Lanka is a terrible sniper rifle

[TeaHawk]

Quote

The Lanka fires a high velocity projectile through magnetic induction.

Also. Can anybody explain this? What is this projectile? If there is one, why we would have only elemental damage? If it is some sort of plasma, how is it being magnetically or rather magically accelerated? And even if it is plasma which is somehow magically accelerated, how does it have such a punch through? Would not it rather splash and burn target instead of piercing like a full metal jacket? If it is plasma, what is the magazine for? What is stored there? It feels like a very inconsistent design.
And who the hell would build an extremely slow velocity plasma rifle and put 8x magnification on it? Tell me that.

What the hell is this? >_<

Edited August 14, 2019 by TeaHawk

[-VS-Airikr]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb TeaHawk:

2. Lanka projectile hit is counted only once even with multishot.

There's no much to explain. Take any hit-scan sniper rifle with 200% multishot. On hit sniper combo counter will take multishot in consideration. For some weird reason this does not seem to happen with Lanka. Apparently, only one projectile is taken in account. In other words, it's harder to advance combo counter on Lanka.

just a quick note that this is wrong. I just tested it with Vigilante Armaments + Split Chamber and both charged/uncharged shots.

I always get 2, sometimes 3 on the counter, depending on the multishot.
 

in "normal" einvironment it increases the counter only by one because the enemies die after the first bullet (tested it in Adaro). Counter also works completely fine on an unmodded Lanka with multishot mods.

[TeaHawk]

19 minutes ago, Airikr said:

just a quick note that this is wrong. I just tested it with Vigilante Armaments + Split Chamber and both charged/uncharged shots.

I always get 2, sometimes 3 on the counter, depending on the multishot.
 

in "normal" einvironment it increases the counter only by one because the enemies die after the first bullet (tested it in Adaro). Counter also works completely fine on an unmodded Lanka with multishot mods.

Thank you very much for this demonstration. It seems that I've mistaken on how exactly it works. Could you please quickly test any hitscan sniper with 200% multishot on low levels? I wounder if combo counter will also increase by one. It's important. I cannot check it myself for the moment and won't be able to for next 10 hours. Thanks.

Edited August 14, 2019 by TeaHawk

[-VS-Airikr]

vor 41 Minuten schrieb TeaHawk:

 

hitscan sniper counters increasesby 2 or 3 (tested with 150% multishot - Vectis, Rubico and Snipetron), no matter if the target is killed in one bullet or not.

and Komorex behaves the same as Lanka (raises by 1 if killed by the first bullet).

[TeaHawk]

3 minutes ago, Airikr said:

hitscan sniper counters increasesby 2 or 3 (tested with 150% multishot - Vectis, Rubico and Snipetron), no matter if the target is killed in one bullet or not.

and Komorex behaves the same as Lanka (raises by 1 if killed by the first bullet).

To resume:
In case if target survives first shot both hit-scan and projectile rifles behave the same way.
In case if target is dead after single shot, combo counter on hit-scan increases accordingly to multi-shot, whereas projectile weapons combo counter increases only by one.

Is that right?

Also, thank you very much for taking your time and testing it.

Edited August 14, 2019 by TeaHawk

[Tiltskillet]

6 hours ago, TeaHawk said:

1. Projectile travel time is only 200 m/s.

Just for perspective, it appears this might be as fast as unmodded projectiles go.  It's not 100% complete, but according to the wiki the only other weapon projectile to go even that high is the Seer.  And most projectiles are a lot less.

[Tiltskillet]

[ pesky double post ]

Edited August 14, 2019 by Tiltskillet

[(PSN)LoisGordils]

8 hours ago, TeaHawk said:

4. Lanka has reload mechanics.
Charging each shot is insufficient to make your dps drop. To make this even more annoying, you have only 10 rounds and reload mechanics taking 2 seconds and living you only 4 to continue your combo. Amazing.

A literal non-issue considering how absurdly slow the Sniper combo counter decays.

[-VS-Airikr]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb TeaHawk:

To resume:
In case if target survives first shot both hit-scan and projectile rifles behave the same way.
In case if target is dead after single shot, combo counter on hit-scan increases accordingly to multi-shot, whereas projectile weapons combo counter increases only by one.

Is that right?

yes, indeed, brother

[Leyers_of_facade]

mag bubble +  lanka is still a death sentence to most enemies

Lanka has its purpose, it just doesn't do everything great

[Colyeses]

21 hours ago, TeaHawk said:

reload mechanics taking 2 seconds and living you only 4 to continue your combo.

