Ash QoL changes

[(PSN)HELLHOUND_ROCKO]

so many times i failed an alert-less vault breach in Spy due to me trying to destroy a security camera or especially that Grineer door scanner via Shuriken - but unfortunately as soon as an enemy is within in a few Lightyears range of Ash his Shuriken do everything but targeting the object he has perfectly under crosshair (and trigger alarm if they hit an enemy (possibly even just by impacting near an enemy)), it's sad. you would think it's an Ash tool good for successful secret infiltration (especially as it, like many other first abilities mainly going for a bit of damage, hardly serve any purpose at medium level or higher otherwise) - but in it's current state it is instead the exact opposite of that: an Ash tool for ensuring to fail a secret infiltration attempt. 

 

i know, i know - the perfect Spy mission loadouts consist of other Warfames than Ash, and by whatever means silenced weapons at that. and i do have a Loki Prime with silenced weapons for a specialised Spy loadout too in one of my loadout slots - but i'm an Ash Prime main and don't usually run any silenced weapons on him. and as an Ash main i of course put the aspiration on myself to also be able to run Spy missions in my main loadout pretty good, that makes it so frustrating that an ability of his that is clearly meant to aid in that (and ATM is falsely recommended for this specific task in the loadingscreen tooltips as well) is something you absolutely have to avoid using if you don't want to trigger an alarm.

 

i even would really love to be able to use it to destroy objects from a distance (like explosive barrels, loot containers - or the same stuff like in Spy missions) in combat missions without having to switch from my Dagger in hand to shooting a weapon, using a shot of ammo through that - and then reloading it. but sadly it's the same here again: as soon as an enemy is anywhere within Lightyears distance of Ash it won't work, no matter how perfect i aim at the object.

  

please DE, make it so that if nothing but such a destructible object is perfectly under crosshair (so that it displays only it's name and rank (under my setting stuff only displays that if it's under crosshair, i forgot if this is standard)) Shuriken will only target the object, and probably best with one instead of two Shurikens (to avoid possibly enemy alerting impact sound to surface by the second Shuriken). and maybe also with still applying the damage of two Shuriken - so that it doesn't lose viability against higher than super-low ranked destructible objects. i know it's rather a QoL request - but what else other than QoL and it's ability to be casted during reloads without disrupting them could be to such an ability in un-augmented anyway?

[(PSN)abbacephas]

As someone who exclusively uses Ash for spy missions, why even are you using shuriken? 

[Dhrekr]

7 minutes ago, (PS4)HELLHOUND_ROCKO said:

i know, i know - the perfect Spy mission loadouts consist of other Warfames than Ash, and by whatever means silenced weapons at that. and i do have a Loki Prime with silenced weapons for a specialised Spy loadout too in one of my loadout slots

It sounds like you know nothing. I usually do detectionless Spy missions with my Frost Prime (a build which I call "Spy Frost", which is a joke as it's the same build I always use) and unsilenced weapons.

This suggestion is probably not going to be accepted as it'll probably create more problems than it solves. Can you imagine how many players would come to the forums and - rightly - complain saying "not only is Ash not very powerful, but why did you nerf him, now in difficult missions I get frustrated because I used to be able to soft-target enemies and now I instead hit some barrel the other side of the map, this is horrible".

 

Anyway, if you have already played The War Within, then you have access to a weapon that is pinpoint accurate, always available, and silent.

[Benour]

Is this thread just late aprils joke? Like seriously you complaining about such stuff? Should i laugh or more like NotLikeThis?

WAKE UP! 

[(PSN)JoelsonMS]

Please people, make Ash's Blade Storm ability back to the way it was. Please! Spoiled my Ash ... Thanks in advance and waiting for your response!

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

Turn it back into a lazy, kill-stealing, "point-at-one-enemy-and-everyone-dies" ability?

Mmm... Nah.

[Benour]

Haha to be honest old ash 4 was more fun and like 10x more effective at killing. You think they murdered Ember with her rework? (i think shes still very good) Ash: "Hold my beer". 

This whole marking enemy and then going "ham" is just to slow for my taste. Hes still pretty OP if you know how to mod him and play him, his dmg scaling is one of the best. But yeah id rather press 4 to win not gonna lie. It was glorious in defense missions with volt speed buff. Nowadays you barely see him in mission and i pub ALOT.

Ash his dead. Press F to pay respect. 

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

 

[Chewarette]

Ash is currently one of the most balanced Warframe in the game right now. All his spells makes sense, nothing is "insanely overpowered", everything is just.. perfect.

