Squishy or not?

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

When I play higher level content, or content in this game in general, I often opt for more tanky frames. Which means franes that can take a lot of punishment and/or heal themselves up afterwards. This to me means the likes of Rhino, Wukong or Valkyr.

Talking about Steel Path, people frequently mention frames that I would consider too squishy like Nyx, Zephyr, Ash or Ivara.

To me, that didn't sound like very sounds choices, but I admit my approach to the game is more "brutish" and I don't know much about the intrinsics of modding frames to do what the others I've spoken to can do. (comes with the territory when you mostly try and make your builds all by yourself while also avoid using certain mods)

So, long story short: can anyone widen my knowledge on how to make these seemingly "fragile" frames fit for more dangerous content?

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

Am 16.8.2022 um 21:21 schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

you could try Mag?

I've recently gave her a Forma. Now I'm trying to get some sort of build for her.

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Shield gating- minimal shield/fast recharge

Shield tanking- massive shield + arcane barrier+adapt+ a way to easily go into overshields  (Your shields gain damage reduction and have a chance of restoring to 100% on damage which thanx to adapt should have plenty of opportunity to trigger)

Adaptation 

Rolling Guard (Theres a stupid new zariman mod that massively boosts crit chance? on headshots after rolling... sounds like a fun way to play mesa if u didnt have to get headshot)

-------------

I've taken my ivara into steel path here and there.  Besides my infinite invis what really helped her is being able to air glide a really long time.  Some/all acolytes can see through your invis?   But if your just floating in the air invis they get really confused lol...  Acolytes love to crash spy missions =(.   (anti-grav array and one of the Mortus mods both provide a huge increase to glide time)

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

52 minutes ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I'm at MR26 currently. But i admit I still play a lot like a noob. Part of it is that I try and get things, including building up my loadouts, all on my own; not taking advantage of other people's work.

ANd I also have skipped on using certain mods because they give stat penalties which I'm always afraid of will hurt me when I'm in a tight spot.

 

Oh thats fine too. Like I said in my reply, I personally didn't start using most of the squishy Warframes until I was MR 30. At MR 30, Nyx Prime and Banshee Prime were my least used Warframe. Since then, so the last two years, they are now in my upper half of most used Warframes. 

The Sisters of Parvos and Lich missions were a big reason I started to use them more, and I realised I actually liked them a lot! 

I think thats cool you try and work off your own findings and discoveries. Admirable. That being said, I think it would be okay to look at others work too, then incorporate your own knowledge. There is a lot in Warframe, to try and cover it all myself personally would... take too much time. Earlier I watched a video that showed that your Sentinel can solo Steel Path given the right set up. I'd never know that myself, because I'd find it too boring not to attack or shoot enemies ha. 

Do you mean Corrupted Mods? That makes sense. Personally it was just personal experimentation that made me okay with it. 

 

59 minutes ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I'm generally not very mobile. I do walk around, but mostly backing up when enemies are too in my face. Other than that, I mostly stand my ground because I have a rather bad aim which means I stay stationary and ADS in order to hit, especially when I'm going for headshots (this is a general thing for me in shooters)

 

That could be your main issue with squishy Warframes. Again though, thats not a bad thing, just a preference. If you know a little bit about, the general concept of shield gating, you could try Mag? Since her abilities can help you replenish shields, so you can use your powers for the effect, and her Magnetise can let you stand your ground, and let you shoot into enemies, devastating them. Only point of consideration is to take a projectile weapon with decent punch through. Or like others have mentioned, Nyx and Zephyr with their augments! 

Oh and yeah, getting good headshots is very fun! I am the same in this respect too! 

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

3 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

But I'm too hesitant; and have no idea how to build her for such a mission so she doesn't get melted by enemies (normally, I'd got with Wukong or Valkyr for survival)

 

If you go for an efficiency build, and have any rank of Arcane Energise, then you can basically stay in stealth permanently. 

If you have a silenced primary or secondary, (or melee) then enemies will constantly clueless as to where you are, and won't be able to touch you. Assuming you are solo. 

Personally? I'd recommend going up against Grineer at first, to get used to it. Infested can cause some AOE attacks they go through your shields, and Corpus Nullifiers will knock you out of stealth... but with practice, even those won't stop you. 

