Gauss is not a better Volt. He's a better Valkyr (From a former Valkyr main)

[Jarriaga]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)thegarada said:

Regardless of Gauss being a better Volt or a better Valkyr. Valkyr needs to be a better Valkyr. While I do not think she is terrible, she is seriously out dated. She needs better flexibility and better damage.

Agreed.

[Sharkgoblin]

5 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

No, Arcane guardian does not stack chance. Each Arcane guardian has an individual 20% chance to proc 600 armor (It behaves like Arcane Avenger). It's just that the user interface only shows 1 of them being active.

true its even on the wiki

wtffffffffffffffff i was told it stacked the chance of proccing 

Edited October 11, 2019 by Sharkgoblin

[Jarriaga]

4 minutes ago, Sharkgoblin said:

true its even on the wiki

wtffffffffffffffff i was told it stacked the chance of proccing 

Hopefully it wasn't someone trying to buy an Arcane Guardian for cheap from you.....

Edited October 11, 2019 by Jarriaga

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

38 minutes ago, RX-3DR said:

Defeats the purpose of centering a system about moving around when you can play him exactly like Valkyr, a frame that doesn't have a system that requires you to move around.

I dunno. Having to spam Mach Rush to keep your Redline up was pretty suboptimal. Since the ability itself does very little damage, plus you're not using your weapons while you're zipping about all over the place..

Having melee attacks charge battery is actually really helpful to keep your Redline gauge up while on the offensive. I much prefer to use his 1 as a mobility tool or a way to quickly CC packs of enemies.

Edited October 11, 2019 by (NSW)Ace-Bounty-Hunter

[Jarriaga]

18 minutes ago, Heidi said:

Cant compare Volt and Gauss, Volt can help on deal more dmg with his shields and can be used in Eidelon hunts. 

I was referring to the initial reception and perception threads of Gauss replacing Volt, which only shows the number of people building him for speed and nothing else.

[RX-3DR]

41 minutes ago, (NSW)Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

I dunno. Having to spam Mach Rush to keep your Redline up was pretty suboptimal. Since the ability itself does very little damage, plus you're not using your weapons in the process while you're zipping about all over the place..

Having melee attacks charge battery is actually really helpful to keep your Redline gauge up while on the offensive. I much prefer to use his 1 as a mobility tool or a way to quickly CC packs of enemies.

How about just tweaking the drain rate and charge rate? This particular problem is specifically spawned from the fact that they did 3 things at the same time, they reduced Kinetic Plating's drain, they reduced Redline's drain, and they added battery on melee hit. Large parts would already fixed by reducing the drain and raising the battery gain, which they did although I'd say they did it too much. Without even using melee, with the PC changes, you don't even need to be sprinting to actually build battery during Redline.

Edit : Here's some hardcore gameplay showcase with Gauss and maximizing Redline,

Spoiler

 

 

Edited October 11, 2019 by RX-3DR

[Troposphere6]

12 minutes ago, (NSW)Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

I dunno. Having to spam Mach Rush to keep your Redline up was pretty suboptimal. Since the ability itself does very little damage, plus you're not using your weapons while you're zipping about all over the place..

Having melee attacks charge battery is actually really helpful to keep your Redline gauge up while on the offensive. I much prefer to use his 1 as a mobility tool or a way to quickly CC packs of enemies.

The redline gauge stays at 100% once you get it there so if you don't use any of gauss' gauge draining ablities for the first ten seconds of redline it usually fills quiet quickly at least in my experience the only time I run into trouble with it is when I forget that. 

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

28 minutes ago, Troposphere6 said:

The redline gauge stays at 100% once you get it there so if you don't use any of gauss' gauge draining ablities for the first ten seconds of redline it usually fills quiet quickly at least in my experience the only time I run into trouble with it is when I forget that. 

I am aware of this. But prior to the buffs he got in the latest PC patch (Still waiting for it on consoles), micromanaging his battery truly was a chore. I literally had to spam Mach Rush every few seconds in higher level missions because the drain from Redline and Kinetic Plating was way too high. That meant less time actually killing things overall. And even when I finally reached that magic 100%, I would only be able to benefit from it for about 20 seconds tops with a 278% duration build. It wasn't all that fun.

At least now it won't be an issue and Redline will actually be an enjoyable ability to use.

