Arcane Sure Footed

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

There seems to be no 'Ideas' area to post this so I have put it as a General Discussion.

I think it would be quite nice to have an Arcane Sure Footed. At Rank 1 you get 20% chance to resist knockdown (And stagger?), at Rank 2 40%, Rank 3 60%, Rank 4 80%, until you cap it at Rank 5 with 100%.

With some of my builds they need the extra Mod slot when Arcanes don't matter all that much, and vice-versa.

I also think it would benefit players who can't log-in that often to reach the minimum of 400 days just for the first chance to get PSF. Some people may get the chance to play once or twice a week, some even less, yet play as much as possible. I don't feel they should be at a disadvantage. Once a week to reach 400 days is nearly 8yrs. There could even be people who have played since launch and not reached this.

The regular version only offers 60%. Couple that with Power Drift and you are at 90%, but perhaps using a slot you would rather not waste it on. Adding Fortitude aswell would take you to 110%, but again it is another slot.

I believe the resistance to knockdown & stagger is needed now more than ever with how frequent they have become in this game. Couple that with the all too often offending magnetic procs and you can be rag-dolled with a wonky interference screen. I had it happen with the recent Recall Ten Zero, and it was awful. My Nekros had 20 capped energy so I couldn't summon my minions to prevent this.

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

I don't see why they would make that, primed sure footed already exists 

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

Sometimes I do think, "ah, how nice it would be to be able to fit Primed Sure Footed into the Arcane Slot" - but then again if we did have an "Arcane Sure Footed", I'd also want to fit it into the main build, because sometimes I can spare a mod slot, and sometimes I can spare an arcane slot. So it becomes a moot point unless we have both options available.

And do I expect us to eventually have both a Primed Sure Footed mod and an Arcane Sure Footed? Nope. Seems very, very unlikely.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

5 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

I don't see why they would make that, primed sure footed already exists 

It seems you may not have read the whole Post just the Title, as I have mentioned PSF.

Even going by just the Title, PSF isn't first available until 400 log-in days, and not tradeable as far as I know (If anyone would), so I still feel your comment isn't useful in any way.

[trst]

There's literally an entire feedback section to the forums: https://forums.warframe.com/forum/1219-feedback/

 

As for the idea though there's both no reason for it and DE is very unlikely to add anything of the sort. It's expected for players who play less (once a week is honestly too low for a live service game) to be at a disadvantage, but even then there are alternatives to the mod if they still want the effect. But also DE already considered nerfing the mod, and potentially all similar immunity sources, to remove self staggers. So I can't see them wanting to add a similar effect elsewhere.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

5 minutes ago, (PSN)Hikuro-93 said:

And do I expect us to eventually have both a Primed Sure Footed mod and an Arcane Sure Footed? Nope. Seems very, very unlikely.

Sadly I feel you may be right. But you never know eh. Especially if nobody mentions it and they don't think if it 😉

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

1 minute ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

It seems you may not have read the whole Post just the Title, as I have mentioned PSF.

Even going by just the Title, PSF isn't first available until 400 log-in days, and not tradeable as far as I know (If anyone would), so I still feel your comment isn't useful in any way.

I did read, it's just that it's highly unlikely that they would make an arcane that has literally the same effect as one of the mods.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

2 minutes ago, trst said:

There's literally an entire feedback section to the forums: https://forums.warframe.com/forum/1219-feedback/

Thank you. I wasn't aware that was for ideas, I thought it was for feedback on updates, etc.

2 minutes ago, trst said:

 

As for the idea though there's both no reason for it and DE is very unlikely to add anything of the sort. It's expected for players who play less (once a week is honestly too low for a live service game) to be at a disadvantage, but even then there are alternatives to the mod if they still want the effect. But also DE already considered nerfing the mod, and potentially all similar immunity sources, to remove self staggers. So I can't see them wanting to add a similar effect elsewhere.

Really, nerfing it? Seriously, I play less & less now anyway with all the bad decisions they are making, if they add this in I'm out for good. There is no way I want to deal with the constant ragdoll, mixed in with all the other visual mess they have implemented. Static casting Frames suffer now as it is having to stand still while they get an Ability off and getting hit by Eximus pools under their feet, imagine being constantly knocked down and having it under you. No thanks.