So you could also put Rolling Guard in your build, so you can cleanse yourself of status. 

My own personal favourite solo Ivara in Steel Path Survival, is to use Helminth to get Khora's Ensnare over Ivara's Navigation. Then I use Ivara's Augment for Artemis Bow that, is the explosive arrow. Then throwing on Internal Bleeding to her bow. 

Its really fun, since you can Ensnare a whole lot of enemies together, land up headshots and the explosion will trigger slash damage in an AOE, and since all the enemies are grouped with Ensnare... (which also helps land said headshots). 

Alternatively, same tactic but with Glaive Prime or Stropha. The only struggle you might have, is with the Acolyte appearing, but thats where Ensnare serves an additional purpose, as it works on them. I usually make my melee a dedicated Acolyte killer. 

Hope you try it and have fun! 

[Tiltskillet]

4 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

Ash's invis seems a bit short tho.

It is, but it's workable with modding.    He's also got some invulnerability options in his 4 and 3 while he's not invisible.  And he's the least inherently squishy of the invisible frames.

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 23 Stunden schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

I think thats cool you try and work off your own findings and discoveries. Admirable. That being said, I think it would be okay to look at others work too, then incorporate your own knowledge. There is a lot in Warframe, to try and cover it all myself personally would... take too much time. Earlier I watched a video that showed that your Sentinel can solo Steel Path given the right set up. I'd never know that myself, because I'd find it too boring not to attack or shoot enemies ha. 

My way of thinking is that I leech off of the work of others where I should put in the work myself. To me, if I have to resort to the knowledge of others, I let the game defeat me instead of the other way around.

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

2 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

My way of thinking is that I leech off of the work of others where I should put in the work myself. To me, if I have to resort to the knowledge of others, I let the game defeat me instead of the other way around.

 

I mean, if thats your style and preference, I am not going to interfere. 

For myself I am sitting here using a computer I don't know how to create, eating food that was resourced from a bunch of different places. Warframe is just one game I play. I thought the Felarx Incarnon weapon was underwhelming at first. I'd rather watch a 10 minute Youtube video where someone has spent their day trying to figure out the best builds, then spend 10 hours of my own time experimenting on a gun I wasn't really fond of. As it turns out, the guns Evolved form is just generally inferior to the base form, as far as I can tell. Alternatively, I personally have spent a lot of time experimenting with weapons and builds. More than most probably... so if someone asks me for advice... should I shun them? I am more than happy to help or assist. 

If I consider them leeches who benefit of my knowledge... and so I shouldn't leech of others either... thats consistent. Resorting to the knowledge of others, isn't the same as appreciating the knowledge of others. I think its about context. Finding out your own builds because thats enjoyment for example, versus avoiding others advice, because you believe its leeching carries more negativity. Negativity that isn't necessary. 

Also some people are inconsistent as in they will help others, but avoid needing help from others. I think that can be a bit unfortunate, because that often creates situation where many people need help, but because people look down on the idea of asking or taking advice or help, no one gets it, rather than fostering or encouraging the spirit of cooperation and compassion. Though again, not to say coming up with your own builds or knowledge first hand is bad. I do that a lot too. I do also stand on the shoulders of giants in a lot of other areas though (like science, computers, and food!)

 

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

Am 16.8.2022 um 21:32 schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

My own personal favourite solo Ivara in Steel Path Survival, is to use Helminth to get Khora's Ensnare over Ivara's Navigation. Then I use Ivara's Augment for Artemis Bow that, is the explosive arrow. Then throwing on Internal Bleeding to her bow. 

I haven't really dabbled much with Helminth. Because I never knew how to use infusion right. No idea which ability to put onto which frame.

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

So if you are still relatively new to the game, might just mean its a matter of time

I'm at MR26 currently. But i admit I still play a lot like a noob. Part of it is that I try and get things, including building up my loadouts, all on my own; not taking advantage of other people's work.

