The impact AoE nerf could have

[cute_moth.npc]

Wait I have posts in this thread from January all of a sudden..

Oh, this is it! The great megathread! This is officially the thread the prophecies warned us of.

Hi D.E, 

NERF IT 

Just don't go completely overboard. Please return AoE to "valid option" status instead of "this may as well be called Zarrframe"

[mycroft_]

On 2022-08-24 at 7:11 PM, Venus-Venera said:

Chewing gum no longer tastes good after a while. 😉

Especially if you mix it with 'real food', which is what DE did when they inappropriately merged the thread "DE, pls, fix and balance all we have in this game at this moment. Make time for it." into this one

That thread wasn't chewing gum, it was an entire cake, and now it's all mixed in with used chewing gum. That's gross.

[PollexMessier]

I just want self damage back but as it's own stat independant from a weapon's damage, that deals % health so it's even across all frames and doesn't have the potential to insta kill you. and for god sake remove projectile collision with friendly entities because the amount of times I've hit myself with an explosive because my kavat or another player jumps in front of my face when I'm firing is absurd.

Self damage is necessary in this game imo. It's incredibly fun to synergize with on damage effects (when the devs actually let you do that.) and depending on your team can sometimes be the only way to trigger these effects on yourself. A hell of a lot of game breaking bugs can be sorted out by dying and reviving yourself. Which is also sometimes just not possible depending on your team, or your warframe's build and mission level. And self damage is a pretty big incentive to not spam aoe weapons which is what the current issue with them is.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb PollexMessier:

I just want self damage back but as it's own stat independant from a weapon's damage, that deals % health so it's even across all frames and doesn't have the potential to insta kill you. and for god sake remove projectile collision with friendly entities because the amount of times I've hit myself with an explosive because my kavat or another player jumps in front of my face when I'm firing is absurd.

Self damage is necessary in this game imo. It's incredibly fun to synergize with on damage effects (when the devs actually let you do that.) and depending on your team can sometimes be the only way to trigger these effects on yourself. A hell of a lot of game breaking bugs can be sorted out by dying and reviving yourself. Which is also sometimes just not possible depending on your team, or your warframe's build and mission level. And self damage is a pretty big incentive to not spam aoe weapons which is what the current issue with them is.

so you want to make gameplay even more difficult? in a game where hardly anything works without boosters? and people farm for something like normal khora 3+ months?
how serious is that?

and what about warframes like harrow? or gloom skill? or should we just play with something like that???????
and you probably haven't heard anything from other players who block your view.
or weird mobs running towards players like formula 1.

[mycroft_]

6 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

so you want to make gameplay even more difficult?

 

Given that it's way too easy right now...kinda.

But it's important to note, 'restoring self damage' and 'make gameplay even more difficult' are completely different things. Putting self damage in wouldn't make the game more difficult. It would only make shooting at your feet with an explosive weapon more difficult. That's not much of the game, altogether.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb mycroft_:

 

Given that it's way too easy right now...kinda.

But it's important to note, 'restoring self damage' and 'make gameplay even more difficult' are completely different things. Putting self damage in wouldn't make the game more difficult. It would only make shooting at your feet with an explosive weapon more difficult. That's not much of the game, altogether.

the game was way too easy in 2013/2014 as well. we camped in defs for hours back then.
saryn used to do the most damage and still does! you can see that in defs and survs. not even a top aoe weapon like kuva zarr can compete with saryn. and despite blatant overkill damage with zarr's orange/red crits, saryn does 60-80% team damage!
so why should aoe weapon be nerfed? or sausage guns with 5 ammo become even weaker?

someone screaming for aoe weapon nerfs has no idea about the game. because you can speed run with ignis wrath just as well as with kuva zarr. Mainly because it takes me two shots to bypass Shield Gating on lvl 1 enemy.

[PublikDomain]

Happening!

And it keeps giving! Monke up next:

• Wuclone deals half damage.
• Wuclone deals extra damage to marked targets.
• Wuclone uses your ammo.
• Wuclone can self-stagger himself (and inherits PSF).
• More damage and range growth to Iron Staff.
• Iron Staff forward combo gains a vortex that pulls enemies together.

 

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

2 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Happening!

Yeah, twitch chat is already malding

[p_silveira]

Tbh most of these won't do much. Nerfs were way too small. DE is afraid of the backlash ¬¬' .

[trst]

1 minute ago, p_silveira said:

Tbh most of these won't do much. Nerfs were way too small. DE is afraid of the backlash ¬¬' .

Yeah the impact of it is going to be entirely within the exact numbers. Expecting ammo to still be too plentiful and AOE's to have too much max.

Also I head no mention of Energized Munitions which I'm fully expecting to slip through the cracks.

[Sammonoske]

I'm glad they pretty much took nobody on the forums advise lol. Granted this a work in progress, it's not going to completely kill aoe like most here wanted.

[p_silveira]

2 minutes ago, trst said:

Expecting ammo to still be too plentiful and AOE's to have too much max.

Also I head no mention of Energized Munitions which I'm fully expecting to slip through the cracks.

Not to mention Ammo Mutation and Protea's Dispensary (available to every frame through Helminth). Unless those are addressed, the ammo changes will accomplish absolutely nothing.

[Tiltskillet]

10 minutes ago, p_silveira said:

Tbh most of these won't do much. Nerfs were way too small. DE is afraid of the backlash ¬¬' .

IMO it's better to go small with something like this.   Although I'd maybe use the word "diffused" rather than "small".

