Please. Make. Rage-mode, Warframe only, (non-operator)

[StabbyTentacles]

Please. Make. Rage-mode, Warframe only, (non-operator)

To clarify. There is: plenty, a deluge, an avalanche, of operator content, and for all the operator philes, go ahead, knock yourselves out with it.

For the great many players who either are not fans of, or don't enjoy the operator situation. (Please, have some sympathy, some compassion.) There is/has been no escaping it.

I ask now, that Rage-mode be allowed to stand firmly within the realm of  Warframe combat.

 

I am so over, mashing 5 every time I want to get my focus school up, (Insert extensive uncomplimentary, deprecative reasoning as to why operator gameplay is jarring, shrill, and unharmonious.)

 

I'd like to return to a simpler time.

When you could jump into a mission and play Warframe, I remember those days, Pepperidge farm remembers...

[Omega-Shadowblade]

Rage- mode?

[Aeon94]

12 minutes ago, Omega-Shadowblade said:

Rage- mode?

DE said Melee Channelling will be a Rage-Mode.

On 2018-08-04 at 12:20 AM, [DE]Taylor said:

“NEW CHANNELLING” (still very WIP)
We’re toying with the idea of building up your channelling energy for an ultimate melee mode. All we have is animations, we’re looking to play with this system more before we can offer more details:

Equip animations:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Un-equip animations:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by Aeon94

[Omega-Shadowblade]

Just now, Aeon94 said:

DE said Melee Channelling will be a Rage-Mode.

Don't recall that exact description but alright, makes a bit more sense of the context. Still, extremely early phase in development. Might not even make it to the game, too early to really know what it'll do.

[SpicyDinosaur]

I didn't realize we were lacking in content for warframes and had a "deluge" of content for operators. Could you elaborate? 

[NinthAria]

I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but I'm...perplexed why you'd think a revamped warframe mechanic, in the warframe melee combat system, would have anything to do with your Operator. Obviously anything's possible, but it strikes me as very unlikely.

[Nitro747]

... what the heck are you even trying to convey here??? õ_o

[(XBOX)BKRS Veeco]

6 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

Please. Make. Rage-mode, Warframe only, (non-operator)

To clarify. There is: plenty, a deluge, an avalanche, of operator content, and for all the operator philes, go ahead, knock yourselves out with it.

For the great many players who either are not fans of, or don't enjoy the operator situation. (Please, have some sympathy, some compassion.) There is/has been no escaping it.

I ask now, that Rage-mode be allowed to stand firmly within the realm of  Warframe combat.

 

I am so over, mashing 5 every time I want to get my focus school up, (Insert extensive uncomplimentary, deprecative reasoning as to why operator gameplay is jarring, shrill, and unharmonious.)

 

I'd like to return to a simpler time.

When you could jump into a mission and play Warframe, I remember those days, Pepperidge farm remembers...

Operator content is going to be included in updates, it's a part of the game, the game changes. Rage mode is not "jumping into and playing Warframe." As a frame phone you can "jump in and play warframe" on old content and stick with the old Warframe you know, all you want to. If they were to go through with this, and if the operator was involved in anyway, it is extremely unlikely that you would need the operator, over the option of them both getting some variant of this individually.

However, despite the fact that I haven't heard nor do I see any operator crap with the information youve provided, I can't even take this pitiful begging seriously. If you wanna post a rant session about something that isn't even out yet, then post the information you've been given to lead you to make this assumption.

5 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

I didn't realize we were lacking in content for warframes and had a "deluge" of content for operators. Could you elaborate? 

I concur, while the story quests have been adding scenarios where you need to use the operator, the only other thing I've encountered where you HAVE to use the operator is eidolons and kuva, and if you play in a group, you don't even have to use it yourself. People need to start making friends instead of throwing a fit because they can't solo anymore. It is an online game ffs. I really hope that my operator is more viable after I get through the focus trees and get the arcanes, as of right now he dies too quickly with a rank 3 vigor arcane and a leveled amp. He's not viable for missions outside of eidolong, I just use him for the lols.

