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How about reducing milestones to 25(stashes)/50(weapons/mods) days BUT conut only days  if person plays at least 4 missions(or over 1h in total) and kills at least 300mobs in one day?

That is not much to play, easy to achieve even for mr0 people and proves that you don't just jump in for rewards but play a bit.

 

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3 hours ago, Zilotz said:

How about reducing milestones to 25(stashes)/50(weapons/mods) days BUT conut only days  if person plays at least 4 missions(or over 1h in total) and kills at least 300mobs in one day?

That is not much to play, easy to achieve even for mr0 people and proves that you don't just jump in for rewards but play a bit.

 

I think a lot of people totally miss the point of this sort of system. No one needs to prove anything.

WF is a free to play game. DE stays in business by getting people to start playing, keep playing, and come back to play again if they haven't in a while. A lot goes into this, from the partner program and advertising to Tenno Con and huge events/quests, and frankly just making the game good so people have fun with it. Making it fair and engaging so they feel good about spending time and money on it. A small part of that larger effort - to keep people at least interested enough that game stays on their radar and they'll get sucked back in by cool new updates/maps/quests - is the login rewards. Nearly every online game does this, all for pretty much the same reason. It costs nothing to throw in a little daily reward to hook those few players who might've been drifting a bit. If the rest of the game just isn't quite enough for someone who's getting a little burned out, or they're starting to focus on a new game, a small incentive to log in might just be enough to keep them around a bit longer. If they stay around a bit longer, there's odds that they'll see something that makes them want to play more or buy some plat.

Creating a system that makes people "prove" that they're committed to this game, something that tests whether they're a "real" WF fan, accomplishes absolutely none of this. If the login system is supposed to separate the veterans from the noobs, or whatever everyone seems to think it's for, it is at best simply not doing what login rewards are supposed to do, and at worst pushing away people who are on the fence. And while you might think "good riddance, if they were on the fence they're not worthy anyway!", the 200 or so employees of Digital Extremes would probably prefer that they stick around.

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38 minutes ago, Zilotz said:

How about reducing milestones to 25(stashes)/50(weapons/mods) days BUT conut only days  if person plays at least 4 missions(or over 1h in total) and kills at least 300mobs in one day?

That is not much to play, easy to achieve even for mr0 people and proves that you don't just jump in for rewards but play a bit.

 

It adds more points of failure, it forces people to do things and at that point it really isn't a login reward. 

The whole point of the login reward system is to get people to log in to bolster Warframes Metrics and with the hope that maybe the player will choose to do a thing, the operative word being choose. 

There is nothing wrong with a simple, just log in reward. Lots of games have them tho usually they are more "visible" to the player. Not that you don't see Warframes reward track but most other games I've seen login rewards for are significantly more chunkitized. 

EG they are broken up into essentially weekly cycles. First six days you pull from a standard reward pool, the seventh you get something a bit more spiffy. So there is always something just over the horizon and it doesn't have to be anything "great" just something. That cycle repeats about four times and at the end of the fourth cycle (28 days or ~1month) you get "the big reward".

 

As far as the PlayX Missions have ~Y time and have killed ~Z enemies. That can in theory work but typically those are presented to the player as a daily/weekly challenge. Tho we already have essentially that between the Alerts/Invasions/Syndicate Missions and of course the Sortie. We really don't need any more daily challenges. 

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> Creating a system that makes people "prove" that they're committed to this game, something that tests whether they're a "real" WF fan, accomplishes absolutely none of this.

Just putting carrot(like real milestone rewards) near is enough to entertain people, no?

Or we can try both ways at same time - one like it is now(login and get but takes long) or log in and play a bit and get 4 times faster what you want.

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5 hours ago, Oreades said:

EG they are broken up into essentially weekly cycles. First six days you pull from a standard reward pool, the seventh you get something a bit more spiffy. So there is always something just over the horizon and it doesn't have to be anything "great" just something. That cycle repeats about four times and at the end of the fourth cycle (28 days or ~1month) you get "the big reward".

