[Maiming Strike] and Dominant Strategy - Why [Maiming Strike] Hurts Warframe as a Whole

[EnvoyOne]

4 hours ago, Shelusine said:

There is no reason to nerf maiming strike as of now. Most melee weapons are simply impractical due to range limitation and flawed mechanic. Furthermore, the overwhelmingly strongest part of a loadout is still the warframe. As long as these issues aren't fixed maiming strike is kinda low on the list of things to fix.

I never asked them to "nerf" MS, nor do I make any demands that they fix this problem first, or even soon. I agree that this particular problem is kinda low tier, but any DS in any game is a strong indication that something is wrong somewhere, you know?

[(XBOX)Demon Intellect]

5 hours ago, DreisterDino said:

They adressed this issue with words already some time ago and assured they want to have a look, but actions still have to follow..

Edit: For example, in the first Devstream in which they showed they new Melee system, on a Reach-Mod that has been picked up the text has been changed from +x percent to +x meters. This would bring most meleeweapons on par with each other since a weapon with barely any range would benefit a lot more than a weapon which has already has good range. And range probably is one of the most important stats on melees anyway.

 

The only thing i am bit worried about is that i have a feeling that we wont see changes to the Melee-system for a long time.

We have Melee 2.9 now and i dont hope but think that we might get stuck at this point for quiet some time (which would be really bad because there are some really annoying issues). Anyone remembers Damage 3.0? Yeah..right..😉

Damage 3.0 was for a completely different reason. That was the issue of mandatory mods.

[(NSW)1kSakura]

3 hours ago, JaxMess said:

Nothing matters.

 

That’s such a nice cover actually ❤️

[Firetrucksrule]

5 hours ago, skoobatoob said:

On Melee Crit: Gain X% melee crit (additive, why not?!) for Y seconds. This buff stacks Z times.

This idea comfortably rewards high-crit weapons while not completely enabling 5% weapons.

Literally came onto this thread just to share this exact same suggestion that I'd literally never once seen in years of playing. It wouldn't make MS any less of a dominant strategy but it would make it a lot less restrictive and annoying. I honestly feel like people have a bigger issue with the macroed repeating 20+ meter diameter of death that spin attacks can make than they do the crit chance buff. Would also nicely buff melee outside the context of spin attack spam. 

3 hours ago, Lutesque said:

The only problem with Maiming Strike is that its the only mod that does this....

If mods like Weeping Wounds or Argon Scope worked the same way then we would have more option not just in how we mod our weapons but with which weapons are viable.....

Wait, I'm actually agreeing with one of Lutesque's suggestions? *pinches cheek*

Joking aside, only reason I ever get happy at seeing argon scope from an acolyte is I know it'll sell well. Mod is honestly pretty much trash, only works well on crit weapons and usually only ones you don't already have a riven for. This change wouldn't just make argon scope better, it wouldn't even just make most primary weapons better. It would actually downright change how riven stats are evaluated and how builds are made. I honestly suspect that could completely change the meta in a way that makes way more weapons more viable without massively devaluing others. 

[Radagosh]

Even w/o maiming strike or rivens with +cc on slide you oneshot the whole content in the game with any decent zaw. Removing the effect would not fix anything. Melee3.0 might change something but i'm highly critical of that as well, since they can't just nerf melee without making everyone complain (as seen in the damage3.0 show case).

Power creep has been growing for 6 years, enemy scaling hasn't, this lead to the current game being hardly challenging. Hopefully a difficulty option, as mentioned in one of the latest dev streams, will help fight this problem. As I personally don't see them having enough ressources to rework the scaling, armor and damage of the whole game at all.

In conclusion, Maiming strike is just part of a way broader problem that isn't fixable by just removing a mod, that hardly matters.

 

[YazMatazO]

Instead of the way it functions now, they should just make it a 90 % chance to upgrade to next critical tier on slide attack. There you go, would fix all your problems.

Personally, I never only spin, and never use Maiming Strike outside of Axi Exterminates. 

[George_PPS]

Slide attack is a great form of attack and is the gold standard that all other melee attack can learn from and to improve. It’s is Warframe. 

