Controversial Opinion: The Large Endo Awards for Narmer Bounties Are a Good Thing

[HiddenKazuma]

I see a lot of people complaining about Endo drops in the Narmer bounties but honestly for people like me - who haven't been playing for years and years - they are a godsend. Being able to get 1-2k Endo in a single bounty is about the fastest you can currently earn Endo, and as you are transitioning from using mid-rank mods to using max-rank mods and primed mods, the reliable source of a resource you need massive quantities of is very nice.

[shocker53]

Great argument! Personally I feel like people are being super selfish with what they say when they say this or that should be removed or what should have lower drop chances

Great for them who have all the mods maxed, it's a great accomplishment! But that doesn't mean everybody who plays Warframe has done that too, the Endo rewards are for those who haven't been able to max every mod they've gotten their hands on, not for the people who have

[krc473]

5 minutes ago, HiddenKazuma said:

I see a lot of people complaining about Endo drops in the Narmer bounties but honestly for people like me

I can see a lot of people looking at this and asking "What are Narmer Bounties?". You need a spoiler tag. I do agree that it gives a useful amount of Endo. But I am not a fan personally, for those (like me) that don't need the Endo it is a little annoying when you get six Endo rewards per bounty while looking for the Isotopes or frame/weapon parts.

• I would rather it was not there, but I don't hate it because the amounts are usable.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

Most already know that. What you're seeing is people exhibiting the classic "I got mine so eff everyone else" attitude.

They think because they reached a certain level in game, the game should stop everything they're doing to adjust the drop tables to only give them kuva and axi relics. 

They're literally exhibiting that they think the warframe universe revolves around them.

[(PSN)Pablogamer585]

To be fair I complained about Narmer bounties giving so much Endo because my old go-to Endo farm which was Railjack (Aka that gamemode no one touches because they hate it) got nerfed into oblivion prior to the introduction of  Call of Tempestarii, just to be replaced by this after TNW dropped.

It is less of a "I got everything (I personally don't, yet) so eff everyone else" but more of a "You give just to take, and then give it again when you see you've got nothing to offer."

[Numerounius]

I think it is a godsend for players that are running low on endo, I got about 70K endo just from farming the bounties for the brief time I needed to gather everything else (didn't need the endo but I was not disappointed to see this number pop up), with people having tons of credits from railajck missions, and sisters I think rank 10 mods are going to be much more generous to more people rather than needing to find dedicated farms. 

But the weighting of the bounty rewards should not be so heavily weighted towards the endo and isoplast rewards, I feel like they could have done a better job balancing the Caliban and isoplast rewards though, on one hand keeping the warframe parts weighted lower than others is much better for those that want the endo but on the other hand I don't want 15 weapon blueprints and no warframe parts. 

It is vastly better than having the near crap vanilla rewards like in the now nerfed ghoul purge bounties and debt-bonds for Fortuna so I have to give credit to DE for that.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

I'll say this about Endo rewards

I've never understood why people are willing to Buy legendary cores.

I've always had plenty of endo piling up for mod ranking.

[sunderthefirmament]

1 hour ago, XHADgaming said:

But the weighting of the bounty rewards should not be so heavily weighted towards the endo and isoplast rewards, I feel like they could have done a better job balancing the Caliban and isoplast rewards though, on one hand keeping the warframe parts weighted lower than others is much better for those that want the endo but on the other hand I don't want 15 weapon blueprints and no warframe parts. 

It is vastly better than having the near crap vanilla rewards like in the now nerfed ghoul purge bounties and debt-bonds for Fortuna so I have to give credit to DE for that.

Then we'd get further into dead drop territory.  By the time I had all the Caliban pieces I needed (two sets) and the three new Narmer weapons, I still had to farm isoplasts and accrue a handful of useless extra BP's in the process.  I have no need for the endo, but it's still more evergreen than a third Caliban chassis.