ANd I also have skipped on using certain mods because they give stat penalties which I'm always afraid of will hurt me when I'm in a tight spot.

vor 7 Stunden schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

Some of what I mentioned, doesn't require gear or mods. Its just how you play. Like, rolling actually gives you a damage reduction. Some people aren't aware of this, but it means if enemies are shooting at you, rolling is good way to reduce damage. So is being evasive, and jumping around a lot. Enemies are limited by AI patterns, and that can be exploited. If you jump, roll, and flip a lot, they can struggle to keep up. However moving around a lot can make you own aiming tougher too, but thats where a few things can help. Practice. If you practice trying to hit enemies whilst moving a lot, you'll get better. Plus you have tools like aim glide to help. Also, some powers and abilities don't need you to aim. Like Saryn. Saryn's powers will ramp up off enemies, if you maintain your spores, you can just run around and melee to spread spores and always be jumping and flipping. 

I'm generally not very mobile. I do walk around, but mostly backing up when enemies are too in my face. Other than that, I mostly stand my ground because I have a rather bad aim which means I stay stationary and ADS in order to hit, especially when I'm going for headshots (this is a general thing for me in shooters)

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 17 Stunden schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

Also some people are inconsistent as in they will help others, but avoid needing help from others.

Well, that is kinda me.

I do like showing people the ropes in games that I enjoy myself.

But for myself, I avoid guides and any other sort of help outside of in-game tutorials as much as possible. I think that in part has to do with a time when I used guides extensively for a singleplayer game, with the result that it took the fun out of the game for me. It was just "go there, do that" without any form of discovery for myself.

Since then, I go into any game blind and try to go as far as I can without needing any form of help. Over time, it became my mindset that if I need outside help, I had failed at doing what the game asks of me; that I failed at the game and that I am inferior to the rest of the players doing it.

[Lutesque]

On 2022-08-17 at 11:40 PM, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

My way of thinking is that I leech off of the work of others where I should put in the work myself. To me, if I have to resort to the knowledge of others, I let the game defeat me instead of the other way around.

You Should Watch This: skip to 6:30

Here Gerald Says: " An expert Technique that Seems Game Changing will Eventually Turn into Common Knowledge as the Meta Developes... This is why Daigo Stresses 'You Don't Own Your Strategies' ".

Not Only That... But knowing the Strategy is Actually The Easy Part... Executing It is a Whole Other Animal and in Doing So the Strategy becomes Just as much Yours as Whoever Discovered it...obviously you can't Claim you Discovered it aswell but you do get join the Group of People who are Proficient with the Strategy....

And One Last Thing....

You do Realise that 99% of Everything We as Human Beans Learn was Already Discovered By Someone Else ... And in order to make New Discoveries... You have to Learn all the stuff that was already Discovered ?

Even if you don't Discover anything New.... You can use what you learn to Taylor a Solution that Fits your Play Style... Which is what I've been Doing.... I know The Meta but I don't Use The Meta 👀....

22 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

I mean, if thats your style and preference, I am not going to interfere. 

For myself I am sitting here using a computer I don't know how to create, eating food that was resourced from a bunch of different places. Warframe is just one game I play. I thought the Felarx Incarnon weapon was underwhelming at first. I'd rather watch a 10 minute Youtube video where someone has spent their day trying to figure out the best builds, then spend 10 hours of my own time experimenting on a gun I wasn't really fond of. As it turns out, the guns Evolved form is just generally inferior to the base form, as far as I can tell. Alternatively, I personally have spent a lot of time experimenting with weapons and builds. More than most probably... so if someone asks me for advice... should I shun them? I am more than happy to help or assist. 

If I consider them leeches who benefit of my knowledge... and so I shouldn't leech of others either... thats consistent. Resorting to the knowledge of others, isn't the same as appreciating the knowledge of others. I think its about context. Finding out your own builds because thats enjoyment for example, versus avoiding others advice, because you believe its leeching carries more negativity. Negativity that isn't necessary. 

Also some people are inconsistent as in they will help others, but avoid needing help from others. I think that can be a bit unfortunate, because that often creates situation where many people need help, but because people look down on the idea of asking or taking advice or help, no one gets it, rather than fostering or encouraging the spirit of cooperation and compassion. Though again, not to say coming up with your own builds or knowledge first hand is bad. I do that a lot too. I do also stand on the shoulders of giants in a lot of other areas though (like science, computers, and food!)

 

That's Dope ♥️ !!!

6 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I haven't really dabbled much with Helminth. Because I never knew how to use infusion right. No idea which ability to put onto which frame.

