Could Warframe learn from Dark Souls?

[(PSN)CaptainIMalik]

I think they really could. Maybe there's some inspiration but I think they could benifit a lot from Dark Souls. From bosses to a lot of things. Dark Souls has good bosses, DE could take things like that.

 

Imagine invading other peoples worlds lol.

[Heckzu]

Dark Souls is meant to be a single-player RPG where you play as a mediocre character struggling to survive through Hell.

Warframe is a co-op TPS where you play as an overpowered war machine.

Exactly what would you think you implement from Dark Souls into Warframe without it ending up just as easy or boring as the regular content we have?

[taiiat]

you haven't explained anything you think is valuable for Warframe to perhaps take inspiration from.
anything.

not very useful feedback therefore........

[(PSN)CaptainIMalik]

4 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

Dark Souls is meant to be a single-player RPG where you play as a mediocre character struggling to survive through Hell.

Warframe is a co-op TPS where you play as an overpowered war machine.

Exactly what would you think you implement from Dark Souls into Warframe without it ending up just as easy or boring as the regular content we have?

Well they can look at the bosses at Dark Souls and sort of see what makes them fun.

 

I think I have seen a boss that has 'phases' just like Dark Souls but they I don't think the bosses are engaging enough in my opinion. I don't really care much about fighting them as in I want to fight them in a way to phrase it. I just want to skip through 

 

I think the Final Boss at Dark Souls 3 is a good example of how to make a boss fun

 

Edited November 29, 2016 by (PS4)CaptainIMalik

[probably_absent]

I think one thing DE could really learn from Dark Souls is how Dark Souls tells lore. DE is already doing this to some degree, but imagine if every weapon had some little blurb that came with it about who made it, or who uses it, or just anything vaguely related to it. It wouldn't be too difficult to implement, since its only text, and it would to tons for the world-building.

[UrielColtan]

There are many game bosses DE could learn from, Dark Souls is good but has much less emphasis on shooting and is bit slower paced, not that some concepts from the game couldn't be sped up for good measure, as Bloodborne did in a fairly modest way.

Either way DE needs to ditch the invincibility states of bosses, also less locked off new bosses. It's not a good way to stall for new content, as people eventually forget about said bosses or only do them until they get whatever item they have and never again because they are so unfun to get to and to fight. Making all that work go to waste. Fun replay value is a better staller than prioritizing stall mechanics specifically.

Edited November 29, 2016 by UrielColtan

[Brasten]

13 minutes ago, (PS4)CaptainIMalik said:

Imagine invading other peoples worlds lol

No. Just flat out no.

If that's all you think when you think Dark Souls in other games you need to take a deeper look at how those games are designed and what OTHER THINGS can be drawn from them.

The Bosses are kind of a good point, however they are hampered by the Co-Op nature of Warframe and the Peer Hosting. Most of Souls/Born games get wanky when you get bring in Co-op people, especially due to latency issues.

If you want a starting point for suggestions there, you should look at Stat and Enemy scaling. Which Warframe could really use more of. The Souls games have almost as many weapons as Warframe does at this point. Although you also start to see that scaling break down as you get into the really high New Game+ zones, which is where Warframe's level 100+ Enemies live as well.

Edited November 29, 2016 by Brasten

[(PSN)CaptainIMalik]

1 minute ago, Rayven71 said:

I think one thing DE could really learn from Dark Souls is how Dark Souls tells lore. DE is already doing this to some degree, but imagine if every weapon had some little blurb that came with it about who made it, or who uses it, or just anything vaguely related to it. It wouldn't be too difficult to implement, since its only text, and it would to tons for the world-building.

 

This is true. Dark souls keeps the lore vague or open to interpretation, you're just put into a place and know nothing about it. It makes you want to know what's going on. DE is doing this to a degree I'd say so far playing this, adding lore to every weapon would sort of be like a treasure in finding lore to a place I guess to say.

[Zhoyzu]

if you want dark souls go play dark souls.  there is no reason to try and copy other games simply because you cant be bothered to load up the other game.

