Endorphinz Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Out of all boss type encounters, I'm not sure how the dev team decided to mess up Necramechs in the isolation vaults so much. All the hallmarks of frustration are there. First we have the traditional damage gating, reducing all damage by like 99% or so, always fun. Small, erraticly moving weakpoints, can't have a good boss fight without those. Crippling the player by randomly slowing you to a crawl for no apparent reason, and cancelling your operator mode, that's there too. And the biggest sin of all, reflecting damage back at the player. On top of good old fashioned one-shot damage output. I really apologize about the sarcasm dripping in my post but I want Warframe to feel fun to play, not like something I have to dread. I don't want every boss encounter in the game be "use Chroma or cheese it". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AltairFerenc Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I did 1 iso vault... Never again... Not like I was ever interted getting a mech myself seems kinda pointless I just wanted sciliant but god damm the fight is horrible no CD ironskin, can deal an awful ot of damage to you for no reason, sometimes you just can't use abilites because why not, can only shoot the arms becase your weapons of mass destruction can't do damage in the face of a rusty machine... I tought the profit taker was bad because of unending horde of corpus and "you can only hit me with this ONE element for now while on a timer" but god damm.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Kuhl MC Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Or you could simply bring a powerful single-shot weapon (e.g. sniper) and make use of shieldgating. Or use Baruuk or a link Trinity. I acknowledge some of the mentioned points (slow fields with no visual indicator and the inconsistent hitbox), but apart from that, I like, that the fight actually needs the player to figure out a strategy/loadout in order to be successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xardis Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 For the level of the mission and enemy, damage output is 10 to 50 times too high. Weakspot mechanic is a good choice IF the enemy doesnt have a weakspot ON HIS BACK and can turn just like every other enemy, and has the same cc exponential resistence as sentients... I would be fine with most of this enemies issues if: Necramech has a low turning speed, granade damage was a lot lower so its not a one shot AoE spam, with low turning speed, his rifle could have higher damage - telegraphed one shot essentialy, or close to it. CC resistence can stay, but forcing you into your warframe from operator is not fine at all, both here and in Birdolon fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamLoco Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Endorphinz said: Out of all boss type encounters, I'm not sure how the dev team decided to mess up Necramechs in the isolation vaults so much. All the hallmarks of frustration are there. First we have the traditional damage gating, reducing all damage by like 99% or so, always fun. Small, erraticly moving weakpoints, can't have a good boss fight without those. Crippling the player by randomly slowing you to a crawl for no apparent reason, and cancelling your operator mode, that's there too. And the biggest sin of all, reflecting damage back at the player. On top of good old fashioned one-shot damage output. I really apologize about the sarcasm dripping in my post but I want Warframe to feel fun to play, not like something I have to dread. I don't want every boss encounter in the game be "use Chroma or cheese it". The fun part of this encounter is to show the Devs that you don´t care about their nasty bosses and just use Octavia to finish them in 5 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anisette Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 It encompasses the three major F elements. ・Damage Reflection ・Invincible ・Damaged cap DE loves this, but I hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevoisvevo Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 3 hours ago, (XB1)Kuhl MC said: Or you could simply bring a powerful single-shot weapon (e.g. sniper) and make use of shieldgating. Or use Baruuk or a link Trinity. I acknowledge some of the mentioned points (slow fields with no visual indicator and the inconsistent hitbox), but apart from that I like, that the fight actually needs the player to figure out a strategy/loadout in order to be successful. Yes because I need strategy guides from the wiki or the reddit subfuroms to enjoy a poorly designed enemy bossfight. Might as well tell everyone to use Octavia radiation stropha inorder to one shot them all due to cheese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 5 hours ago, Anisette said: It encompasses the three major F elements. ・Damage Reflection ・Invincible ・Damaged cap DE loves this, but I hate it. You missed "tiny little weakspot on an enemy which jumps around like a hummingbird on crystal meth". Someone there must have gotten annoyed that nobody wants to fight Hek any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anisette Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 1 hour ago, DoomFruit said: あなたは「覚醒剤のハチドリのように飛び回る敵の小さな弱点」を見逃しました。