This is what I was thinking about, yeah. Other games do "time gated" rewards, but the span of time we're talking about is so short that it's something you can reasonably achieve.

I've stopped playing WF for a few months here and there, and the login rewards were never a factor in keeping me around or making me come back. Even when I'm active, there are a few days a week I can't really play - or just don't want to - so the login system as it stands is worthless to me. Years of waiting, and once I get there I'm still years behind? And that's if I'm perfect on it. If I play like I do now (and this system gives me no reason not to), that span of "behind" time just becomes ever more enormous. No thanks. I'll log in on days I can't play for a week, maybe a month, for something shiny.. but not for two and a half years.

There are other games where I've logged in to keep that "reward track" going when I couldn't play (GW2, BDO, DDO, etc), and it's entirely possible that these logins kept me playing longer than I otherwise would've. Conversely, I might not have taken those breaks from WF if it had a more functional system here - I get a little burned out on this game after reaching whatever goals I set for myself, and it's easy for a week long break to turn into a month or more, even if I haven't made the decision to quit playing for good.

At the end of the day, I did quit most of those other games and I did stick with Warframe. They just weren't good enough, and Warframe was. But who knows if I'd have been a better customer for DE if I'd logged in more?

Edited by andrewd084

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Perhaps DE should move to a seasonal reward system similar-to-but-not-the-same-as Fortnite...

A year is broken into 2-4 seasons and login rewards are largely cosmetic or means to drive more store traffic and fuel the game (like small amounts of platinum).

Do a Tennogen call for armor, syandanas, sigils, etc. and set them up to be login rewards at quarter, third, half, or whatever intervals you want.

Fill the gaps with Tellurium or Oxium or something and then you're all set.

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6 hours ago, arii1986 said:

What this system does is punish a dedicated player for missing a day. There are example in this thread of players who have been playing for years and have only just achieved their first milestone.

Yes, it's the same players that play derelicts left and right to farm nekros, relics, mods, exp, kavat scans, ayatan statues and so on and yet they donate 0 mutagen samples to the dojo research because the hema research is and i quote "too grindy"

You have to see past the bs to understand what are the circunstances of life and intentionally not logging in.

Same reason some players want all the sigils because they are needed. Do you honestly need that many sigils when ou can only use 1?

Do you honestly believe the weapons or the mods for that matter will trow the player into higher efficiency gameplay?

Don't make excuses, login, make that effort and then you will be rewarded.

Edited by KIREEK

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4 minutes ago, KIREEK said:

Yes, it's the same players that play derelicts left and right to farm nekros, relics, mods, exp, kavat scans, ayatan statues and so on and yet they donate 0 mutagen samples to the dojo research because the hema research is and i quote "to grindy"

You have to see past the bs to understand what are the circunstances of life and intentionally not logging in.

Same reson some players want all the sigils because they are needed. Do you honestly need that many sigils when ou can only use 1?

Do you honestly believe the weapons or the mods for that matter will trow the player into higher efficiency gameplay?

Don't make excuses, login, make that effort and then you will be rewarded.

Generalisations, painting everyone with the same brush and assumptions are NOT helpful friend-o

I have to move in a couple of months as my wife is expecting our second child. My PC is going to be in a box, I will have sh*t loads of stuff to do. So no - I won't be able to login that day to "make that effort" and  "be rewarded" 🙄

Mate - real life stuff happens: this system is pure BS. All the people in this thread defending it sound massively elitist and just want to excuse the sh*ttiness of it because they got what they wanted - screw everyone else.

