(PSN)Silverback73 Posted March 29, 2020 Share Posted March 29, 2020 (edited) Our parents set to killing us, their own children, on the Zariman Ten Zero. Rell, once turned, after being the very reason the MITW was held at bay for so long, tried to kill us. How long has our doppelgänger been whispering in our ear? Leading us to the supposed truth of “evil Natah” as Lotus became “the lie.” The Void poisons Sentients. What happens when we wake up and the solar system is in ruins, and there are no Sentients? Only slaughtered innocents and the Lotus looking up at us as the light goes out in her eyes and a Second age of Darkness begins as the MiTW laughs from atop the burning mountain of ash that we created? Is this why we’ve been shown the Duviri Paradox? Because the MiTW wins and we are his instruments of destruction? Is the only way to stop it to go back and make sure it never happens? HIS VERY HAND GUIDES OUR RAILJACK WITH A VOID ENGINE AS IF TO SUGGEST PUPPETS ON STRINGS. Edited March 29, 2020 by (PS4)Silverback73 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samlexicon Posted March 29, 2020 Share Posted March 29, 2020 Don't forget that we are Hypnotically controlled by the Creators of the Universe. The Kavat !!! DE has left that part out as they also live in fear of being tripped whilst going down the stairs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XaoGarrent Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Nah. We're the good guys, and we'll remain the good guys as long as Grineer and corpus leadership remains what it is, and the Sentients can't get over an irrational grudge against a civilization that's long dead. Extreme enemies require extreme measures to combat. Number one rule of conflict: You don't engage your enemies by the rules of your principles. You engage them by the rules of their own principles, thus allowing them to become the architect of their own destruction. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currilicious Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Next time you're in game check your profile and sum up your kills, but exclude the infested (those don't count). That number (anyone that has played for a while) puts us in the genocidal monster category any era in known human history. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)BMWWOW Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 WARNING - Black Mirror (TV show) spoiler!!! I have pondered this theory. We are exceedingly deadly killing machines. You even see the occasional grinner or corpus cowering behind a crate, yet still we wipe them off the map. We go forth and kill because we are told they are evil, and admittedly the Sortie bosses are certainly gorgons in their own right. But what if it's like the Black Mirror episode where the soldiers kill indiscriminately because they are brainwashed to see evil in anyone the government does not like? What if we have been on the wrong side the whole time? Or that we are in between... to the leaders we are toys - mere pawns - in a pathetic battle of egos on a grand scale between leaders who have no right to employ us so? Mere children being taken advantage of for our naiveté'.... Deadly children... asleep in our real understanding of the machinations of these grand egos.... Deadly children.... about to wake up.... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Silverback73 Posted March 30, 2020 Author Share Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, XaoGarrent said: Nah. We're the good guys, and we'll remain the good guys as long as Grineer and corpus leadership remains what it is, and the Sentients can't get over an irrational grudge against a civilization that's long dead. Extreme enemies require extreme measures to combat. Number one rule of conflict: You don't engage your enemies by the rules of your principles. You engage them by the rules of their own principles, thus allowing them to become the architect of their own destruction. It’s not that we don’t THINK we are the good guys...it’s that the MiTW is the great deceiver...twisting the minds of any he encounters to further his own ends. It’s the Second Dream turned nightmare. We wake up to the horror of what we’ve done, but it’s too late. The MiTW laughs... Edited March 30, 2020 by (PS4)Silverback73 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_The_F00l Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 2 hours ago, XaoGarrent said: . You engage them by the rules of their own principles, Then what is the difference between you and them? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuChulainnWD Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Currilicious said: Next time you're in game check your profile and sum up your kills, but exclude the infested (those don't count). That number (anyone that has played for a while) puts us in the genocidal monster category any era in known human history. You do realise that to genocide a people is to remove them completely from existence if possible? The Tenno know when to stop. They have the power to wipe out entire civilisations but they don't. The Grineer, Corpus, Infested, and the Sentients are all hell bent in taking control of the Origin system by any means necessary. The Tenno apply enough force to stop those incursions. Numbers of dead is relative to the time, age and population of said civilisations, and their level of commitment to commit to war. First world War casualties were horrendous in comparison to Second World, War, compared to Korea, compared to Vietnam, compared to Gulf War one, compared to Afghanistan and Iraq. The Tenno are surgical strikes against specific targets, applying enough forces to put a stop to enemy aggression. Evil does prevail when good men stand by and do nothing. Mind if that does make you feel better, go ahead, let the enemies run rough shod over the civilian populations that can not protect themselves. TLDR, learn some history, and learn the meaning of words. They are important. Edited March 30, 2020 by CuChulainnWD 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)UltraKardas Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 46 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said: Then what is the difference between you and them? Quite a bit. Honor on a battlefield is a handicap for the enemy. Somebody who fights dirty, willing to stab in the back or play