If any, all Warframes should be brought to his level. Not the other way around. Old 4 was fun, sure, but terrifically overpowered and skill-less. Now Ash is a lot more enjoyable to play.

[(PSN)JoelsonMS]

8 minutes ago, Chewarette said:

Ash is currently one of the most balanced Warframe in the game right now. All his spells makes sense, nothing is "insanely overpowered", everything is just.. perfect.

If any, all Warframes should be brought to his level. Not the other way around. Old 4 was fun, sure, but terrifically overpowered and skill-less. Now Ash is a lot more enjoyable to play.

It's really. The numbers prove how much fun it is. Come to that people. BACK BLADE STORM. DE needed to give Ash to see if people were interested in playing with him. Literally, it is now useless.

[(PSN)JoelsonMS]

13 minutes ago, (PS4)LeBlingKing69 said:

 

My God ... so sad to see this video. I have not seen it yet ... that's just how I feel.

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

35 minutes ago, (PS4)JoelsonMS said:

My God ... so sad to see this video. I have not seen it yet ... that's just how I feel.

The whole point of that video is to satirize people with your point of view.

[(XBOX)Angryspy101]

If you want to make bladestorm more unpractical and repetitive by locking yourself into cutscenes that can last for 10+ seconds just because you want to play Ash in the most braindead way possible than please don't touch Ash ever again.

By the time a cast of Old Bladestorm finishes, I would have already been three rooms ahead killing everything with current Bladestorm + my weapons together.

 

Easier to use =/= Better 

Edited April 5, 2019 by (XB1)Angryspy101

[Tsukinoki]

5 hours ago, (PS4)JoelsonMS said:

Please people, make Ash's Blade Storm ability back to the way it was. Please! Spoiled my Ash ... Thanks in advance and waiting for your response!

So you want to go back to the old "Press 4, wait 10 seconds while no one else can harm the enemies your ability marked and then go back to doing something?
How about no?
Especially the point where you cast it on tanky enemies that wont die to it...and no one else can hurt them until the ability finishes, meaning people are being attacked and damaged by auras and can't do anything because some Ash in the corner is spamming 4 and dealing next to no damage to the entire room...

Hek with the old ability we had a defense mission drag on ages because the Ash would just spam 4 with a Macro and no one else could kill the final enemy in the wave, and the ash couldn't kill the eximus....took 9 or 10 casts before the enemy died and there was literally nothing that the rest of us could do....I'm glad Ash can't do that anymore.

The old ability was:
-Anti-group
-Anti-fun (for both the Ash who was locked into an unskippable cutscene and his team mates who can only sit on their hands until the ability finishes, and hope that ash doesn't immediately cast it again for 25 energy)
-Vomit inducing

DE won't change it back.

Edited April 5, 2019 by Tsukinoki

[Pizzarugi]

Let's not bring back press-4-to-win Ash. It's bad enough we still have Saryn and Mesa, we don't need to be re-adding more to the list of mechanics trivializing the game for the whole team.

[JohnLemon123]

Ash just needs minor improvements to his invincibility and his shurikens, and he'll be golden. He's incredibly close to being one of the ''gold standard'' warframes, that being those with no useless abilities, and whose kit reflect their theme well.

[Nightbind]

After playing Ash for over 1k hours and looking into many Ash feedback, I feel like now is the time to at least give him some minor QoL for him.

Ever since his rework, there has been many opinions around Ash and his Bladestorm and some minor changes to his Bladestorm.

I haven't seen people use Ash for a long time. He is outshadowed by other stealth frames.

My idea of QoL for him is gonna focus on giving him more utility for damage since Ash has always been dps, why not become a dps frame that helps other frames deal more damage.

1.His Shuriken: The skill itself is pretty good, bleed damage is deadly. The QoL for this skill is allowing Shurikens to ricohet between targets and stagger the targets. This minor buff should give Ash some utility for himself and his teammates.

2.Smoke Screen: The mobility buff should have been with him from the start, but its current state is pretty ok, but the duration is a bit too short, but he is dps stealth frame, so he is mainly dps anyways.

3.Teleport: This ability provides Ash with extreme mobility, but it is ineffective agianst bosses or some cc immuned NPCs. I believe this skill's QoL should be when Ash teleports to a target, place a mark on them that increase the target's incoming damage from all scources.

4.Bladestorm: This skill is the big problem. Its current state is clunky. Marking system is slow. While you mark other enemies your teammates might have killed them. Also triple marking is terribly long.