Edited October 11, 2019 by (NSW)Ace-Bounty-Hunter

[FreeWilliam]

2 hours ago, Jarriaga said:

I see where you're coming from. It's just that as a former Vakyr main, I can not help it but to compare them based on the experience of playing them. The similarities in playstyle with the respective practical application of their buffs are large enough that I can't ignore them.

I actually have the same impression of him.

I play more of a 'Shouty Hugs' build with my Valkyr (Range and Prolonged Paralysis. I've got a 'Mag to the Face' build that uses pull similarly) to summon more mobs to smash, but otherwise am 90% melee-main/RAWRframe 

He FEELS like playing the build I was shooting for with Valkyr sometimes.  

Overall he's a great frame, he just also makes me want some Valkyr fixes ASAP (A toggle or option so we can choose whether to yeet or yoink with ripline and a replacement sound with prolonged paralysis so one of her best tactics isn't 'jump around and scream while driving the party crazy')

[0_The_F00l]

Not agreeing with the comparison with valkyr ,

The only relation would be the speed boost for melee that is common to both.

Every frame can be considered a better or worse other frame from that perspective.

[Jarriaga]

1 hour ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Not agreeing with the comparison with valkyr ,

The only relation would be the speed boost for melee that is common to both.

Every frame can be considered a better or worse other frame from that perspective.

That's fine if you don't agree. To me, the practical implementation of their abilities are directly comparable with regards to playstyle. Mach Rush does what Ripline does traversal-wise (With knockdown as well) plus more. Redline + Kinetic Plating does what Warcry does plus more. Thermal Sunder (Heat first) behaves like Prolonged Paralysis pull. Kinetic Plating by itself can provide Hysteria invulnerability. The only thing he's missing is lifesteal, but then there's Valkyr missing armor stripping.

Some frames have similar abilities. You can compare Frost globe to Gara wall for example. But what about the rest of their kits? Does Frost have a Shattered Lash equivalent or a Splinter Storm Equivalent? Does Gara have an Avalanche equivalent as a wide-area nuke? They are not comparable as whole kits because the similarities between Frost and Gara begin and end with Mass Vitrify and Snow Globe as area defense and nothing more. Gauss on the other hand overlaps with Valkyr so much that he feels like a straight upgrade.

Edited October 11, 2019 by Jarriaga

[(PSN)allfatherthor77]

I cant wait to have those buffs on ps4. With that being said all those buffs do not go against the character. Hitting with a melee weapon is still moving. 

Edited October 11, 2019 by (PS4)allfatherthor77

[Jarriaga]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)allfatherthor77 said:

I cant wait to have those buffs on ps4. With that being said all those buffs do not go against the character. Hitting with a melee weapon is still moving. 

You'll love those buffs. It's like DE wants you to be using Redline at all times.

[FreeWilliam]

1 hour ago, Jarriaga said:

To me, the practical implementation of their abilities are directly comparable with regards to playstyle.

This is what I ran into as well.  I'm using the same buttons in slightly different ways to do basically the same things with him.

Mind you, I'm not complaining at all, it's nice to have the 'RAWR/Smash!' playstyle get more support.  He does feel like a less screamy version of Valkyr sometimes though.

[(XBOX)bigsnake84]

Another melee main enjoying Gauss greatly? Awesome!

He is an amazing frame that compliments my melee style too, and I was using Ash as my melee frame. I'd use Teleports and short duration Smoke Bombs to be hard to hit, and Blade Storm as an extension of my melee. Blade Storm a group over there and slice a group over here.

But Gauss... I can be everywhere with Mach Rush! This really is a big thing for me. I always wanted to move with blinding speed controlled by split second reaction time, but the closest to that before was either speed buff until it's annoyingly slippery, or use something similar to a Teleport. But now I can speed off to wherever, and stop on a dime!

Now I'm not claiming Gauss is a better Ash, that makes no sense at that point, but Gauss is for sure a better frame for me. I actually use all of his abilities and they all use each other in synergy. I enjoy the management of his battery as it encourages my speedy mentality. Even on console right now before his buff.

Great frame! New main!

[JackHargreav]

Gauss is a worse Wisp

[Zekkii]

I came here to say I had the exact same thought process when I built Gauss a couple days ago.  Valkyr isn't weak due to her compatibility with melee, but Gauss does everything she does and more.

