Is Grendel ever going to get improved further?

[RS219]

Remember when Gauss received an amazing rework to all his skills, turning him from decent to amazing?

Grendel's changes were mostly bugfixes on the other hand, and a minor tweak or two.

He's got pointlessly low shields, it's hard to tell what buff you'll be getting when casting Nourish, the heal from Nourish needs to be improved (and it'd be great if the buffing radius heals allies too, even if to a lesser degree) and a bunch of other issues that hold him back.

His current passive is completely tied to his 1. A passive shouldn't be reliant on an ability in order to work (or vice-versa in Chroma's case), and should be active on a 24/7 basis. Glutton (the aforementioned passive, +50 armor gained per enemy swallowed) should just be listed as a feature of Feast, and Grendel be given another passive on top of it in relation to his heavyweight theme - heck, I wouldn't mind if it was just a copy-paste of Atlas' own passive (as opposed to only being active if he's doing a heavy attack with the Masseter).

Also, the energy drain should be looked into. Frequent use of his abilities makes Zenurik's energy bubble quite hard to use since the drain halts energy regen - though to be fair Nourished Energy does buff Zenurik's gain rate, but it still forces players to frequently remove enemies to benefit from those.

Edited January 23, 2020 by RS219

[LSG501]

Honestly I can only think of 2 things I'd like to see 'fixed' with grendel, one is the damn vacuum not picking up an enemy due to the smallest of items being in the way.... the amount of times I've tried to suck up an enemy only for it to be ignored due to something that isn't even visible unless I look down is just stupid.    The second is when he's in his ball he just has no power to get up a hill/set of stairs so I'd like him to be given a bit more 'torque'... not that I use this ability much.

As to shields, I'd rather they just got rid of them and gave him a small buff to health, the amount he has are pretty pointless either way and in fact cause issues if you want to run a rage set up. 

A QOL change would be all the abilities function without needing to absorb an enemy but consume the energy instead, yes I know there was a change done to his 4 which was similar to this.

 

 

[(NSW)MoonlightSerenade]

A new passive like the one Atlas has would be good at least he wouldn't lose energy.

He needs his energy drain looked at also. Uses his one to use the rest of his abilities but you cant unless he has food but he drains to fast then you cant use them.

I'm sure others have better ideas than me just wanted to chime in 🙂 

I will say this he is so much fun though I just absolutely adore him.

[Benour]

I would love being able to actually you know HEAL when you devour enemies and let them sit in belly (some heal over time). Buffs are "meh". Passive is pretty much useless.

His only pros is being kinda beefy (with umbrals and stuff he can get over 4k HP iirc). And being able to spit enemies out of tileset.

His devour + 4 combo sounds and looks fun, but i saw literally 0 ppl using it in actual gameplay (or any grendel at all tbh).

He needs some love and tweaking just like hildryn. And as OP said Gauss tweaks were actually very well done i love that frame. Many ppl think Grendel is complete trash also...  Atleast he looks kinda cool LUL

 

Edited January 23, 2020 by Benour

[PsiWarp]

Honestly with Titania's Tribute getting a cycle wheel for any type of enemy you cast it on to get a buff you selected... Grendel should be able to select his Nourished buffs without specific enemy types. You eat, you cast, you get what you need.

[--RV--arm4geddon-117]

His 3 & 4 can just get dumped in a meatgrinder and be totally redesigned.

Nourish armor buff should give ARMOR too ,not just toxin dmg

And his energy consumption on his 1st which is the pillar of his whole kit need to be toned down but like hardcore toned down.

No exponential energy drain increase ( and same should be with ember's 2 ) and 0.25 drain per enemy inside his guts, capped at 2.5 total per second at 175 efficiency.

On a side note all of the sounds he emits while using abilities are the worst and most disturbing ability sounds i've ever heard in 4 yrs of WF...change or remove.

Seriously

Edited January 23, 2020 by arm4geddon-117

[Amadurim]

i use Grendel sometime just for fun. My only concerns are that his 2 is inconsistent and his 4 is so bad it could become one of the least used ability in the game.

As stated above, his passive should be in his 1. 

I play grendel with rage+hunter adrenaline feast/puke playstyle, use 2 occasionally for energy buff and heals, 3 to hit someone behind wall or against corpus/infested and never use 4.

it works well even in sortie level.

The exponential energy drain make this playstyle the best and unique for him, for now, for me.

[Tiltskillet]

2 hours ago, arm4geddon-117 said:

On a side note all of the sounds he emits while using abilities are the worst and most disturbing ability sounds i've ever heard in 4 yrs of WF...change or remove.

Well, for me...

the sounds he emits while using abilities are the best and most disturbing ability sounds in WF...excellent work, DE!

[Aeon94]

Just putting this idea here to hear your thoughts.