Oh you want this Zenistar? Be a mindless login zombie and get it. Yeah nahhhhhh

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By that same fact you wont be playing any game period if your pc is in a box.  You wont be moving to destiny,  or mhw or any other thing you simply wont be playing.  Its harsh but you dont deserve the items if you arent doing anything to get them.  You arent getting syndicate standing or focus or any other number of things if you dont put in effort for it and yet people assume that simple logins require less effort.  They dont.  People have lives and people miss days.  But those same people also get other things done with their time that people in game dont get done.  Im not getting my LoL account exp by playing warframe, Nor am I getting warframe stuff grinded out by playing LoL.  Its a trade youre making even if the choice to make it is taken from you.  

So no these people arent elitist or anything,  they simply earned things you didnt and dont want their efforts wasted because people want things faster even though those people had just as much time spent doing other things than logging in. 

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1 hour ago, arii1986 said:

Generalisations, painting everyone with the same brush and assumptions are NOT helpful friend-o

I have to move in a couple of months as my wife is expecting our second child. My PC is going to be in a box, I will have sh*t loads of stuff to do. So no - I won't be able to login that day to "make that effort" and  "be rewarded" 🙄

Mate - real life stuff happens: this system is pure BS. All the people in this thread defending it sound massively elitist and just want to excuse the sh*ttiness of it because they got what they wanted - screw everyone else.

Oh you want this Zenistar? Be a mindless login zombie and get it. Yeah nahhhhhh

But you will get the zenistar sooner if you want to as you will pick the reward in that category, it's only when you want everything you will be needed to be at par with everyone else, this isn't unfair

Edited by KIREEK

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22 minutes ago, LuckyCharm said:

By that same fact you wont be playing any game period if your pc is in a box.  You wont be moving to destiny,  or mhw or any other thing you simply wont be playing.  Its harsh but you dont deserve the items if you arent doing anything to get them.  You arent getting syndicate standing or focus or any other number of things if you dont put in effort for it and yet people assume that simple logins require less effort.  They dont.  People have lives and people miss days.  But those same people also get other things done with their time that people in game dont get done.  Im not getting my LoL account exp by playing warframe, Nor am I getting warframe stuff grinded out by playing LoL.  Its a trade youre making even if the choice to make it is taken from you.  

So no these people arent elitist or anything,  they simply earned things you didnt and dont want their efforts wasted because people want things faster even though those people had just as much time spent doing other things than logging in. 

You are making logging in sound like a significant piece of gameplay. Like an achievement or something. I don't deserve items because I am not logging in? You are crazy bruh.

Earning syndicate or focus ain't the same kind of dealio - you miss one day of farming Zenurik and it won't matter too much to your progress. It's just refreshed with no penalty for losing a day.

Oh but miss a login day? Well there's your 100, 200, 300 whatever streak down the toilet. Again, you are defending a broken and unscalable solution. Slap on more rewards for future login days and I'll tell you what will happen.

Day 2000: Zenistar MKII comes out - new player on a login streak sees it, gets disheartened, leaves.

Your argument is invalid.

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23 minutes ago, KIREEK said:

But you will get the zenistar sooner if you want to as you will pick the reward in that category, it's only when you want everything yu will be needed to be at par with everyone else, this isn't unfair

If a piece of sh*t is shaped like a potato, it's still a piece of sh*t. Gating off content just sucks for everyone involved. 

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7 hours ago, arii1986 said:

You are making logging in sound like a significant piece of gameplay. Like an achievement or something. I don't deserve items because I am not logging in? You are crazy bruh.

Earning syndicate or focus ain't the same kind of dealio - you miss one day of farming Zenurik and it won't matter too much to your progress. It's just refreshed with no penalty for losing a day.

Oh but miss a login day? Well there's your 100, 200, 300 whatever streak down the toilet. Again, you are defending a broken and unscalable solution. Slap on more rewards for future login days and I'll tell you what will happen.

Day 2000: Zenistar MKII comes out - new player on a login streak sees it, gets disheartened, leaves.

Your argument is invalid.

