Chroma is too powerful!

[krc473]

On 11/3/2017 at 10:29 AM, Oru5732 said:

The frame is easy to aquire (through quest and junctions), but hard to forma, but if you consider that a sufficient reason not to nerf him, tonkor shouldn't have been nerfed either, because you needed a lot of formas to make the weapon great.

Chroma requires you to do a quest, junction quests, and build the separate frame parts. Chroma needs to have 7 parts built to complete him.

My Chroma is perfectly fine with a single forma. I was able to forma him to 1 hit Eidolon limbs with just a single forma. I do not know why sticking one forma in Chroma is hard.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2017 by krc473
Said 6 parts instead of 7. Chroma needs 7

[K4RN4]

1 minute ago, krc473 said:

My Chroma is perfectly fine with a single forma. I was able to forma him to 1 hit Eidolon limbs with just a single forma. I do not know why sticking one forma in Chroma is hard.

I put 5 or 6 forma in my Chroma, to be able to use a better Aura and an Exilus Mod, so that was kinda hard.

 

3 minutes ago, krc473 said:

Chroma requires you to do a quest, junction quests, and build the separate frame parts. Chroma needs to have 6 parts built to complete him.

You have to do the junctions to progress through the game, so those are no extra effort.

I totally forgot you needed other warframe parts to build chroma

[krc473]

Just now, Oru5732 said:

I put 5 or 6 forma in my Chroma, to be able to use a better Aura and an Exilus Mod, so that was kinda hard.

I could probably do this with three forma total. Based on my current build. 1 forma to change aura polarity. 1 forma to allow the use of the exilus (compensating for the reduction in mod capacity through removing steel charge).

1 minute ago, Oru5732 said:

You have to do the junctions to progress through the game, so those are no extra effort.

I really have no idea how much effort this is. I did all the junctions within a couple days of them being released. I already had Chroma at the time. In fact, I think I was circa MR21 when that happened, so, had everything already (that means the junctions were too easy). 

I am trying to look at it from a new player's perspective. Actually getting the junctions done does take time and effort. Of course, I never had this as a new player, so I do not know about it (we killed bosses to get planet nav segments to progress)

[Tricky5hift]

You still need to take damage to even get that buff and you always run the risk of getting yourself killed.

If anything, I think Chroma needs a buff making Vex Armor a toggle ability.

[K4RN4]

11 hours ago, Tricky5hift said:

You still need to take damage to even get that buff and you always run the risk of getting yourself killed.

You can usw selfdamage weapons to geht that buff Quote reliably.

Getting yourself killed with Chroma isn't that easy, since bis second ability grants a significant health or armor buff.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

He'll be reworked when he gets his prime.

I don't think his damage capability is an issue in his current state. Once he's reworked and is a valuable member of space ninja society overall, not just rare niches, then they might consider lowering that multiplier.

[Tricky5hift]

4 hours ago, Oru5732 said:

You can usw selfdamage weapons to geht that buff Quote reliably.

Getting yourself killed with Chroma isn't that easy, since bis second ability grants a significant health or armor buff.

You can still kill yourself by accident if you're not careful.

Be glad that you actually have to do something to get that damage buff.

[TheBrsrkr]

Considering you have to almost die to get it, and it's a buff ONLY for Chroma, I'd say it's fine. 

[DrBorris]

Yeah... no.... if anything Chroma needs buffs (to everything except Vex Armor). 

 

And to get Chroma to this "OP" state, he requires more grinding than any other frame (Forma, Mods and Arcanes). 

[Viges]

17 hours ago, TheBrsrkr said:

you have to almost die

Ha-ha-ha wat

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

Am 2.11.2017 um 21:03 schrieb Jakorak:

and yet before plain of eidolon you would see a chroma once in a blue moon

Exactly, cause his kit is quite literally made for open world, in contrary to the prior meta, which was rather designed to perform at its best when used against swarming enemys.

That shadow step had to go probably did its part too.

Anyways. New envirement, new meta. That something works better under certain conditions definitly doesn't automaticly make it OP. Same thing, damage and survivability, would apply to Ash and Mesa too. Nezha and loki trade some of that damage for CC and superior mobility, what's a factor too.

Are those o.p. now all of a sudden?...

[Newnight]

1 hour ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Exactly, cause his kit is quite literally made for open world, in contrary to the prior meta, which was rather designed to perform at its best when used against swarming enemys.

 

Wait but wouldn't swarming horde of enemies be better since they concentrate on you and almost kill you? 

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

vor 48 Minuten schrieb Newnight:

Wait but wouldn't swarming horde of enemies be better since they concentrate on you and almost kill you? 

Ye, for like 2 seconds until your buff is build up, regardless of how many enemys fire at you, if they do at all since swarming doesn't essencially mean that enemys attack you. He doesn't have any way of generating aggro eather and enemys much rather attack tenno that attack them (aoe) or things that DO generate aggro (summons aka necros and atlas).

From there he's missing integrated means to compensate or interrupt the damage (healing or Cc, his ult and breath kinda are Cc but a lousy kind)

Having the buff means that he's independent of range tho, that's why he's fit for PoE.