[StabbyTentacles]

5 hours ago, NinthAria said:

I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but I'm...perplexed why you'd think a revamped warframe mechanic, in the warframe melee combat system, would have anything to do with your Operator. Obviously anything's possible, but it strikes me as very unlikely.

Am concerned/troubled as to the ongoing/current 'trend' of shoehorning/insinuating Operator's into every combat system.

2 hours ago, Nitro747 said:

... what the heck are you even trying to convey here??? õ_o

A suggestion. That is explained, considered/argued, in the Op.  (õ_o x2)

5 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

I didn't realize we were lacking in content for warframes and had a "deluge" of content for operators. Could you elaborate? 

I'll refer you to...

6 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

To clarify. There is: plenty, a deluge, an avalanche, of operator content, and for all the operator philes, go ahead, knock yourselves out with it.

Elaborate? See Game. You can download it from here https://www.warframe.com/

 

[StabbyTentacles]

35 minutes ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

I concur, while the story quests have been adding scenarios where you need to use the operator, the only other thing I've encountered where you HAVE to use the operator is eidolons and kuva, and if you play in a group, you don't even have to use it yourself. People need to start making friends instead of throwing a fit because they can't solo anymore. It is an online game ffs. I really hope that my operator is more viable after I get through the focus trees and get the arcanes, as of right now he dies too quickly with a rank 3 vigor arcane and a leveled amp. He's not viable for missions outside of eidolong, I just use him for the lols.

No fit here, aside your own.

I do have a maxed out operator.

Oh and friends too lmao, and I play with friends, do you breath air? (Point is friend, friends wont make the operator any more fun. Think of it this way. You know how you 😍 the operator? Well some player's don't. Not for whatever imagined, insubstantial reasoning you apply...

It's nothing personal.  Some Warframe player's do not like playing Warframe with operator's. Could be any reason really; I myself don't like their gameplay even when maxed out, even if it/they were Op Af and could 1 shot everything, to me it's/they're not fun.

 

Edited August 14, 2018 by StabbyTentacles

[SpicyDinosaur]

1 hour ago, StabbyTentacles said:

I'll refer you to...

8 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

To clarify. There is: plenty, a deluge, an avalanche, of operator content, and for all the operator philes, go ahead, knock yourselves out with it.

Elaborate? See Game. You can download it from here https://www.warframe.com/

 

Oh, apparently your word is a definitive fact now, my bad. Good thing you posted this topic, brah. 😉

Don't bother elaborating, that might get confusing or something, offering actual information and not just repeating your undetailed statement over and over.

 

Edit: I think maybe, if you want to make your point, you should try honey instead of vinegar, so to speak, when people dare to disagree.

Edited August 14, 2018 by SpicyDinosaur

[(XBOX)BKRS Veeco]

3 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

Oh, apparently your word is a definitive fact now, my bad. Good thing you posted this topic, brah. 😉

Don't bother elaborating, that might get confusing or something, offering actual information and not just repeating your undetailed statement over and over.

 

Edit: I think maybe, if you want to make your point, you should try honey instead of vinegar, so to speak, when people dare to disagree.

I concur 

 

For real though, if they're blatently forcing you to have to use you're operator on the constant, I will support you, but I don't see it. I went the past 3 days without having to pull him once. I farmed 6 maiming strikes and an argon scope, 8 forma, 3 prime sets, and a crap ton of MP. So I still don't see how you can't just "hop into a mission and play warframe" cause that's exactly what I did, it was like being MR 8 all over again,and but I had all my stuff from now I suppose when fortuna drops you're going to post ranting about their open envrionments and how it's ruining the game? They are in no way removing "old Warframe" from the game. Theyve altered some of it, yes. They've moved things like arcanes which was introduced with the raid they had that nobody liked, so they moved it to new content rather than to old content.

