Quellor is weak overall

[Rixuel]

So am I the only one who think the Quellor is weak overall?

- Reload time sucks

- Primary fire is not doing enough damage

- Primary fire rate is too slow

- Secondary fire range is too short

- Secondary will force you to reload if you have 74 ammo or less

- Everytime you press "X" on the keyboard, you are being forced to reload

For a low drop rate weapon from a railjack mission, it's not worth getting it

 

[Drachnyn]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Rixuel:

- Everytime you press "X" on the keyboard, you are being forced to reload

There is an option to turn that off in your settings. Something about "reload with context action".

[Rixuel]

4 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

There is an option to turn that off in your settings. Something about "reload with context action".

Thanks, I didn't even know that lol 😛 I will check the settings

[(XBOX)Tyreal2012]

Its not just the Quellor, most Assault Rifles need a boost. I use the Quellor quite a bit, including in Lichs and Railjack, but i find myself switching to melee after around level 80, just because the TTK is too high compared to melee.

Fire rate is indeed a bit slow, but seeing as i pretty much run Shred on all builds its alot more manageable. (I haven't ranked Prime Shred up yet)

[NinjaZeku]

6 minutes ago, Rixuel said:

reload

Do you even Synth Set bro? Do a quick Melee attack or two, and you're already good to keep firing for a bit.
With just Deconstruct & Fiber on your Companion (Sentinel FTW), you'll be reloading a lot less in general 😄

And you can even slap on the Exilus Mod that further enhances that function,
if you're not leaving that spot for Terminal Velocity to increase the Secondary Fire range.

15 minutes ago, Rixuel said:

- Secondary will force you to reload if you have 74 ammo or less

Well, should it not? Would you prefer to just have nothing happen, i.e. the game forcing you to manually reload?
(BTW, you can interrupt reloads with Melee / Roll / weapon swap / Operator / whatnot.)

... mind, I'm definitely not saying Quellor is perfectly fine as-is.

Not least, it would sure be swell if Primary Fire used similar percentages of Crit vs Status as Secondary, rather than being opposite,
so that building with one in mind will not leave the other that much weaker (DE what is with that, seriously).

[Rixuel]

3 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

Do you even Synth Set bro? Do a quick Melee attack or two, and you're already good to keep firing for a bit.
With just Deconstruct & Fiber on your Companion (Sentinel FTW), you'll be reloading a lot less in general 😄

I don't have these mods yet o.o and my sentinels gonna need more forma.
 

Quote

 

And you can even slap on the Exilus Mod that further enhances that function,
if you're not leaving that spot for Terminal Velocity to increase the Secondary Fire range.

 

I changed the exilus mod to the dash slot so I can slap vigilante supplies on it. With vigilante supplies, I don't have to worry about ammo depletion and I can enjoy the flat crit chance.

Quote

Well, should it not? Would you prefer to just have nothing happen, i.e. the game forcing you to manually reload?
(BTW, you can interrupt reloads with Melee / Roll / weapon swap / Operator / whatnot.)

I would prefer it shoots that secondary fire even if im under 75 ammo and then reload 😛
 

[NinjaZeku]

2 minutes ago, Rixuel said:

With vigilante supplies, I don't have to worry about ammo depletion

I honestly doubt that Mod's relatively weak effect (compared to Primed Mutation) can keep up with serious Secondary Fire spam.

(And the set bonus is not a flat +Crit Chance, it's a quite unreliably proccing effect for big-single-shot weapons.)

4 minutes ago, Rixuel said:

I would prefer it shoots that secondary fire even if im under 75 ammo and then reload 😛

Well, that's not how Warframe works I'm afraid, the game only lets you shoot ammo you actually have inside your gun.

[GKP_light]

yes, it is weak, like all not-critical weapon.

(i like the fact that it is an automatic weapon with high base damage but low fire rate. but the base damage are not high enough to compensate the fact that there is no good crit.)

 

i don't know how they don't understand that in this game, only the critical weapon are good.

i don"t know what they should do about it.

-a massif buff of the not critical weapons ?