[SirTobe]

Gauss is not a raging catgirl tho :D 

But i appreciate the thread. I have been completely uninterested in Gauss so far, but this concept seems more relevant to my playstyle. Might give it a shot next week. 

What keeps me using Valkyr is mostly for Arbitration survivals against infested, since she's not affected by the dreaded leechers with a self sustaining warcry build, got tons of health and armor against slash and toxin, and is just generally fast and agile which is fun. 

[(PSN)Silverback73]

8 hours ago, sleepychewbacca said:

Wait wot. 

I thought Gauss was a better Excalibur. 

Tell me you're pulling my leg. 

Stahpitu.

Gauss is a better Rhino is a better Excalibur is a better Gauss.

Somebody get the rock, paper, and scissors...

Edited October 11, 2019 by (PS4)Silverback73

[(XBOX)ShadowBlood89]

8 hours ago, Jarriaga said:

 

Posted October 1
Gauss Changes & Fixes:
Passive:

• Increased Shield regeneration speed buff from 80% to 120% max.
• Increased Battery charge rate from moving by 25%. Going from 0% to 100% at full (unmodded) sprint now takes 20s vs 25s previously.
• Battery will no longer drain during the Sanctuary Onslaught Zone teleport.
• Gauss Spectres will start with 80% battery.
• Fixed battery gain not taking vertical velocity into account.

Mach Rush:

• Now grants 1% Battery charge per enemy hit during the dash.
• Increased Battery charge rate during continuous run by 33%.
• Can now jump from ground while running (cannot jump in air) without cancelling the dash.
• Added small synergy with Thermal Sunder; running through a bubble will add its damage to your dash and impact burst.
• Fixed the ability screen showing "distance per energy" and unintentionally applying both Efficiency and Duration under the hood, resulting in Energy drain not matching the UI when you had Duration Mods. Changed Energy per meter stat into Energy per second: unmodded Energy drain remains the same, and while speed Mods previously increased Energy drain (more distance covered), they now no longer do. Thus, Energy drain will be either the same or better than before, never worse.

Kinetic Plating:

• Decreased Battery drain from damage by 33%.
• While active, Melee weapon hits will grant a small amount of Battery charge.

Thermal Sunder:

• Increased bubble Duration from 4/6/8/10 to 6/9/12/15.
• Increased minimum radius from 33% max to 50% max.
• Split damage into two stats for Cold vs Heat. Increased damage for Heat mode by 2x.
• Removed Blast damage stat, the Blast will use the damage of the mode you are applying (Cold or Heat) + the additional damage for cancelling the Status.
• Blast Armor removal increased from 0-50% to 0-100%.
• Blast Armor removal will now apply before the Blast damage is dealt, causing it to be more effective.

Redline:

• Increased Redline % gain rate by 33%.
• Increased projectile seek chance from 33% to 50%.
• Decreased passive Battery drain by 33%.

General:

• Added new sounds to Gauss when his Redline is filled and when it has been exceeded!
• Fixed aimglide applying while holding aim with sword alone during Gauss Mach Rush, allowing you to become Zephyr.
• Fixed jumping while using Gauss Mach Rush across water giving you no height, resulting in you getting wet.
• Fixed Slash Status Effects dealing full damage to Gauss while Kinetic Plating is active. Status damage will be determined by current damage reduction at the time the Status occurs.
  
  so you probbily didnt see that he got a pc buff
  an why do so many ppl have to compare other frames to each other
  -,- gauss has a speed based on kinetic energy an volt has speed buff based on electricity
  guass speed is for only him
  volt speed is for any allies in range
  volt, ember, saryn, frost all have the same first ability so why are you not saying any of them are better than each other
  nidus 1 is just a reskined version of frosts 2
  nidus 2 is just less flashy version of vaubon 4
  nidus 3 is just single target equinox day 3
  nidus 4 is just oberons renwal in one spot
  so whats next gonna say saryn is a crappy speed frame compared to volt cause her molt give her a small speed buff?
  
  so in short
  MANY FRAMES HAVE SIMILAR ABILITIES BUT NONE OF THEM ARE MADE TO BE A BETTER VERSION OF EACH OTHER
  so maybe should compare you to one of your relatives an say your a inferior version of them?
  cause thats the logic your using when comparing 2 frames with similar abilities with concept theme that are same but differnt

[Jarriaga]

48 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

an why do so many ppl have to compare other frames to each other

Because they can be compared? You can compare cars. Why can't you compare frames? More so when the new frame felt extremely familiar to my former playstyle with Valkyr. Asking me not to compare them is asking me to willingly ignore my own experience.