[(PSN)CaptainIMalik]

3 minutes ago, UrielColtan said:

, as people eventually forget about said bosses

I forgot who Alad V was when playing Second Dream until I asked my friend

 

3 minutes ago, Brasten said:

No. Just flat out no.

If that's all you think when you think Dark Souls in other games you need to take a deeper look at who those games are designed and what OTHER THINGS can be drawn from them.

The Bosses are kind of a good point, however they are hampered by the Co-Op nature of Warframe and the Peer Hosting. Most of Souls/Born games get wanky when you get bring in Co-op people, especially due to latency issues.

If you want a starting point for suggestions there, you should look at Stat and Enemy scaling. Which Warframe could really use more of. The Souls games have almost as many weapons as Warframe does at this point. Although you also start to see that scaling break down as you get into the really high New Game+ zones, which is where Warframe's level 100+ Enemies live as well.

 

I was sort of joking with the invasion thing

[WindigoTG]

There's nothing to learn from the Souls.

There's plenty to learn from the Warriors though.

[(XBOX)Woofsie]

As someone who has been part of the Soulsborne community from the get go, I wholeheartedly approve of this. From learning to give little lore blurbs per weapon, or improving bosses (as difficult bosses are hard to come by in Warframe) I completely approve.

[UrielColtan]

Maybe with the first game working connection was the case at times, but coop in later Dark Souls or Bloodborne experiences no worse issues than Warframe does. The only major difference is people can't randomly coop with you by way of a "public" function, and its level based coop.

Edited November 29, 2016 by UrielColtan

[(PSN)mr_chainsaw555]

26 minutes ago, (PS4)CaptainIMalik said:

I think they really could. Maybe there's some inspiration but I think they could benifit a lot from Dark Souls. From bosses to a lot of things. Dark Souls has good bosses, DE could take things like that.

 

Imagine invading other peoples worlds lol.

jesus christ will people ever shut up about how much warframe should be like dark souls? they are two completely different horses and it should stay that way, i don't want to die over and over again by a goddamn drahk just because someone was a dark souls fanboy and wanted to cram that BS into everything

[(XBOX)Woofsie]

1 minute ago, (PS4)mr_chainsaw555 said:

jesus christ will people ever shut up about how much warframe should be like dark souls? they are two completely different horses and it should stay that way, i don't want to die over and over again by a goddamn drahk just because someone was a dark souls fanboy and wanted to cram that BS into everything

Mate, he had an idea he wanted to share. Calm down.

[Marvelous_A]

The only thing I want DE to learn from DS is how they write the story. In DS you can find lore not only through character lines, but also in location design and item descriptions. DE used to write meaningful codex e.g. codex of Ember Prime and synthesis, but they are lazy these days, remember the codex of Nekros Prime, "Death's new master" - even shorter than Nekros' codex, that's a whole new level of laziness TBH.

[Kaotyke]

Well, play Sorties without Redirection, Vitality and Steel Fiber (No mods at all really), no Gear or Companions, only use the first power, Solo and use melee only.

Spoiler

Prepare to Die

 

Edited November 29, 2016 by Venom-Snake

[(PSN)mr_chainsaw555]

Just now, (XB1)Woofsie said:

Mate, he had an idea he wanted to share. Calm down.

you try having this kind of BS preached to you to no end, droning on about how warframe should be like *insert game of the week* like your parents moaning to you about why you should be more like your overachiever brother/sister

Just now, Marvelous_A said:

The only thing I want DE to learn from DS is how they write the story. In DS you can find lore not only through character lines, but also in location design and item descriptions. DE used to write meaningful codex e.g. codex of Ember Prime and synthesis, but they are lazy these days, remember the codex of Nekros Prime, "Death's new master" - even shorter than Nekros' codex, that's a whole new level of laziness TBH.

dark souls has lore so godamn convoluted, it makes kingdom hearts and metal gear look simple by comparison, it was at the point that the devs were giving a cash prize to whoever can make sense of it (which still hasn't been claimed yet mind you), yeah, lore i need several encyclopedias to get a basic understanding for will totally enthrall me

 

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

Yes, especially with status procs

[Voltage]

1 hour ago, Venom-Snake said:

Well, play Sorties without Redirection, Vitality and Steel Fiber (No mods at all really), no Gear or Companions, only use the first power, Solo and use melee only.

