Lord_Drod

I've been pretty clear why I'm against it and have specifically addressed the original post. You brought up the RNG, not me.

They don't need to make the table worse. If anything they should remove the arcane from that table and make it a guaranteed tau. You have already made great points about how its not an exclusive reward. The system doesn't need to be catered to people that aren't willing to engage with it, simply in the name of subjective fun. It's perfectly fine to have netracells as the alternative. They aren't equal missions and shouldn't give equal rewards.

I would guess that they do since that is an extension of your warframe.

I know where you stand. I was just saying I don't agree with his suggestion as someone that is neither for or against the gear randomizer. Although, I guess technically speaking, I am for it, even though personally I'd be against it, because it would make the experience a lot different in pubs - where things like mirror would be an extremely boring snoozefest, or everyone would play revenant etc. So overall the experience might be less fun running with the same setups. There is more going on than just randomized gear in EDA and it should not just award efficiency. I don't believe they will actually do this anyway.

I'm neutral on the gear randomizer. Whatever they roll out for EDA, that's their thing, but I'll work within the parameters. I think it should reward more than just efficiency if you're willing to engage with it. And it's still more challenging to use RNG, even if its not our idea of challenge. You know why they do it. Even ignoring RNG, the mission is still a harder mission than netracells are and shouldn't be rewarded the same. I could see them adjusting the RNG some before giving same rewards.

Nah, there shouldn't be an alternative to EDA to get the same rewards. It's supposed to be end game content. That makes no sense. You can't compare it to other game modes. That's why they have the point system in the first place. Alternatively, you can get these same rewards for 500 captures. So they can't and won't do that.

lol but aren't they tanky enough? Sometimes the rogue mechs are hard to kill. I was testing stuff last week and 20 round of tennokis was barely denting them, especially if they were eximus? Then sometimes they snap go down. I know they have weakspots... I got distracted though and forgot. I was testing regular melee and optimizing iron bride and there was variance. I forget what the modifiers were last week. This week I didn't have trouble killing a summoned voidrig in mirror with bone. I know voidrig has better damage, but bonewidow has better movement. Mod to skip hahaha. No please not tankier...wait as long as I can just run along sure whatever. Although survival might be tough with some modifiers? nah. Nah, definitely not leeching. There's so many differing levels of skill and experience, DE had to know that would be regularly occurring within the mode. I am sure most people would be happy with a wisp in squad. The cc is good too, on the enemies it works on I guess. And the mech is a fine way to contribute, even if its not the preferred thing to use. You can do a ton of damage, protect and stay alive. The mech is safe from the liminus guys too I think, so you're less likely to go down and make the mission more challenging (not saying you have an issue, but in general). It's kinda silly how there is a no operator modifier, but it would be worse if we had no access to the mech in this mode, as its the one tile where you can play SP without a cooldown with a mech and then they'd just instantly take that away. I mean, its not like you are gonna get in that clunker for an exterm bounty run, so why even have it at all? Then by having it, the mission is less challenging. Then I guess they don't want to limit companions, since they were just reworked? I guess its just one mission a week you have to work around. I think you'll get used to it, regardless of the changes they make. Most new content, only feels bad at first. I thought thrax guys were tough when I first came back after a year off, but they are just another enemy now. Maybe I'm just slower than other players at new content, but adapt eventually. They want to provide some new challenge or thinking, but not make it too hard, despite what it says.

I'd rather them rework and update old game modes that are dead due to being inaccessible outside of one tile or only existing for a particular frame. Then new game modes. For example, Circuit was good as far as having different mission types within the same endless mission. Why isn't there an option like this for other areas, where there's resources and rotational rewards using our own gear? Where's endless eximus stronghold defense? Why is cascade or flood only on zariman? Why is Armageddon not updated? So many things but mot is still mot whether I'm playing a new frame or rework. So I wish frames would fall much farther down the list. I'd like to see tile reworks as well. Expand corpus ship to include so many lost areas. Earth Defense, rework gas city IO and index, new corpus ship defense. Rework sanctum mirror so the parkour is meaningful and not all within sling range etc. Frames? Yawn.

It's a f2p game. I'm sure they make more money off RNG formats while also creating more difficulty without having to create and balance a complex and demanding mode. It's a win win. The challenge wouldn't be as prevalent if you can pick optimal choices for mirror defense or disruption. The core gameplay has to provide this and rng will mask or suppress a lot of the setups that trivialize the missions. I'm always hopeful for new game modes even if they personally aren't what I'm looking for. While I'd like freedom to run my choice of gear as well I don't think it would enhance my experience of the mode too much.

