A better Nyx rework?

[XenMaster]

Back then with the disarm passive, Psychic bolts ability was the worst when comes in terms of damage. But when against Nullifier and heavy units in terms of crowd control, it prevents these units to do fatal damage against us and debuffing our powers because of the disarm effect and radiation proc effect.

 

Radiation cannot be removed by Nullifiers because it count as Status Effect not a warframe debuff. Not to mention disarm is permanently remove their weapons.

 

Now that the Passive become Accuracy Reduction, and Psychic Bolts turn into scalable debuff that cannot upgrade its number of targets and not spammable, it became clunky.

 

There are changes that people would like to see when DE return to buff her :

 

1. Return of the radiation proc

2. Spammable cast

3.Number of targets increased by STR stat

4. Commands Mind Control and Chaos number of targets (5-10 chaosed enemies) to attack the debuffed psychic bolts.

 

The number four is one thing that will change Mind Control AI behaviour because right now its not aggressive.

 

 

[XenMaster]

1. Allow to bypass defense mission wave kill requirements

 

2. More number of mind control targets

 

3. MC target can turn other enemy into MC target

 

4. Mind Freak augment for all

 

At current state of Nyx's Mind Control, the target sometimes idle which its bad when bombard try to attack it and the aoe splash hit you. Basically a bug for the AI.

 

Wind up need to be removed and add as flat damage buff to the target instead.

 

Mind Control and Enthrall allow to gain status and elemental mods from currently equipped weapons (Nyx's equipped pistol/Revenant's equipped melee).

[XenMaster]

the only passive i could think of for nyx is

Infinite punch through.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Confuse nearby enemies. Short range of course.

Edited March 14, 2019 by Zilchy

[XenMaster]

The beast titan, has a command shout that command whatever small titans hes controlling.

 

With the all three Nyx's abilities, that can be added as good manipulation mechanic.

 

Start from Psychic Bolts :

 

1. Command range is 15m for Mind Control and Chaos units

 

2. Psychic Bolts take 500% extra damage from Mind Control and Chaos targets.

 

3. The amplify damage will be removed if either the abilities duration is run out. Example, if Psychic bolts targets has run out of duration debuff, all extra damage will removed.

 

4. Command will force Mind Control and Chaos targets to ignore any nearby hostile and only attack the debuffed targets.

 

Scenario :

 

Nyx has 10 chaos influenced targets, 1 mind controlled heavy gunner in a room.

 

When nyx cast psychic bolts, assume she still has that clunky recast, 6 bolts will target whatever nearby hostile.

 

6 bolts hit Nyx's 6 chaos units (or non chaos units).

 

the Command will override their AI to force Mind Controlled heavy gunner, and the 4 chaos units that are not debuffed within 15m of nyx to attack the debuffed targets.

 

But the debuffed target with chaos influence will attack another debuffed target that are not themselves and vice versa.

 

So basically in other words,

 

give command mechanic to Psychic Bolts for Nyx to be useful in thematically manipulating everyones mind.

 

Her passive could be turn into infinite punch through for her weapons against debuffed, mind controlled and chaos influenced targets.

[XenMaster]

Before I go through every nook and cranny, I ask a question to DE.

 

"What do you see Nyx as a warframe?"

 

A. Problem as Mind Controlled enemy:

 

1. Mind Control not fighting its former allies (assumed its a bug)

 

2. Not able to kill enemy by themselves due to their "damage vs tenno" stats. Its too low.

 

3. Too much depending on Psychic Bolts debuff due to "number 2".

 

4. Contradicts with Defense mission progress. Stops wave if Mind Control is the last one alive.

 

B. Feedback on how to improve and fix these problem :

 

1. Allow Mind Control to bypass kill requirements in Defense mission.

 

2. Use their 50% max armor/shield/health as damage output. (Remove wind up damage) (STR scaled)

 

3. Their damage output ignore 50% enemy defenses. (STR scaled)

 

4. (As new augment or rework) Increases number of target up to 3.

 

C. Psychic Bolts problem heard by every Nyx player

 

1. Number of bolts are not scaled by any stats.

 

2. Cannot be spammed due to DE's thematic reasoning.

 

3. Radiation status removed have reduced Nyx's crowd control effectiveness against Nullifier (I assumed this is a nerf to her)

 

4. Disarm passive removed have reduced Nyx's crowd control effectiveness againdt Heavy units with the old Psychic Bolts spam.