Experiment...  Put Parasitic Armor on Inaros 😝....

5 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

But for myself, I avoid guides and any other sort of help outside of in-game tutorials as much as possible. I think that in part has to do with a time when I used guides extensively for a singleplayer game, with the result that it took the fun out of the game for me. It was just "go there, do that" without any form of discovery for myself.

Yeah well... in Warframe it's the Exact Opposite.... It's not fun because the Game doesn't have a Tutorial and How are you going to Discover anything if you Don't understand how anything Works due to bad in Game Descriptions ? 😱....

5 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

Since then, I go into any game blind and try to go as far as I can without needing any form of help. Over time, it became my mindset that if I need outside help, I had failed at doing what the game asks of me; that I failed at the game and that I am inferior to the rest of the players doing it.

Again.... Warframe is the Exception.... For any other Game that's fine but This Way Of Thinking doesnt work in Warframe 👀...

 

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

12 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I think that in part has to do with a time when I used guides extensively for a singleplayer game, with the result that it took the fun out of the game for me. It was just "go there, do that" without any form of discovery for myself.

 

That makes a lot of sense. Plus i can personally relate to that as well. I play a lot of JRPG's and they can be very long, but in some of them, trying to complete everything can be tough, especially without guides. I think one of the worst examples was in Final Fantasy XII, where the best weapon in the game was locked behind a system... that required you to NOT open up a certain amount of select treasures in the game. Except JRPG's are all about looting from chests all the time! So for myself, I mostly played blind, but then I would use guides when I was either stuck, or near finished, and wanted to see if there was extra I missed out on. 

So our experiences are different, and I have found an enjoyable way to play games. I think if you are happy and enjoy the games your own way, that is great. The only potential issue is if you aren't actually enjoying yourself though. Like if you go from one extreme of following guides too much, to avoiding any sort of outside help at all, which may also take out the fun. Maybe a nice middle ground could be nice? Thats completely up to you to decide though, but I do understand what you mean too! 

It also seems like you might be very critical and hard on yourself though if you think you fail at a game or are inferior. Games ideally should give us positive emotions, feelings and experiences, to help with the more negative parts of life. I myself, have slow reflexes. I could consider that it makes me inferior to other players... but then a lot of players have slow reflexes too, and I don't think less of them. I also gave good game sense and knowledge, patient as well. 

Sometimes its about how we contextualise our strengths and weaknesses. 

 

13 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I haven't really dabbled much with Helminth. Because I never knew how to use infusion right. No idea which ability to put onto which frame.

 

If you are doing this off just your own experimentation, that is going to be hard yeah. Since you generally have to know quite a bit about the game, the different Warframe's and your own play style. That being said, you can always undo the process. You never lose an ability permanently, you can undo it easily enough, and also replace abilities too. Having a good knowledge of all the different subsume abilities helps too. 

Like you mentioned you like playing Tanky Warframes like Nezha, Wukong, Rhino and Valkyr? They might have abilities you don't care for so much, you think about the ability you use the least, the think about all the options you might have. For example, Gloom is an ability which slows enemies and gives life steal! Imagine how much more tanky your tanky Warframes would be with it? They would be even harder to kill. Or imagine Rhino with Nidus Larvae? Where you group enemies then can charge them?

There are some Helminth exclusive abilities too, like Energised Munitions, which is great for guns. Its a very exciting system, with a lot of experimenting available, but can also be a bit overwhelming! 

Also with Mag, since I know you like being tanky. Could focus on learning her 3 and 4. Since they can help you with replenishing shields, and if you can constantly replenish them, it will help you survive. Maybe a high efficiency build, and wide range could be good to start off with. Magnetise will benefit as well, which will be the main way you can damage/kill enemies. 

Good luck and take care! 

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

Am 19.8.2022 um 01:00 schrieb Lutesque:

Even if you don't Discover anything New.... You can use what you learn to Taylor a Solution that Fits your Play Style... Which is what I've been Doing.... I know The Meta but I don't Use The Meta 👀....

To me, this is still more akin to simply following footsteps others have laid out, not doing my own homework on this.

