It's time to nerf Wukong

[kinoko_takenoko]

It is not that everyone uses Wukong because it is too powerful.
The problem is that other warframes are not worth using in many situations compared to Wukong.
For example, what is the use of an ability that does only a little damage to all but very low level enemies in the current situation?

It's getting boring to go around strengthening only the enemies and smashing the equipment that can be used.
We should strengthen each piece of equipment individually so that each piece of equipment can have its own value.

Why use Warframe when Overguard has rendered many CCs useless and Wukong is useless?
Is it because Tenno is an outdated legacy?

[Tyreaus]

2 minutes ago, (XBOX)DragonMan 2700 said:

I believe the reason so many new players have him is because base Wukong is in the tenno lab / mistwalker heals (moving through lasers)

You should look at the usage stats chart DE made for 2021. It shows Wukong Prime at high usage rates, well above Saryn's too. That doesn't really fit with an ease of acquisition hypothesis.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

7 minutes ago, (XBOX)DragonMan 2700 said:

I agree PLZ don't nerf ¦ SON WUKONG ¦ 

I believe the reason so many new players have him is because base Wukong is in the tenno lab / mistwalker heals (moving through lasers)

The part that is completely unbalanced you pass it through the lining of the ass.

His passive: Broken
1: Ridiculous broken
2: Haha i'm inmortal.
3: Not enough with 2? more immortal.
4: It's funny that it's his only balanced ability but everyone says it's bad xD

[gamingchair1121]

13 minutes ago, (XBOX)DragonMan 2700 said:

I agree PLZ don't nerf ¦ SON WUKONG ¦ 

did... you just assume my post was about not nerfing wukong? you have no idea how much he needs to be nerfed. just remember that 10% of players use him. the next down is excal at 4.5%. and excal a starter

and your suggestions aren't going to do anything because wukong prime is mr5 so as soon as new players get to mr5 they will get him because people tell them to.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

12 minutes ago, gamingchair1121 said:

limbo's 4

So we're clear that limbo is fine after the eximus rework, then? Lol

Because the community said the opposite....so which is it? 

25 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

hahahahaha hahahaha hahahahah

- On the steel path in round twenty you could put 20 layers of shield with frost and it would take  5 seconds to disappear and with the low amount of energy that frost has that is useless.
- The 1 augment is decent at least.
- 100% strip need 250% of ability strength. Don't work on eximus. Hilarious.

I have a triple umbra frost, maybe you need to work on your build? 

 

19 minutes ago, bonamb said:

This is kinda a false equivalence. Warframe is a game all about power fantasies, so each warframe is generally "Op" with at least one thing, but very few are on wukongs level for being "Op" at everything, and as such are used by a massive proportion of the community. Its literally shown in the usage stats Pablo just posted on his twitter! (wukong is the one in the top right). 

 

A few players have stated they're handicapped and appreciate wukong because not everyone has the ability to spam R2 like me for an hour. 

I already know a wukong and aoe nerf is incoming, just saying people will find some other way to steal your kills and you'll be back to square one.

That's where stats can be flawed. Not sure if you know, but stats aren't some magical number that tell the whole truth, or really evil people would be right most of the time. 

[Tiltskillet]

-derple post-

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Frost

For somebody trying to find edge cases for OPness, he's too easy:  Globe's scaling health/true damage mechanic and invulnerability period. 

Not that I think this little mini-game of "Find edge cases where bad frames are OP" is  a justification for anything.  It's just a fun exercise.

[ABlindGuyPlays]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

Ok you got me there lol. But I will test and get back to you. He is/was meta for eidolons at one point and his grass is still a low level nuke. I literally haven't played him since 2019.

Doesn't mean some youtuber hasn't found a way to make him OP.

I picked oberon because i use him. I like him, but frankly? Too many other frames do what he does but better.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

1 minute ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

 

I have a triple umbra frost, maybe you need to work on your build? 

haha

[gamingchair1121]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

So we're clear that limbo is fine after the eximus rework, then? Lol

he's playable but the eximus abilities bypassing the rift needs to be toned down, maybe if they are in the opposite plane they can't kill you with abilities or something

[ABlindGuyPlays]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

A few players have stated they're handicapped and appreciate wukong because not everyone has the ability to spam R2 like me for an hour. 