As for your point on the less regular players, I totally see that, you are right there. But then it would be something that benefits even the more frequent players. But as you stated they are thinking of nerfing what is already in the game then that point is void on my part I suppose.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

10 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

it's highly unlikely that they would make an arcane that has literally the same effect as one of the mods.

They have them for Cold, Heat, Toxin. And those are just off the top of my head.

[trst]

3 minutes ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

Really, nerfing it? Seriously, I play less & less now anyway with all the bad decisions they are making, if they add this in I'm out for good. There is no way I want to deal with the constant ragdoll, mixed in with all the other visual mess they have implemented. Static casting Frames suffer now as it is having to stand still while they get an Ability off and getting hit by Eximus pools under their feet, imagine being constantly knocked down and having it under you. No thanks.

As for your point on the less regular players, I totally see that, you are right there. But then it would be something that benefits even the more frequent players. But as you stated they are thinking of nerfing what is already in the game then that point is void on my part I suppose.

The proposed nerf was just removing self stagger immunity as part of combating the overuse of AOE spam. It might not happen with how long its been since it was talked about but, afaik, DE never said it won't ever happen either.

But still players who won't hit that 400 day count still have the option of using regular Sure Footed, using Wyrm with Negate (last I used the mod it counted CC effects as status effects), learning to roll through CC (you get full immunity plus 75% DR for the entire animation), or using a frame/ability that grants it. So having an arcane that does the same thing would just be more redundancy.

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

6 minutes ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

They have them for Cold, Heat, Toxin. And those are just off the top of my head.

Flame repellent and Antitoxin gives you damage resistance to fire and toxin damage.

Arcane resistance makes you immune to the toxin status effect at max rank, it's not the same.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

3 minutes ago, trst said:

The proposed nerf was just removing self stagger immunity as part of combating the overuse of AOE spam. It might not happen with how long its been since it was talked about but, afaik, DE never said it won't ever happen either.

Oh I see. To be honest, I used to get annoyed with people spamming their Bramma about. Especially when they weren't paying attention and it was constantly going off on top of my head. And I myself never was one for massive AoE.

But since the Zariman update Wukong overtook Nekros as my most used Frame. And before then I rarely used him. It was because those missions needed you to be everywhere at once, and quickly, and I play solo outside of Fissures. Then with Cascade it helps to kill the enemies inside the area, and with the new Eximus about, I simply gave my Twin the Kuva Zarr. It was just so much less hassle. And lots of players must have felt the same, because what did DE do... nerf Wukong.

They implement these awful designs, and then punish the players for finding the best & easiest way to deal with them.

Is AoE spamming out of hand still?... Yes. Is it made worse by the design choices of DE?... Definitely.

3 minutes ago, trst said:

But still players who won't hit that 400 day count still have the option of using regular Sure Footed, using Wyrm with Negate (last I used the mod it counted CC effects as status effects), learning to roll through CC (you get full immunity plus 75% DR for the entire animation), or using a frame/ability that grants it. So having an arcane that does the same thing would just be more redundancy.

I wasn't aware of the Wyrm thing. I'll have to look into that. Simaris Mod, right? It rings a bell. My nephew recently started playing a few days ago, so that may massively help him.

13 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

Flame repellent and Antitoxin gives you damage resistance to fire and toxin damage.

Arcane resistance makes you immune to the toxin status effect at max rank, it's not the same.

Ah, ok. I stand corrected then 😃

[Tiltskillet]

31 minutes ago, trst said:

The proposed nerf was just removing self stagger immunity as part of combating the overuse of AOE spam. It might not happen with how long its been since it was talked about but, afaik, DE never said it won't ever happen either.

More recently than re-introducing self damage?  (Which itself wasn't very recent afaik.  The last time I'm aware of was the end of November.)

[BiancaRoughfin]

1 hour ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

There seems to be no 'Ideas' area to post this so I have put it as a General Discussion.