(sorry for the late reply; I took a step back from checking the forums for a few weeks)

Am 19.8.2022 um 01:00 schrieb Lutesque:

Experiment...  Put Parasitic Armor on Inaros 😝....

I could do that.

But, would you know it, I have second thoughts. At one hand, it means I can figure stuff out without having to rely on what others did before me. On the other, it's very time consuming and I'll sure as hell find more ways how to not do it than how to do it right.

Am 19.8.2022 um 01:00 schrieb Lutesque:

Again.... Warframe is the Exception.... For any other Game that's fine but This Way Of Thinking doesnt work in Warframe

I mean, how can I know if I'm actually good enough to hold my own if I'm just doing what others tell me to do?

I'm sorry for this all sounding so dimissive, I try to be accepting and understanding, but I'm also stuck in the ways I've chosen for myself and any change will need to have enough draw to pull me off those rails.

It's not against you. It's just my stubborness and insecurity.

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

Am 19.8.2022 um 08:02 schrieb (PSN)slightconfuzzled:

It also seems like you might be very critical and hard on yourself though if you think you fail at a game or are inferior.

It's something that I feel rather frequently in my life overall. Thinking that I'm behind others and being left in the dust because I can't keep up.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I mean, how can I know if I'm actually good enough to hold my own if I'm just doing what others tell me to do?

If you just do what others Tell you to do without Question then yes... You probably are not Good Enough to Hold your Own....

But if you understand the Reasoning behind doing what Others Tell you to do then You are Good enough to Hold Your own 👍....

That's The Difference....

2 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

To me, this is still more akin to simply following footsteps others have laid out, not doing my own homework on this.

You do realise that Any Homework your Teacher Gives you has Already Been Solved by Someone.... 

Think about it.... There's all kinds of Things you wouldn't be Able to do if someone Doesn't Teach you Other Things First.... You can't Do Math if someone doesn't Teach you how to Count First.... Sure you could go Figure out How to Count on your Own but What Would be the Point... Or better yet.... How would you even know that's what you need to know 😱 ? It's Already been Solved by someone so you might Aswell learn it from Someone else so you Can Finally Solve Math Problems....

 Warframe is Kinda the Same way but Alot Worse.... Because Unlike Maths, Warframe is Inconsistent about it's Rules.... 

Right now I'm Having Trouble Figuring Out why Ivara's Piercing Navigator is being affected by Ability Strength when The Wiki says it's Not Suppose to be.... I could Go into the Simulacrum and Bang my Head trying to Figure out How it Works or if it's even Working At All....

And You know what... I probably will at Some point (since I'm bored) but it Would be better if DE explained what the Mod is Actually Doing so I can Get on with my Life and spend more time Actually playing the Game....

I mean that's What you want to do Right ? To play The Game.

I understand where you are Coming from.... Infact even some Developers understand that Gamers Are Self Absorbed Narcissists who like to Figure things out for themselves and Have Even Designed techniques around Teaching players how to Play the Game in Secret without Hurting their Precious Little Egos.... Shigeru Miyamoto understands this Very Well.... The Original Metroid Games are Often Sited as Games that Don't Hold the player's Hand when in Truth they Actually Do it more than Some Modern Games do.... They just Do it In Secret.... The Same Goes For The Earliest Legend Of Zelda Games.... If Miyamoto-San wanted to Teach you Something... Rather than have a Tutorial Pop Up explaining How it Works.... Very Often he would Lock you in the Room where the New Gimmick is and The only Way Out is to Use that Gimmick to Escape.... This Proving that you understand how the Gimmick Works.... Games like Portal are Designed Exclusively using this Methodology... That's literally what you do in the Whole Game.... Thinking that you are Figuring stuff out on your own when in Truth the Developers are leading you by the nose...

 

I noticed that DE tries to do the Same thing with Warframe but often They Botch the Execution and wind up having to Explain it anyway.... But more than That... Nothing the Game Actually Teaches you Actually Gets Utilized... Everything from The Xoris to Spoiler Mode only Gets Utilized on these Islands that are Not part of the Core Loop of Warframe....

Hence why it's a Bad experience trying to learn Anything in Warframe on your Own.... Especially if the Game flatout Lies to about how something Works in its Description.... Nightwatch Napalm and Piercing Navigator being Good Examples.