 

Slide attack is a very satisfying way of attack with some movement at the same time. It is what many players like and will to continue to use it. I have also build few Zaws and other weapons that are based on Conditional Overload plus Blood Rush but not any slide attack kids or Rivens. The latter still work extremely well with amazing damage but with slightly less fluid movement. Why not make other better but to nerf what’s working?

There is always going to be something or some builds that work the best. Why not propose to get something else to work as fast and smoother as slide attack? If you want to nerf any meta, Warframe might as well as not exist because warframes are fast kill beings with extremely powerful weapons. 

 

No one wants to kill things slow. Warframe is unlike any other games. The power of warframes and various weapons is what makes this game so fun. Please stop suggesting nerfing what is working. Instead, do something to propose improvements on what can be improved to make everything strong and powerful. 

Wukong rework is a great example. The rework upgraded the abilities of Wukong to meta status just like almost all newer warframes that are all metas in some missions. 

Players want buffs on what’s weak not nerfs on what’s strong. If your loadouts aren’tas strong as others, make them stronger. If your weapons aren’t doing well, mod them better, or get proper Rivens. 

[(PSN)Mono-Pop]

10 hours ago, JaxMess said:

In a recent post I made about blocking and it's current state in Warframe I had a segment talking about [Maiming Strike] and it's current place within the game.

I will make a video illustrating my points. EDIT: VIDEO ADDED

My argument is that in it's current form it introduces a Dominant Strategy into Warframe.

A Dominant Strategy in this case is defined as something that "just always works" requiring no thought, no use of clever mod combinations, and no use of game mechanics. This problem is greatly exacerbated by the growing and prominent use of "spin to win" macros in order to automate the process of inputting perfectly timed spin-attacks to not only optimize movement, but also DPS.

This does not imply or explicitly state that the mod is "over-powered" although in this case I think there are many arguments for this.

Also, I think this is probably a PC problem, I have never played Warframe on anything other than PC and am unfamiliar with the potential for macros in the console space. Because of this I am not speaking to anything other than my own experience.

The Problems:

A Dominant Strategy -

One of the indicators of a problem as I see it is simply that every time I load into a mission there is a higher than 50% chance that at least 2 of the "random" teammates I'm grouped with will be using a [Maiming Strike] + Macro build (excluding myself - Yes I also use one, more on that later).

This is an enormous red flag, reminiscent of the days when loading into a mission there was a higher than 50% chance that 2 of the "random" teammates I'm grouped with were using the Tonkor; a weapon that had it's critical strike chance greatly reduced and brought in line with other explosive weapons by adding self-damage. A welcome and needed change in my opinion, and one that greatly improved the game as far as I'm concerned. The Tonkor introduced a Dominant Strategy(DS) into Warframe at that time, and once players came across it, they adopted it, consciously or not. That is the inherent problem with a DS.

Further discussion about DS might help to consider that any video game based in PvP dies a quick death once a DS is found unless a "balance patch" is issued to deal with it. I'm not going to provide any examples, because I'm sure just reading this your mind lept to the first time you were on the receiving end of one. This is not to say that there aren't imbalances or holes in any PvP game, those things are not a DS, a DS is, by definition, dominating in it's field. "The thing that always works."

[Maiming Strike] -

My major beef with [Maiming Strike] is that it does too many things for too little cost; it's too efficient. And because of this it greatly hurts melee as an effective game system, and makes melee weaker as a result.

I know based on how many responses I've already responded to that people think that I want it "nerfed" or to make melee weaker or to make it deal less damage or to make certain weapons less prominently used or to kill fewer enemies all at once - I don't care about any of those things. What I care about is melee as a whole, a game system, and it's health within Warframe. I want melee to be a more robust system within Warframe. While there are many issues that contribute, melee weapon range and range mods, for example. [Maiming Strike] is just one of them, and the one I'm focused on in this post.

So what about [Maiming Strike] makes it so prone to Dominant Strategy? Slide attacks. Slide attacks already do lots of things. It's a movement ability. It often has higher base damage. It looks cool. It's fun to use. It's easily made into a looping macro. It attacks in a wider than usual attack arc. Simply put, it does too many things. Adding a flat improvement to critical strike on all melee weapons during the already dangerously-close-to-being-a-Dominant-Strategy slide attack, just further cements it as "the obvious choice," in any melee situation. Again, this isn't about whether or not it deals the most damage, or having the same results achieved by some other measure. It's about answering the question "why wouldn't I choose a slide attack if slide attacking solves all of my problems?"