Edit: TLDR if you don't care to, but at least go back and actually read my first post and address the stuff in there.

 

 

4 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

No fit here, aside your own.

I do have a maxed out operator.

Oh and friends too lmao, and I play with friends, do you breath air? (Point is friend, friends wont make the operator any more fun. Think of it this way. You know how you 😍 the operator? Well some player's don't. Not for whatever imagined, insubstantial reasoning you apply...

It's nothing personal.  Some Warframe player's do not like playing Warframe with operator's. Could be any reason really; I myself don't like their gameplay even when maxed out, even if it/they were Op Af and could 1 shot everything, to me it's/they're not fun.

 

You're not addressing anything I said just the way I said it, I don't 😍 the operator, I just don't see how he is required for anything other than the above listed material. Since you failed to address it, let me quote that for you, maybe you'll read it this time

 

5 hours ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

operator is eidolons and kuva,

And story, cause apparently I deleted that part by mistake.

Other than those things where is the operator a requirement? If anything it only offers benefits which are entire optional to use, yet you're acting as though you're forced to. Since you're REFUSING to read my statements, I never once said playing with friends makes operators more fun, what I did say was

5 hours ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

and if you play in a group, you don't even have to use it yourself

The only thing I would've had to use him for that I wanted was arcanes, which while they sell good, arcanes were thrown into the eidolons so that there was a reason to still do it, so you've got 3 things you'll have to use operators for to get stuff you may want, but if you're suggesting that they remove any rewarding content for operators that's stupid

 

So maybe you're next post should at least address what I'm saying and not be another mindless, nonsensical, uninformative post that adheres to nothing that's been stated.

Where is it that you have to switch to your operator to do anything for your Warframe in the same sense that you're assuming you're going to have to 

5 hours ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

mashing 5 every time

To which by the way, what do you mean by 

 

5 hours ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

mashing 5 every time I want to get my focus school up

Anyways? Because if you wanna get focus exp, get a lens and put it on weapons and frames specific to farming it out, boom. Problem solved.

And if you so DESPERATELY feel the need to reply again, why don't you provide sources to half the crap you're ranting about, that way we can all be on the same page here, and maybe, just maybe, be able to see your side of things. Unjustified rants about something youre hardly required to use isn't going to win you any favors.

Now, the things I listed where you have to use the operator are the only things I've encountered, so if I'm missing some big event, let me know. Cause right now it just seems like you're upset the operator is in the game, which I don't want to believe is the point based on...

11 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

for all the operator philes, go ahead, knock yourselves out with it.

Also provide some sort of proof for

 

11 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

For the great many players who either are not fans of, or don't enjoy the operator situation. 

And

11 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

There is/has been no escaping it.

Here's your homework kiddo, I don't care if you finish it.

 

Edited August 14, 2018 by (XB1)BKRS Veeco
Tldr edit

[(XBOX)BKRS Veeco]

4 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

Point is friend, friends wont make the operator any more fun.

Also, you're opinion here may be a little too clouded, my buddy doesn't enjoy the operator much aside from energy bubble from zen tree, but we did a interception and after he saw me just sniping enemies and hiding in void mode, he started doing it and had a blast, now not to say this is something you can just go around doing ALL the time, but some moments can be made enjoyable if you can look past your anti-operator agenda.

[Synpai]

They have only shown Warframe animations for the trigger and exit for this mode....where is this even coming from...?

 

Even in my rework of focus, channeling stays purely Warframe.

Let's compare how much "Operator content" we've got compared to Warframe?

Regardless don't be fooled by the "Warframe is the name of the game" argument, Warframe is a universe with a set of governing rules as such Operators and warframes go hand in hand....body in body...mind in mind....idk you get the point though.

 

For the Operator-phobic players I can imagine that's where the Umbra Warframe(s) and Mods will come in.