But it is the same,  if youre new and still workinh your way through the syndicates if you miss a day you'll take one day longer to eventually max them out with the daily standing cap.  And focus?  I still haven't maxxed mine out even though I worked at getting all the passives.  Im not crying "give me all the focus cus Ive played done 5 focus farm missions and I want it now"

Thats all this is here.  You miss a day and have to wait one day longer. There are no penalties for breaking streaks in this.  

Its completely fair.  And if new players are disheartened and going to leave because they cant be bothered logging in each day then I dont think theyre the type of player that needs the login items anyway.  Warframes a game people have sunk years of their life into playing and logging in for.  If theyre not going to see that and get discouraged to play then they werent going to become long time players anyway.  

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7 hours ago, LuckyCharm said:

But it is the same,  if youre new and still workinh your way through the syndicates if you miss a day you'll take one day longer to eventually max them out with the daily standing cap.  And focus?  I still haven't maxxed mine out even though I worked at getting all the passives.  Im not crying "give me all the focus cus Ive played done 5 focus farm missions and I want it now"

Thats all this is here.  You miss a day and have to wait one day longer. There are no penalties for breaking streaks in this.  

Its completely fair.  And if new players are disheartened and going to leave because they cant be bothered logging in each day then I dont think theyre the type of player that needs the login items anyway.  Warframes a game people have sunk years of their life into playing and logging in for.  If theyre not going to see that and get discouraged to play then they werent going to become long time players anyway.  

I have failed to understand how the daily tribute system works. I didn't even realise it was based on accumulative login days - not consecutive login days. Better research required next time...

For shame 🙈 going to find a nice brown paper bag to stick my head in

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23 hours ago, Zilotz said:

BUT conut only days  if person plays at least 4 missions(or over 1h in total) and kills at least 300mobs in one day?

Those metrics don't go together at all. 4 missions might be 12-15 minutes tops for some people. 1 hour is only three twenty minute survivals (less for the loading screens). 300 mobs, really shouldn't take an hour to kill.

Not even close, no Xerxes I, am I. 300 enemies packed into a narrow space isn't a barrier, it's an invitation. 

 

Many of the people who log in for short periods, also run sorties. They just don't want to do marathon sessions. A lot of the fuss over log in rewards were just people complaining because they feel they shouldn't have to put any effort in, and others who don't want "n00bs" to get the same stuff they have, "because we earned it, and it's just being given away to anyone now".

 

Don't fret yourself trying to figure out how they can "fix" something that isn't actually broken. 

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I dont understand one thing. Why do players in the lead not want new players to experience the same loot? Most arguments are on how their dedication is being invalidated, but honestly, I dont see this as a race. I see it as a bonus reward where you can now choose what's most valuable to you. For me, I dreaded getting primed fury when I'm a blahtahtah player, primed vigor when I never used regular vigor, soon I'll get primed shred, which is the mod I want. I don't care if I can/cannot catch up to the race nobody is winning, I just want to have fun choosing the rewards I desire.

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2 hours ago, arii1986 said:

I have failed to understand how the daily tribute system works. I didn't even realise it was based on accumulative login days - not consecutive login days. Better research required next time...

Don't worry about it, Tenno. Things aren't really explained well in this game, and with the amount of fuss some people made about the change, it certainly seemed like it was a huge deal. 

The rewards for logging in, are just that, a way for them to say 'thanks for joining us today'. It's like if your grandmother gave you a cookie and a dollar for ice-cream whenever you visited. Some people seem to be of the opinion that they are entitled to it, and are willing to hire a lawyer to force the old woman to give them their 'due' for all the days that they weren't there. Some seem to be upset that Grandma is equally generous with all her grandkids, even the ones who only show up every once in a while, snatch the cookie and run off down the road. 

 

Don't be like them. You just play the game that you enjoy, have fun with the things you have, and don't sit around fretting about what you have that others don't, or what they have that you haven't unlocked yet. 

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I want the rewards to stop getting worse. Lodestar Syandana and Armor is honestly just bad. And I think it's entirely fair to say by the time you do aquire those you'll likely have gotten something better anyway. Please go back and revisit them and give them something to make them unique.