 

[Harvey0605]

Grendel is so pathetic that I didn't feel like even maxing its rank.

 

[Aramisaki]

Reposting this from megathread which was in turn reposted from the devstream thread before today's. Maybe I can flesh it out some more with reasons for changes and whatnot.
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1136759-pc-grendel-masseter-feedback/?do=findComment&comment=11322170

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

On 2020-01-23 at 6:03 AM, PsiWarp said:

Honestly with Titania's Tribute getting a cycle wheel for any type of enemy you cast it on to get a buff you selected... Grendel should be able to select his Nourished buffs without specific enemy types. You eat, you cast, you get what you need.

Hard disagree.  quiver style functionality shouldn't be plastered on everything.  It works for Ivara only because Ivara isn't having to use all of her types of arrows at once due to the nature of each arrow.  In every other situation in current WF where we have selectable abilities on a single ability it never comes out good.  Grendel's situation can be fixed via having the amount of enemies in his tummy at the time determine which buff he gets.

 

ex:  1=first buff 2= second buff 3= third buff 4+= all 3 buffs.

This not only thematically fits (as Grendel is an insatiable beast) but also fits into the gameplay loop.  Eating more enemies gives you more armor and more buffs (in my example.)  but you also lose energy faster.

I don't agree with Titania getting the quiver style functionality personally.  But considering really only one of her buffs is really worth it and the fact that I don't have an elegant solution for the ability like I did with Grendel i'm not particularly fussy over it.

[Mu_Gera]

Has anyone tested if the nourish strike buff really gives abilities extra toxin damage? I've tried to test it many times in game but I've never seen a frost proc viral or an ember gas or whatever when I buff them, despite the ability description saying otherwise. That could be another thing they look at, would be great for nourish now that elemental augments don't buff abilities.

Also his passive could heal 50 hp per enemy per second instead of 50 armor, I feel like it wouldn't be redundant if nourish gets better scaling for health and affects allies in radius, and it would offer better survivalbility at low and high number of enemies in grendels gut.

Edited February 1, 2020 by -Bv-Concarne

[Tiltskillet]

Grendel could use more help, but just make the Nourish icons easier to read and Pulverize easier to steer, and I'd be so much happier with him.

 

 

[Xepthrichros]

Grendel is a beast and I use him as an alternative to Mesa. 

And he works great even in sorties with energy limitations. 

[Madway7]

What I'm hoping he gets

 

- Remove his shields and maybe give him a small amount of extra base health

- Passive to be a part of his 1 and be affected by strength mods (maybe change passive to a power str or damage increase based on enemies in his gut or just knockdown/stagger immunity so long as he has at least 1 enemy in his gut)

- More manageable energy drain on his 1 (possibly with an enemy cap)

- Give his 3 more utility such as removing armor (I know enemies in his gut lose armor, this would be a quick % removal rather than a % over time)

- His 3 could also be changed so he would basically get the corrosive equivalent of Chroma's 1 either if you use it without any enemies in his gut (would drain energy/s) or if you hold the button rather than press it (maybe he could full auto or burst shoot out enemies rather than having to press it over and over)

 

20 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

Grendel's situation can be fixed via having the amount of enemies in his tummy at the time determine which buff he gets.

 

ex:  1=first buff 2= second buff 3= third buff 4+= all 3 buffs.

This is a great suggestion for how his 2 could work

 

 

[Tiltskillet]

22 hours ago, (XB1)Knight Raime said:

Grendel's situation can be fixed via having the amount of enemies in his tummy at the time determine which buff he gets.

 

ex:  1=first buff 2= second buff 3= third buff 4+= all 3 buffs.

This not only thematically fits (as Grendel is an insatiable beast) but also fits into the gameplay loop.  Eating more enemies gives you more armor and more buffs (in my example.)  but you also lose energy faster.

Even though it's frustrating sometimes, I like the hunting specific enemies aspect of Nourish so I'd enjoy a combination of your proposal with what we have now.  i.e., we'd still need enemy types to access each buff, but  Grendel could cast multiple buffs simultaneously with the requisite targets in his gut.  For example:

Melee target: Nourish Armor.

Ranged + heavy: both Energy plus Strike at once.

Ranged + heavy + melee: all 3 buffs with every Nourish.

Still much easier to use than now, preserves the hunting aspect, and gives more control than your proposal when I don't care about or actually want to avoid a specific buff.

[Tiltskillet]

Also I'm curious how people would feel about Feast becoming a targeted ability.  Or a kind of hybrid ability, where it requires a target to get started, but eats multiple enemies in an AoE once it meets that criterion. (The pickup vacuum effect could be treated the same way.)

Requiring a target has some disadvantages compared to now, but it would be nice to have more certainty that once Feast is activated it's actually going to eat something.