 

D. Psychic bolts feedback to improve

 

1. Number of bolts scaled by STR stat

 

2. Remove recast and allow to spam the ability but rebalance by increase Energy cost from 50 to 60.

 

3. When enemy is hit by Psychic Bolts, the Chaos influenced targets within 15m of it will attack the debuffed victim. Overriding their previous target.

 

"During Chaos targets attacking, their damage increased by 5% based of their max health until either of their debuffed run out duration (whether Psychic Bolts victim or Chaos targets to prevent the damage bonus to oneshot all our allies)"

 

4. (As augment) Give 50, 75, 100% chance to disarm the debuffed target.

 

E. Absorb feedback

 

1. Explosion range is too short.

 

2. Unreliable and lower scaled damage buff after deactivating

 

3. Explosion damage fall off is bad.

 

4. Knockdown without slowed effect is bad. Hence why Nyx after deactivating absorb get oneshot because enemy further from her absorb range effectiveness dont get knocked down.

 

5. Absorption to damage explosion ratio is bad if energy consumption per threshold of damage is too much.

 

6. Dynamic damage type absorbed are bad due to enemy dont have proper damage type against them.

Edited March 20, 2019 by XenMaster

[XenMaster]

There are some bugs like they keep idle until it reach to Nyx and start fighting again or not attempt to fight at all.

 

Leave the bug and other abilities aside, as a manipulation ability, unlike in other games,

 

1. Nyx's one is bad because they cant deal enough damage due to their damage output is meant for versus to warframe HP stats while NPCs has more thousand of HP than players.

 

2. With Psychic Bolts not being able to spam, Mind Control doesnt "PRIORITIZE" to attack debuffed enemies from the 2nd ability.

 

3. Every enemy NPC has sluggish movement that also reduce their effectiveness attack range.

 

4. Eximus and in built abilities are not scaled with any of player stats, they became less beneficial to Mind Control them.

 

5. A nuisance when comes to Defense mission, not being able to bypass waves just because Mind Controlled enemies is still alive the fact that you already use so many bullets on that NPC just to uncast it back to only progress a mission.

 

There are lot of things to make any type of Mind Controlled enemy strong and reliable as ally.

 

A. Unlimited Damage Stack

 

a. Similar to Mallet, Mind Control need to change its "4 seconds wind up for damage soak" into "unlimited damage absorption".

 

b. Same ratio to damage output, but this make Mind Control stronger and better which why Octavia's Mallet is one of the strongest ability. It scales throughout the level

 

B. Aggro (new passive ability for any type of Mind Control)

 

a. To make sure no enemy attempt to attack Nyx because of how squishy she is, allow Mind Control to gain an aura that will cause any hostile to attack the MC ;

 

Aura Radius : 10m (Range stat)

Duration of the debuff outside aura : 5 seconds (Duration stat)

 

C. Hostile Power Scale

 

a. Shield Osprey's overshield, Eximus Frost Globe, Eximus Firewave, Mine Osprey's landmine or any ability based they have can be buffed through Power Strength stat.

 

200 overshield x 1.0 Multiplier (100% STR) x 500% Mind Freak augment = 1000 overshield (less if reaches limit)

 

Conclusion :

 

Turn any type of Mind Controlled enemy into Proxy Tank. In other words, an "AI that tanks" for player.

 

With scalable damage buff and ability stat, any type of enemy will become reliable for Nyx to Mind Control. Even the useless grineer can be a tank that aggros any enemy within its range and kill any enemy with decent buff.