I think it would be quite nice to have an Arcane Sure Footed. At Rank 1 you get 20% chance to resist knockdown (And stagger?), at Rank 2 40%, Rank 3 60%, Rank 4 80%, until you cap it at Rank 5 with 100%.

With some of my builds they need the extra Mod slot when Arcanes don't matter all that much, and vice-versa.

Learn to not use AoE weapons to shoot things at point blank and you wont need even the mod.

[quxier]

I'm against it. Not just because it's powerful or something but such addition give them free ticket to NOT fix something. Big part of Enemies stagger/knockdown has been fixed but imagine having that arcane. You get staggered? Oh just equip this. Such "suggestions" already exist for different aspects of warframe.

[sunderthefirmament]

43 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Learn to not use AoE weapons to shoot things at point blank and you wont need even the mod.

Reductive and inaccurate. Chained CC effects are the only thing I die to anymore, outside of a very rare toxin effect from an unexpected enemy. PSF has more use than just enabling close range AOE weapons. And let’s be real. Allies and summons/companions can move unpredictably enough to make your long range bramma arrow into a close range one.  User error isn’t always to blame. 
 

To the OP, sure. I like your suggestion.  This is coming from a PSF user who skipped it on his first chance because self stagger wasn’t a thing yet, and now uses it on many builds.  I think such an arcane would be more likely to be implemented if the knockdown immunity were conditional, like “5 seconds of knockdown immunity on kill, stacking” or something. Melee kill maybe?  Headshot?  Lol. Knockdown immunity on headshot would just be mean. 

[emmyemi]

2 hours ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

Static casting Frames suffer now as it is having to stand still while they get an Ability off

Is this (partly) why I see people praising PSF so often? Because personally unless an ability FORCES me to go to the ground, as very few do, I'm usually either aim gliding or sliding while casting long abilities. This works with a vast majority of abilities and lets you stay mobile during pretty much any casting animation, even if you normally would be forced to stand still while casting it.

Super useful for staying out of the line of fire while keeping crucial abilities active.

 

As for the topic of the thread, I wouldn't mind having an Arcane alternative to PSF. Or even having one that requires some condition in order to gain the immunity, instead of just giving it to you unconditionally like PSF does. I'm not convinced they would be likely to do this, but I'm not against having more options.

[Pakaku]

It would never happen because, as pointed out, it's already available as a daily login tribute mod (and because of that, they won't add something that can be obtained earlier)

If you want it as an arcane, then it needs to have catches like an arcane does, conditions to activate it and stuff like that. Maybe immune to more than just knockdowns. Doing that would also leave the mod alone as a standalone, always-active Sure Footed mod

[BiancaRoughfin]

19 minutes ago, sunderthefirmament said:

And let’s be real. Allies and summons/companions can move unpredictably enough to make your long range bramma arrow into a close range one.  User error isn’t always to blame.

Because who would bother to look around to have a notion of their surroundings in an action game right?

AoE weapons should be Risk/Benefit, as it currently stands there is no Risk on using them, Self Stagger may be a nuance but its nowhere close to the consequences of a badly planned shot should do. To me, DE removing Self damage was a massive mistake and sparked a bunch of braindead metas.

1 minute ago, Pakaku said:

If you want it as an arcane, then it needs to have catches like an arcane does, conditions to activate it and stuff like that.

A 5~10 second cooldown should do the trick.

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

3 hours ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

There seems to be no 'Ideas' area to post this so I have put it as a General Discussion.

I think it would be quite nice to have an Arcane Sure Footed. At Rank 1 you get 20% chance to resist knockdown (And stagger?), at Rank 2 40%, Rank 3 60%, Rank 4 80%, until you cap it at Rank 5 with 100%.

With some of my builds they need the extra Mod slot when Arcanes don't matter all that much, and vice-versa.

I also think it would benefit players who can't log-in that often to reach the minimum of 400 days just for the first chance to get PSF. Some people may get the chance to play once or twice a week, some even less, yet play as much as possible. I don't feel they should be at a disadvantage. Once a week to reach 400 days is nearly 8yrs. There could even be people who have played since launch and not reached this.