-a nerf of most of the critical weapons ?

-a nerf of the crit and crit mod ?

-give some crit chance to all weapon that have low crit chance ? (excepte nukor)

-create some strong mod that work only on not crit, or are only usefull for weapon with low crit chance ?

Some weapon are interesting, but dont have as mush damage as critical weapon, so are not play. Quellor is one of them.

 

 

[NinjaZeku]

1 hour ago, GKP_light said:

i don't know how they don't understand that in this game, only the critical weapon are good.

Massive disagree on my part.

Not least with Viral (+ Heat) procs being a new meta,
and boss-type enemies having gained limited Status succeptability,
lotsa (pure) Status weapons / builds are plenty amazing.

Of course, there's still certain imbalances that could stand to get ironed out,
but the idea of Status weapons being good is not a ludicrous notion by any means.

[GKP_light]

il y a 26 minutes, NinjaZeku a dit :

Massive disagree on my part.

Not least with Viral (+ Heat) procs being a new meta,
and boss-type enemies having gained limited Status succeptability,
lotsa (pure) Status weapons / builds are plenty amazing.

Of course, there's still certain imbalances that could stand to get ironed out,
but the idea of Status weapons being good is not a ludicrous notion by any means.

But you can have a weapon with status and crit.

even with a low status chance like 10%, if the weapon have a good fire rate, you can apply the viral. with some multishot and 1 mod 60-60, it is very fast.

and lot of weapon are good in crit and status.

 

there is no reason to play Boltor prime compare to Boltor telos.

[Sevek7]

4 hours ago, Rixuel said:

So am I the only one who think the Quellor is weak overall?

- Reload time sucks

- Primary fire is not doing enough damage

- Primary fire rate is too slow

- Secondary fire range is too short

- Secondary will force you to reload if you have 74 ammo or less

- Everytime you press "X" on the keyboard, you are being forced to reload

For a low drop rate weapon from a railjack mission, it's not worth getting it

 

Yeah, the recent changes to status basically nerfed all status weapons in comparison to crit weapons. It was a weird choice to cap the status effectiveness up to a maximum. Since crit weapons with multishot mods will essentially get the full benefit of status anyway in that case. So using a status weapon now just means you're taking a crit weapon but dumping the crit. So yes, at the moment status weapons are far worse than crit weapons. I'm hoping the developers realize this mistake!

[Klaeljanu]

7 minutes ago, NinjaZeku said:

Massive disagree on my part.

Not least with Viral (+ Heat) procs being a new meta,
and boss-type enemies having gained limited Status succeptability,
lotsa (pure) Status weapons / builds are plenty amazing.

Of course, there's still certain imbalances that could stand to get ironed out,
but the idea of Status weapons being good is not a ludicrous notion by any means.

I wonder how much of the complaint is based on Scarlet Spear with its Sentient mobs(and many of the other bosses) being status immune. 
I definitely agree that status weapons are still very useful though.  E.G. Scourge still wrecks stuff, and I have a Komorex based Nidus that frankly erases mobs faster than an Acceltra.

On the subject of the Quellor itself, I wonder how much of the complaint is due to the gun being much better at corrosive+cold+hunter_munitions than it is at viral+heat+hunter_munitions, with the former combination now being very much in the shadow of the latter?

[BlackCat500]

I don't know what y'all are building but I'm not sure what makes you think status is weak. It's just that corrosive all day every day doesn't work anymore. Is it that?

[GKP_light]

Il y a 4 heures, Klaeljanu a dit :

I wonder how much of the complaint is based on Scarlet Spear with its Sentient mobs(and many of the other bosses) being status immune. 
I definitely agree that status weapons are still very useful though.  E.G. Scourge still wrecks stuff, and I have a Komorex based Nidus that frankly erases mobs faster than an Acceltra.

On the subject of the Quellor itself, I wonder how much of the complaint is due to the gun being much better at corrosive+cold+hunter_munitions than it is at viral+heat+hunter_munitions, with the former combination now being very much in the shadow of the latter?