They were the focus of this line of story quests and uh...Warframes can't talk, so how interesting is it for bosses and such to throw one liners at us? or have a whole narrative just bouncing off of Warframes like trampolines? GOD EATER. Go play God Eater: Resurrection (or watch it)  and you'll see how strange it is to have a character be silent through cinematics. It's like responding to a paragraph with "K" but the person keeps going like you gave a full response. 

 

11 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

I'd like to return to a simpler time.

When you could jump into a mission and play Warframe, I remember those days, Pepperidge farm remembers...

That time is behind us. 'member when Nova insta killed the map? I 'member. But when new things come we can either: "change and adapt" like a void bug or bash against that sentient resistance like a woodpecker does a tree.  Though I technically bash against it due to no need for resistance removal, (Big Suprise incoming) I support the future that operators can bring. 

[Klokwerkaos]

Much like people who hate arch wing, people who hate operators haven't earned their way up to get most use out of it.  I didn't like arch wing at first, till I could carry every mission.  Didn't like operators either till I farmed some focus.  Simple solution?  Up your arsenal

[VentiGlondi]

How do you even expect operators to use a mechanic related to melee

Operators don't even have their own operator-exclusive melee weapons

[AvaloN1101]

2 hours ago, Klokwerkaos said:

Much like people who hate arch wing, people who hate operators haven't earned their way up to get most use out of it.  I didn't like arch wing at first, till I could carry every mission.  Didn't like operators either till I farmed some focus.  Simple solution?  Up your arsenal

So you only dislike stuff until you get super strong, borderline OP, and then you have fun? That... doesn't sound like fun at all. Imagine sitting through 20 waves of Defense, doing nothing but being Saryn. I don't think I need a spoiler alert to say it's not fun at all lol. If you like to be lazy and take it easy, then cool beans. You do that. I actually like to DO stuff in my games, like move more than 2 fingers.

Getting back to the original topic, there's a fundamental design difference you're not really addressing. When was the last time your Archwing was absolutely necessary for farming something on a daily, or even weekly, basis? The occasional alert, Atlas component farming, the rare Razorback armada... you don't even really need to do any of those. In your quest to "up your arsenal" you can't say the same about Operators. 

Do you need 120% piercing mods? No; there aren't even many weapons that it's absolutely necessary on to make it an amazing weapon. How about Atlas? ...for the lols, yes. Yes, he is absolutely necessary then. 

If you want to improve your arsenal, could you skip arcanes? How about kuva? No.

The fact is, DE is getting MUCH better at integrating additional mechanics into the game. And it's not always a good thing. Operators are not very intuitive; they're creative, but under-developed as a mechanic.

Should you be able to use your Operator wherever you want? Yes. I disagree with the OP. I want my 4' 8" operator to beat people up with War. Sue me.

Should you be forced to use your Operator? No. Just like if I don't want to bring Inaros, Nidus, or Wukong to a no-shield alert or similar, I shouldn't need to. I'll just bring Saryn.

[Fallen_Echo]

37 minutes ago, AvaloN1101 said:

So you only dislike stuff until you get super strong, borderline OP, and then you have fun? That... doesn't sound like fun at all. Imagine sitting through 20 waves of Defense, doing nothing but being Saryn. I don't think I need a spoiler alert to say it's not fun at all lol. If you like to be lazy and take it easy, then cool beans. You do that. I actually like to DO stuff in my games, like move more than 2 fingers.

Getting back to the original topic, there's a fundamental design difference you're not really addressing. When was the last time your Archwing was absolutely necessary for farming something on a daily, or even weekly, basis? The occasional alert, Atlas component farming, the rare Razorback armada... you don't even really need to do any of those. In your quest to "up your arsenal" you can't say the same about Operators. 

Do you need 120% piercing mods? No; there aren't even many weapons that it's absolutely necessary on to make it an amazing weapon. How about Atlas? ...for the lols, yes. Yes, he is absolutely necessary then. 