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13 minutes ago, Zahnny said:

I want the rewards to stop getting worse. Lodestar Syandana and Armor is honestly just bad. And I think it's entirely fair to say by the time you do aquire those you'll likely have gotten something better anyway. Please go back and revisit them and give them something to make them unique.

So you want a refund? Other sets you pay for. It's given to you for free as a thank you for playing. What is the problem? 

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46 minutes ago, Descent-of-Damocles said:

I dont understand one thing. Why do players in the lead not want new players to experience the same loot?

Don't try to. Their mindset only makes sense to people like them. You are right, it's not a race. We'll all get there sooner or later. 

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Are the super good coupons going to still be included in the daily rewards? The only time I can afford to get Platinum is with an excellent coupon (75% off).. I’ve only gotten 1 of those. But, The chance to get one of those at least every 2 months or maybe 3 months max would be nice.

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14 hours ago, LuckyCharm said:

But it is the same,  if youre new and still workinh your way through the syndicates if you miss a day you'll take one day longer to eventually max them out with the daily standing cap.  And focus?  I still haven't maxxed mine out even though I worked at getting all the passives.  Im not crying "give me all the focus cus Ive played done 5 focus farm missions and I want it now"

Thats all this is here.  You miss a day and have to wait one day longer. There are no penalties for breaking streaks in this.  

Its completely fair.  And if new players are disheartened and going to leave because they cant be bothered logging in each day then I dont think theyre the type of player that needs the login items anyway.  Warframes a game people have sunk years of their life into playing and logging in for.  If theyre not going to see that and get discouraged to play then they werent going to become long time players anyway.  

The struggle here is every day missed is another day you're behind the leaders, and the gap only widens the more days you miss, or in the case of you having started warframe more recently, you never had the option at all. As it currently stands the proposed login changes do absolutely nothing. you still need to wait 900 days to get all the mods and weapons, a catch up mechanic is needed, if atleast for the functional items. don't care for the cosmetics.

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30 minutes ago, Chronozilla said:

The struggle here is every day missed is another day you're behind the leaders, and the gap only widens the more days you miss, or in the case of you having started warframe more recently, you never had the option at all. As it currently stands the proposed login changes do absolutely nothing. you still need to wait 900 days to get all the mods and weapons, a catch up mechanic is needed, if atleast for the functional items. don't care for the cosmetics.

I gather that.  Im about 40 days behind the leaders too and while i dont particularly agree that non cosmetic stuff should be tied behind this sort of wall the thing is that de are putting the cosmetics in there too so if someone chose they could pick up the 1000 day reward im working towards on their 100th day..  Thats not really a catchup mechanic thats just a kick in the shins to anyone who actually waited that long for it.  

Add to that the best rewards are gained by day 500 anyway barring sigma and octantis there really isnt reason for the catchup thing other than a tiny bit of mastery and a little power gain,  since the benefits are insignificant for the mods.  

But i think one of the major reasons veterans who have logged in this long are annoyed besides the prestige factor is it feels like for the last 3 rewards at least theyve intentionally made no effort for them to be decent. The syandana does nothing and looks pretty trash compared to even the earliest tennogen ones.  The armor set is stationary with no animation or cool metallics or any special glows or effects. And primed sure footed still locks you into a longer animation than just using handspring to stand back up. The only reason vets want to keep these as prestigious items are that they have nothing else to show for those last 300+ wasted login days.  

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5 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

So you want a refund? Other sets you pay for. It's given to you for free as a thank you for playing. What is the problem? 

The problem is DE doesn't care for vets...Please don't use the "it's free" argument. I've spent at least over £100 on this game and probably much more. Time is money and I've invested tons of it into Warframe. I've even made a thread yesterday asking for MORE things to buy.

Here's what money can get you: Prime armor with unique effects while channeled

Here's what time can get you: An armor set for 1000 days of logins.