 

A "Rewards 2.0" update doesn't sound plausible, but I do wish something could be done for dead drops like extra Caliban parts, Quassus BP's, Sevagoth pieces, and many, many others.

[Lutesque]

7 hours ago, HiddenKazuma said:

I see a lot of people complaining about Endo drops in the Narmer bounties but honestly for people like me - who haven't been playing for years and years - they are a godsend. Being able to get 1-2k Endo in a single bounty is about the fastest you can currently earn Endo, and as you are transitioning from using mid-rank mods to using max-rank mods and primed mods, the reliable source of a resource you need massive quantities of is very nice.

The only part of your Oppinion that's Controversial is that you think this is okay for a Tier 6 Bounty....

I also think 1000+ Endo is a Great Reward... But it needs to be made available at lower levels.... Tier 4 At the Very Least....

7 hours ago, shocker53 said:

Great argument! Personally I feel like people are being super selfish with what they say when they say this or that should be removed or what should have lower drop chances

Great for them who have all the mods maxed, it's a great accomplishment! But that doesn't mean everybody who plays Warframe has done that too, the Endo rewards are for those who haven't been able to max every mod they've gotten their hands on, not for the people who have

It's honestly Easier and Faster to just buy Sculptures.... 👀

5 hours ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

I'll say this about Endo rewards

I've never understood why people are willing to Buy legendary cores.

I've always had plenty of endo piling up for mod ranking.

Some people just Collect Them.... I've been playing for 3 Years and I only got a Legendary Core to drop Once.... 👀

 

[HiddenKazuma]

Yeah, actually thinking about it, DE messed up a lot with the Narmer bounties - like them not actually being unique at all lol - but I think they nailed the rewards table. The amount of Isoplasts needed seemed super punishing at first blush, but it actually wasn't that bad to farm Caliban? Not like Fortuna Debt-Bonds, to give an example that I do think is awful.

And the low drop chance of the Caliban parts feels harsh when you are farming the parts, but once you have the parts you are glad for it; would much rather have 600 or 900 Endo than the couple thousand credits you'd get from selling the part.

[project_eulogy]

16 hours ago, HiddenKazuma said:

Yeah, actually thinking about it, DE messed up a lot with the Narmer bounties - like them not actually being unique at all lol - but I think they nailed the rewards table. The amount of Isoplasts needed seemed super punishing at first blush, but it actually wasn't that bad to farm Caliban? Not like Fortuna Debt-Bonds, to give an example that I do think is awful.

And the low drop chance of the Caliban parts feels harsh when you are farming the parts, but once you have the parts you are glad for it; would much rather have 600 or 900 Endo than the couple thousand credits you'd get from selling the part.

 

If they changed the bounties every hour so you had a chance to farm the parts/bps you were actually missing, Caliban wouldn't be so bad to farm. it would be like any other Bounty BP farm. But its punishing when you play for 5 hours and its the same exact bounty/rewards during the entire time youre trying to farm, so you end up saying screw playing WF and go play something else. I'm not phased by having to farm resources, that's just the first name of the game, the last name being the build gate. But i am not OK with the experience of the bounties not changing for the entire time i'm able to play.

[Cenyn]

I'm always happy to get endo, but those bounties are nowhere near the fastest endo farms. Arbitrations, railjack, and SP vodyanoi (best) are all much faster.

As for reward dilution, endo is not remotely the worst offender in that regard *glares at maprico rewards*.

[Squick]

Too much dilution, too many places to get endo. By the time you're "new war ready" you have access to a large variety of endo farms, many of which are better because they are more consistent. Putting more endo in place of things that you actually need (isoplast. breath of the eidolon) feels like a lazy way to extend the grind.

[HiddenKazuma]

On 2022-01-09 at 3:24 PM, Cenyn said:

I'm always happy to get endo, but those bounties are nowhere near the fastest endo farms. Arbitrations, railjack, and SP vodyanoi (best) are all much faster.