You're not Stupid for not Understanding a Game that Flip Flops over its Own Rules... And if you really Can't play Warframe without Figuring things out on your Own... That's Fine too... That just means Warframe isn't for you.... But there are Plenty of Games that can be Figured out By yourself.... Like Hades.

I can Confirm that you will be Able to Understand and Enjoy Hades without Ever having to Google a Single Thing About it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Because it's in Game Descriptions are Accurate and it's Rules are Consistent.... You're not going to Come Across some Bull $@#& that Doesn't Work because the Developers were Afraid it might be Too Over Powered 👀.... Digital Extremes Constantly Giving into this Excuse is Exactly Why Warframe has no Tutorial.... Anything it Teaches you would Just be a Lie anyway when you have to Fight a Boss or Something since the Game just Disables 90% Of Everything that Works on Normal Enemies.... A tutorial would do more Harm than Good in Warframe ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So yeah....that's my 2 and a Half Cents.

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

On 2022-08-15 at 3:46 PM, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

When I play higher level content, or content in this game in general, I often opt for more tanky frames. Which means franes that can take a lot of punishment and/or heal themselves up afterwards. This to me means the likes of Rhino, Wukong or Valkyr.

Talking about Steel Path, people frequently mention frames that I would consider too squishy like Nyx, Zephyr, Ash or Ivara.

To me, that didn't sound like very sounds choices, but I admit my approach to the game is more "brutish" and I don't know much about the intrinsics of modding frames to do what the others I've spoken to can do. (comes with the territory when you mostly try and make your builds all by yourself while also avoid using certain mods)

So, long story short: can anyone widen my knowledge on how to make these seemingly "fragile" frames fit for more dangerous content?

Zephyr is immune to projectiles if her third ability is on (it requires a little range to deflect rockets entirely but  is easy to build for.)

She also can fly so just avoid melee hits and you are fine.

If you do get hit by let's say an eximus AoE, just use the rolling guard mod to remove the status effect.

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb hyzmarca:

Ash and Ivara both have invisibility.

Ash's invis seems a bit short tho.

But on the topic of Ivara, someone suggested I should take her into survival to try for myself. But I'm too hesitant; and have no idea how to build her for such a mission so she doesn't get melted by enemies (normally, I'd got with Wukong or Valkyr for survival)

vor 5 Stunden schrieb hyzmarca:

skillful use of shield gating can let you survive almost anything.

I didn't even know how shieldgating works until recently. I have no idea what to make of that knowledge.

[L3512]

16 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I largely avoid guides because I have it in my head that I'm using other people's work where I should put in the work myself. (tho there is a lot I have only learned by others telling me about it; like how shield gating works)

If you are talking about corrupted mods; I have always been hesitant to put on something with a stat penalty.

Play how you want but a lot of WF is not intuitive especially finer mechanics, you have listed Nyx, Zephyr, Ash or Ivara which all have decent options for survivability. Crowd control and invisibility are good, operator is good, movement is good. Sometimes looking at other peoples guides gives you something to balance ideas, look at how and why they do something rather than just blindly follow, adapt builds to suit you play style.

As for corrupted mods, they range from tolerable to necessary depending on the build, some abilities have breakpoints that you will not achieve otherwise. Some frames can absolutely afford to dump one or two stats.  

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

I consider it as a matter of options and tools. So in Warframe, the game can you different tools and options, which lets you have more potential solutions, to problems. 

Some of these can be say gear. Like for example, my Operator is max levelled in all schools, and they have an Arcane, where going into Void Crouch/Mode heals my Warframe. So if my Warframe ever seems like it might die, I have build up a habit and instinct and muscle memory, to switch to Operator, Void Dash/Sling which activates Magus Lockdown, Crouch, heal Warframe to max, and then continue. 

Obviously I couldn't do that when I first started Warframe, as it takes time to get to that level, but I also use to use line of sight a lot. Peek behind cover and line of sight to shoot enemies, but still have defence. I still try and aim for heads, which for many Warframe players is unnecessary, but I found it good practice for my own style and enjoyment. Even if my character was invincible, and couldn't die, I would still probably play them as if they could. Which means, I am aware of line of sight, and cover, and rolling, and enemy prioritisation (you identify which enemies may possess more threat and may worth killing first) and other such micro decisions that you can build over time, and overlap with skill. 