[(PSN)psycofang]

14 hours ago, Viges said:

Ha-ha-ha wat

Self damage.

 

Anyway chroma isnt op, he just has high damage, remember nidus and his high damage and everyone jumping on the bandwagon screaming OP pls nerf cuz he does damage?

Not only did they not nerf his damage they made him really wonky to use at times with his nerfs yet everyone went quiet afterwards because they saw A nerf. 

The draw backs to this set up is it requires a lot and not everyone can just "do it" youll need a number of forma'd set ups, maxed out mods and self damage all for a buff that only affects you. 

Nerf this and why bring chroma at all? Hes selfish and barely helps the team besides his tumultuous dps, Chroma has ALWAYS been the frame that can magically deal with anything by just hitting it harder than everyone else. 

High level sentients? Bosses? Priority Mobs? His solution is to hit it harder than everyone else. 

Thats all hes able to do atm thats all hes ALWAYS and only been able to do since his inception after they nerfed his credit boosting from his 4. 

Only reason people notice it now is because theres a boss with a ton of hp where chroma actually gained a niche use for his high damage.   

Everyones jumping on the wagon acting surprised that chroma can kill things and Trinity proving shes the only relevant healer since she can heal lures and acting like this is new. 

Nerf them and people will topple on to the next best thing x N or until the people annoyed by chroma / trinity fall into a meta THEY like and someone else comes along and demands that be nerfed.

Buff the lures to make trinity needed less, make the other healers heal the lures too, lower weapon damage against Eidolons but buff void damage vs them to make chroma and op weapons less of an answer. 

Theres other alternatives besides nerfing something.

Edited November 5, 2017 by (PS4)psycofang

[Djego27]

On 3.11.2017 at 19:43, TheBrsrkr said:

Considering you have to almost die to get it, and it's a buff ONLY for Chroma, I'd say it's fine. 

That is not the case, you just have to be a little more careful with the first hit you take, what is not a big deal given you play a fairly tanky thing even without vex armor up.

On 3.11.2017 at 19:44, DrBorris said:

And to get Chroma to this "OP" state, he requires more grinding than any other frame (Forma, Mods and Arcanes). 

Nonsense, Chroma requires considerable less grind then reasonable balanced damage frames, because they all need that same forma, they need more specific mods and weapons because they do not have damage multiplication that applies to everything(point in case Ember\Saryn with status weapons) and the "need" for arcanes is highly debatable on Chroma given that it is the highest weapon based single target damage in the game as well as one of the most tanky frames at the same time.

9 hours ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Are those o.p. now all of a sudden?...

It always was given that it never made any sense why Chroma has such a high damage multiplier(as a self buff, different to Ember where you have to recast it on re spawns multiple times per minute, since it is a de buff) then Ember and gets that to all damage instead of just the one element you select by colour(what would far more reasonable). Also there is no reason for Chroma having 20 times the EHP then Ember given that both are the same kind of weapon damage buff heavy hitters at high levels.

Edited November 5, 2017 by Djego27

[Soketsu]

Nope, it will pointless, like many other nerf. Look at ash does it change thing ? was i worth it ?

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

1 hour ago, Soketsu said:

Nope, it will pointless, like many other nerf. Look at ash does it change thing ? was i worth it ?

Yea, Because now I can play ash in public without scaring my teammates.

[Soketsu]

2 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Angryspy101 said:

Yea, Because now I can play ash in public without scaring my teammates.

So it was just in order to not scared people in pub about taking their kill so now ember can take take the role of popular fast cleaner ? impressive x)

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

1 hour ago, Soketsu said:

So it was just in order to not scared people in pub about taking their kill so now ember can take take the role of popular fast cleaner ? impressive x)

Yea , except ember only does that on low lvls, ash on the other could wipe rooms on low, mid, and high lvls because finisher damage and slash procs.

Also, unlike world on fire, bladestorm made ash invulnerable to damage.

Nice try, but old bladestorm ash was 10x better than WOF ember, that's why it needed to get nerfed.

[Soketsu]

1 minute ago, (Xbox One)Angryspy101 said:

Yea , except ember only does that on low lvls, ash on the other could wipe rooms on low, mid, and high lvls because finisher damage and slash procs.

Also, unlike world on fire, bladestorm made ash invulnerable to damage.

Nice try, but old bladestorm ash was 10x better than WOF ember, that's why it needed to get nerfed.

Because now yes it change the meta x)

but at least I'm not completly mad they didn't remove he other way to do it x)

Edited November 5, 2017 by Soketsu

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

1 hour ago, Soketsu said:

Perhaps but at least I'm not completly mad they didn't remove he other way to do it x)

For now....

[TheGrimCorsair]

I usually run rings around them for damage with Banshee+Resonance (Teralyst excepted, of course). To the folk whinging about having to almost kill yourself to get the damage buff for Vex... it's 100 hp. If your Chroma is almost dying after losing 100 hp you've got some problems and they lie somewhere between keyboard and chair.

Vex sure doesn't need to be a toggle, though. That'd be ridiculous, unless it had an uncapped increasing power consumption.