Arguments I've already rebuked:

[Maiming Strike] is not as powerful as Xmod or Yweapon or Zability, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.

This argument is attempting to fight an argument that is not the one I am presenting. A DS is not dependent on anything other than the use cases it finds itself contained within, nor does it matter if something else "does more damage" or "is more effective against shields" or whatever other scenario is displayed. The only thing that matters is the principal of "least resistance," as applied to what it can accomplish with minimal effort. In this case the argument is not that it's "too strong" or "too overpowered," the argument is that it's "too efficient" and shuts out other options.

[Maiming Strike] is only viable on weapons that have long base range, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.

This is simply fundamentally untrue. While the problem is great exacerbated on whips and other weapons with a long base range, much in the same way that the macro makes the problem worse, to say that simply making the mod unusable on whips would make it's inherent problems disappear is simply false.

[Maiming Strike] is very difficult to get, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.

There is some validity to this argument, in my opinion, which is why I think the flat critical stat is fine on [Riven] mods, but even still, a universally equip-able mod that only takes 7 capacity drain is a problem. Potentially, making the [Maiming Strike] cost what's worth in terms of drain, 15 or 16 by my calculation, may fix the problem outright. However, it also just may make people use more [Forma] and only slightly delay the problem.

So what's your point?

Does any of this really even matter? No. What's your point? What do you want out of making this post?

I dunno man! I'm just so freaking sick of loading into a mission and everyone just twirling away the enemies in a race to the end. With melee 3.0 just around the corner I feel like they have an extremely good window to address a lot of the things that make the current melee system lackluster. My previous post about blocking, this post about [Maiming Strike], I think a lot about Warframe, it's Devs, and it's community and I hope to see all of them happy! In this case it feels like I'm telling everyone to "take their medicine" or at the least telling the Devs to make the community "take their medicine" which I'm sure a lot of people don't want to hear, but I wouldn't bother if I honestly didn't feel like changes to these systems wouldn't be beneficial to all parties involved.

Basically, I think of it like this: Spin-attacks are really freaking cool, honestly one of my favorite parts of Warframe, but they are a spice, not the main course. Spin attacks are the cinnamon of the Warframe ingredient list. You cannot live on cinnamon alone, in fact, eating pure cinnamon is toxic and can kill you. But as a smaller part of a greater whole, it can dramatically improve the entire dish. For the last few years, playing Warframe is increasingly more and more cinnamon flavored, to the point where if I don't also just eat cinnamon in many cases, I'm basically left behind.

So what can be done?

I want to include some ideas for potential fixes, not because I think [DE] should listen to me, but because I don't like being the type of person who complains or raises issue with something without already having a potential solution to suggest. I am honestly trying to help after all. My hope is that suggestions like these inspire the right people to make a better and more informed decision that I can.

1. Simply make it normal crit and not flat-additive crit. (This will piss a lot of people off, but honestly this just makes a lot of sense to me. MS is the only mod in the game that gives flat crit. That means it's universally equip-able and has a 100% uptime. The only other things that give flat crit that I can think of are the Harrow buff and the Kavat buff. Things that are both fine in my opinion.)
2. Give it an internal cooldown. (Once every 8 seconds? Every 15? Every 30? Maybe it lasts for 5 seconds every 15 seconds? The options here are endless.) 
3. Remove the mod outright. (Potentially there could be some amount of compensation if this is the route taken, anything from just giving all weapons higher base crit, applying the mod to all weapons at all times, doing nothing to compensate, increasing melee base damage - basically anything, but I think this is the least likely option anyway.)
4. Increase the capacity drain cost. (Again, without access to the internal code and basic design philosophy of the Dev team it seems to me that it should be worth 15 or 16 drain, that makes it 8 with a [Forma], but again, this might not solve the problem of it's overuse and over-saturation at all.)
5. Make it equip-able only on the melee weapons that the Acolytes use. (I really like the way this one ties into the world and the story.)
6. Some combination of the aforementioned suggestions? (Maybe give it normal crit all the time and flat crit on a cooldown?)
7. Do nothing. (Honestly, I meant to have written in my other post about how because this option gets boring and tedious after a few years, it tends to fall off after people use it for a while. Because just holding a macro is often less fun than actually playing the video game, maybe all they need to do is make the other melee option more fun than just partially AFK grinding by holding a macro button.