The key stipulation though is they have to be willing to evaluate how it works and  iterate on it as needed.  In a timely manner--not 2-3 years from now.

[V2lkyr]

I'm glad they're not deleting AoE.

[trst]

3 minutes ago, p_silveira said:

Not to mention Ammo Mutation and Protea's Dispensary (available to every frame through Helminth). Unless those are addressed, the ammo changes will accomplish absolutely nothing.

Mutation was mentioned as getting changes but nothing specific was said.

But yeah I'm hoping they don't leave blatant methods to exploit the new ammo system. As any of them would invalidate all the changes they're bothering to make.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Sammonoske:

I'm glad they pretty much took nobody on the forums advise lol. Granted this a work in progress, it's not going to completely kill aoe like most here wanted.

and which aoe then? almost all aoe weapons are bad and can not keep up with the performance of ignis wrath.
or who saw lenz in the game? I haven't for MANY years...

in addition, almost everyone is satisfied with a few usable aoe weapons. here complain always the same crybabies. but they complain about everything. they won't like anything because they don't even play the game!

[Tiltskillet]

39 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Happening!

The Steel Path relics situation will be interesting.  How much will it split the playerbase?  Will enough people bother with SP relics to make it worthwhile in random co-op?

Can people who aren't in SP be taxi'd to SP fissures?  Probably not, so how much more miscommunication and confusion will there be doing radshares right after a prime release? :P

[PublikDomain]

9 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

The Steel Path relics situation will be interesting.  How much will it split the playerbase?  Will enough people bother with SP relics to make it worthwhile in random co-op?

Can people who aren't in SP be taxi'd to SP fissures?  Probably not, so how much more miscommunication and confusion will there be doing radshares right after a prime release? :P

I can't imagine it does much, did they mention any additional rewards? It sounds like just the normal SP rewards. Cracking relics is cracking relics; it's an optimization problem. Whatever is fastest is best, and fastest is still going to be bum-rushing Thermal Sunder Titania on the lowest level content possible.

[0_The_F00l]

I am so very content after seeing the devstream :)

[BansheeAndZephyrMarried]

52 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Happening!

And it keeps giving! Monke up next:

• Wuclone deals half damage.
• Wuclone deals extra damage to marked targets.
• Wuclone uses your ammo.
• Wuclone can self-stagger himself (and inherits PSF).
• More damage and range growth to Iron Staff.
• Iron Staff forward combo gains a vortex that pulls enemies together.

 

HOLSTER SPEED INCREASE 

PRECISION HEADSHOT DAMAGE INCREASE

STEEL PATH RELICS?!?!!?!?

THIS IS ALL I EVER WANTED HECK YEAH

I just hope SP fissure endless doesn't mess with Acolyte spawns and render the whole thing pointless. SP Kuva survival suffered so much from borked spawns and it took DE way too long to fix them. 

[Dunkelheit]

Tbh, the AOE nerfs won't go far enough, but they already have the next phase on their mind. But I am so happy that Reb + Pablo have taken over. Every single thing they talked about was meaningful and good for the game.

Wukong nerf won't do much, but I like that they are going small.

[mycroft_]

1 hour ago, PublikDomain said:

Happening!

And it keeps giving! Monke up next

 

What about the rest of the ideas presented in the thread that was recently merged into this one, "DE, pls, fix and balance all we have in this game at this moment. Make time for it."?

 

Quote

What's up with Hydroid? Why he still not playable? Nyx, where are you too? Can't see this frame for a long time now. And why does Saryn know how to accelerate? Why would she do that?? ...it's extremely irrational for her!

 

Where is the challenge in game? Where is the AI in enemy mobs? Where is multiplayer in this "multiplayer" game? (look at L4D to understand how a true cooperative should work!) There is no need to hone your skills in this game at the moment

Here is another topic in which I touch on Smeeta excessive popularity and interesting cut-out content that could have been fixed very easily, but DE ruined everything.

The game is still in beta test, which also does not give it any advantages... most likely, DE thus relieves himself of a lot of responsibilities, but it's still not right. Testing the game for so many years and simultaneously releasing new content is ridiculous. Moreover, players through this forum report errors that happen in their "beta-game", but DE ignores most of these errors. They ignore the meaning of the BETA TEST itself! DE, test your game at the beginning, then exit the beta, and then add something new - that's correct actions. As a result, we have eternal bugs now. 

 

[mycroft_]

1 hour ago, Sammonoske said:

I'm glad they pretty much took nobody on the forums advise lol. Granted this a work in progress, it's not going to completely kill aoe like most here wanted.

 

These changes don't go anywhere near far enough, as per usual...

[PublikDomain]

1 minute ago, mycroft_ said:

What about the rest of the ideas presented in the thread that was recently merged into this one, "DE, pls, fix and balance all we have in this game at this moment. Make time for it."?

Beats me, if you haven't noticed this thread is kind of a S#&$hole lol. There's a lot of stuff that's just been blanket merged in.

Though DE did mention some additional ideas I've seen floated in this thread, like adjusting self-stagger mitigation tools and adding LoS, and even one I hadn't seen mentioned before: ammo drop biasing. But these are the additional steps if/when a second pass is needed.

[0_The_F00l]

5 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Though DE did mention some additional ideas I've seen floated in this thread, like adjusting self-stagger mitigation tools and adding LoS, and even one I hadn't seen mentioned before: ammo drop biasing. But these are the additional steps if/when a second pass is needed.

I have been screaming about Ammo changes for years now 🥲