As for reward dilution, endo is not remotely the worst offender in that regard *glares at maprico rewards*.

This is fair. However, those are all very late game and hard (excepting Railjack, but that requires a lot of investment into a game mode that, while I love it, I know not everyone enjoys). They are not super accessible to players who are still in the "trying to get most important mods from rank 8 to rank 10" zone.

Arbitrations and Railjack can also be super variable - sometimes you get a great team, sometimes you get an awful team (or no team at all in Railjack). The Narmer bounties are consistent and accessible.

[drnlmza]

42 minutes ago, HiddenKazuma said:

Arbitrations and Railjack can also be super variable - sometimes you get a great team, sometimes you get an awful team (or no team at all in Railjack). The Narmer bounties are consistent and accessible.

I do wonder how consistent they'll be in 3 months time, though, as the number of players who've gotten what they want from them increases.

 

Currently, I find the endo drops annoying, but that's because I want all the new toys RIGHT NOW, and those drops get in the way of that. Once I'm over this initial hump, the drops will look a lot more useful.

[L3512]

Anyone remember Arcana bounties having a decent chance to drop 2.5k endo per stage?

 

[Caelum-Warblade]

When you can literally get 3k+ Endo from farming Railjack content in like 15 minutes or less, anyone who says the Endo rewards from the Narmar bounties are just being foolish. Endo is an extremely important currency and to get to the point where a player can actually do The New War quest, players deserve a bit of a break in how they progress.

It's locked behind, all previous questlines to unlock TNW, getting a Necramech, Archwing, Railjack and probably more things I'm forgetting.

Like who is complaining about the Endo rewards because it's so far in the game to get to the point where you can even run these bounties, give players a bit of a break!

[Cenyn]

15 hours ago, HiddenKazuma said:

This is fair. However, those are all very late game and hard (excepting Railjack, but that requires a lot of investment into a game mode that, while I love it, I know not everyone enjoys). They are not super accessible to players who are still in the "trying to get most important mods from rank 8 to rank 10" zone.

Arbitrations and Railjack can also be super variable - sometimes you get a great team, sometimes you get an awful team (or no team at all in Railjack). The Narmer bounties are consistent and accessible.

If you can run New War you're likely able to run arbies at least, possibly SP Arena too. I will admit to being baffled by sub MR 10 players in those modes; but there they are, a lot quicker than I reached that stage. I feel fairly comfortable in Q&A directing players around MR 8 towards those modes, at least as near-future goals.

RJ just depends on when people feel like getting into it.

Anyway! I'll stop hijacking your topic with my quibbling.

[HiddenKazuma]

I think people who have been playing for a while may not have a sense of how relatively fast it actually is to get to New War, especially if getting through the quests is your goal, as is often the case for newer players who otherwise lack direction.

I've introduced quite a few new people to the game (five now, I think?), and while one of them is post New War and two others are very close to New War, none of them are anywhere near being able to survive Arbitrations, especially not to the level needed to actually make it a worthwhile Endo farm.

A large part of this is because the main quest line really doesn't have much in the way of "gear checks". Really the closest thing to a proper gear check is the Excal Umbra fight in Sacrifice, but that's still doable, if painful, with a mote amp.

I suppose Rising Tide is something of a gear check, but it's certainly doable at a much lower level of gear than Arbitrations.

[Redfeather75]

I liked it alot too. Endo gets so demanding and the more places I can get it in big chunks the more freedom I have in later game leveling my stuff. Narmer seems to be good leveling for standing and endo.

[Rigtis]

En 12/1/2022 a las 15:08, Cenyn dijo:

If you can run New War you're likely able to run arbies at least, possibly SP Arena too. I will admit to being baffled by sub MR 10 players in those modes; but there they are, a lot quicker than I reached that stage. I feel fairly comfortable in Q&A directing players around MR 8 towards those modes, at least as near-future goals.