I am one of those people, but I can get the need to just.... tune down the whole turret thing. It's more the last time pablo went on about nerfs it felt in poro taste and he basically held up baby pictures to try deflecting criticism. 

So I'm REALLY uncharitable feeling.

[p_silveira]

Me seeing Pablo hinting at re-balancing Wukong on Twitter:

 

Wuclone is hella broken and paired with AoE he disrupts the mission for the other 3 players in the squad. I'm tired of loading into a SP alert and it becoming a walking simulator because of Wuclone + Zarr/Bramma/etc killed everything on sight in 2 seconds. I'm all in for nerfing them.

[Tyreaus]

1 minute ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

haha

See, the problem is, you forgot the third umbral forma. That's what catapults him to OPness. /j

[CosoMalvadoNG]

5 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

See, the problem is, you forgot the third umbral forma. That's what catapults him to OPness. /j

No needed  i use glowing power. 

I have already tried all the frost builds and well I think I can speak.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

Haha even needs a nerf on twitter

[bonamb]

8 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

That's where stats can be flawed. Not sure if you know, but stats aren't some magical number that tell the whole truth, or really evil people would be right most of the time.

Maybe this is reaching a little lol. Its just the player usage stats that show how massively wukong is overused due to how "op" he is - stats being things that game devs can look at to see where their game needs tweaking. There's other stats around too to paint a fuller picture - the ones from 2021 that show that wukong is used by 10% of the playerbase out of the (at the time) 47 odd warframes? Definitely a reason for that! 

You can argue about stats all you like, but at the end of the day you know that the wukong overuse is an unfortunate mixup of bad metas - wukong effectively being a turret that can use your aoe firearm with 0 repercussions for you. Sure, there will always be other metas (spin to win / move ftw) but hey hopefully they'll be a little less egregious! 

12 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

A few players have stated they're handicapped and appreciate wukong because not everyone has the ability to spam R2 like me for an hour. 

I agree, warframe does need to improve somewhat on accessibility. Single shot rapid fire guns without an automatic or at least "hold down this button to keep firing" are a nightmare, For other stuff DE is riding the line of trying to avoid stuff that plays the game for you and accessibility, so I can sympathise with them here. 

[vanaukas]

1 hour ago, Berzerkules said:

What a great community we have here. Players will take pleasure mocking others when DE breaks their toys instead of addressing the root of the problem. 

Spoiler

 

 

[ABlindGuyPlays]

4 minutes ago, bonamb said:

I agree, warframe does need to improve somewhat on accessibility. Single shot rapid fire guns without an automatic or at least "hold down this button to keep firing" are a nightmare, For other stuff DE is riding the line of trying to avoid stuff that plays the game for you and accessibility, so I can sympathise with them here. 

The real problem on this one is while WuClone is damned handy for people like me who have longer than average reaction times? Those same features will then get abused by the majority.

I also dislike Wuclone because 'i wanna play the game' and generally only whip the thing out when I feel like I can't hack it or keep up.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

8 minutes ago, bonamb said:

Maybe this is reaching a little lol. Its just the player usage stats that show how massively wukong is overused due to how "op" he is - stats being things that game devs can look at to see where their game needs tweaking. There's other stats around too to paint a fuller picture - the ones from 2021 that show that wukong is used by 10% of the playerbase out of the (at the time) 47 odd warframes? Definitely a reason for that! 

You can argue about stats all you like, but at the end of the day you know that the wukong overuse is an unfortunate mixup of bad metas - wukong effectively being a turret that can use your aoe firearm with 0 repercussions for you. Sure, there will always be other metas (spin to win / move ftw) but hey hopefully they'll be a little less egregious! 

I agree, warframe does need to improve somewhat on accessibility. Single shot rapid fire guns without an automatic or at least "hold down this button to keep firing" are a nightmare, For other stuff DE is riding the line of trying to avoid stuff that plays the game for you and accessibility, so I can sympathise with them here. 