Voltage, since you brought up arbitrations. I can relate to that feeling of failure, but we've had so much power creep since arb has been released, when I go back, its just a cake walk. It's not SP, the enemies start much lower level etc. It's a pretty chill farm with all the tools we have now and experience acquired since release. I'm still waiting for a steel arb mode, but I guess that's what deep arch is? An endless mode, perhaps with some updated arch melee mods and stuff would be cool or something new! However, on the other side, it can be fun if your teammates do go down in arb and you have to res all of them carrying points on a low HP build already, and trying not to fail the mission. I think overall that's better than having perma death where you'd lose teammates forever. I'm interested in hearing if you'll still be feeling the same adrenaline rush with Deep Archimedea Mirror Defense in a few weeks or months or will that start to wear off? Will groups become more prepared and used to the demands while the lesser prepared drop out? If it becomes that trivial level, where you don't have to focus or think as much, which should be more likely with a diverse arsenal, and better teammates (due to investment, experience, or both), will it lose some of that value? I completely agree that it is nice when people don't go all out and trivialize the objective. That's one thing that ruined scarlet spear for me was playing with mesa and limbos in space and there was nothing to do at all but just walk around. Granted if that event came back, I can cover so much more ground now I'd enjoy it a lot more, but I wouldn't want or need limbo/frost to protect. Unless you're playing extremely high levels, you don't need to overgear for things like mobile defense and normal defense. The forced randomizer puts you in situations where the mode is more enjoyable from a challenge standpoint. If you had 2 defense frames every attempt, it would become very boring, especially since killing isn't a requirement. I still think mirror defense sanctum needs better glyph placement and maybe even a better spawn room for the targets altogether. The parkour for the eyes on the boss is just much more spread out, which is a good thing. The glyphs shouldn't all be within 10-20m from the target. The personal debuffs and mission modifiers are a great way to add to a challenging mode. However, the core gameplay in sanctum is still missing. Does anybody like running anything other than exterm for rep? That should tell you how much the modes in general are lacking. I believe some better core gameplay with these added modifiers would go a long way. RNG is a separate issue for some people, but you can see how allowing top gear would eliminate a lot of the fun/challenge and it's masking for what are otherwise very dull gameplay modes at the core.

@SirKnumDang that is pretty fast. How do you know which is the 3rd one? I usually attempt this, but end up going to a terminal. You don't hack any of them? I usually get turned around there without one hack. So how quickly do you get to the netracell, like a 1:30? Well I knew getting to the netracell was the hard part and why can't they fix the circles where 100% is accessible? It's silly if part of it is out of bounds on a tile that large. You could try using odomedic to counter health drain.

I've had to switch my heavy attack button to avoid the void blast bug and a side effect is depending on whether my melee or secondary is out? not sure...I have to hit different keys to throw the amphors. I don't see how you could even set this up in the UI, but its related to your issue. Default heavy attack still works to throw with one out, but not the other.

This was a bug that got fixed. I reported it. It was not showing, but I can confirm it is showing now.

On the flip side, it is funny that steel essence excavation incursions are only 200 cryotic now, while interception incursion takes 10 mins. Archon Defense is pretty slow because of the two tiles as well. Earth and Gas city are large with spawns coming from the corners and a lot of obstacles blocking line of sight. Although I guess we are lucky corpus ship defense is not in the rotation.

Deimos needs a moon, where the old derelict missions reside. Then Deimos is the open world since they are completely different tiles. Sanctum being on Deimos though makes sense to me more than the derelict does.

There already has been. The first week to unlock the mode. They aren't on every week and for me, I'll just have to choose between op and specters. The companion is still around. I'm just saying there's ways to work around bad RNG if you're utilizing what you have access to. Those things are all useful in a squad as well.

Excavation is the worst at high levels. I am totally in favor of excavators receiving some kind of buff. I don't know why they didn't. Defense was a lot more manageable. Pretty much any bullet takes it down at the cap, but gets bad around enemy level 1k . It's definitely the most annoying mode in circuit, even using defense frames. You still have to wipe the entire surrounding area or it will just insta die on spawn. Between operator, gear, a mech, companion and a flex slot that is plenty. Also, skip the rogue mechs. They aren't very fast. You only have to kill them in disruption where they are much easier or if you are trying to decrease mirror defense timers, but I wouldn't summon one unless you have a mech sitting on the spawn point ready to smash them. I guess in survival you might have to kill them, but could also have a mech ready there too.