If you want to improve your arsenal, could you skip arcanes? How about kuva? No.

The fact is, DE is getting MUCH better at integrating additional mechanics into the game. And it's not always a good thing. Operators are not very intuitive; they're creative, but under-developed as a mechanic.

Should you be able to use your Operator wherever you want? Yes. I disagree with the OP. I want my 4' 8" operator to beat people up with War. Sue me.

Should you be forced to use your Operator? No. Just like if I don't want to bring Inaros, Nidus, or Wukong to a no-shield alert or similar, I shouldn't need to. I'll just bring Saryn.

Thats it the main problem of operators they were practically shoehorned into the game and their stance hasnt improved much.

I wouldnt have this much problem with operators if they would be essentially the same as archwing mode, a few missions here and there, some minor content around but nothing what i must get to raise the power of my frame. Sidecontent you might aswell call it, deciding if its worth your time or not is entirely on you, nothing is forced but this is not the case with operators.

Kuva got removed from the operator forced gameplays thanks to the survival mode but now the arcanes are locked behind them. Well atleast i can pay some plat to ignore the operator gameplay but every time a bad host messes up the zenurik dash i start to rage because atleast in the old focus i havent needed to deal with their clunky movement and horrible apparance.

Also apart from the shoehorning i still want to get a meaningful character customization, body sliders, face creator and whatnot, i get it that you can use some fashion to create a good looking operator but if i want a femine looking teen for my octavia or a buffed up guy for rhino i have no choices.

[AvaloN1101]

25 minutes ago, Fallen_Echo said:

Thats it the main problem of operators they were practically shoehorned into the game and their stance hasnt improved much.

I wouldnt have this much problem with operators if they would be essentially the same as archwing mode, a few missions here and there, some minor content around but nothing what i must get to raise the power of my frame. Sidecontent you might aswell call it, deciding if its worth your time or not is entirely on you, nothing is forced but this is not the case with operators.

Kuva got removed from the operator forced gameplays thanks to the survival mode but now the arcanes are locked behind them. Well atleast i can pay some plat to ignore the operator gameplay but every time a bad host messes up the zenurik dash i start to rage because atleast in the old focus i havent needed to deal with their clunky movement and horrible apparance.

Also apart from the shoehorning i still want to get a meaningful character customization, body sliders, face creator and whatnot, i get it that you can use some fashion to create a good looking operator but if i want a femine looking teen for my octavia or a buffed up guy for rhino i have no choices.

Well yeah, just about anything has a work-around to obtain it. It's called plat. You can buy anything you want from the market or other players with plat. Pre-rolled god-tier rivens, arcanes, weapons, you name it. But if you actually want to feel the achievement of farming it yourself yet you don't really enjoy the gameplay of it, it becomes a hassle; a huge negative experience that you don't look forward to doing. Plat resolves the question of not having time but wanting the item. It doesn't really resolve the question of not having fun but wanting the item. You get it by paying plat, but what's the fun in that? It's boring. I understand it's give-and-take though, so I don't personally worry too much about it. Beggars can't be choosers.

Don't get me wrong though, I definitely agree with your statement. I'm not arguing anything, just adding to it.

In the end though, I feel like we can trust the DE devs to improve on the situation in the future. The game didn't get to where it's at overnight, and it certainly won't get to where it's going in that fashion either.

[(XBOX)BKRS Veeco]

1 hour ago, Fallen_Echo said:

Thats it the main problem of operators they were practically shoehorned into the game and their stance hasnt improved much.

I wouldnt have this much problem with operators if they would be essentially the same as archwing mode, a few missions here and there, some minor content around but nothing what i must get to raise the power of my frame. Sidecontent you might aswell call it, deciding if its worth your time or not is entirely on you, nothing is forced but this is not the case with operators.