[(PSN)Cosmic-TM]

Hello, long time player first time forum poster here. I was just sitting in my Orbiter watching the ten Charamote in my aquarium clip through each other when I started thinking about the Nyx and Titania reworks that came out a while back and how disappointing they were, now I can't say I expected a full revision to both of their kits but if it happened before with Nezha why couldn't it happen again? Ever since I farmed Nyx Prime a year back I've been playing her nearly nonstop and the main problem I've found, aside from how squishy she is, is just the plain fact that her abilities seem diluted from what they should be. She was toted around as a mind melding mistress capable of bending the enemy to her will but when it comes down to it she's just underwhelming to play. You never really get the sense that you're taking control of the battlefield with her aside from grabbing a Corrupted Bombard or Ancient Healer by the brains and getting a short buff or bullet sponge. Honestly, whenever I play as her, I find myself just using Chaos. Like a mini distraction for when the going gets tough. So, for the fun of it, I jotted down some abilities and augments that I think would work better in making Nyx viable at higher levels, without getting her tail kicked to Uranus and back, and making playing as her feel more powerful then it is now. So check it out:

Passive: Nyx mentally diverts damage done to her into controlled thralls. Status debuffs, such as elemental stuns, knockdown, and knockback, are absorbed by enemies mind controlled by Nyx. As well as a small amount of damage, this scales depending on the amount of enemies under her control to a max of 50%.

Ability 1 - Kinesis: Nyx plants her feet on the ground and mentally grabs hold of 6,8,10,12 enemies around her in a 10,15,20,25 meter radius stunning them, as the ability is held down Nyx drains the enemies "Mental Integrity" dealing damage to their health over time and adding to a special overshield meter named "Psychokinetic Shielding" that absorbs any damage taken to her (Much like Nezha, except fully blocking damage done to her). This Psychokinetic Shielding scales with power strength and is a held ability meaning the longer you hold it down, the more shielding Nyx gets, and the more energy it costs. Once released the enemies affected are stunned for 5 seconds, giving Nyx the time to get rid of them or get out of there before she gets blasted.

(Affected by Range and Efficiency mods)

*If Nyx already has any amount of Psychokinetic Shielding Kinesis cannot be cast.
*Gives Nyx a full body cosmetic effect according to her energy color like the effect on her hands and forearms.

Augment - Kinetic Whiplash: Cast Kinesis again to have Nyx release her Psychokinetic Shielding as a explosive radial discharge around her dealing 10/15/20/25% of it's remaining health as radiation damage. Dealing a max of 3600. Like Rhino's Iron Shrapnel augment. (This is taking into account the fact that that it can go above 10k)

Ability 2 - Psychic Burst: Nearly identical to Psychic Bolts as it is now, Nyx releases 2,4,6,8 Psychic Bolts that strip enemies of their armor. Now however, the bolts explode in a small aoe burst applying the effect to a max of 1,2,3,4 additional enemies per bolt. Also, the weird held down cancel is removed. Just recast the ability to cancel it's effect on all targets.

(The debuff is affected by Power Strength mods, the ability is affected by Range mods)

Augment - Chaos: Enemies affected by Psychic Burst can't distinguish friend from foe, confusing them and making them attack random factions. (Like normal Chaos but miniaturized)

Ability 3 - Mass Hysteria: Same as Chaos except now enemies under the effect of Mass Hysteria will have their minds slowly melted, doing ticks of 15, 20, 25, 30 damage over time. At the end of Mass Hysteria enemies will be dealt one last burst of 115 damage. Enemies that die will play an animation of their brains gushing out of their ears as they fall to the ground, enemies that don't will be stunned for 2,4,6,8 seconds. Enemies under the effect of Mass Hysteria are more vulnerable to Kinesis granting Nyx more Psychokinetic Shielding then normal.

(Affected by Range, Efficiency, and Power Strength mods)

Augment - Mental Illness: Enemies that come within range of Hysteric enemies will gain the effects of Mass Hysteria for 25,30,40,50% of it's duration and damage.

Ability 4 - Swarm Maiden: The enemy are pawns, and Nyx is their queen. Nyx mind controls 6,12,18,24 enemies around her for a duration turning the battlefield on it's head. Enemies under her control receive an small innate damage multiplier but, like Kinesis, their minds will begin to melt as they bend under Nyx's control. Enemies will deteriorate over time and take one large hit of damage at the end of the ability's duration, those that survive will be stunned for a short time, those that die will have their heads explode in a flash of psychic power. Additionally, surviving enemies will be open to finisher attacks.

(The damage multiplier and damage ticks are affected by Power Strength mods, and the ability is affected by Duration and Efficiency mods.)

