The formula for Gas damage is broken.

[RomanHigh]

I did some testing with Gas damage and Electricity damage (against multiple different Faction types) and found that Electricity basically outperforms Gas on all accounts. Because the Gas build has Bane mods that compensate for Faction-based resistances, I think that the disparity in damage is because Gas' proc formula for damage over time doesn't include Heat or Toxin; but it used to include Toxin. The procs also cap out at ten, which no other DoT proc in the game does.

I'm really hoping that this formula is an error and that DE didn't arbitrarily make Gas the worst Elemental damage type on purpose. 

Video with the damage comparison is here: 

 

Edited April 30, 2020 by RomanHigh

[lukinu_u]

Gas totally deserve a reverse to the changes.
It was one of the few balanced status (not very good if used randomly, but strong when deep investement and understanding are made) but it was totally destroyed.

I totally agree with this.

[Traumtulpe]

There is the theory that the lack of damage over time from Gas stems from a silly mistake in the formula: The damage previously scaled with Toxin mods, but not Heat mods - in an attempt to streamline status effects, DE might have intended to also include Heat mods by inserting "Gas" instead of "Toxin" into the formula. This could then result in no scaling at all (as we currently see it), since there are no "Gas elemental mods".

In any case, Gas has clearly been broken into uselessness. Then there was a patch that was supposed to revive this damage type - which did nothing. Somehow DE was unable to identify the glaringly obvious issue of nonexistent scaling, despite numerous complaints.

Honestly, these things aren't unusual in Warframe. I refer to obvious bugs, that make certain parts of the game nonfunctional, and remain unchanged for extended periods of time (sometimes years). Another recent example would be the distinct feature of glaives: The throw and the subsequent explosion. Both are currently bugged and unaffected by many mods. Instead of doing something about these bugs, glaives were then further nerfed by the addition of damage falloff.

[(PSN)LoneWolf_001]

Well, here's to a future improvement to gas procs...maybe a far, far, far future...

[Diavoros]

Gas is dead, viral is new king, heat is the new corrosive, get on with the changes, meta changes. (But unfortunately the players don't change)
 

[Kadesfy]

8 minutes ago, Diavoros said:

Gas is dead, viral is new king, heat is the new corrosive, get on with the changes, meta changes. (But unfortunately the players don't change)
 

DE made it clear that they intended to balance all status procs, so the underperformance of gas is something that players should really tell and show that it seems wrong ... and not just be conformist about it..

[Galuf]

il y a 16 minutes, Kadesfy a dit :

DE made it clear that they intended to balance all status procs, so the underperformance of gas is something that players should really tell and show that it seems wrong ... and not just be conformist about it..

Tbh I don't agree with most things that went well in the status changes. But the Gas rework is probably the most infuriating one, it has probably the worst one. I get that they tryed to box gas in a spot it is difficult justifying it. It was already clunky before the rework, with only mods from toxin working for the dot.

Edited May 1, 2020 by Galuf

[Tiltskillet]

46 minutes ago, Kadesfy said:

DE made it clear that they intended to balance all status procs, so the underperformance of gas is something that players should really tell and show that it seems wrong ... and not just be conformist about it..

Unfortunately I'm sure a lot of players are perfectly happy with the current situation,.  Especially now that it's been allowed to go so long and most people have geared for it.

Having a couple of status types that are clearly better than everything else means not having to think or do as much to approach the optimal.

And  any dev attention brought to a  bad status type  increases the risk of somebody at DE saying, "Wow, Viral is a little nuts..."

[Tiltskillet]

3 hours ago, lukinu_u said:

Gas totally deserve a reverse to the changes.

Including changing the proc back to toxin?  

[lukinu_u]

il y a 15 minutes, Tiltskillet a dit :

Including changing the proc back to toxin?  

Totally.
Gas was interesting mainly because of the multi-proc and interaction with toxin.

The fact it create a gas damage cloud which is a damage instance that proc a toxin status but potentially more if used well, with the each their own proprieties and damage resistance/weakness, both scaling with toxin mods with different modifiers made gas one of the most unique and interesting damage type in the game.
And most importantly, it wasn't OP but strong if used smartly, as all Warframe things should be.

Changes to gas is for me, a HUGE step backward in the direction of making status more interesting, all status should have been treated the same way, with possible interesting and unique interaction.

For example, imagine if blast status was an explosion of a set radius that knockdown enemies, but with radius scaling with heat and knockdown duration scaling with cold. The status would be easy to understand and use, but would have different possible interesting scaling depending on how you mod it.
If all combined elements had scaling like this depending on the two elements they are made of (with gas damage scaling with toxin and cloud range with heat), this would lead to a bunch of interesting and uniques playstyles.

[Oreades]

So I take it this is in the upcoming patch? 

If memory serves wasn't gas originally triple dipping on damage? 

[schilds]

They could have gas aoe apply any elemental procs on a weapon. For most weapons this would only be magnetic, cold and electric. It might give them (and gas) a bit of a boost in popularity.

Specific weapons with innate combined elements would be easy to balance independently if necessary.

[RomanHigh]

1 hour ago, Oreades said:

So I take it this is in the upcoming patch? 

If memory serves wasn't gas originally triple dipping on damage? 

On Faction damage, yes. 

[Galuf]

il y a une heure, Oreades a dit :

If memory serves wasn't gas originally triple dipping on damage? 

It was triple dipping on faction bonuses(like x% damage to something) for its AoE factor. First time with the hit, second time with the dot(but it is like every dot) and third time for its AoE effect because it was a damage instance based on the tic of the dot so it was also multiplied and yet almost nobody used this mechanic in regular content because it wasn't that practical anyway.

Edited May 1, 2020 by Galuf

[MonsterOfMyOwn]

Gas is underwhelming, but so does magnetic, impact, blast and piercing.

Aside from the low ticks, the issue is also the damage multiplier in itself. Nobody cares about killing trash Infested mobs, and that's the only thing it's good at.

But blast, impact, piercing and magnetic are still bad too, and viral is "too good", so the rebalance didn't hit the spot.

[Lutesque]

RIP Gas...

Toxin is still good though... 

I'm still going to level up my Faction Mods because Slash still works (Except on Corpus Enemies)

[RomanHigh]

On 2020-05-01 at 12:16 AM, Lutesque said:

RIP Gas...

Toxin is still good though... 

I'm still going to level up my Faction Mods because Slash still works (Except on Corpus Enemies)

Well, Toxin is better than Gas because AT LEAST IT USES ITS OWN DAMAGE TYPE IN ITS PROC DAMAGE FORMULA

 

AND THE DAMAGE DOESN'T MAX OUT LIKE GAS FOR NO #*!%ING REASON I'M SO MAD