My suggestion would be make him auto mark his enemies, but with target limit and send a number of clones equal to the target number, this should make Bladestorm faster while Ash is mobile.

The target limit should be around 8 since Ash himself is an assassin, not a cc frame. For example, Ash marks 6 enemies, Ash then sends 6 clones to kill them all.

Please, let me hear your ideas too.

Inb4 He is fine, he is a lot more active now....

Yes, he is a lot more active, but there is almost no incentive to pick him over other frames except his durability, even with that his kill speed is still slower than most frames.

Edited April 6, 2019 by ARMATHD
Deleted unnecessary words.

[Hrodgrim]

I really want Shuriken to get the Atlas treatment. Keep spamming the power to increase the amount of blades thrown. 

[Critiamat]

When I play Ash it's in 90% for these sick Bladestorm cutscenes so I don't like idea of adding more clones/shadows...

With marking itself I would like to see kind of circle like Garuda and Mesa have with theirs 4th to mark faster.

[Nightbind]

I can understand on your Clones, but I still wonder why they didn't give Ash the target circle like Mesa and Garuda in the first place.

 

Edited April 6, 2019 by ARMATHD
Grammar.

[Nightbind]

That's nice, but I think if he had ricochet and had Atlas's treatment, it would make his 1st a bit too useful.

Like 4 shurikens ricocheting and staggering enemies, slash procs would be insane.

[(PSN)joss777]

 

Hello to all. ash would really need to be reworked. Are 1 in shuriken exalter. Are 2 an invisibility like ivara or more duration.Are 4 much too slow to target or do like Ember with the world on fire for these clones this is just ideas but it would be really cool and fun to play

 

 

[TheGrimCorsair]

Not gonna say no to improving the energy efficiency of shuriken by letting it strip whole groups of enemies of their armor and setup more procs for Condition Overload.

Invisibility is pretty fine where it's at. Ash really doesn't need it that much save for a quick breather to replenish health given his overall solid durability. He 100% should not be invisible for long periods of time, imo.

A damage buff on the mark seems good, we can change the augment for this to let killing the marked target propagate the mark, rather than its current lazy effect of killing enemies one at a time for (virtually) no energy.

Other than triple-marking being a minor annoyance and kinda pointless, I've got no real qualms with the way his 4 works. He can use it to clear groups, but clearing groups isn't his main function so I'm mostly ambivalent towards any particular changes to it. I'd be happy if they just expanded the cone slightly and had it run off one mark.

Not too worried about his damage output in general, particularly after the interview with Mogamu making it pretty clear that long term plans include a massive overhaul of player killing speed/potential.

[Xaiken-EN-]

I have mained Ash since single digit updates and have yet to find a frame to dethrone him.

Ash's Shuriken used to be a skill shot. They eventually moved it to auto targeting and it helped a lot. However, it leads to unreliable specific targeting. Sometimes I try to shuriken the Bombard in front of me but they fly off to the enemies else where. I suggest Shuriken throws out a 3rd manually aimed shuriken in addition to the 2 auto targeting shurikens. Ricochet and stagger on his shurikens would be great additions to his shurikens as well.

A duration buff to Smoke Screen is always appreciated but not something that's needed. 

As it stands, I almost never use his 3. Fatal Teleport/ Covert Lethality is certainly a viable build but not my thing. While I am in favor of free aim teleporting, placing a damage mark on the enemy would definitely make me tempted to use the ability more often

His 4 is in a good place but it can be better. Its a great multitask, fire and forget ability but what it suffers the most from is marking clunkiness. Having to wave my mouse around like a spastic monkey doesn't feel good. I have a suggestion to streamline the process.

• Pressing 4 starts marking mode. Marks enemies like Mesa (large reticle we can paint over an area). Enemies are marked once but energy is not spent here.
• Enemies marked while invisible will half the energy spent when clones attack.
• Pressing 4 again will release clones. Clones will attack enemies up to 3 times with each attack spending energy.
• If Ash runs out of energy, the clones will stop attacking.

This should help make marking faster and less waving the mouse about like a madman. One problem could be the ability ending prematurely before all marked enemies are attacked if Ash runs out of energy. The old system spends the energy right away, guaranteeing marked enemies are attacked once (as long as teammates haven't killed them yet). 

[Nightbind]

Off topic, but what happens to the discussion? Some posts' timestamp is different and why I am not the thread's owner anymore? Just curious.