TBF, the whole combo mechanism is perfectly antithetical to snipers in general anyway.

[kgabor]

OP, while you bring up some good points about the low travel time for a sniper and powercreep, no one will take this seriously if you unironically call the Lanka a bad weapon, it's still one of the best weapons in the game, regardless of these flaws.

19 minutes ago, Colyeses said:

TBF, the whole combo mechanism is perfectly antithetical to snipers in general anyway.

But muh 'Enemy at the Gates', it's a well known fact snipers killed whole armies and were literal gods of war and they weren't just rare occurrences, like Simo and other aces.

The only reason armies didn't consist of only snipers was because they feared they would be more devastating than Hydrogen bombs and Hollywood movies and History Channel are obviously the best sources for learning about history. (especially Pawn Stars and Ancient Aliens) /s

[Peter]

Lanka has unfortunately never been a good reference in the world of snipers, it is the famous weapon case that has much damage but loses in all other features (including aesthetics).

I'd love to see a rework on this kind of weapon someday.

[(PSN)NewcastleDisease]

vor 21 Stunden schrieb Chewarette:

Lanka is not popular. A popular weapon is a pre-nerf Simulor Synoid or Tonkor.

depends on your definition of popular... not many run around with a lanka, because in survival etc it will not perform really good.

but it has become a warframe "legendary" weapon on killing higher level enemys beacuse same argument you use: high damage. and thats what makes her popular..

[nslay]

The flight speed complaint would be valid if we were ordinarily sniping targets 100+ meters away. But in normal missions and Eidolons, targets are 10+ meters away where Lanka's flight speed does not matter very much.

The charge does take some time to get used to... But I'm completely fine with it! I was having a blast using it in Interception and Defense with Gas damage. The thing does so much damage and enemies are so low level that the gas procs are still large enough to kill a large clump of enemies even with damage type disadvantages!

My only complaint with Lanka is the outrageous scope zoom. In almost all realistic situations, targets are 10+ meters away, not 100+ meters away! I do not want to see Teralysts's nose hairs for +50% critical chance!

EDIT: In fact, I think I am going to slap Hunter Munitions on Lanka mod'd with Corrosive damage and bring it on my daily 1-2 hour Derelict Survival! I can use it to pick off Ancients.

Edited August 15, 2019 by nslay

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

Isn't Lanka's projectile speed the fastest in the game?

Anyway, I think it would be really great if DE made Lanka's shot hitscan (even if only when charged). Hitting mobile distant targets isn't hard, but we could really do without the whole prediction.

[nslay]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Quantaminum said:

Isn't Lanka's projectile speed the fastest in the game?

Anyway, I think it would be really great if DE made Lanka's shot hitscan (even if only when charged). Hitting mobile distant targets isn't hard, but we could really do without the whole prediction.

At the distances of enemies in normal missions or even Eidolons, you *really* don't need any sort of prediction or leading... Even for mobile enemies! You're probably not going to miss someone 10-20m away with Lanka.

In principle, the flight speed is really dumb on a sniper. In practice, we're really not using any sniper at the kinds of ranges where it matters much! The dumbest aspect about snipers is high scope zooms (like 8x on Lanka) where we don't actually encounter enemies at distances that warrant those zooms outside of open world... In case you were so bored you decided to play open world, archwing close enough to spawn enemies, then fly 100-200m away to snipe everyone at those distances that are not reflective of any Warframe game play... only then does Lanka really suck!

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

5 minutes ago, nslay said:

-Snip-

I guess you're right.

I can't even find a good reason to use Lanka outside of eidolons, except for some Bossfights in a Kuva Flood node, and even then I'd rather take Opticor or some hitscan weapon. Laggy hosts and non-hitscan weapons don't combine as well.

[nslay]

10 minutes ago, (PS4)Quantaminum said:

I guess you're right.

I can't even find a good reason to use Lanka outside of eidolons, except for some Bossfights in a Kuva Flood node, and even then I'd rather take Opticor or some hitscan weapon. Laggy hosts and non-hitscan weapons don't combine as well.

Agreed! I am the same way. 

[TeaHawk]

All right people. I've heard a couple times something about good damage. Well. Would you mind to develop this point?
What do you call good damage? Can you give me numbers and explain how do you achieve these numbers. If you're using a warframe to boost you damage, I want you to explain why Lanka makes a better combination with this frame.

Could you please do this for me?