Yea that's fair. I already know it's coming. I'm just excited to see what's next on the chopping block afterwards.

23 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

haha

So it's just you not paying attention, then? 

If we both have triple umbra frosts and my bubble lasts longer than yours, what other factor are we missing?

Just a reminder that frosts dome converts incoming damage during the invulnerability period, so maybe it's your timing? For reference:

"Frost creates a protective globe of ice with a diameter of 10 meters, a base health of 3000 / 4000 / 4500 / 5000, and additional health equal to 500% of Frost's base armor bonuses. Upon activation, the globe is invulnerable for 1 / 2 / 3 / 4 seconds. Incoming damage that is absorbed during the invulnerability period is converted into health and added to the globe's health."

 

[kinoko_takenoko]

12 minutes ago, bonamb said:

Maybe this is reaching a little lol. Its just the player usage stats that show how massively wukong is overused due to how "op" he is - stats being things that game devs can look at to see where their game needs tweaking. There's other stats around too to paint a fuller picture - the ones from 2021 that show that wukong is used by 10% of the playerbase out of the (at the time) 47 odd warframes? Definitely a reason for that! 

The easier the Warframe is to obtain, the more people will use it.
Wukong is the easiest Warframe to get, and you can get it as soon as you join the Clan.
Hard-to-get Warframes are used by fewer people.
Grendel is the hardest Warframe to find and currently exists behind ZoTA.

That is not the only reason why Wukong is used, but its statistics as a means of comparing Warframes to each other is meaningless.

[bonamb]

1 minute ago, ABlindGuyPlays said:

The real problem on this one is while WuClone is damned handy for people like me who have longer than average reaction times? Those same features will then get abused by the majority.

I also dislike Wuclone because 'i wanna play the game' and generally only whip the thing out when I feel like I can't hack it or keep up.

I actually might be able to help a little with that - I tend to use tanky frames (atlas, etc) because I like to relax and play warframe, not play reaction speed simulator 9000. It lets me take my time to actually do stuff. I've also got a friend with slower reaction times than me, and he enjoys even heavier frames like Grendal, or Nidus with his immortality passive (and the big guns that come with big frames - like the trumna - aren't all that bad too). 

22 minutes ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

I have already tried all the frost builds and well I think I can speak.

Eyy another Frost main, nice. 

Spoiler

 

 

[gamingchair1121]

2 minutes ago, kinoko_takenoko said:

The easier the Warframe is to obtain, the more people will use it.
Wukong is the easiest Warframe to get, and you can get it as soon as you join the Clan.

actually technically excal is the easiest to get because hes a starter but even then wukong still has more usage

[ABlindGuyPlays]

Just now, bonamb said:

I actually might be able to help a little with that - I tend to use tanky frames (atlas, etc) because I like to relax and play warframe, not play reaction speed simulator 9000.

Oberon's got plenty of tank on a triple umbral build. It's mostly 'by the time I get a bead on anything someone else has already killed it.' Gets kinda old.

[(XBOX)Shodian]

1 hour ago, Berzerkules said:

We'll finally get that co-op experience we all want once AoE gets nerfed. Lith fissures will be amazing now that everyone will get to contribute. 

I can't wait to Spore my enemies with Saryn instead of using my Baramma.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

10 minutes ago, kinoko_takenoko said:

The easier the Warframe is to obtain, the more people will use it.
Wukong is the easiest Warframe to get, and you can get it as soon as you join the Clan.
Hard-to-get Warframes are used by fewer people.
Grendel is the hardest Warframe to find and currently exists behind ZoTA.

That is not the only reason why Wukong is used, but its statistics as a means of comparing Warframes to each other is meaningless.

Let me guess... Are you main wukong?

Well the easiest and most affordable warframe is excal since you can have it from the beginning of the game, then they give you another Excalibur improved with potato and with umbra slots... how is it possible that even so a warframe that you have to manufacture for almost 4 days is twice as used.

Explain that to me sir of the little monkey.