Are insta-revives slowly killing teammate revive as part of gameplay?

[Tsukinoki]

2 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

1. I like the idea of a health boost or buff for reviving. 

If you want people to revive others then make it mechanically rewarding in some aspect and you'll have people tripping over themselves to revive you.
As it stands in WF there is just no reward to reviving and a lot of players don't see it being worth the risk.
Why bother reviving someone when you aren't getting anything for it?

3 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

2. I don't shares your experience of rarely being revived. If you're teammates weren't reviving you before, then you probably play too far away from the objective. In my experience players usually try to revive others for the most part. It has been a big part of team play. I've never heard of an Oberon trolling with a revive timer, that is not a common thing.

I'm generally the player in a group that actually plays the objective and keeps any hallway heroing to a minimum.  I keep up, I kill enemies, and I focus on the objectives and reviving others.
If its not a pre-made squad then I just don't get revived. most of the time even when I'm right there.  Its a good 60% or so where I just don't get revived.  Maybe its because I don't play the meta frames or whatever but I just rarely get revived, even when doing a Zephyr max-turbulence build against Grineer where the reviver would have been protected by my turbulence.

As to the Oberon trolling, sure its not common, I've only run into it a handful of times but at least I have an out in the future if it happens again.

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

6 hours ago, Avenwing said:

More often than not people just leave you to bleed out these days. If there was an actually significant penalty to reviving no one would want to have to use it so most people would start reviving others again.

People were already doing that before this mechanic was introduced. It isn't the fault of the mechanic but the community itself. Yes, I will admit fault at having a hand in this as well; I have purposely left squadmates behind for a number of reasons. They are a lone Tenno hanging back for "duh loots" so they die to getting mobbed (almost always Sortie content). They came into content unprepared and my constantly reviving them is putting the mission at risk so I just leave them to die unless I know for sure I can pick them up. They pass up reviving me of other Tenno that are not in a highly dangerous spot to pick up yet turn around and cuss thr team out to revive them yet they are in the middle of Napalm hell. People who run off lone wolfing it when asked to stick to the team since they keep dying yet they keep running 400m away for the kill hogging (these players will run from you if you decide to follow them instead). And many many more.

Blazing through content, doing things efficiently, etc doesnt always line up with the way other players want to play and sadly, majority rules is a normal part of gaming. If you wanna be the dude that opens every single box in every room yet your squad just wants the Assassination target dead, good chances youre gonna be left for dead.

[Tsukinoki]

6 hours ago, Avenwing said:

More often than not people just leave you to bleed out these days. If there was an actually significant penalty to reviving no one would want to have to use it so most people would start reviving others again.

Question here:
If there was a "significant" penalty (what-ever that would be because very few things would be "significant" for vets) why would I risk being helpless for the 5 seconds it takes to revive you?
If the penalty was large enough to make people not want to spend revive what incentive would I have to reviving you if you go down?  After all I'm risking death and the penalty for dieing just so that you can avoid the penalty for dieing....and at absolutely no benefit to myself what-so-ever.

The only thing I see adding a "significant' penalty to death doing is making it so that people cheese the content harder so that they avoid going down and avoid reviving others as that would just be a pointless risk.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Tsukinoki

[Beartornado]

Not dying in the first place is still the superior strategy, and avoids the issue of changes to how reviving works.

[Avenwing]

3 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

Question here:
If there was a "significant" penalty (what-ever that would be because very few things would be "significant" for vets) why would I risk being helpless for the 5 seconds it takes to revive you?
If the penalty was large enough to make people not want to spend revive what incentive would I have to reviving you if you go down?  After all I'm risking death and the penalty for dieing just so that you can avoid the penalty for dieing....and at absolutely no benefit to myself what-so-ever.

The only thing I see adding a "significant' penalty to death doing is making it so that people cheese the content harder so that they avoid going down and avoid reviving others as that would just be a pointless risk.

Could always go back to the 4 revives a day only, but make it 4 revives overall so people can't just switch frames after blowing all their revives. Can't risk letting your team members die in some content because they might not have any revives.

[Sziklamester]

After the insta revives I experience more people tend to ignore to revive you because you can now "insta revive" that is the same like you left behind and rot there until you die. I don't like it because it costs affinity and I don't want to die just because noone revive me when I down just because I have the option to speed up my dying process. I tend to no or very rarely drowned but that is just as annoying to die by this or just someone who reachable distance to you and insta revive when you could save his/her life. This is just annoying because you wasting time and effort to try to save others and you cannot. 