Augment - Reverend: Swarm Maiden must now be cast on a specific target. The enemies around the target will fall under the influence of Swarm Maiden instead of those around Nyx. The armor and damage of the target cast upon is doubled and will emit a psychic aura spreading Nyx's influence to the first 2,4,6,8 enemies that come into its contact and dealing radiation damage to all others. The duration of Swarm Maiden is doubled on the Reverend. The queen's knight in psychic armor.

I think that by giving Nyx a way to sustain herself using a overshield buff ability and putting more emphasis on her ability to take control of the battlefield and create an army of drones to fight for her and take damage for her, all while giving her abilities a new look and feel, can make her a genuinely fun Warframe to play. Letting her take on missions solo or support a team by diverting enemy fire. Those are my thoughts anyway, I'm open to feedback if you've got it. All in all this is just my way of making Nyx the brain bender she was always meant to be. She's been around for so long after all, why not show her the love she deserves?

And while we're add it, can we have it so that Nyx moves by lifting herself up using sheer telepathic will? ...Too much? Alright.

[XenMaster]

 

[Diangelius]

I admire your dedication on thinking hard about ideas and writing down all of this. However I heard many people said that DE would not read any Original Post in this General Discussion thread, just no idea why though. I think you should post it on Feedback but then again I just don't know where players can post their WF's interesting ideas and DE will read them.

[(PSN)Cosmic-TM]

5 minutes ago, Diangelius said:

I admire your dedication on thinking hard about ideas and writing down all of this. However I heard many people said that DE would not read any Original Post in this General Discussion thread, just no idea why though. I think you should post it on Feedback but then again I just don't know where players can post their WF's interesting ideas and DE will read them.

Oh, that's a shame. But it's fine, I never really expected this to get all the way up to DE's line of sight. I'm happy enough just sharing my ideas and knowing they're being heard by someone at least, so thanks!

[XenMaster]

As long Swarm Maiden's mind controls can deal decent damage to those debuffed enemies from 2nd ability.

[Steru]

Maybe... you could tell Raethalius about your idea.

He's openminded makes videos about warframe's concepts so he might do one about your nyx rework rework. 

[OriVerda]

34 minutes ago, Diangelius said:

I admire your dedication on thinking hard about ideas and writing down all of this. However I heard many people said that DE would not read any Original Post in this General Discussion thread, just no idea why though. I think you should post it on Feedback but then again I just don't know where players can post their WF's interesting ideas and DE will read them.

That's not even the worst of it, top DE members like Scott, Steve, Sheldon, etc typically avoid the forums leaving it up to Rebecca to sort through our feedback and suggestions. She then goes on to tell the rest of the team how the community feels, but also leaves out most of the negativity and negative feedback.

At least this is what I was told by a trusted clan mate.

[XenMaster]

2 minutes ago, OriVerda said:

That's not even the worst of it, top DE members like Scott, Steve, Sheldon, etc typically avoid the forums leaving it up to Rebecca to sort through our feedback and suggestions. She then goes on to tell the rest of the team how the community feels, but also leaves out most of the negativity and negative feedback.

At least this is what I was told by a trusted clan mate.

Just like how Disney tried to fake sale Captain Marvel. My god.

[Deathnor]

i like it and think its themed well. that being said i dont think that shes gonna see any changes. im am working under the assumption that one of two things must be true. the first is whoever was in charge of her rework has little experience and should not be messing with frames or any type of creative aspects of the game. im doubtful but it is always a posability. the second is that her rework was of a very limited purview. meaning its scope was from never going to have anything close to any new abilities. my reasoning for this is kinda simple.

they took a coin flip passive thats based around survivability in terms of the design aspect and traded it out with a coin flip passive thats based on survivability in terms of a design aspect.

they took the obvious route of trying to add a reason to throw on some power strength in to her builds to spice up viability in her builds by having a armor strip on her 2 only to have to quite quickly follow up of trying to add a reason to throw on some power strength in to her builds to spice up her viability by adding a low (ludicrously low like unusable low) damage buff on her 4.

the damage buff they added to her 4 actively work against her fours augment. recasting the four cancels the buff.

they traded out her passive for one that literally must be turned off to make her 4 function as its supposed to. 

they took the community seriously when they asked for some kinda damage scaling on her  mind controlled target. they went about it by allowing us pump bullets into a ally that still cant kill anything at a reasonable pace when we could just use those same bullets to kill 5 or 6 times the number of enemys then the mind control target can. 

then the creme de la creme of her rework which i think shows how how limited the scope of her rework was comes to the forefront. assimilate who's text should read as follows. "You can move." for some reason it was not given the mesa's waltz treatment and made a exilus. if that kinda simple was missed someone who should not be working on reworks handled this rework or any changes to augments were completely off the table. meaning her rework was to be from a management perspective of a really low scope.

or thats my 2 cents on the matter.