RJ just depends on when people feel like getting into it.

Anyway! I'll stop hijacking your topic with my quibbling.

Relax your attitude, dude. It's not OP's fault that now there's a better alternative to Endo farm than those you listed and his points make complete sense. I have tried every method for long time and must say that Narmer bounties are one of the easiest, even rivalizing Railjack. You can play them solo, do not need specific (copypasted) builds and requires much less grind if your goal is only endo. I kinda dislike when people use MR as a way to "measure" a player's skills. Actually, I have seen low MR players doing a better job in Arbitrations than most high-rankers.

[Cenyn]

4 hours ago, Rigtis said:

Relax your attitude, dude. It's not OP's fault that now there's a better alternative to Endo farm than those you listed and his points make complete sense. I have tried every method for long time and must say that Narmer bounties are one of the easiest, even rivalizing Railjack. You can play them solo, do not need specific (copypasted) builds and requires much less grind if your goal is only endo. I kinda dislike when people use MR as a way to "measure" a player's skills. Actually, I have seen low MR players doing a better job in Arbitrations than most high-rankers.

? At no point did I relate MR to skill and I agree it would be silly to do so. I'm not sure how you arrived at that idea given my post can be summed up as 'early game players are outpacing my personal impression of progress, good for them, I'ma point them at some meta if they ask'.

I am not, at MR 30, intrinsically ~3% less knowledgeable than a Legendary 1, nor am I twice as knowledgeable as an MR 15. I've seen plenty of silly errors from L1s, and plenty of low MR players carry in Eidolon hunts, ESO, etc. A number of Q&A regulars are lower MR than I am, but know a heck of a lot more than I do on various subjects.

MR is, however, decently correlated to equipment and mod collections as certain milestones are required to advance the story/star chart. Thus my aside 'at least as near-future goals'. Skills can be picked up on the go in this game, but gear checks are harder to pass.

Narmer bounties being easy != them being being fast.  The endo is a nice bonus to farming Caliban or isoplast (whyyyy do we need so much?), but there's no real reason to do the bounties once you have all the equipment gated behind them. Bounties take, what, 7-12 minutes depending on squad or stages? Let's assume you get the most endo in each stage that you can, that comes to 3900 endo.

That is significantly less than the roughly 1k a minute that the Arena farm yields, even when discounting the heavy RNG (do you ever see endo in every single stage? I sure don't). Arbies are chill, turn-your-thinking-off modes. RJ also nets you credits, RJ gear, affinity, Sevagoth, Ignis wraith, etc. RJ is one of the more rewarding game modes---if you enjoy it, which I don't, particularly.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Bounty#Stage_5_

For other early game sources of endo, consider: Maroo once a week (helps teach movement skills too), Simaris each day (gets you other stuff too), and melt down duplicate mods for endo (never for credits).

[Rigtis]

hace 20 horas, Cenyn dijo:

? At no point did I relate MR to skill and I agree it would be silly to do so. I'm not sure how you arrived at that idea given my post can be summed up as 'early game players are outpacing my personal impression of progress, good for them, I'ma point them at some meta if they ask'.

I am not, at MR 30, intrinsically ~3% less knowledgeable than a Legendary 1, nor am I twice as knowledgeable as an MR 15. I've seen plenty of silly errors from L1s, and plenty of low MR players carry in Eidolon hunts, ESO, etc. A number of Q&A regulars are lower MR than I am, but know a heck of a lot more than I do on various subjects.

MR is, however, decently correlated to equipment and mod collections as certain milestones are required to advance the story/star chart. Thus my aside 'at least as near-future goals'. Skills can be picked up on the go in this game, but gear checks are harder to pass.

Narmer bounties being easy != them being being fast.  The endo is a nice bonus to farming Caliban or isoplast (whyyyy do we need so much?), but there's no real reason to do the bounties once you have all the equipment gated behind them. Bounties take, what, 7-12 minutes depending on squad or stages? Let's assume you get the most endo in each stage that you can, that comes to 3900 endo.