Anyway, thanks for reading!

Video: (If you're watching this freshly uploaded, the resolution will improve after YouTube finishes processing it. Just wait til then I guess.)

 

Wow, there is so little for you to be doing currently that you’re complaining about something people use for fun in a game?

 

Sort you’re priorities out man.

[(PSN)Mono-Pop]

2 hours ago, Firetrucksrule said:

Literally came onto this thread just to share this exact same suggestion that I'd literally never once seen in years of playing. It wouldn't make MS any less of a dominant strategy but it would make it a lot less restrictive and annoying. I honestly feel like people have a bigger issue with the macroed repeating 20+ meter diameter of death that spin attacks can make than they do the crit chance buff. Would also nicely buff melee outside the context of spin attack spam. 

Wait, I'm actually agreeing with one of Lutesque's suggestions? *pinches cheek*

Joking aside, only reason I ever get happy at seeing argon scope from an acolyte is I know it'll sell well. Mod is honestly pretty much trash, only works well on crit weapons and usually only ones you don't already have a riven for. This change wouldn't just make argon scope better, it wouldn't even just make most primary weapons better. It would actually downright change how riven stats are evaluated and how builds are made. I honestly suspect that could completely change the meta in a way that makes way more weapons more viable without massively devaluing others. 

Wow the crit mod is only good on crit weapons, that insight is astounding.

Edited July 3, 2019 by (PS4)Mono-Pop

[Firetrucksrule]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Mono-Pop said:

Wow the crit mod is only good on crit weapons, that insight is astounding.

See your smart assery might have a good place in any other context but here you're just being a jackass. 'only works well on crit weapons and usually only ones you don't already have a riven for.' It's like you went as far out of your way as possible to only read only half of that statement so you could try and look smart for two whole seconds. It's weaker than point strike. There's no reason to use it on a good riven build outside of maybe the odd niche application. For something that's not always applying, requires a context action to work, and has incredibly low drop chances it could at the very least be BiS compared to point strike. Instead it applies a smaller bonus calculated on a diminishing return. It should not be literally weaker than the pre existing mod that's incredibly common and always applies. Yes, making it work well on most weapons is a lot better than it working well on almost nothing like it does now. 

[nslay]

From my point of view, the melee combo system is so much more powerful. And there are a great deal of melee weapons with awful critical chance... so I use Maiming Strike with Berserker on those kinds of weapons to help bootstrap my attack speed. Then with very high attack speed, I can be sure to crit frequently enough to keep Berserker up enabling me to continue to build my melee combo up very fast... even though I am using a garbage crit weapon! So I do that slide attack once or twice and that's it for a while. At least that's how I use it...

So no, I don't agree with gimping Maiming Strike when it can enable really bad crit melee weapons to work a lot better.

[xV3NOMx]

11 hours ago, JaxMess said:

In a recent post I made about blocking and it's current state in Warframe I had a segment talking about [Maiming Strike] and it's current place within the game.

My argument is that in it's current form it introduces a Dominant Strategy into Warframe.

A Dominant Strategy in this case is defined as something that "just always works" requiring no thought, no use of clever mod combinations, and no use of game mechanics. This problem is greatly exacerbated by the growing and prominent use of "spin to win" macros in order to automate the process of inputting perfectly timed spin-attacks to not only optimize movement, but also DPS.

The Problems:

A Dominant Strategy -

One of the indicators of a problem as I see it is simply that every time I load into a mission there is a higher than 50% chance that at least 2 of the "random" teammates I'm grouped with will be using a [Maiming Strike] + Macro build

(Yes I also use one, more on that later).

[Maiming Strike] -

My major beef with [Maiming Strike] it's too efficient.

So what about [Maiming Strike] makes it so prone to Dominant Strategy? 

Slide attacks. Slide attacks already do lots of things. It's a movement ability. It often has higher base damage. Again, this isn't about whether or not it deals the most damage, or having the same results achieved by some other measure. It's about answering the question "why wouldn't I choose a slide attack if slide attacking solves all of my problems?"

Arguments I have not rebuked:

• [Maiming Strike] is not as powerful as Xmod or Yweapon or Zability, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.
• Maiming Strike] is only viable on weapons that have long base range, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.
• [Maiming Strike] is very difficult to get, therefore it cannot introduce a DS.