with dirty tactics has the upper hand on somebody who's morals/principles don't allow them to do that. So you either fight on an even playing field, or the person who has stronger principles gets the honor to die with them. A cheater on steroids is more likely to win after all, compared to their competitors who follow the rules. In battle, there's no judge, umpire, or official to call fowl play or the like. So that's what the Tenno are at this point. Despite what other people have said, The Tenno have not attacked any civilian forces. Military and Military leading personnel only. The Grineer and Corpus has attacked several small colonies, or devastated civilians. The Tenno are ultimately the ones who come to their aid. You can see this in the destroyed Deck 12. Where the Corpus slaughtered their own people and left only ruins. I'm also fairly certain that Inaros, and Gara lived/died protecting settlements under their charge. Worst the Tenno have ever done, is rebel against their creators. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TARINunit9 Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Oh look, it's this thread again On one hand, mercenaries who sometimes fight for the highest bidder. On the other hand, space Nazis, company towns, and bigoted extraterrestrials. Yeah, point goes to the Tenno, thank you 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_The_F00l Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 1 hour ago, (PS4)UltraKardas said: Quite a bit. Honor on a battlefield is a handicap for the enemy. Somebody who fights dirty, willing to stab in the back or play with dirty tactics has the upper hand on somebody who's morals/principles don't allow them to do that. So you either fight on an even playing field, or the person who has stronger principles gets the honor to die with them. A cheater on steroids is more likely to win after all, compared to their competitors who follow the rules. In battle, there's no judge, umpire, or official to call fowl play or the like. So that's what the Tenno are at this point. Despite what other people have said, The Tenno have not attacked any civilian forces. Military and Military leading personnel only. The Grineer and Corpus has attacked several small colonies, or devastated civilians. The Tenno are ultimately the ones who come to their aid. You can see this in the destroyed Deck 12. Where the Corpus slaughtered their own people and left only ruins. I'm also fairly certain that Inaros, and Gara lived/died protecting settlements under their charge. Worst the Tenno have ever done, is rebel against their creators. You miss the point, you highlighted earlier that we employ the same tactics that the enemy uses, but your statements now show otherwise. Ex: The enemy uses the tactics of suppressing the civilian population and exploiting them for personal gain. Civilian population is forced to assist Grineer by scavenging and providing tech. You kill them and reduce the capability of the enemy. Are you if given the opportunity going to do the same? If yes then what you said is suitable and then you are just the same as the enemy just more likely to win. If not then your earlier statement is false. I don't particularly care about the means to end wars, I am fine being called the villain I have no illusions that I am doing things to suit my needs, whether it benefits others is a side effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyshlee Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 I thought that "What if we're the bad guys?!" was the default premise of the game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Silverback73 Posted March 30, 2020 Author Share Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said: Oh look, it's this thread again On one hand, mercenaries who sometimes fight for the highest bidder. On the other hand, space Nazis, company towns, and bigoted extraterrestrials. Yeah, point goes to the Tenno, thank you My point is that the MiTW might be LITERALLY twisting our minds and perception, the entire “Sentient Invasion” a fabrication making us see friend as foe, unwittingly taking over the solar system as more and more Void fissures open to take over and corrupt everything. As likely happened to our parents. As happened to Rell. As might have happened to Natah. The second dream corrupted into a nightmare with us waking to the reality of having killed the Lotus and devasted the system for the MiTW to take over. The MiTW could be ERRA for Natah or “Mother”...what with the same Margulis transference tech that protected us also existing in the Lotus helmet but now also removed. I’ve even entertained the idea that we are actual “children of the Void” that only think we are human because the MiTW needed a physical form in our reality to “birth” us. Suddenly, then, the Duviri Paradox becomes the only way to stop him. Edited March 30, 2020 by (PS4)Silverback73 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swagernator22663 Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Imagine still thinking Tenno are not the bad guys. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swagernator22663 Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 2 hours ago, TARINunit9 said: Oh look, it's this thread again On one hand, mercenaries who sometimes fight for the highest bidder. On the other hand, space Nazis, company towns, and bigoted extraterrestrials. Yeah, point goes to the Tenno, thank you You're a going for a rough awakening my dear summer child. Just don't stop playing once you learn the whole truth about your paragons of justice called Tenno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currilicious Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 3 hours ago, CuChulainnWD said: You do realise that to genocide a people is to remove them completely from existence if possible? The Tenno know when to stop. They have the power to wipe out entire civilisations but they don't. The Grineer, Corpus, Infested, and the Sentients are all hell bent in taking control of the Origin system by any means necessary. The Tenno apply enough force to stop those incursions. Numbers of dead is relative to the time, age and population of said civilisations, and their level of commitment to commit to war. First world War casualties were horrendous in comparison to Second World, War, compared to Korea, compared to Vietnam, compared to Gulf War one, compared to Afghanistan and Iraq. The Tenno are surgical strikes against specific targets, applying enough forces to put a stop to enemy aggression. Evil does prevail when good men stand by and do nothing. Mind if that does make you feel better, go ahead, let the enemies run rough shod over the civilian populations that can not protect themselves. TLDR, learn some history, and learn the meaning of words. They are important. Ah so the end justifies the means. Now that's an argument that gets repeated over and over in history. Oftentimes, an outcome preceded by a sea of red. I guess I would just have to politely disagree. But hey this is fantasy right, it's a game after all. So you are entitled to your own projection of morality or justifications of your in-game actions. No need to piss on mine lol. