

Then don't. Use one of the many glaive-types or gunblade-types.

If your response is, "I shouldn't have to use those," then I can't help you. Vary your arsenal so you can handle situations that you aren't comfortable with.

[MBaldelli]

9 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

Have Bounties finally become so unpopular that their inserted into Sorties for the ten people left with the patience for THAT godawful system?

I get the impression it's quite the opposite really.  They're popular, but people don't like doing them because they're set at the sort of grind that caused vivergate to happen years ago.  The only good thing is that Ostron Reputation doesn't give much in terms of coveted mods like the syndicate did.  It's just more piddly things to do around Cetus.  

10 minutes ago, INight00 said:

The sortie is fine, the three missions go by quickly without pause. Unless you are unlucky and get a defend the target/ area kind of thing.

In your opinion of course.  I happen to see this expanding the mission count from three to five with some pretty middling to poor rewards for the sortie system.  The RNG for sorties seriously needs an inspection and eventually a rework.  Speed of doing the sortie shouldn't be a factor in those rewards either.  

[PakkiTheDog]

1 minute ago, INight00 said:

"rant"

Any suggestions?
You know, some proper feedback?

I do not work for DE, i'm a customer so it's not on me to do their job. But even with that said i gave suggestions... like making the PoE sortie like it was before, with a one mission.

2 minutes ago, INight00 said:

The sortie is fine, the three missions go by quickly without pause. Unless you are unlucky and get a defend the target/ area kind of thing.

The reason why i don't do the bounties is because the time/reward ratio is to low and some missions are way to boring. The "defend the cargo" or "protect the area" ones the most. They basically just changed the sortie into 5 objectives instead of 3 like it used to be.

6 minutes ago, INight00 said:

Some people benefit from the forma drop, just because it affects one, doesn't mean everyone is negatively affected.
The drop chance booster helps those who need argon... should they need/ use it.

Some people benefit from the neurodes drop, but that doesn't mean they should be added into the drop table. Obtaining formas is easy, just do a couple of fisures and build one every day. Compare forma to other rewards like orokin catalyst, reactor, exilus adaptor, drop chance boosters (the same rarity). Not worth it. As for the drop chance booster, it's much better to get or buy the 2x resource booster even for farming rare resources. Even a vet will find a use for the resource booster, while the drop chance one...

[Marine027]

Can partly agree on it.

On the Kuva thou, lets be honest, it is still a failed bandaid, i mostly reroll maybe 5 times at most and i not evne care for rivens, only the oens i get random, don't care to farm kuva and i still get trough the game without problems you know, we got higher stats and stronger weapons but now real new content that actualyl would benefit from a Riven as example, Rivens are cancer adn everoyne who calsl one godlike or focuses on them really should reconsider what game they play in the first place.

Edited January 19, 2018 by Marine027

[.-Dark]

I have a problem with the PoE sortie. After i finish the first incursion (Assassination), i'm asked to find hidden caches, but the incursion won't start when i move to the location. The timer to accept the task runs out and i fail the sortie.

[pavlo555]

44 минуты назад, Radagosh сказал:

but hey it's DE they like RNG and making their playerbase suffer through hours on end of repetitive content to achieve what could be done in 20 minutes with better fleshed out systems.

First off, it is a free-to-play game, so RNG is kinda something we must live with, since it keeps us in. What RNG I want to- and should be- gone even here in an F2P is the per-stat RNG on rivens, go figure in the riven calc that you can roll a stat terribly or perfectly, each one. 250% damage vs 350% damage is quite significant. Even locking the stats won't help.

Secondly, what would you do if you are already done with everything in 20 minutes? Nothing, uninstall time, we don't want that.

[Radagosh]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb pavlo555:

First off, it is a free-to-play game, so RNG is kinda something we must live with, since it keeps us in. What RNG I want to- and should be- gone even here in an F2P is the per-stat RNG on rivens, go figure in the riven calc that you can roll a stat terribly or perfectly, each one. 250% damage vs 350% damage is quite significant. Even locking the stats won't help.

Secondly, what would you do if you are already done with everything in 20 minutes? Nothing, uninstall time, we don't want that.

That's what I felt towards old void and 120min survival for 1 rare prime part - they changed that as well. Now, I understand that RNG is necessary and I'm completely okay with it if it's done in a good way. Riven's and their rerolling system are not. Just look at Terra another free game to see how this system can be done right.

Your second point is great. There are so many systems in the game that aren't dependant on RnG just look at focus, syndicates, modding and leveling. But there are others that depend on it such as the relic system. Are you done with the whole new prime access in 20 minutes after launch? No, you take maybe half a week to a week if you prepped syndirep and void traces. Locking 1-2 stats on rivens wouldn't change people rolling for better ones, it would just make it easier, faster and way more kuva efficient. I'm sorry but I dislike using 3 hours of booster time to farm kuva just to not change my rivenmod after all.

And for sorties and token system, well as we've read in here there are people that gave up on it. And you know what I would too. I've got 500k Endo, 200 Mil creds  50+ of each potato kind and nowadays I wonder why I'm even doing sorties. I mean 1/4 is a riven that's nice, however, what this means is that 3/4 times I can't use the reward, which is not so fun.