48 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

-,- gauss has a speed based on kinetic energy an volt has speed buff based on electricity

That is an irrelevant observation when talking about the buff's practical implementation. That's like arguing a car's top speed in a race was not its true speed when compared to another car because one of them uses fuel and the other one is electric.

48 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

guass speed is for only him
volt speed is for any allies in range
volt, ember, saryn, frost all have the same first ability so why are you not saying any of them are better than each other
nidus 1 is just a reskined version of frosts 2
nidus 2 is just less flashy version of vaubon 4
nidus 3 is just single target equinox day 3
nidus 4 is just oberons renwal in one spot
so whats next gonna say saryn is a crappy speed frame compared to volt cause her molt give her a small speed buff?

so in short
MANY FRAMES HAVE SIMILAR ABILITIES BUT NONE OF THEM ARE MADE TO BE A BETTER VERSION OF EACH OTHER

As posted before: Some frames do have similar abilities. You can compare Frost globe to Gara wall for example. But what about the rest of their kits? Does Frost have a Shattered Lash equivalent or a Splinter Storm Equivalent? Does Gara have an Avalanche equivalent as a wide-area nuke? They are not comparable as whole kits because the similarities between Frost and Gara begin and end with Mass Vitrify and Snow Globe as area defense and nothing more. Gauss on the other hand overlaps with Valkyr so much that he feels like a straight upgrade.

 The practical implementation of their abilities are directly comparable with regards to playstyle. Mach Rush does what Ripline does traversal-wise (With knockdown as well) plus more. Redline + Kinetic Plating does what Warcry does plus more. Thermal Sunder (Heat first) behaves like Prolonged Paralysis pull. Kinetic Plating by itself can provide Hysteria invulnerability. The only thing he's missing is lifesteal, but then there's Valkyr missing armor stripping. 

It's not just one ability that is "similar". It's the entire kit. As a former Valkyr main, it is impossible for me not to compare them when I'm basically playing them the exact same way.

48 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

so maybe should compare you to one of your relatives an say your a inferior version of them?

Nice straw man there, but I'll entertain your idea.

Pick a category or a task. Have us both do it. Can be solving a math problem. Can be a race. If one of us is beating the other one in 9 out of the 10 tasks, then it is fair to say that one is objectively better at said quantified, measured tasks.  

48 minutes ago, (XB1)ShadowBlood89 said:

cause thats the logic your using when comparing 2 frames with similar abilities with concept theme that are same but differnt

You're using the concept as an argument while asking for people to ignore its practical implementation and use as to avoid comparison. You're using a "It's a Ferrari, not Toyota" argument when someone says that they are both cars. You're splitting hairs at that point.

Edited October 11, 2019 by Jarriaga

[Proslackernifty]

So, you're saying Valkyr is bad and Gauss is slightly less bad?  

[Jarriaga]

Just now, Proslackernifty said:

So, you're saying Valkyr is bad and Gauss is slightly less bad?  

That's one way to put it.

[OvisCaedo]

Hmmm. I don't think it's QUITE so clear cut, but I can see where you're coming from on this. I think the issue is mostly just that Valkyr's kit is so narrowly focused that it's very easy for other frames to heavily overlap with it; pretty much all she does is "don't die" and "buff melee". She has some edges on this over Gauss, still, since she does not need to worry so much about toxin or radiation damage, and her attack speed buff can also be shared with allies. Paralysis can also open enemies to finishers, and while you might not often want to actually DO these finishers, enemies being open to finishers does grant a very significant damage buff to regular melee attacks against them.

[Proslackernifty]

17 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

That's one way to put it.

I totally get why people like Gauss.  He's unique and he can be fun to play.  But, until he gets a good augment, I think he's just average.  There are a few things he lacks, like healing, buffing, or CC skill, or a really standout damage skill.  I understand that his fourth is a decent ability, but if his fourth could just buff the group at 50% strength I would give Gauss another try.  I'm hoping for a good augment at this point, and I hope it comes soon.  

As for Valkyr, she needs TLC badly.  Like you said, a good zaw will outperform her claws and it just shouldn't be that way.