Why doesn't someone want to stab their kuva lich?

[IceColdHawk]

2 minutes ago, Aldain said:

This is a VIDEO GAME. Let people do things how they want, especially if they are doing it solo farrrrrr away from your efficiency.

Keep your pants on. The OP simply just asked out of curiosity. Not dictating you how you should play.

6 minutes ago, Aldain said:

I don't want to play Saryn or Mesa for every mission which also isn't the most efficient way of playing when talking kills-per-second, is that wrong too?

Well see, that's a bit different. Expecting people to join you with a certain frame is kinda optimistic. But expecting people in lich hunts to...ya know...hunt liches...should be fairly common sense. I can only speak for myself here but i'm wondering why anyone would hunt a lich if they don't actually hunt it. That's what gets me curious and i can feel the OP. And it's sad that those (or some at least) that don't want to stab, are unwilling to give a productive answer.

Also slight but unrelated note...Saryn and Mesa are far from best when it comes to kills per second for most non endless missions. So if you were speaking about a meta-related "wrong" then yeah, it'd be "wrong" if you chose to pick Saryn during an exterminate 😛 

[(XBOX)ShadowBlood89]

On 2020-07-01 at 12:25 PM, (PS4)KatiSavo said:

You know when your kuva lich spawns in a lich mission and you can knock him on His knees and test your mods so you can eventually defeat him completely? What I'm wondering is when he does spawn for some players they decide not to stab him at all, they'd rather kneel him 3 times so he leaves or they just ignore him altogether. Their gear is clearly good enough to handle a rank 5 lich so it's not about it being too difficult. Why does someone choose not to stab him since stabbing gives you kuva and murmur, quickening the entire process so much? This has been bothering me for quite a while now and those types of players who do this never seem to have an answer if I kindly ask. If anyone has any idea behind their thinking I'd appreciate if you'd let me know. 

user has not found out all 3 requiems an could be close to the last one an not wanting to waste the liches rage meter
user might be with a friend an using there own enraged litch to help produce more thralls in mission to get more murmurs 

[xcrimsonlegendx]

I always try to stab mine, the extra murmur progress/kuva is just polite to give the entire group.

[DragoonStorm1]

On 2020-07-04 at 12:40 AM, TARINunit9 said:

Survival is only five minutes and it has by far the highest time investment:thrall ratio

This is where our differring approaches becomes relevant. Let's say we at least both wait until the 5 minutes are up before stabbing, so we get the most Thralls per mission. I'm walking out of the mission with 20 Thralls and a full anger bar, in order to make my Lich spawn in the next mission -- which, if it's another Survival, is another 10+10 thralls. You are walking out with 30 Thralls (ten from stabbing the Lich) and an empty anger bar, so your next mission can only get up to 10 Thralls. But you do get to refresh your mission list, which I agree is good.

Both of us spend 10 minutes to get roughly 40 Thralls

This is why I don't take the "you get more murmurs/Thralls" argument seriously. Because I really wouldn't. What I'm doing is refreshing my mission list at the cost of a more tedious final battle

Oh but my goal is to do more missions in the time it takes to do one surv.
Lich anger is tied to node clearing, and not thrall stabbing, and my primary focus is requiem brute force, not thralls at all.
Thralls are just a side bonus, if they spawn on my missions.
I most often get the right combo with only one (or two) discoveries-via-murmur. The more stabs, the more requiems I can cross out. (And it's more beneficial to transfer all the murmurs that would've revealed the first or second requiem, into the third slot, by finding those mods out myself, before they get revealed)

And so in the time it takes you to do one surv, I could've done 2 other missions.
It may seem slow at first, but it ramps up super fast.
(plus I swear there are patterns that help you guess the combo from your previous lich lol. I almost always have 1-2 mods that stay behind, in a different order. But even if that sounds delusional, the rest remains.)

[ShortCat]

On 2020-07-04 at 11:20 AM, Aldain said:

As long as you don't mind that I and many others don't give a damn.

This is a VIDEO GAME. Let people do things how they want, especially if they are doing it solo farrrrrr away from your efficiency.

I find it rather odd hearing arguments like this, while preaching how unfun or grindy a Lich hunt is. Did you ever considder that people are not "teaching you how to play" or "force their way onto others" but rather genuinely want to help, by pointing at decisoins, which may lead to this misery?

[Galuf]

if you play in pub games there is no point camping a lich if it is not your own. You want to piss off your lich so you want to kill your thralls, and atm ranking up your lich is worth it if you have the gear to still steamroll Tier 5 liches, wich results in significantly harder in missions.

Starting from my 10th weapon or something I started hard detroying any lich spawning in pub games. At a point it leaves itself.

Now about thrall conversion: it really depends on the layout and spawn points. Sometimes it is not even worth it, sometimes it rains conversions and it is definitely worth it. The more people are in the party the less it is worth it to camp thralls in terms of murmurs/hour 🙂.

[BlueGuy13]

On 2020-07-04 at 5:20 PM, Aldain said:

This is a VIDEO GAME. Let people do things how they want, especially if they are doing it solo farrrrrr away from your efficiency.

Agreed, let me be a complete a-hole to people and remove the report system so I can do what I want without repurcussions. Remove the afk penalty while we're at it ty.

[TARINunit9]

6 hours ago, DragoonStorm1 said:

Lich anger is tied to node clearing, and not thrall stabbing

...um... no, that's wrong. Lich anger is tied to killing thralls. That's why your method seems "slow at first", because it's provably far slower

[Tiltskillet]

32 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

...um... no, that's wrong. Lich anger is tied to killing thralls. That's why your method seems "slow at first", because it's provably far slower

Yeah.  It's why one of the better but not immediately obvious little  tricks to lich management is to avoid finishing thralls between the lich spawning and despawning.

[Makunogo]

On 2020-07-01 at 6:01 PM, ShortCat said:

It actually does not behave like that. Converted Thralls count towards mission spawn limit, if this limit is not reached. This is mentioned on the wiki and you can easely test in a Defense mission, since only 2 Thralls will spawn each wave - if you encounter a Lich in early waves, let him convert and then pay attention whether there will be regular mission spawns.

Furthermore, for a Lich to convert, he needs enemies nearby, which is not allways the case. Then, there is the conversion cooldown of 20 seconds, or more than 3 minutes in total. Not only does it needlesly extend mission time, it also blocks other Liches from spawning.

 

good luck getting all your thrall kills in 3 minutes lol

[DragoonStorm1]

On 2020-07-05 at 9:52 PM, TARINunit9 said:

...um... no, that's wrong. Lich anger is tied to killing thralls. That's why your method seems "slow at first", because it's provably far slower

huh.
This is definitely something that I've been mistaken at then...
I actually thought this was how the anger should've been linked, but that for some reason, it wasn't. O_o

Now that's actually good news, that explains quite a few things xD and with some tweaks to my method I can speed it up at the lower anger stages, while still speedrunning for the kill at medium-high stages.

I can't believe one aspect of the lich system turns out to have always been the way I thought it should've been xD

Thanks for showing me this lol