Kuva got removed from the operator forced gameplays thanks to the survival mode but now the arcanes are locked behind them. Well atleast i can pay some plat to ignore the operator gameplay but every time a bad host messes up the zenurik dash i start to rage because atleast in the old focus i havent needed to deal with their clunky movement and horrible apparance.

Also apart from the shoehorning i still want to get a meaningful character customization, body sliders, face creator and whatnot, i get it that you can use some fashion to create a good looking operator but if i want a femine looking teen for my octavia or a buffed up guy for rhino i have no choices.

Arcanes used to be locked behind the raid, which was removed and replaced by plains, so yes the arcanes got moved to new content instead of old, that way people feel rewarded for playing their operator and there's a reason to level into them, and there will be more content where the operator will be necessary, but they're not going to focus all the content around the operator. Nor should they ignore it, there are people who enjoy the operator, it's a part of the game now. You don't have to use him yourself though for anything outside of story, find people who do enjoy playing it and they can do all the work for you.

[AvaloN1101]

1 hour ago, (XB1)BKRS Veeco said:

Arcanes used to be locked behind the raid, which was removed and replaced by plains, so yes the arcanes got moved to new content instead of old, that way people feel rewarded for playing their operator and there's a reason to level into them, and there will be more content where the operator will be necessary, but they're not going to focus all the content around the operator. Nor should they ignore it, there are people who enjoy the operator, it's a part of the game now. You don't have to use him yourself though for anything outside of story, find people who do enjoy playing it and they can do all the work for you.

It really feels like you're nit-picking words here, then trying to make a sound argument out of it. Biased or not, all opinions are important, whether you agree with them or not. Look at it objectively for a second though.

Arcanes. Whether you want to admit it or not, there are quite many arcanes locked behind Operator use, in terms of 'farming'. Of course you can buy them with plat. Everyone knows that so there's no real benefit in reiterating it. It's also besides the point. If you want to farm arcanes and you have a good grasp on Warframe combat but not so much with Operator usage, you're in for a frustrating time. Sure, you can practice and get better. You can work your behind off to craft a good Amp. In the end, if you're not comfortable with using the Operator, or just don't enjoy it, you're not gonna be able to farm arcanes yourself. Thus you hit the plat wall.

Kuva. Operator mode is required to complete kuva siphon & flood missions. We also have the endless kuva farming node in the Kuva Fortress, in which no Operator usage is needed. However, the amount of kuva rewarded honestly cannot be said to be worthwhile. It takes 3,500 kuva to re-roll a riven mod from #10 onwards. Every 5 minutes on Taveuni, you get 2 capsules to harvest kuva. Let's say you're absolutely perfect and complete 2 capsules every 5 minutes, for a total of 400 kuva. With no resource booster, you'd need 9 successful kuva harvests, which will take 45 minutes for ONE re-roll opportunity, and with a resource booster it'd take just under 25 minutes for the same amount. This is really unattractive as unrewarding as it is. If you have the time to farm kuva all day, awesome. More power to you. Not everyone is the same. So kuva siphons end up being the best use of your time, as far as kuva farming is concerned. Which is locked behind Operator usage. You're other "option" is to buy pre-rolled rivens with plat. Surprise surprise, another plat wall.

If you can think outside the box, and you're making an attempt to understand the game mechanics and can appreciate it, it really takes no effort to see all this.

I am NOT saying Operators are dumb or are absolutely required. I've said this in another post and I'll say it again: the Operator mechanic doesn't have the depth to be as integrated as it is right now. DE has done an outstanding job integrating many things into the game that we know and love. But imagine if certain mods, equipment, frames, etc., could only be acquired from Conclave. Many games in recent years have made that dire mistake: REQUIRING their players to play a certain way to achieve a goal or acquire certain progression-geared equipment. People stop playing, or refuse to do that, become stagnant, and quit.