I agree. I guess they are trying to force coordination more than making it unforgiving. Locking you into the same gear for all 3 missions should force you to work together more instead of everyone individually adjusting for each mission type. However, I don't really see that as much of an issue when you only get a small selection and can only take one piece of gear on your own to get max rewards. Then if they were separate you could abuse your one piece of gear to something more tailored to the mission type. Simply locking you into your chosen gear and parameters for the full mission could solve this issue and let you run each mission separately, while also allowing you to start with a fresh group, in case you lost some players. The only issue with that is you'd have the ability to forma and adjust your builds within your loadout for each mission also. I don't really see that as a problem.

Endo is hardly the main feature of this game. Most of the endo cost is just on the last rank or two which doesn't really provide that much performance increase. You shouldn't really max mods early on and only invest in mods you know are going to be used all the time. Endo is awarded in so many different ways now, railjack, bounties, selling all your duplicates etc. If you play the game doing other stuff you enjoy, the endo accumulates naturally. Just go at your own pace and don't feel rushed to max mods or get to a certain point quickly and you'll enjoy it a lot more.

lol I was surprised they didn't merge the threads and confuse everyone.

@KiteForest_2035 I completed a 37 point solo modless run with loki, bronco, ninkondi. If you want an extra "challenge" haha. I used mech once to erase timer in mirror but didn't care to move it across. I used it in disruption, but I guess I could have gone pure OP there also. It just may have taken longer, not sure. The mechs are only a threat when summoned outside of disruption and you can ignore them. Between companion, operator, gear, and mech (none of which I removed anything on), RNG is a non issue. I have forma in over 95% of things, but most of that junk is no match for operator, companion, on call, and Kahl's brothers. I don't really believe in locking out of operator for challenge sake as that's a core component of the game. It was hard the first day, like a lot of new things are. It's still fun reading about the modifiers and what could come up and maybe having to focus a little more than what we're accustomed to.

Kat, can I have some flowers too? I just did a 37 pt solo modless run with loki, bronco, ninkondi. Operator, Gear, Companion, Necramech has to go! Honestly, I don't really think this mode would be that fun with my favorite gear. There's too many annoying things I don't actually want to deal with as an idea of "fun". I don't really care for mirror defense in general and especially not alchemy or survival. Disruption feels like a downgrade and very boring vs mechs. I still like exterms and effervo though. The sanctum tileset expansion kinda sucks imo. Lots of terrible rooms with huge pits, can't touch the floor or glassed in areas and inaccessible areas except by a staircase in the ground. If RNG removal would make this game mode fun for you, then I support you. I need some different gameplay as far as missions go and they seem to struggle with creating new quality modes.

The pickups in sanctum are also just way too easy and not fun compared to the parkour in citrine farm, there is no comparison. Both of defense targets are in large open areas with great parkour, but in Sanctum its a super tiny area with small jumps. It's super boring. The only thing I like is the aesthetics and sound of the tile vs a much older tile. It's easier to solo in sanctum though as a result of everything being close together and the enemies just not really attacking like the grineer/corpus can. They have one enemy and that's the hollow vein. The others don't really do anything.

It seems weird to get rewards for the first mission if you fail the 2nd mission, and the 2nd if you fail the 3rd. That kind of defeats the point of having to go all at once.

Yeah, Deimos was by far the worst system. Have you tried farming the captura scenes? I thought Zariman is great though especially since you are rewarded for every mission you do even at max daily rep, you earn plumes to turn in. Deimos is just an absurd abomination requiring you to constantly check and turn in. As far as daily rep, I guess it isn't much different from Zariman except the bounties themselves take way longer and there's not a lot of side things like Angels or even the accolades. Nothing in Deimos is fast either. Well, after looking, it does reward a ton of rep for 1 SP bounty, 15k, but I'm sure those are 3 times longer so it evens out. Sanctum is probably still 2nd best, and DE probably doesn't want you stockpiling rep to turn in, so that's why they removed it. There is still an arcane farm, with whispers and gruzzlers now, although that's not quite the same. I enjoy running through and farming voca more then voidplumes, and I love both tiles. Ideally, I'd like voidplumes to emit sound and Voca to give more rep.