To come back to your you're done after 20 minutes point. Well sorties are the only thing for which I'm logging in right now, they usually take around 10 minutes so with my RnGfixes at least I would get another 10 minutes of playtime out of the game.

[pavlo555]

1 час назад, Radagosh сказал:

That's what I felt towards old void and 120min survival for 1 rare prime part - they changed that as well. Now, I understand that RNG is necessary and I'm completely okay with it if it's done in a good way. Riven's and their rerolling system are not. Just look at Terra another free game to see how this system can be done right.

Your second point is great. There are so many systems in the game that aren't dependant on RnG just look at focus, syndicates, modding and leveling. -snipsnip-

Can't disagree completely with rivens, since there are certain arguments to be made, but, well, it isn't the worst.

Now onto syndicates and focus... They are tied to exp. And while It's quite rushable, it's rushable in the most boring way. If we put in token system for sorties, you will be able to be done with sorties, which returns you to focus and syndicates which you got regardless of anything. You can also be done with prime access, and you don't always need the newest cosmetics to return for the same primes you just ground out.

Where am I going with this? We don't need token system, screw that stuff, and throw it out of the window alongside sorties themselves. We need more lategame missions to reward us the stuff we want, have more frequent alerts/stratus/sorties-as-alerts to get guaranteed stuff. As you said, you only login for sorties, as you came to that point -- to the lategame, which there isn't much aside from sorties. And at high levels you get sufficient exp to not need to rush it out, to not resort to viver-like strategies. You invest more time to not only get riven, but also a brewed exilus, a 6 hrs booster of sorts.... Have that in, DE, just give us stronger alerts per MR. This way, you are given an option to get more stuff, more playtime.

[GrayArchon]

2 hours ago, PakkiTheDog said:

I do not work for DE, i'm a customer so it's not on me to do their job.

I feel like this should be obvious, but... games and entertainment in general are different industries than most, and require constant, helpful feedback from their customers to thrive. The developer doesn't know what you want until you tell them.

Edited January 19, 2018 by GrayArchon

[TheLexiConArtist]

2 hours ago, Radagosh said:

That's what I felt towards old void and 120min survival for 1 rare prime part - they changed that as well.

Implying running radiant relicshares (which you're forced to grind for, unlike keys which were shareable without bringing your own) and getting no rare part at all in 8 or more runs (0.9^8^4 = ~3.4% chance of no rare having appeared) is any better than not getting one specific rare part after 6 C-rotations of survival.

Or doing three runs of the same radiant relic and getting four copies of the same uncommon reward all three times (0.2^4^3 = 0.0000004096% supposed chance of occurring).

RNG gonna RNG.

[pavlo555]

30 минут назад, EDYinnit сказал:

Implying running radiant relicshares (which you're forced to grind for, unlike keys which were shareable without bringing your own) and getting no rare part at all in 8 or more runs (0.9^8^4 = ~3.4% chance of no rare having appeared) is any better than not getting one specific rare part after 6 C-rotations of survival.

Or doing three runs of the same radiant relic and getting four copies of the same uncommon reward all three times (0.2^4^3 = 0.0000004096% supposed chance of occurring).

6 C-rotations is also 2 hours, ain't got time for that, got time to run 2 radiant relics that time and 6 some other. And while radiant relics are slow to obtain, they are fast to use, so even if we split that... you aren't running 20 minutes to get to C rotation, you can go for 5 minutes when you stacked some radiants. (Actually this paragraph sounds stupid)

Also, we went to relics due to C rotations being completely cucked. Nothing of value was on A or B rotations as DE never bothered tweaking/playing with them --- everything on C. You just don't get stuff on C.

Edited January 19, 2018 by pavlo555

[BlackCoMerc]

16 hours ago, GrayArchon said:

I feel like this should be obvious, but... games and entertainment in general are different industries than most, and require constant, helpful feedback from their customers to thrive. The developer doesn't know what you want until you tell them.

If the devs are relying on forum suggestions to determine development direction, the game is doomed. Its their job to understand what their customers want and how to give it...

[GinKenshin]

just make poe-only sorties, just like how the void occupy the 3 sortie missions, poe should do the same. 6-8 bounties roughly equals 3 sorties imo

problem is, how will the negative effect work 

[pavlo555]

3 часа назад, GinKenshin сказал:

just make poe-only sorties, just like how the void occupy the 3 sortie missions, poe should do the same. 6-8 bounties roughly equals 3 sorties imo

problem is, how will the negative effect work 

Negative effects in sorties just should NOT include "%Weapon% only" effects. Beauty of PoE is most weapons (except bows/projectiles) see use and therefore, it's nice to... snipe stuff. Removing these options isn't a challenge --- it's just being an A******.

[(PSN)Boomstickman98]

5 hours ago, BlackCoMerc said:

If the devs are relying on forum suggestions to determine development direction, the game is doomed. Its their job to understand what their customers want and how to give it...

That thought train is completely backwards. If DE does not know what we want, and has no way to find out, i.e. through forums, then they will assume the game needs no change, something that actually will doom the game. Furthermore, your train of thought seems to think that everybody wants the exact same thing, when that could not be further from the truth. Everybody has differing opinions on what should be done, meaning that it is way too possible that a lot of the playerbase could end up feeling betrayed if DE misinterprets what we want and does the complete opposite. This would, in turn, severely reduce sales.