そこにいる誰かが、もう誰もヘクと戦うことを望まないことに腹を立てたに違いありません。 I completely agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duality52 Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 On 2020-10-03 at 2:22 AM, Anisette said: It encompasses the three major F elements. ・Damage Reflection ・Invincible ・Damaged cap DE loves this, but I hate it. On 2020-10-03 at 8:22 AM, DoomFruit said: You missed "tiny little weakspot on an enemy which jumps around like a hummingbird on crystal meth". Someone there must have gotten annoyed that nobody wants to fight Hek any more. More: Immune to Status Procs Poor Visual Feedback (No start-up animation for Storm Shroud) Very quick recovery (can refresh Storm Shroud, can somehow recover their arms upon being disarmed in some cases) No interesting reactions of the Necramechs to our damage. We just snap their arms and they just keep moving. The only player-to-enemy interaction with the hostile Necramechs is how we can ram our own Necramechs (Fallen or player made) to stun the hostile ones. The poor visual feedback is the main kicker over why hostile Necramech fights are more of an annoyance over being fun/difficult. The Eidolons may have a constricted meta, but their attacks are properly telegraphed, along with parts of Profit Taker Orb and Exploiter Orb (except their auto-homing plasma cannons). Hostile Necramechs are basically Tusk Thumpers, but more punishing and forces players to heavily cheese the encounters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiseGuard Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 11 hours ago, Duality52 said: No interesting reactions of the Necramechs to our damage. We just snap their arms and they just keep moving. I beg to differ. Last time I ripped of one of its arm, it kept charging me to the death and occasional salvo of mines. I wonder who would play this content if there were no hard counters like Octavia. Imagine dancing with six Necramechs for some relics. What a great reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaotea Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 On 2020-10-03 at 7:30 AM, Endorphinz said: Out of all boss type encounters, I'm not sure how the dev team decided to mess up Necramechs in the isolation vaults so much. All the hallmarks of frustration are there. First we have the traditional damage gating, reducing all damage by like 99% or so, always fun. Small, erraticly moving weakpoints, can't have a good boss fight without those. Crippling the player by randomly slowing you to a crawl for no apparent reason, and cancelling your operator mode, that's there too. And the biggest sin of all, reflecting damage back at the player. On top of good old fashioned one-shot damage output. I really apologize about the sarcasm dripping in my post but I want Warframe to feel fun to play, not like something I have to dread. I don't want every boss encounter in the game be "use Chroma or cheese it". Ive done a few. and while i agree it needs work, there are counters. (Though its definatly not a boss, more a special enemy like the jugganaught). While it only takes damage on weakpoints, AoE seems to work from non direct hits. Also, its damage reflect has a minimum range, so battle at a good distance. Unfortunatly it is all but impossible solo. What it needs is to not reflect abilities, because gitting hit by your own slow nova is instant death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xmegarockx Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 remove the reflect damage please is killing my. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyanil Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Not sure if it's just me, but not being the host makes it really annoying hitting the necramech. The number of times I hit it for 0 when aiming at the spot is pretty bad. As the host, one shotting the necramech is never an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duality52 Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 4 hours ago, WiseGuard said: Last time I ripped of one of its arm, it kept charging me to the death and occasional salvo of mines Which is basically what I was saying: Necramechs do not react to any damage they take. People suggested that destroying the power sockets of the Tusk Thumper will slow its speed and rotation while causing it to "limp". Makes the encounter less of an annoyance and more interesting with these interactions. The Aerolyst, upon destroying all of its canisters will get stunned briefly before resuming its normal attack pattern. Stunning Sentients is already abnormal outside of abilities. The Necramech should have more of these interactions: snap an arm off and it recoils/kneels in reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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