There is some validity to these arguments

 

So what's your point?

Does any of this really even matter? No. What's your point? What do you want out of making this post?

I dunno man! I'm just so freaking sick of loading into a mission and everyone just twirling away the enemies in a race to the end. For the last few years, playing Warframe is increasingly more and more cinnamon flavored, to the point where if I don't also just eat cinnamon in many cases, I'm basically left behind.

So what can be done?

1. Do nothing. (Honestly, I meant to have written in my other post about how because this option gets boring and tedious after a few years, it tends to fall off after people use it for a while. Because just holding a macro is often less fun than actually playing the video game, maybe all they need to do is make the other melee option more fun than just partially AFK grinding by holding a macro button.

*Fixed

It seems you already answered your own debate, no need for others to contribute to this post.

[Ikyr0]

Pretty sure Meme Strike is in DE's nerf gun crosshairs, among a few other things like Saryn. I expect a hefty dose of nerfs with Empyrean, and Melee 3.0. The power creep has gotten completely out of hand.

Players trying to justify Meme Strike's current existence are completely bonkers. Even DE has commented on how they need to look into it. It's going away come Melee 3.0, deal with it.

Edited July 3, 2019 by Ikyr0

[(PSN)Mono-Pop]

2 minutes ago, Ikyr0 said:

Pretty sure Meme Strike is in DE's nerf gun crosshairs, among a few other things like Saryn. I expect a hefty dose of nerfs with Empyrean, and Melee 3.0. The power creep has gotten completely out of hand.

Players trying to justify Meme Strike's current existence are completely bonkers. Even DE has commented on how they need to look into it. It's going away come Melee 3.0, deal with it.

Maiming strike has nothing on condition overload or combo counter mods.

[Firetrucksrule]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)Mono-Pop said:

“Just get a riven.”

 

Yep, you have nothing meaningful to say.

'it should be better than a mod that everyone has that you do absolutely nothing for.' 

'If I'm choosing between one mod or the other I will literallynever have a reason to choose argon.' 

Which is it, hard of reading or hard of thinking? Or just ignoring the inconvenient points so you can latch on to the riven statement and twist it out of context?

The riven point is the most important point to me personally, it wasn't the only one I made. What's the point of a rare over priced meta mod that doesn't work with your best builds? 

If you're going to stack diminishing returns you might as well at least use bladed rounds. That'll add more dps than argon scope and is no where nearly as expensive. 

Its a mod that's literally worthless on most weapons. It's rather telling that you'd respond to me just to be a $&*^ instead of actually arguing against my point. 

[nslay]

Looking at your video, I am a bit surprised that you can so easily maneuver and slide attack together. It's as if you're walking... just spinning. That's a really convoluted way of moving and attacking...

Did you ever once consider that maybe slide attack wasn't meant to be used that way? And that maybe there's actually something wrong with such a sophisticated physical maneuver offering the movement flexibility you've demonstrated? I honestly think that's what is broken. I can just imagine carpal tunnel syndrome doing that. And that you can move very precisely between point A and point B spinning like that?

I don't know man... I just do the strategic slide attack once or twice to get my Berserker buff up. Never once occurred to me that you should be able to spin around and maneuver as if you were walking. It just makes no physical sense that you can do that... Though I guess there's a lot of parkour stuff that makes no sense either.

[Zanchak]

Considering the mountains of rivens that exist and never needed to... maiming strike isnt much of a bother. Rivens purpose was to make lesser used weapons see action and evolved into even the best weapons having them. They are more of an issue than this one melee mod, no matter how it's explained or used in play.

[RX-3DR]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)Mono-Pop said:

Maiming strike has nothing on condition overload or combo counter mods.

Doesn't melee 3.0 address the issue with the combo counter? At least, from earlier iterations and intentions, I never really kept up with what they planned on it.

The thing about Condition Overload is that it doesn't really shoehorn people into doing repeatedly mashing slide attacks. The problem with Maiming Strike is not a question about how much damage you were getting out of it, if they wanted to address that problem, they would be looking at plenty of things and bringing them up. The problem is evident when simply observing when you have 2 people in the squad doing nothing but running slide attacks on a macro and ignoring every melee weapon action. It draws value away from everything else within melee.