Personally I think this should go and the revive time need to be expanded a bit to 30 second so someone whom near enough can save you. Both part could be bad because some who drowned doesn't want wait long till he can do something but with the insta revive just seems like peoples ignore you. First of all a lot of peoples ignoring the squad chat and those players whom not have mic and not using chatting programs could be easily ignored by players. I don't want to use mic I like type but hate when I ask for help and noone help when everybody dancing on me. That is just blaming and this should be fixed somehow. I don't want to lose affinity and doesn't want out of th action and ignored because of this.

[(XBOX)chris2k30]

Tbh you shouldn't ever need "reward" incentive to partake in grp help when part of a grp, if you dont want to help a fellow team m8 out if they fall put yourself on solo, i play with randoms all time some helpfull some not it just the nature of randoms no matter the game but no matter what anyone else does an no matter how many times they fall i'll always atleast try an revive even if it means backtracking.

 

[Hypernaut1]

I also see this as acting like shield gating by proxy. 

With insta-reviving, it pretty much blends the 4 revives into one life bar.  You get 4x to get one shot.

One change I would like is that a players last revive should look different, and maybe get a slightly longer timer.

[Tsukinoki]

10 minutes ago, Avenwing said:

Could always go back to the 4 revives a day only, but make it 4 revives overall so people can't just switch frames after blowing all their revives. Can't risk letting your team members die in some content because they might not have any revives.

I go into every mission with the gear required to solo it because its just bad practice to go in under-equipped in case you get matched with not so good players.
So what risk is there in letting them die?
Meanwhile what benefit is there in risking one of my daily revives?  Unless it is right before the daily reset why should I bother risking one of my revives to pick them up?

Further your idea hurts new players, you know the players who need their revives, and has absolutely no impact on vets.  I rarely go down 4 times in 24 hours so this idea wouldn't impact me at all.
Meanwhile the new player that just started the game?  Well after messing up 4 times this game becomes a "Don't play until the daily reset as you won't be able to complete missions!" for them which drives new players away.  Incidentally this is one of the reasons that DE changed the revives:  The old revive system of 4 per frame needlessly punished new players and had absolutely no impact on vets.  It drove away players who messed up a few times and then essentially couldn't play any more that day.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Tsukinoki

[Tachibana_Hibiki]

People are very considerate of their teammates' time and don't want to slow mission progress, so they use instarevives.

I rarely play with a team, and being KO'd is a great shame for me. I feel like I'm dragging the team down, last thing I want is them wasting time reviving my careless rear.

[Hypernaut1]

13 minutes ago, (Xbox One)chris2k30 said:

Tbh you shouldn't ever need "reward" incentive to partake in grp help when part of a grp, if you dont want to help a fellow team m8 out if they fall put yourself on solo, i play with randoms all time some helpfull some not it just the nature of randoms no matter the game but no matter what anyone else does an no matter how many times they fall i'll always atleast try an revive even if it means backtracking.

 

The thing is, the culture in the game may change to where most people just insta-revive when downed. Eventually, your first instinct won't be to revive others anymore after wasting your time running back to an insta-reviver enough times. Then that attitude just spreads and you will see players only reviving when do into an endless.

This may actually be better for gameplay...I don't know. Without players reviving each other as much, players are going to actually start running out of them and playing more carefully

[Valiant]

Seems to be encouraging bad practice if anything. I was on one sortie and these two guys just kept going down with their atterax spam but insta-reviving themselves before anyone could revive them. I gave a bit of advice about not using all the revives up so quickly. Unsurprisingly it came to the point where at least one found themselves down on the floor unable to revive themselves and were totally surrounded by enemies. Nevermind their initial rushing around cleaving stuff on the map, it's quite selfish because if an ally did want to save them as they can't do it themselves the ally is put at risk too.

[Sloan441]

8 hours ago, UmbraCorporation said:

Before the insta-revive change, no one came back to revive me.

After the insta-revive change, no one comes back to revive me. 

Let's face it, Tenno are selfish.  

Depends how you look at it since this isn't the whole story.

Lets play out the scenario from a different viewpoint:

You're on a mission. You haven't seen your teammates since 5min after the match started. Not only aren't they in affinity range, they're not anywhere near your particular tile. One kisses the dirt. You see his red marker, but...he's not nearby. He's not on a nearby tile. Or even in a not-so-nearby tile. Where the heck did this guy go...oh, he's bled out.

This scenario happens far more often than not. After several years of seeing just this thing play out, you've come to the realization that if you can't see the tenno that just dropped, you're not going to get to him in time, so you don't bother since going looking for him is both increased risk to you and it probably won't matter regardless.