I AM saying that making Operator usage NECESSARY to accomplish certain tasks was a mistake. As you've said before, you didn't need to use the Operator to acquire all those things. That's perfectly fine. It's also perfectly fine that there are certain things that need to be improved. When you start thinking stuff like, "...everything is fine how it is," is when the game will stagnate. DE, to their credit, doesn't have that mindset. Many players do, though.

Give DE a chance to hear what everyone thinks about the features of the game. Discuss it toxicity-free. Don't just start quashing people because you don't agree with what they're saying.

[StabbyTentacles]

9 hours ago, Klokwerkaos said:

Much like people who hate arch wing, people who hate operators haven't earned their way up to get most use out of it.  I didn't like arch wing at first, till I could carry every mission.  Didn't like operators either till I farmed some focus.  Simple solution?  Up your arsenal

Given we've been made to play them down the barrel of a gun, for 2+ years now, I think its safe to say I've used 'it'.

16 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

I do have a maxed out operator.

Its not like I've intentionally, needed, to try (apply myself to) not like them. Quite the opposite, but alas they suck. And they: undermine, frustrate, and discourage, good gameplay.  

9 hours ago, VentiGlondi said:

How do you even expect operators to use a mechanic related to melee

Operators don't even have their own operator-exclusive melee weapons

Yet, but hey I am really hoping you're right here. 

I'd like to note here, although I have made it clear that I do not enjoy operator's, I do not demand those who do, not play them. I ask, that they be made more optional, is all.

Instead of having to use them players could as easily just hit 5 and automatically have access to the focus. (I'll leave it at that.)

5 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

Thats it the main problem of operators they were practically shoehorned into the game and their stance hasnt improved much.

I wouldnt have this much problem with operators if they would be essentially the same as archwing mode, a few missions here and there, some minor content around but nothing what i must get to raise the power of my frame. Sidecontent you might aswell call it, deciding if its worth your time or not is entirely on you, nothing is forced but this is not the case with operators.

Kuva got removed from the operator forced gameplays thanks to the survival mode but now the arcanes are locked behind them. Well atleast i can pay some plat to ignore the operator gameplay but every time a bad host messes up the zenurik dash i start to rage because atleast in the old focus i havent needed to deal with their clunky movement and horrible apparance.

Also apart from the shoehorning i still want to get a meaningful character customization, body sliders, face creator and whatnot, i get it that you can use some fashion to create a good looking operator but if i want a femine looking teen for my octavia or a buffed up guy for rhino i have no choices.

This is exactly my understanding of the operator bottom line.

Essentially you must use them. 

2 hours ago, AvaloN1101 said:

I am NOT saying Operators are dumb or are absolutely required. I've said this in another post and I'll say it again: the Operator mechanic doesn't have the depth to be as integrated as it is right now.

Agreed.

2 hours ago, AvaloN1101 said:

I AM saying that making Operator usage NECESSARY to accomplish certain tasks was a mistake.

Completely agree AvaloN1101, it was the wrong move. Make them optional, and give player's far greater customization. In appearance, and gameplay.

You want/enjoy Operating, well operate your a😈 off, hit the maximum Operator option.

You find Operating is not for you, hit the minimum Operator option. 

But instead, we all have to now have these graceless, Operator's jumping in and out of Warframe gameplay. With ever increasing, snowballing frequency.  

Edited August 14, 2018 by StabbyTentacles

[Klokwerkaos]

13 hours ago, AvaloN1101 said:

So you only dislike stuff until you get super strong, borderline OP, and then you have fun? That... doesn't sound like fun at all. Imagine sitting through 20 waves of Defense, doing nothing but being Saryn. I don't think I need a spoiler alert to say it's not fun at all lol. If you like to be lazy and take it easy, then cool beans. You do that. I actually like to DO stuff in my games, like move more than 2 fingers.

Getting back to the original topic, there's a fundamental design difference you're not really addressing. When was the last time your Archwing was absolutely necessary for farming something on a daily, or even weekly, basis? The occasional alert, Atlas component farming, the rare Razorback armada... you don't even really need to do any of those. In your quest to "up your arsenal" you can't say the same about Operators. 