[nslay]

4 hours ago, nslay said:

EDIT: In fact, I think I am going to slap Hunter Munitions on Lanka mod'd with Corrosive damage and bring it on my daily 1-2 hour Derelict Survival! I can use it to pick off Ancients.

Here's what that solo run looks like with Lanka in Derelict Survival (it's really hard to do this with Revenant!). I mainly used the Lanka to pick off Ancient Disruptors which almost completely nullify Reave's ability to kill anything surrounding the Ancient Disruptor (earlier in game, would also use Danse Macabre which Toxic Ancients/Ancient Disruptors also mess up!). I especially also used Lanka to kill Parasitic Eximus units fast (especially when 5+ Disruptors are around preventing me from Reaving the thing to death! ... or when an Ancient Disruptor itself is Parasitic Eximus!). If you're not familiar with Parasitic Eximus units... being near them drains your energy and they spawn very frequently in Infested missions. You can encounter 1-3 of them at any given moment!

Spoiler

This is what 5x zoom looks like! This is my major gripe with snipers in this game... See that enemy? 7.9m away... Yet, I need 8x to get +50% critical chance to use the Lanka at its full potential! But when will you ever need 8x zoom for anything in this game? Open world? No... not really. I guess you can shoot the drop ships! Bounties won't even begin until you enter a yellow circle area. If you move away from this area to go 100+ m away to make good use of 8x zoom, you're abandoning the objective. You don't need 8x zoom for Survival, you don't need it for Eidolons, you don't need it for Interception, you don't need it for Defense. You do not need 8x zoom. You do not even need 3x or 5x zoom in this game! So here's to +50% critical chance when you can't even tell what you're aiming at anymore! It is really dumb.

Score screens!

Spoiler

Not bad right? Lanka is pretty fun and effective ... It's definitely not a terrible weapon! you just can't really use the 8x zoom and barely use the 5x zoom!

 

Spoiler

Here's the number of Mutagen Samples you can earn when not using a cat or farming frame! Not very many...

And here's the build I used! The Hunter Munitions didn't produce enormous Slash procs like I expected (probably because of Ancient Healers!)... so probably use Vigilante Armaments or Harkonar Scope instead?

Spoiler

I think maybe the Vile Acceleration is what makes the difference. I can definitely see how someone might be annoyed by the default 1 second charge time. It's probably why Opticor Vandal was side-graded with a significantly reduced charge time!

[nslay]

3 hours ago, TeaHawk said:

All right people. I've heard a couple times something about good damage. Well. Would you mind to develop this point?
What do you call good damage? Can you give me numbers and explain how do you achieve these numbers. If you're using a warframe to boost you damage, I want you to explain why Lanka makes a better combination with this frame.

Could you please do this for me?

The scope bonus grants additive critical chance after all mods... So whatever your critical chance is after mods, add +20%, +30% or +50% to it just for using the scope. At 8x zoom, you can achieve more than 100% critical chance unlocking another tier of critical damage!

Lanka has an OK base critical chance of 25%. With Point Strike, that increases to 62.5% which is OK. With 8x zoom, that critical chance becomes 112.5%... so not only does it always deal critical damage when using 8x zoom scope, it can deal the next tier of critical damage (even higher!).

On top of that, its base damage (fully charged) is the highest base damage of all snipers in the game.

Players just don't like the charge mechanic... Having to wait 1 second to be able to shoot and deal the highest damage possible is annoying. It's not as simple as click and the shot is fired immediately. They also don't like that its a projectile weapon. Lanka is a terrible long range sniper because the projectile has a relatively slow travel time! So you will miss moving targets at long range... Luckily, this is Warframe. We're not shooting targets at long range ever! Mostly just 10-20m...

References:

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Lanka

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Critical_Hit#Crit_Tiers

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by nslay
Correct a sentence

[TeaHawk]

6 hours ago, nslay said:

You do not even need 3x or 5x zoom in this game! So here's to +50% critical chance when you can't even tell what you're aiming at anymore! It is really dumb.

You're totally right, but nobody gives a damn! I've recently started a topic about possibility of choosing your own magnification. Almost no one reacted.

 

5 hours ago, nslay said:

The scope bonus grants additive critical chance after all mods... So whatever your critical chance is after mods, add +20%, +30% or +50% to it just for using the scope. At 8x zoom, you can achieve more than 100% critical chance unlocking another tier of critical damage!

Lanka has an OK base critical chance of 25%. With Point Strike, that increases to 62.5% which is OK. With 8x zoom, that critical chance becomes 112.5%... so not only does it always deal critical damage when using 8x zoom scope, it can deal the next tier of critical damage (even higher!).