Some of what I mentioned, doesn't require gear or mods. Its just how you play. Like, rolling actually gives you a damage reduction. Some people aren't aware of this, but it means if enemies are shooting at you, rolling is good way to reduce damage. So is being evasive, and jumping around a lot. Enemies are limited by AI patterns, and that can be exploited. If you jump, roll, and flip a lot, they can struggle to keep up. However moving around a lot can make you own aiming tougher too, but thats where a few things can help. Practice. If you practice trying to hit enemies whilst moving a lot, you'll get better. Plus you have tools like aim glide to help. Also, some powers and abilities don't need you to aim. Like Saryn. Saryn's powers will ramp up off enemies, if you maintain your spores, you can just run around and melee to spread spores and always be jumping and flipping. 

Some people are mentioning Nyx's 4 power, which does make her pretty tanky. I actually don't use it myself, because she can be squishy, but I use her all the time in Steel Path. I just move a lot. I find her Chaos ability more than enough, so then its just Eximus that are a threat, so then priority targets. Thats just my play style and preference though, Plus if you mind control an enemy that is a buffer, like a Shield Osprey... 

Zephyr likewise has massive CC. So if you stay mobile and on the move, you kill enemies too fast for them to be too much of a threat. That being said, her Turbulence and Augment can also help her survive as well. Also, again, I should point out the games tools. Like... even though its not directed related? If you have a max ranked Arcane Energise? You can spam your powers and abilities more, which means more CC, which means enemies die faster, which means you can energy and health pick ups more, which helps you maintain your gameplay loop. 

For myself, there were all these Warframes I thought were useless, because I would die in the star chart all the time. So I avoided them, and when I got to Steel Path, I use to stick to certain Warframes, like Nidus and Mesa, who I considered tanky... but then I started to get bored and tried out other Warframes... and they performed beyond my expectations. 1. I was much more skilled and experienced. 2. I had better tools, better Arcanes, better guns, better knowledge of the maps, and enemies, and a better Operator, and all of this combined, meant, I wasn't as squishy as I use to be. Even more so... i actually took off a lot of mods that made me tanky, since I no longer needed them. Some of my Warframes, more range was better way to survive than more health or armour. Rolling Guard was better than Umbra mods. So on. 

Important to note though, a lot of this is just preference of play style. Somedays I just feel like taking Nidus, getting max stacks, and standing out in the open hitting enemies with a shotgun. Not everyone is going to enjoy playing a glass canon, or being squishy or having to ninja flip everywhere, and use line of sight or cover. Nothing wrong with taking a more brute force approach, or speccing into being very tanky, aka an immovable object that soaks damage etc I play like that too a lot. Thats a fun and valid play style. I also really like playing squishy Warframes and finding ways to make them not feel squishy.

Also again, may be a matter of gear as well. Gear that helps your energy economy, having access to energy pads, health pads, ammo pads, for peace of mind. Operator stuff, making your companions tanky too, so they are a good distraction. Like if you have Link mods, or the mod that lets you heal companions with melee... some more advanced methods like shield gating. So if you are still relatively new to the game, might just mean its a matter of time and access. It wasn't until I was MR30 that I started to enjoy playing as Nyx or Banshee. I only use to use Ivara for Spy, until I started to realise around then, she could excel at Steel Path Exterminate, Survival etc learning how to survive as Mag and Zephyr also made it easier to survive as Nidus, Nezha, Lavos, Mesa much easier too. 

 

[hyzmarca]

14 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

When I play higher level content, or content in this game in general, I often opt for more tanky frames. Which means franes that can take a lot of punishment and/or heal themselves up afterwards. This to me means the likes of Rhino, Wukong or Valkyr.

Talking about Steel Path, people frequently mention frames that I would consider too squishy like Nyx, Zephyr, Ash or Ivara.

To me, that didn't sound like very sounds choices, but I admit my approach to the game is more "brutish" and I don't know much about the intrinsics of modding frames to do what the others I've spoken to can do. (comes with the territory when you mostly try and make your builds all by yourself while also avoid using certain mods)

So, long story short: can anyone widen my knowledge on how to make these seemingly "fragile" frames fit for more dangerous content?