Do you need 120% piercing mods? No; there aren't even many weapons that it's absolutely necessary on to make it an amazing weapon. How about Atlas? ...for the lols, yes. Yes, he is absolutely necessary then. 

If you want to improve your arsenal, could you skip arcanes? How about kuva? No.

The fact is, DE is getting MUCH better at integrating additional mechanics into the game. And it's not always a good thing. Operators are not very intuitive; they're creative, but under-developed as a mechanic.

Should you be able to use your Operator wherever you want? Yes. I disagree with the OP. I want my 4' 8" operator to beat people up with War. Sue me.

Should you be forced to use your Operator? No. Just like if I don't want to bring Inaros, Nidus, or Wukong to a no-shield alert or similar, I shouldn't need to. I'll just bring Saryn.

You can decide what is fun for you, you cannot decide what is fun for everyone and the condescension of your post is not welcome, please refrain from that in the future.  It's ok to disagree, it's not ok to put down someone's opinion as inferior.

Additionally, you put my post in a hyperbolic narrative that misrepresents it, also not appreciated.  Perhaps don't comment on my stuff until you cam engage without rhetorical attack please and thank you.

[Klokwerkaos]

6 hours ago, StabbyTentacles said:

Given we've been made to play them down the barrel of a gun, for 2+ years now, I think its safe to say I've used 'it'.

Its not like I've intentionally, needed, to try (apply myself to) not like them. Quite the opposite, but alas they suck. And they: undermine, frustrate, and discourage, good gameplay.  

Yet, but hey I am really hoping you're right here. 

I'd like to note here, although I have made it clear that I do not enjoy operator's, I do not demand those who do, not play them. I ask, that they be made more optional, is all.

Instead of having to use them players could as easily just hit 5 and automatically have access to the focus. (I'll leave it at that.)

This is exactly my understanding of the operator bottom line.

Essentially you must use them. 

Agreed.

Completely agree AvaloN1101, it was the wrong move. Make them optional, and give player's far greater customization. In appearance, and gameplay.

You want/enjoy Operating, well operate your a😈 off, hit the maximum Operator option.

You find Operating is not for you, hit the minimum Operator option. 

But instead, we all have to now have these graceless, Operator's jumping in and out of Warframe gameplay. With ever increasing, snowballing frequency.  

Saying you've used it, and saying you've maxed out all your focus trees and pool are two very different things and provide very different perspectives.  Things change a lot on warframe as the power level change a at various pivots, operators are no exception.  Synergies matter.

[StabbyTentacles]

2 hours ago, Klokwerkaos said:

Saying you've used it, and saying you've maxed out all your focus trees and pool are two very different things and provide very different perspectives.  Things change a lot on warframe as the power level change a at various pivots, operators are no exception.  Synergies matter.

Okey to be clear: I have used it. I have maxed out all focus trees... to the point where I have literally, many millions uninvested. It is not possible for me to be anymore powerful. As an operator. In the game. As it stands.

Furthermore: had this maxing out process made me an in-game living god clearing the map with the push of a button, I'm sure I would still not enjoy the operator.

Why?

It has no synergy/team work, with other players, unlike Warframes.

It has little to no finesse, unlike Warframes.

It breaks in-game immersion, unlike Warframes.

It is redundant/unnecessary, (only you are forced into using it,) unlike Warframes.

It has no place in the game, except where it has been forced into gameplay, unlike Warframes.

If Warframes were giant mechs, or super Gundam Mobile Suits, or Evangelions and we pooped out of them, to run around as little moon-wizards. I guess I could see some reason for that, but they are not, and there is no practical/good reason. But I digress, forget any reasoned, coherent thoughts as to why operator's are simply silly. It's their gameplay that makes them lessen Warframe as a game.  The operator was the last thing, a game that needed to work on its in game combat needed.