Nerf Vex... maybe? I mean, you get huge armor and damage output for no gains in resistance to CC and all slash procs are forever armor piercing against against you. Would much rather see Cold Ward nerfed to be slightly less the obviously mechanically superior option to its siblings. Electric and Toxin could use a few buffs here and there, maybe, and Fire may as well not exist at the moment for all the worthless value of a couple hundred HP it brings. Would much rather see Chroma's 1 & 4 gone over with a fine-toothed comb as you pay out the &#! to use either with little to no appreciable return over just sticking to 2 & 3 alone.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb Djego27:

 

It always was given that it never made any sense why Chroma has such a high damage multiplier(as a self buff, different to Ember where you have to recast it on re spawns multiple times per minute, since it is a de buff) then Ember and gets that to all damage instead of just the one element you select by colour(what would far more reasonable). Also there is no reason for Chroma having 20 times the EHP then Ember given that both are the same kind of weapon damage buff heavy hitters at high levels.

 

It does make sense when you consider every aspect of a frames kit as part of his balance. Think of it as a pentagon chart how it's common in all kinds of stat based rpg's, only that int, agi, strength etc make room for survivability, support, Cc, weapon amp, ability damage/aoe, utility/power efficiency etc.

His utility is horrible (needs wind up, resets), his ability damage is nearly non existant, so is his support but his survivability and weapon buff is pretty much maxed.

Example ember is more balanced as she has ability damage, pretty good Cc and a weapon buff that is able to support others while running her kit with pretty good efficiency and utility. Of course she's gonna lack in some aspects compared to chroma, but she has things he doesn't have while beein among the best choices for the main content of the game, which is fighting hoards of enemys.... her prime sells for a fortune for a reason.

[Djego27]

Well the team buff one as Ember is not really that effective given that next to nobody uses pure heat on her weapons and the need for CC is not really there if you can just take anything the game throws at your face till L200 ish. The only thing where Ember CC is useful is mostly to avoid getting hit(because this is different to chroma lethal at higher levels) and if you solo defence, MD or excavation at L100+, what next to nobody does with the frame.

I would not say that Ember is that much of a best choice for the main content, most people just stand around afk with WoF on, what mostly is the reason they play Ember. You can basically do the same for the "low level" stuff with Equinox. This guy I did meet today on Akkad with a Equinox wasn't even that much behind 35 waves in, but he left because I got shut down by infested healer/disruptor auras and took multiple revives from me to reach 35. That is not so much a issue with the frame, just takes a bit more practice at higher levels.

For Ember it takes a lot more levels to really shine as damage frame, given that the advantage mainly is the single target damage, at what point it is just less survivability and damage then Chroma, given that both do basically exactly the same there, use buffed weapons to deplete a few million HP each round in 2-3 minutes:

Since people are probably not aware of how Ember works. you have like halve of your weapon damage in fire and use in the examples above flash accelrant to add 85% more fire damage to your weapon(and other players, however they do in general not profit from accelerant, given that it just combines into other elements) and then multiply just the pure fire damage by 4.25(with my current 170% power strength setup). On Chroma the same 4.25 multiplier does not only also buff the IPS but you can simply utilize more effective elements like blast or corrosive against Infested at higher levels, leading even with the same multiplier to 3-4 times the dps of Ember in reality, because the elements you scale up also have massive damage bonuses against heavy Infested units, while on Ember this damage is not affected by the de buff(that you also have to cast a lot), same as the basic IPS. Just to point out how ridiculous Chroma damage is, people in general do 1/3 of the damage of my ember in sortis, all 3 other players combined, given that Ember is allready a incredible hard hitting frame at high levels...

Edit: I do however agree that Chormas 1 and 4 need work, given that they do not really anything in scaling content what is always a bad thing for a frame, no matter how good the rest of the abilities are.

Edited November 5, 2017 by Djego27

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

@Djego27

Edit: nvm actually...Accelerant ONLY affects fire. Meaning that you could still combine elements but will only recieve the extra status. 

Ignis wraight could probably still be set to do fire, corrosive and blast but the buff is ignorable in comparance.

That still results in around 5-8 status types (fire, blast x2, corrosive, slash, any combination or fire on your melee, optinally impact and pierce), meaning 10-48x multiplier to your melee's base damage with condition overload (x2-3,6 with maiming/crit/rivens, x 4,25 with the buff if you use fire) what's a lot and fully affects status (inc slash and fire) but it's not as effective as i've anticipated. Still a pretty much unrivaled setup between pinpoint, aoe damage and Cc on her part, what rivals Chroma with ease and is able to heal her for 66-88 damage per slide/per hit enemy. That on top of the afk AOE damage, top notch Cc and armor reduce as fixed part of her kit and further scaling off any other common or not so common status types (like viral or frame specific status like rad-oberon, loki, magnetic-mag, ice-frost and many more)

Chroma COULD run something similar but he's a little too relyant on incomming damage/self harm and healing to utilice it propperly, where ember gets the full extend of her possibilitys with ease.

Actually go around and use what's avaiable to her and she's quite the beast herself. The only real difference to chroma is the survivalbily, which she easily compensates trough her Cc.

Edited November 5, 2017 by (PS4)CoolD2108