I'm not going to try and make some scale on a time-to-money ratio but I think for at least 1000 days that kind of dedication should be rewarded with more than a consolation prize, or rather a "reward just for the sake of being a reward", which is what the past few milestones have been.

I will say this, it is pretty lazy. Primed Sure Footed, Lodestar Syandana and Armor that you will likely already have better alternatives by 1000 days. I'm not asking for powercreep as I'm one of the rare few that don't mind Primed SF even though the mod itself has proven to be broken even at 100%...I just wish if weapons like Azima/Zenistar/Zenith are going to be replaced by cosmetics it'd be something I'd want to wear. Heck, if it was something as simple as the "discs" spun faster while channeling I would drop all my complaints right now. To me all it proves by existing is saying "hey look I got to 1000 days and all I got was this lousy armor!", That's the only value those items have.

And with the upcoming changes to the tribute system (which I originally didn't mind) everyone is now going to start saying "but it's a 50 day login reward what did you expect?" essentially making everything I've said here void, and I'll still be stuck here with a feeling of being thrown in the trash.

I really want to make this as blunt as possible: I have no problem with upcoming changes and players getting rewards it took years for me to get for less. My concern is that all these milestones will amount to is collectionist fodder. Now what gets to benefit newer players has indirectly targetted me as a vet making the system as a whole worthless.

Edited by Zahnny
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3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

The problem is DE doesn't care for vets...Please don't use the "it's free" argument.

Too late. You get a gift for logging in. One nobody paid for, and one that you can't buy. For the record I've spent money on the game too, but I do appreciate the gift I get at login. 

 

3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

Here's what money can get you: Prime armor with unique effects while channeled

Here's what time can get you: An armor set for 1000 days of logins.

No, that's what plat can buy. You can get the plat just from playing the game. You know what you can't buy with plat? A whole bunch of free rewards you can get from logging in. 

 

3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

I think for at least 1000 days that kind of dedication should be rewarded with more than a consolation prize, or rather a "reward just for the sake of being a reward", which is what the past few milestones have been.

Why? Why do you think that? You get a gift from a coworker on a day that isn't even your third anniversary of joining the company, do you turn around and tell them that you deserve a better gift? Because that's what you are doing here. Take a minute to recognise that. 

3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

To me all it proves by existing is saying "hey look I got to 1000 days and all I got was this lousy armor!", That's the only value those items have.

You know how many t-shirts I have gotten from friends who have gone places and brought them back as souvenirs that say the same thing? And you know what I have always said to them?  "Hey thanks, you didn't have to get me anything, but I appreciate you thinking about me. 😊 " 

3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

And with the upcoming changes to the tribute system (which I originally didn't mind) everyone is now going to start saying "but it's a 50 day login reward what did you expect?" essentially making everything I've said here void, and I'll still be stuck here with a feeling of being thrown in the trash.

Nope, most people probably won't care, one way or the other. If you want to be upset that you got a bunch of gifts at specific milestones, that will still take others years to collect, just perhaps in a different order, please feel free. 

3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

My concern is that all these milestones will amount to is collectionist fodder. Now what gets to benefit newer players has indirectly targetted me as a vet making the system as a whole worthless.

Isn't that what they always were? A couple of weapons that high login/high MR would get, the occasional primed mod, some cosmetics, and a bunch of minor resources you could get elsewhere, in between? 

The minute you started worrying about what other people have gotten and what you got, or worrying about how long it took you and how long it might take them, you went down wrong path. The only thing any of us should ever worry about is how we're doing, compared to how we were doing yesterday.

Are you having fun with the game? Are you looking forward to seeing the new content? Have you revisited any of your favourite frames and mission types recently? Are you happy? Those are the important issues, and people seem to be missing that. A lot. 

 

 

 

Personally I think DE should just make it an opt-out system. If anyone doesn't want the gifts, they're free to not receive any of them. How many people do you think will jump on that bandwagon? I'm thinking that it would be a very small number. 

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