The regular version only offers 60%. Couple that with Power Drift and you are at 90%, but perhaps using a slot you would rather not waste it on. Adding Fortitude aswell would take you to 110%, but again it is another slot.

I believe the resistance to knockdown & stagger is needed now more than ever with how frequent they have become in this game. Couple that with the all too often offending magnetic procs and you can be rag-dolled with a wonky interference screen. I had it happen with the recent Recall Ten Zero, and it was awful. My Nekros had 20 capped energy so I couldn't summon my minions to prevent this.

PSF should be left as a reward for long term players so I'll only be down for an arcane version if, and only if, it is a 600-800 day login reward and still not tradeable. 

[Nekomian]

3 hours ago, trst said:

But still players who won't hit that 400 day count still have the option of using regular Sure Footed, using Wyrm with Negate (last I used the mod it counted CC effects as status effects), learning to roll through CC (you get full immunity plus 75% DR for the entire animation), or using a frame/ability that grants it. So having an arcane that does the same thing would just be more redundancy.

Technically under the "ability" portion you mentioned but I wanted to specifically name this one as I didn't see it anywhere yet - Unairu Poise also exists and grants immunity to slow, stagger, and knockdown effects, at max rank being 40s. It's not time gated by login rewards and can be integrated into any build just by pressing the transference buttons rapidly, no arcane / mod slot or anything necessary.

4 hours ago, (PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er- said:

The regular version only offers 60%. Couple that with Power Drift and you are at 90%, but perhaps using a slot you would rather not waste it on. Adding Fortitude aswell would take you to 110%, but again it is another slot.

As much as it would be a nice QoL sort of thing for an arcane to resist knockdowns / staggers, it really isn't necessary when PSF (and sure footed) is an exilius mod and can be slotted in addition to the rest of the build in most cases (given one has the mod capacity). There's also many other mods that naturally fit endurance builds, like rolling guard, that provide both damage and status immunities, in addition to the explanation of Poise I listed above. I just don't think there's a super high demand for it when we have a ton of different ways to already achieve knockdown and various status immune states (though abilities, mods, and even just parkour), and it would just be competing for space in the arcane pool or provide little use for a lot of builds that could utilize other arcanes in a more efficient manner.

[emmyemi]

I still don't really agree that PSF "needs" to stay as a 400+ day login reward. I understand that they want to reward players for staying, but with how many builds seem to consider the mod to be essential, having it gated behind over a year's worth of logging in (potentially much longer if you ever dare to take a break), I think it's beginning to cause more frustration than anything.

I won't be salty if they decide to move some of the more "essential" stuff, like primed mods, out of the pool and replace them with something else that would be useful—maybe legendary cores or 3-day boosters or something. Just because I had to wait doesn't mean anything really, I'd be fine with players being able to get it sooner.

(And to be clear, I've chosen every other mod so far, lol. I still don't have PSF and I'm not convinced I need it, I'll just be getting it on day 900.)

[(PSN)Joylesstuna]

3 hours ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Learn to not use AoE weapons to shoot things at point blank and you wont need even the mod.

When many primaries are AOE and the game encourages you to use aoe weapons why would you not? Give your head a shake. This is the dumbest counter argument ever.

Edited August 13, 2023 by (PSN)Joylesstuna

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

7 hours ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Learn to not use AoE weapons to shoot things at point blank and you wont need even the mod.

Yeah, ok, because that is the only possible instance in the game where knockdown & stagger can happen 🤔

And I didn't even mention AoE in the original Post for you to get this from, that is you jumping to your own conclusions without actually thinking beforehand. But I see people have already called you out on your comment so I'll say no more.

[(PSN)S1ckS1deSold1er-]

7 hours ago, quxier said:

I'm against it. Not just because it's powerful or something but such addition give them free ticket to NOT fix something. Big part of Enemies stagger/knockdown has been fixed but imagine having that arcane. You get staggered? Oh just equip this. Such "suggestions" already exist for different aspects of warframe.

You know what, this is a very fair point. I totally respect this. Now I kind of don't want it either 🤣 Not that I ever see DE fixing their bad decisions, if anything they seem to be doubling down on them. But you are right, if we have more tools like this at our disposal then they would care even less about player experience.