[XenMaster]

Nyx as a supposed crowd control frame, she doesn't have that much DPS aside from her Mind Control and own crafted weapons.

 

She need that debuff more than anyone because of Mind Control's damage type. Too weak and they cannot proc status effect often. Absorb cannot deal any decent even if with the debuff but it became a proper defense ability to avoid one shot attacks.

 

Moreover Nyx's Psychic bolts cost 50 energy without any efficiency mods. That cost a lot per cast which it wouldn't matter if the ability work as a debuffer mechanic. It also require enemy's line of sight on Nyx only the bolts can target them when cast.

 

With 6 bolts limitation and cannot be increased by any stat, the ability need to be allowed spammable.

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

1 hour ago, XenMaster said:

Mind Control's damage type

Mind Control doesn't have a damage type. It deals the damage the enemy you subjugate deals.

[Plushy]

Ya, the new Psychic Bolts have no business costing as much as they do to use or having that annoying need to hold down 2 so it can get recast again.

DE really needs to take a look at Nyx again because a lot of frames are completely outclassing her. Some of them even have abilities that roll several of hers into an even better ability or they just do everything she does and better.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

I wouldn't even mind Psychic Bolts not being spammable if we didn't have to hold it for 3 freaking seconds to release it. There is no reason it should take longer than 1 second. 1/2 would be even better. 

And the changes to Absorb were meaningless, provable with a high strength Nyx in a +300% Nyx Arbitration. They should remove the cost increase and give her the ability to hold 4 to spend energy and multiply the damage absorbed, and auto detonate on release.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

12 hours ago, Plushy said:

Ya, the new Psychic Bolts have no business costing as much as they do to use or having that annoying need to hold down 2 so it can get recast again.

DE really needs to take a look at Nyx again because a lot of frames are completely outclassing her. Some of them even have abilities that roll several of hers into an even better ability or they just do everything she does and better.

I'd even be fine with the ability to only effect 6 targets.  The debuff afterall is not a perma strip.  So you could easily just remove it off of the current targets when she casts it again to effect new targets.  This would preserve her bolt's augment of cheap cc spam while still keeping the debuff as an effect.  

[RagingPavillion]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

And the changes to Absorb were meaningless, provable with a high strength Nyx in a +300% Nyx Arbitration. They should remove the cost increase and give her the ability to hold 4 to spend energy and multiply the damage absorbed, and auto detonate on release.

Agree.  Absorb, despite its damage type change is still irrelevant.  The additional energy drain and absorbed damage limits its capabilities.  From what I've read from other(older) posts, the old absorb also have an invul phase after detonation.  Aside from that getting to a million damage is easier.  The energy drain per damage limits her for at least a few hundred thousand damage with zero energy and a guaranteed death after detonation.  Someone have said that Nyx is s good as her enemies since her abilities depends on the enemies available to her, in theory she should scale well.  Currently Octavia's Mallet is a much better 'Absorb'.

DE's campaign for a more 'active' gameplay hurts a lot of older frames by either increasing energy consumption and decreasing damage or range.

[Xepthrichros]

I can spam Ash's shurikens and end up killing the entire room faster than the team's Equinox. 

I think Psychic bolts that does no damage, should be spammable.

[EinheriarJudith]

i really dislike any skill that uses a press and hold or charge mechanic. they have no place in a fast paced game. hydroid has 2 of them >.>. i dont mind psychic bolts having a cap because it turns enemy defenses off but press and hold to cast it again? dumb.

[Xzorn]

They should just revert the entire rework and try again.

Whoever did those changes played Nyx very casually if at all and it shows.

Spamming Bolts with the Rad proc was a key part of her kit and she just doesn't work right with it's absence. Let alone the Disarm or augmented Stun. Like I care about stripping armor when I'm being shot at cuz her CC sucks now. Not to mention the Rad proc did a better job of disabling Infested Auras.