On top of that, its base damage (fully charged) is the highest base damage of all snipers in the game.

Players just don't like the charge mechanic... Having to wait 1 second to be able to shoot and deal the highest damage possible is annoying. It's not as simple as click and the shot is fired immediately. They also don't like that its a projectile weapon. Lanka is a terrible long range sniper because the projectile has a relatively slow travel time! So you will miss moving targets at long range... Luckily, this is Warframe. We're not shooting targets at long range ever! Mostly just 10-20m...

References:

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Lanka

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Critical_Hit#Crit_Tiers

 

I see. However with Rubico I have 147% critical chace whithout zooming at all. And assuming its insane crit multiplier with 100% chance I have more damage per shot than Lanka with same tier riven. More other, I have more damage with Battacor which is not even a sniper rifle. With rubico I can have 400k dmg per shot with good combo counter and go even further. I like going on high level planes/fortuna and one shot drop-ships before they can even approach. It's beautiful. It's better than fireworks. I've tried the same with Lanka. First, it's hard to hit the ship on a distance due to stupidly slow projectile flight speed and your host having S#&amp;&#036;y internet. Secondly, even if you manage to properly compensate it, damage is so low compared to rubico. That's sad.
Battacor in turn has huge magazine, good firerate, no zoom and alt fire with something around 200k dmg and aoe effect. I mean.... Cmon. The only thing which is good on Lanka is base damage. Some frame abilities take in account only base damage, I assume that. But as a whole, who else cares about base damage, while you're probably building it for 100% crit chance? And then assuming its poor crit miltiplier, it's not that big of a deal.

Edited August 16, 2019 by TeaHawk

[nslay]

6 hours ago, TeaHawk said:

You're totally right, but nobody gives a damn! I've recently started a topic about possibility of choosing your own magnification. Almost no one reacted.

 

I see. However with Rubico I have 147% critical chace whithout zooming at all. And assuming its insane crit multiplier with 100% chance I have more damage per shot than Lanka with same tier riven. More other, I have more damage with Battacor which is not even a sniper rifle. With rubico I can have 400k dmg per shot with good combo counter and go even further. I like going on high level planes/fortuna and one shot drop-ships before they can even approach. It's beautiful. It's better than fireworks. I've tried the same with Lanka. First, it's hard to hit the ship on a distance due to stupidly slow projectile flight speed and your host having S#&amp;&#036;y internet. Secondly, even if you manage to properly compensate it, damage is so low compared to rubico. That's sad.
Battacor in turn has huge magazine, good firerate, no zoom and alt fire with something around 200k dmg and aoe effect. I mean.... Cmon. The only thing which is good on Lanka is base damage. Some frame abilities take in account only base damage, I assume that. But as a whole, who else cares about base damage, while you're probably building it for 100% crit chance? And then assuming its poor crit miltiplier, it's not that big of a deal.

The Lanka does 180% more base damage than Rubico Prime... not even that nice 3x critical damage multiplier (or the scope bonus) on Rubico Prime can make up for that discrepancy.

It's 525 base damage vs 187 base damage.

Any multiplier or multishot applied to these numbers doesn't have any effect on this damage ratio. For example: Serration.

525*(1 + 1.65)/(187*(1 + 1.65)) = 525/187 ~ 2.8

 

Critical damage and scope can narrow it... but not enough

525*4.4/(187*(6.6 + 0.5)) ~ 1.87

Lanka is still doing 87% more damage.

 

But let's say the scope critical damage is additive with 3 prior to Vital Sense (because I'm not sure when it applies).

525*4.4/(187*3.5*2.2) ~ 1.60

Lanka is still doing 60% more damage.

 

Or let's say say the scope critical damage is additive with Vital Sense (again, not sure):

525*4.4/(187*3*(2.2 + 0.5)) ~ 1.52

Lanka is still doing 52% more damage.

 

Or let's say the scope critical damage is multiplicative with Vital Sense (probably not the case)

525*4.4/(187*3*2.2*1.5) ~ 1.25

Lanka is still doing 25% more damage.

 

Give Lanka a comparable Riven to your Rubico Prime and it will smoke Rubico Prime in damage without question. But you want that raw damage? You need to get used to the charge mechanic... especially when you have no room for fire rate mods!

EDIT: Scope bonus is +50%, not +60% critical damage.

Edited August 16, 2019 by nslay