[Matt_328]

I always try to revive, but if they use insta revive instead of wating for help, it's their own business, they are the ones that waste their revives, not me. Regarding the "bad teammates not reviving", nothing new dude, I've seen bad teammates before this new function.

[Kaotyke]

10 hours ago, PsiWarp said:

Pay to revive makes a return in a sense, except not with Plat but with Affinity :P

But yeah, since quick revive's introduction I have noticed that ally reviving have gone down in frequency. With newbies this means they lose precious progress toward leveling their gear (not knowing any better), with vets it means they have 4 (or more with Sentinel Sacrifice) free do-overs even while they hallway hero it out.

I still try to keep the tradition alive by bolting to revive allies any chance I get, but it's becoming less and less meaningful.

Its a bit sad when I get close they revive. Running to revive them is almost instinct now.

Not seeing that with players leveling things, but a lot with those who already have maxed gear.

[phoenix1992]

Because being on my back for 20 seconds until my team decides if it is worth to come back for me is such a fun experience.

1 sec does seem like an overkill, but it is not the biggest issue considering the revival mechanics.

[achromos]

I dunno about you but losing a few levels off my weapons/warframe kinda annoys me.  However, I haven't changed my stance.  If you aren't 4 rooms away and I can get to you, I'll revive you.  IF you are in the same room as me and WONT revive me even if I am providing cover fire and or nobody is around you and you aren't a frame that will die in one shot from even a level 30 enemy...  I wont revive you next time.  It feels bad to do that though, I want to revive people just because I know I'd want t be revived.  Yea I have revives to use, but im giving up the current buffs I have (If I were say... Harrow) and Energy level as well as a % of exp.

[TARINunit9]

8 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

Before instant revives I was rarely revived.  Even if I was the frost sitting next to the defense objective inside the bubble they just ignored me so I bled out over 10 seconds, the bubble dropped for a few as I got back up (which got everyone angry that my bubble dropped) and then things went back to continuing.
After instant revives its the same exact thing.

Nothing has changed with the introduction of instant revives.

I have never experienced anything close to this. Even playing in Public everyone would revive everyone else

[SeaUrchins]

I find the system extremely convenient, it allows downed Tenno to save time and get back to the fight faster, because I wouldn't run to revive them anyway lmao

I used to revive people, but it was back in the time when we had 4 revives per day, now it's pointless.

Edited September 22, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

9 hours ago, Valiant said:

Seems to be encouraging bad practice if anything. I was on one sortie and these two guys just kept going down with their atterax spam but insta-reviving themselves before anyone could revive them. I gave a bit of advice about not using all the revives up so quickly. Unsurprisingly it came to the point where at least one found themselves down on the floor unable to revive themselves and were totally surrounded by enemies. Nevermind their initial rushing around cleaving stuff on the map, it's quite selfish because if an ally did want to save them as they can't do it themselves the ally is put at risk too.

For some reaso I assumed with I stant revive your device number was no longer capped at four plus arcanes.

[Lancars]

Thank you!. I saw this as a problem from the near start of having the instant revives. When i play an oberon i'm trying my best to keep people alive and everyone seems to choose insta-revive instead of letting me run 2 feet over to revive them.

Also people are starting to ignore reviving cause they assume you'll just insta-revive.

[Lancars]

47 minutes ago, SeaUrchins said:

I find the system extremely convenient, it allows downed Tenno to save time and get back to the fight faster, because I wouldn't run to revive them anyway lmao

I used to revive people, but it was back in the time when we had 4 revives per day, now it's pointless.

You still only get 4 revives per mission tho. So you have to wait for the mission to end which you won't get loot or leave.

[Hypernaut1]

2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

I have never experienced anything close to this. Even playing in Public everyone would revive everyone else

This is my experience too. People even run to revive at the end of a mission so everyone leaves together

[SeaUrchins]

5 minutes ago, Lancars said:

You still only get 4 revives per mission tho. So you have to wait for the mission to end which you won't get loot or leave.

If you die that much in a mission,then you don't deserve the loot. Go invest some formas into your gear and learn how to be useful to the squad instead of taking advantage of the votekick system absense. Period.

[KIREEK]

Quote

It's pointless to revive someone, either players don't revive at all (no effort in doing so when the opportunity is there) or when you try and go to extreme amounts of skill to try and defend and revive someone, you realize that the person is already self reviving and all your running was pointless, so you return back to defending the objective, you see what i mean here? You basically walk back and forth for no reason. These litle things sometimes defines players, they know they can defend and go out of their way to help a teammate, even if the teammate isn't of much use they still try and bring him back, not the case anymore.