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)robotwars7 Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 "Everyone thinks they're the hero of their own story" - Handsome Jack (arguably one of the greatest gaming villains of all time). it's never black and white: Villains can do things that are justifiable, and Heroes can be forced to make difficult decisions with unimaginable consequences. I was discussing "Wally" with a friend last night and he reckons a terminator-esque plot to do with time travel could play out here. he reckons Mr. Wall is actually the real physical Tenno that is still trapped within the Planes of Duviri, where the Zariman rests after it's crash, and the Tenno we control is basically their "soul" or Oro or whatever. in Planes of Duviri, we would finally reunite with our physical self, and become whole again. he could be right, he could be talking a load of Pustrels.. either way, we should hopefully get answers when Planes of Duviri becomes a thing (though that's likely not happening until next year now) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuChulainnWD Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Currilicious said: Ah so the end justifies the means. Now that's an argument that gets repeated over and over in history. Oftentimes, an outcome preceded by a sea of red. I guess I would just have to politely disagree. But hey this is fantasy right, it's a game after all. So you are entitled to your own projection of morality or justifications of your in-game actions. No need to piss on mine lol. Who said the end justifies the means? You have moved the goal posts. I said the Tenno by definition have not committed genocide.Words and their definitions matter. Please stop being intellectually dishonest. Even taking out the Orokin, by definition was not a genocide. The Orkin were a ruling elite that were tyrannical to a population. Now if YOU do not like the idea of killing, this is not a game for you. My moral compass is big enough and able to accept that sometimes death and killing are necessary. If anyone is projecting mate it is you. Edited March 30, 2020 by CuChulainnWD 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currilicious Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, CuChulainnWD said: Who said the end justifies the means? You have moved the goal posts. I said the Tenno by definition have not committed genocide.Words and their definitions matter. Please stop being intellectually dishonest. Even taking out the Orokin, by definition was not a genocide. The Orkin were a ruling elite that were tyrannical to a population. Now if YOU do not like the idea of killing, this is not a game for you. My moral compass is big enough and able to accept that sometimes death and killing are necessary. If anyone is projecting mate it is you. Or have I? You seem like a smart bloke. So tell me, even if I blatantly move the proverbial goal posts next to the VAR monitors, does it make my take on my in-game persona wrong? According to your stellar standards no doubt? That steed you're on sure have long legs. My Tenno is a genocidal maniac with a moral compass skewered to the side that pays more. You don't have to like it. No really you don't. But I'm loving it. Edited March 30, 2020 by Currilicious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuChulainnWD Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 Just now, Currilicious said: Or have I? You seem like a smart bloke. So tell me, even if I blatantly move the proverbial goal posts next to the VAR monitors, does it make my take on how I perceive my in-game persona wrong? According to your stellar standards no doubt? That steed you're on sure have long legs. My Tenno is a genocidal maniac with a moral compass skewered to the side that pays more. You don't have to like it. No really you don't. But I'm loving it. Dude, climb off your high horse, you're making yourself look like an Alpha Sierra Sierra. However you wish to project what you do works for you, good for you. The factual in game actions of the Tenno however do not agree with your assessment just by definition alone. Now, if you wish to discuss the Tenno being Slavers now, according to the mechanics of how DE has structured it, that is a different matter entirely. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currilicious Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 1 minute ago, CuChulainnWD said: Dude, climb off your high horse,... Ye see the irony in that statement right? No where have I invalidate your take on your own game whilst you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edyxx Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 What is MiTW? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 I don't think it's an accident that the MiTW appears more the older the operator gets. The question I would have is whether our parents saw him too...I am inclined to think they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILOHARTA Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 the biggest "what if" in the entire game would be: "what if Wally is the good guy?" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuChulainnWD Posted March 30, 2020 Share Posted March 30, 2020 22 minutes ago, ILOHARTA said: the biggest "what if" in the entire game would be: "what if Wally is the good guy?" Or maybe Wally is us? Our older selves projecting through the void, tying in the whole Duvari Paradox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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