[Firetrucksrule]

14 minutes ago, (PS4)Mono-Pop said:

No, after informing someone that a crit mod is only good on a crit weapon, you felt the need to explain to me that riven mods are better than normal mods.

 

You’re just an everspring of knowledge.

So I informed you that a crit mod is only good on a crit weapon? Interesting, I thought I was just agreeing to the post I quoted. Weird though, I really figured anyone here would've already been informed if not already aware, glad I could help. 

I didn't explain to you that riven mods are better than normal mods. I explained that point strike is better than argon scope. I pointed out that a good riven build won't fit argon on it because of that. What's the point of an overpiced meta mod that doesn't fit on your best builds?

19 minutes ago, (PS4)Mono-Pop said:

You act all arrogant, but the actual content of your replies is pretty minimal.

You haven't addressed a single point I've made. All you've done is got your panties in a bunch, act like a jerk and twist around a bunch of statements. You sure you aren't describing yourself? 

[bibmobello]

Maiming is not overpowered alone, the issue is when you combine it with a riven to reach insane critical values.

Another (unfair)big advantage is when you have absurd range values, you can have the same range(and more) of some fire weapons and at the same time you have a 360 hitting area.

On the other side some weapons are pure crap without it.

[ADDpillz]

I never understood why people care so much about how OTHER people play a PVE game.

If you don't like maiming strike...don't use it.

You dont need to start a nerf crusade because other people don't play the way you do.

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by ADDpillz

[Alpha56]

@JaxMess, the Author of the topic.

Complaining about maiming strike, but at the same time having Mesa as most used warframe ?

Mesa : used 26.7%  / xp 308.000.000 / kills 245.000

Saryn prime : used 4.3% / xp 157.000.000 / kills 218.000

Secura Lecta : used 23.7% / xp 112.000.000 / kills 97.000 (i bet you weren't using maiming on your secura lecta right ?))

Complaining about maiming strike but having the auto aim bot warframe mesa as main, as the most used warframe with 245k kills, and the nuke frame saryn with 218k kills, that trivalise the melee thing, by very very far ?

Sorry but... how ironic is that ?

Just look again at the title of the topic : 

[Maiming Strike] and Dominant Strategy - Why [Maiming Strike] Hurts Warframe as a Whole

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by Alpha56

[Veridian]

OP you're really close to the mark in my opinion, but it's not Maiming Strike, it's slide in general.

For one it enhances mobility, we get to targets faster and it's rather precise, because we either kill them and continue on, or bump into them for the kill. Unlike combo attacks, where we often jump over a target.

Another reason - reach. While range is static, slide attack does damage in a circle and it being entirely horizontal gives it more reach than standard attacks, making it able to hit everything near the frame, something not guaranteed for other attacks.

It also deals more damage.

I've often noticed 2 things about myself. 1 - I often use slide attacks, MS or not and 2 - every so often when I want to combo there are always 1-2 enemies that just don't get hit from the group, so I resort to slide once more.

Ultimately I don't believe that MS is a dominant strategy, slide is just an overall better attack, 90% critical is icing. But rather than "fix" that, DE should just add effects to combo attacks to raise them on the same level, otherwise you'd run the risk of removing this dominant strategy, but also leaving melee barely used by the majority.

Edited July 3, 2019 by Ver1dian

[(NSW)Katsuro]

4 hours ago, ADDpillz said:

I never understood why people care so much about how OTHER people play a PVE game.

If you don't like maiming strike...don't use it.

You dont need to start a nerf crusade because other people don't play the way you do.

 

Logic doesn't work in forums...

[Birkenhoff]

vor 21 Stunden schrieb JaxMess:

Does any of this really even matter? No. What's your point? What do you want out of making this post?

I dunno man! I'm just so freaking sick of loading into a mission and everyone just twirling away the enemies in a race to the end. 

A wall of text plus a 9 min Video for this? I want to have your problems, seriously. 🙂

TBH even if MS would get nerved people still would hustle to get all of those sweet kills with their Mesa or Saryn. So why even bother about this? I'd think the real thing that grinds your gear - based on your quoute, the bottom line of your post - is the power creep in general. You just have a real go on MS in this case.

...whatever, I'm not a psychologist but I think you're maybe a bit obsessed about it.