0% from scarlet spear.

the fact that crit is very strong, and stronger than no crit, is old.

and the change that they did to status solve nothing.

 

corrosive+cold itself is good, like viral+heat.

but Viral+hunter_munitions is far stronger than corrosive+hunter_munitions, because corosive is useless to hunter munitions.

(but it is not really the problem here : the main shoot have low crit, so hunter munitions is just bad)

[DrivaMain]

Quellor needs a boost in Fire Rate, Fall-off range, and maybe reduce the ammo consumption on alt fire. It’s sad that I have to used Vile Acceleration to make the primary fire deals decent damage.

Edited May 5, 2020 by DrivaMain

[(PSN)bobvoo3]

I agree, it is weak, but I think it's still usable with a riven like all other weapons.  If they make it stronger, it will eventually be nerfed like all other strong weapons.  We all want strong weapons and frames, when DE does come out with requested, there would be haters that wants to nerf it to be more 'challenging'.  Look at Khora now.  Whipclaw can't even damage the target in capture mission.  Now how many wants to use her in assassination mission anymore.

What I would like is for quellor to get static alt-fire with trigger release fire like Lenz.  Then I can just use it like Tigres.  

Just my 2 cents 🙂

[BlackCat500]

https://i.imgur.com/3RmO1yk.gifv

This is how the weapon performs against 165 heavy gunners, just tested it. No buffs used by the way, I just like the frame.

 

This is the build I made up while levelling it earlier to prove a point that the weapon isn't useless. Is it weaker than some others? Sure. Particuarly any of the currently overpowered ones. That doesn't invalidate what it can do though.

If anything were to be buffed about it, I would say it's the base damage could go just a little bit higher. With tactical reload the reloading issue is a non-issue if you just melee for a second once in a while, it hits multiple enemies with shred installed and also shoots faster, it can cause more than 1 status per shot and it shoots multiple times each shot fired.

[Klaeljanu]

16 hours ago, GKP_light said:

0% from scarlet spear.

the fact that crit is very strong, and stronger than no crit, is old.

and the change that they did to status solve nothing.

 

corrosive+cold itself is good, like viral+heat.

but Viral+hunter_munitions is far stronger than corrosive+hunter_munitions, because corosive is useless to hunter munitions.

(but it is not really the problem here : the main shoot have low crit, so hunter munitions is just bad)

I never said that status > crit.
I said that status weapons are still quite viable. 
There is an argument that they are more viable that crit-only weapons; since the best mix is crit-focused, status-capable, so you can get both status procs as well as big numbers.

The Quellor under old status was easily capable of handling the Veil Crewship Heavy Gunners, a reliable method of determining a "good" weapon, since anything that can handle them was able to handle most general situations.  After the changes in status, it could no longer do that, even under the armor changes.  Haven't tried it under the new railjack though, but given that veil difficulty is roughly analogous to old Saturn difficulty, it might be passable again.  Also note that I'm not talking about using the primary against them exclusively.  You use the primary to get quick stacks of status procs to make the alt-fire more damaging, or to kill fodder trash.

[Steel_Rook]

I don't think there's any question that the Quellor is weak, and not just because it's a Status Gun. Its rate of fire is simply too low for a weapon with this kind of magazine size. It's why you'll see so many people using Shred on it. I don't expect all weapons to be GRRREAT! but I don't see the justification of giving the weapon 300 rounds in the magazine, a 6 RPS rate of fire and 75 SODDING ROUNDS per secondary fire. Additionally, this weapon is pretty clearly an LMG. Why, then, does it not have LMG progressive fire rate? The way this weapon is designed, it should be firing at least at double its current rate of fire, with the potential to spool up even faster. Give us a reason to lean into that gigantic magazine, give us a reason to fire in longer bursts.

I still love my Quellor to bits because it has one of the game's largest magazines (if not THE largest), but it just feels severely under-tuned. It feels like DE just don't like automatic weapons in their game.

[Antris]

Quellor could use a buff, removing the range limitation on secondary fire would be great.