That is significantly less than the roughly 1k a minute that the Arena farm yields, even when discounting the heavy RNG (do you ever see endo in every single stage? I sure don't). Arbies are chill, turn-your-thinking-off modes. RJ also nets you credits, RJ gear, affinity, Sevagoth, Ignis wraith, etc. RJ is one of the more rewarding game modes---if you enjoy it, which I don't, particularly.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Bounty#Stage_5_

For other early game sources of endo, consider: Maroo once a week (helps teach movement skills too), Simaris each day (gets you other stuff too), and melt down duplicate mods for endo (never for credits).

Well, you reference to MR 10 being a liability just because they are was quite misleading. Now, let me tell you that today I made 5K+ endo in less than 20 mins running only the first stage of narmer bounties over and over again (just like we used to do to farm Aya), which also gives extra Narmer Isoplast for some standing with Quills/Solaris in case any clan member needs anything from there. So in comparison to "1K endo a minute" in that archaic Arena mode, where you need some specific looters to do so, I would say Narmer bounties exploit gives you a bit less, but is clearly a lot simpler method (I can even do it while I watch a movie on another screen). Actually, the new Narmer bounties are being slightly popular because of that, easy endo, so even people who have got "everything" keep playing them; like me for instance. Yes, Maroo and Simaris exists too, but those methods can't be well exploited as they are weekly/daily missions and sculptures are scarse for newplayers who don't have access to Arbis or the last ability of the Helminth, Golden Instinct, to reliably farm them in normal missions.

Keep in mind that here we are talking about young tennos, since getting to the New War quest is not big deal according to what I have seen ingame (some people even rushed from Second Dream to New War in a couple of days powered by hype). So, many of them do not have a proper Railjack, tank or a looter for common endo farm methods. On the other hand, Narmer bounties are a godsend for them.

[Cenyn]

17 minutes ago, Rigtis said:

Well, you reference to MR 10 being a liability just because they are was quite misleading. Now, let me tell you that today I made 5K+ endo in less than 20 mins running only the first stage of narmer bounties over and over again (just like we used to do to farm Aya), which also gives extra Narmer Isoplast for some standing with Quills/Solaris in case any clan member needs anything from there. So in comparison to "1K endo a minute" in that archaic Arena mode, where you need some specific looters to do so, I would say Narmer bounties exploit gives you a bit less, but is clearly a lot simpler method (I can even do it while I watch a movie on another screen). Actually, the new Narmer bounties are being slightly popular because of that, easy endo, so even people who have got "everything" keep playing them; like me for instance. Yes, Maroo and Simaris exists too, but those methods can't be well exploited as they are weekly/daily missions and sculptures are scarse for newplayers who don't have access to Arbis or the last ability of the Helminth, Golden Instinct, to reliably farm them in normal missions.

Keep in mind that here we are talking about young tennos, since getting to the New War quest is not big deal according to what I have seen ingame (some people even rushed from Second Dream to New War in a couple of days powered by hype). So, many of them do not have a proper Railjack, tank or a looter for common endo farm methods. On the other hand, Narmer bounties are a godsend for them.

Perhaps I could have been clearer, yes. To be super clear now: MR is not a measure of skill.

I'm glad you have a method you can enjoy. I certainly agree the SP arena farm isn't fun, it's just fast (hurray efficiency).

 

[Lutesque]

4 minutes ago, Rigtis said:

Yes, Maroo and Simaris exists too, but those methods can't be well exploited as they are weekly/daily missions and sculptures are scarse for newplayers who don't have access to Arbis or the last ability of the Helminth, Golden Instinct, to reliably farm them in normal missions.

They Could just... You know... Trade for The Sculptures they need....

I don't know if it's Faster but it's just as Simple as the Narmer Bounties....