Turbulance is one of the strongest anti-ranged abilities in the game.  It creates a huge bubble that directs bullets away from her.  While it's up,  Zephyr isn't going to get shot,  so you only have to worry about melee.   Tornado negates that risk,  anything getting into melee range is going to get sucked up.  

Nxy's absorb with augment can make her completely invincible and Chaos will make enemies attack each other instead of Nyx most of the time. 

Ash and Ivara both have invisibility.  Not getting hit is the best defense,    not being seen is a great way to not get hit. Enemies won't shoot at you if they don't know you're there.  

In addition,  all of them have shields.  Because damage doesn't overflow Tenno shields and shields dropping triggers a short period of invincibility, skillful use of shield gating can let you survive almost anything.  Only Toxin damage can bypass shields. 

 

 

[Lutesque]

6 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

So, long story short: can anyone widen my knowledge on how to make these seemingly "fragile" frames fit for more dangerous content?

In the Case of Ivara, Octavia and Ash.... They just Run Around being Invisible 24/7....

Zephyr has Turbulence up 24/7 Which Prevents her from dying to bullets but still leaves her vulnerable to AoE and melee Attacks...

NYX has Assimilate.... Need I say more ?

And that Leaves us Back to Everyone Else and the Answer to that is Simple:

You're Welcome ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

6 hours ago, Cazzzz said:

Arcane Guardian gives low armor frames a HUGE percent increase to their effective HP,

Arcane Guardian also Has its Priorities Backwards.... You need to be Able to Take Damage to Trigger it.... 9 times of 10 you will Die before it Actually Activates or you will be Almost Dead by the Time it Activates ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

5 hours ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

Isn't his invis rather short tho

At max Duration I think it's like 30 Seconds long.... Which is literally 30 Times Safer than Shield Gating.... Not To Mention his Kit Allows him to Abuse Arcane Trickery anyway....

 

[BiancaRoughfin]

Just now, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

Maybe I'm using Zephyr wrong, but I didn't really think that her 3 was that reliable.

Her 3rd ability is a underestimated marvel. It protects her, with the Augment gives her and her teammates movement speed bonus and to her also increases projectile speed which scales with Power. This means she can increase the effective range of any weapon in the game, in some cases double/triple/quadruple their effective range.
This also affects Melee weapons like Glaives and GunBlades, increasing the Thrown range of Glaves and the range at which GunBlade shots are effective. She can for example double the range on the Stropha`s shot.

This is one of my favorite Zephyr Videos, came out long before her Rework just to show how she already had potential back then.

Spoiler

 

 

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 20 Minuten schrieb TARINunit9:

Nyx and Zephyr have powers that make them literally invincible against ranged attacks, that sounds pretty tanky to me

Ash and Ivara are very squishy, but they go by a more roundabout method: being untargetable. Bullets can't hurt you if they are never fired. This is still a riskier playstyle, so I don't blame you for passing on it

Normally, I use some damage mitigation like Rhino's iron skin or Wukong's defy and just eat enemy fire while I shoot and melee away myself. Or I use things like cloud walker or Valkyr's hysteria to heal up again.

Avoiding damage via dodging, invis etc. hasn't really been my thing so far. As well as more elaborate strategies and ability rotations.

[(PSN)KyomaSatomi]

vor 24 Minuten schrieb BiancaRoughfin:

Keep Strength and Range at least 100%, Lots of Duration and keep her Turbulence (3) active.

Maybe I'm using Zephyr wrong, but I didn't really think that her 3 was that reliable.

[vanaukas]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

Isn't his invis rather short tho

With ash kinda, but everytime he enters into invisibility you cna also stun enemies. Ivara can be virtually invisible the whole mission with proper energy managment.

2 minutes ago, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

I largely avoid guides because I have it in my head that I'm using other people's work where I should put in the work myself. (tho there is a lot I have only learned by others telling me about it; like how shield gating works)

I was advising guides not for the mods itself but for the logic that shield gating has. It's ok if you want to learn from personal experience, that's my route in this game.

Just now, (PSN)KyomaSatomi said:

If you are talking about corrupted mods; I have always been hesitant to put on something with a stat penalty.

No, I'm talking about mods like Brief Respite and Augur mods set.