And yeah, having the secondary fire even with 74 ammo or less would feel much better.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Antris

[Rixuel]

2 hours ago, BlackCat500 said:

https://i.imgur.com/3RmO1yk.gifv

This is how the weapon performs against 165 heavy gunners, just tested it. No buffs used by the way, I just like the frame.

 

This is the build I made up while levelling it earlier to prove a point that the weapon isn't useless. Is it weaker than some others? Sure. Particuarly any of the currently overpowered ones. That doesn't invalidate what it can do though.

If anything were to be buffed about it, I would say it's the base damage could go just a little bit higher. With tactical reload the reloading issue is a non-issue if you just melee for a second once in a while, it hits multiple enemies with shred installed and also shoots faster, it can cause more than 1 status per shot and it shoots multiple times each shot fired.

Is there anything special going over 100% status?

[BlackCat500]

@Rixuel It takes a high base status chance to do that and yes, one of the latest revisited patches made it so that >100% status inflicts multiple statuses per shot. So with 136.8% status you'd always inflict 1 status and at a 36.8% chance a second status with just one shot. Rapid fire plus >100% status means it'll just spam viral, heat and other procs nonstop, but mostly the former two. IPS now is weighted only 1x instead of 4x, so elementals tend to get priority.

 

EDIT: Oh also, remember this is just one shot. Essentially this gun fires 2-3 shots per ammo because of multishot and you fire multiple ammo per second. This is probably like 6-7 statuses per second. The thing is, I prefer rapid fire weapons (or shotguns) for status because you can just apply so many statuses at once. The strength of status guns lies in quantity, not quality. It is essentially the opposite principle of criticals. Also, how a status weapon with low damage can still deal the same or more damage than some crit weapons by debuffing the enemy.

Edited May 5, 2020 by BlackCat500

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

Gets the BP drop yesterday..see this post today...

 

Gosh dang it and looks so good...

Edited May 6, 2020 by (PS4)FriendSharkey

[taiiat]

i like the concept of having an Assault Rifle that is above average Damage per Shot but a reduced Fire Rate. it's something actually different from most of the Assault Rifles that are all clones of each other, they all ultimately do the same thing.

so to make that theme actually work, you can just increase the Base Damage a bit more than it is. around 65 or so.
or, i guess you could give it a more useful Crit Chance. 20% would suffice, 22% if you want to get fancy. reduced Crit Damage is ok, Crits are still great stuff if you're getting Headshots, and something with a lower Rate of Fire fits that well. maybe make it a little more Accurate to make sure that it always does that role, though.

that leaves the 300rd Magazine, 4 second Reload, and 75 Ammo cost for the Alt-Fire... you can either leave all that as is or you could get away with reducing all of those numbers(dividing Magazine/Alt-Fire by 3 or so, and 0.7x Reload) if you also make the Alt-Fire shoot slower than it does now.

 

not every Gun needs to become a bland factory in order to be useful - an Automatic Weapon can be something other than an Ammo vaporizer to have a good role.

On 2020-05-04 at 4:00 PM, Klaeljanu said:

I definitely agree that status weapons are still very useful though.  E.G. Scourge still wrecks stuff, and I have a Komorex based Nidus that frankly erases mobs faster than an Acceltra.

Scourge has very high Damage per Shot with innate Multi-hits and is pure Elemental, Komorex is a very strong Hybrid Weapon.
just applying Status Effects doesn't make a good Weapon, however. other variables need to support it too.

5 hours ago, Rixuel said:

Is there anything special going over 100% status?

the same thing as above 100% Crit Chance. :)

[Steel_Rook]

12 hours ago, (PS4)FriendSharkey said:

Gets the BP drop yesterday..see this post today...

 

Gosh dang it and looks so good...

It's not a TERRIBLE weapon. You can make it work with a decent enough build. It just fails to keep up with even other LMGs of its kind, sadly. And yes, it absolutely does look badass, and is currently one of my personal favourite weapons despite this 🙂

Ah, well. It's a Tenno weapon, which means we'll eventually get a Primed version of it... Some day.