  Reveal hidden contents

Prepare to Die

 

don't forget the Dragon Key and only using W without Bullet Jump slide or roll ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[ElGuirrix]

From Souls I'd say just give items some sort of description, in their codex entries at least, that speak of the weapon itself and manufacturer/s, purpose and users, all in a more secondary plane to the game's main storyline. Perhaps only make warframes and their prime variants have more plot related information, like older ones have, and maybe prime weapons speak of their origins and how later they researched them to make the regular variants.

This way DE can easily create some random corpus corporation or laboratory that researches and produces X type of weapons, give in the background of some random important person and through him/her, more background to the faction instead of just ugly clones and greedy milks.

Also maybe bring back the global synthesis targets on a monthly basis perhaps but being completely personal instead of server-wide to unlock the info.

[BulletsforTeeth]

2 hours ago, (PS4)mr_chainsaw555 said:

you try having this kind of BS preached to you to no end, droning on about how warframe should be like *insert game of the week* like your parents moaning to you about why you should be more like your overachiever brother/sister

dark souls has lore so godamn convoluted, it makes kingdom hearts and metal gear look simple by comparison, it was at the point that the devs were giving a cash prize to whoever can make sense of it (which still hasn't been claimed yet mind you), yeah, lore i need several encyclopedias to get a basic understanding for will totally enthrall me

 

Dude, calm the hell down. DS may not be your cup of tea, but there are a few things it's good at. The lore itself may not be good, but HOW it's told is. Just little lore bits that you can find anywhere, everywhere. Consistancy is important yes, but that doesn't diminish the method.

I don't particularly like DS either, but it does a couple things right. He's not asking to turn WF into a DS clone, but to take a look at what other games do RIGHT and try to learn from such.

Also, read the title. Titles are important. This one says what could warframe LEARN from DS. Not "WarFrame should BE Dark Souls, the multiplayer game". If you can't do that, and calm down, loosen up, my suggestion is to take a MASSIVE chill pill, cuddle something soft or whatever and water down the salt so it doesn't dessicate everything in a 10 mile radius.

Edited November 29, 2016 by BulletsforTeeth

[xFrostKnightx]

There's nothing you could learn or taken from Soul series. Game pacing is different, unlike Warframe almost everything has a chance to kill you and there's no over powered mechanics. While lore hints on items might be a good idea, it's a old suggestion and de keeps making small edits and changes to the lore so i don't see them making anything significant concrete. 
Destiny or Dragons Dogma would be good places to mess around with making enjoyable and fullfilling fights but with how overpowered frames are plus weapons it makes such options to make these things happen really unlikely as the mechanics of Warframe directly go against that flow. 

They however could take examples with making the world and npcs feel alive rather than being static events but the few times they've done so they've dumped it. Kuva missions are the closest we have to feeling like something is happening in the universe. Aside from 5minutes total of text from some quests total, we have nothing about the world on corpus and grineer besides "kill/bad/evil", the closest you have to corpus worlds/settlements are just what you learn from darvo and it just seems like grineer exist for no other purpose than to boss everyone around. 

Pretty much warframe feels like a boxed in experience. It dosn't feel open, even relays are compact and claustrophobic. It's more like being told "do this", there's no freedom or flexibility besides the player personally saying "no" just to feel like they actually have a choice, but that just limits game content. TWW is an example we thought we'd get the first taste of choice, but it was just an illusion and was actually just a moral compass. Something even a web game from the 2000's like adventure quest did, it's not new or amazing and given how they spoke about it on dev stream it sounds like it won't impact the story the way we want it to and simpily have very very minor differences if you go "evil" or "pure". 

Edited November 29, 2016 by xFrostKnightx

[Evanescent]

I think animation and weapon design wise, there's a lot to learn from Bloodborne.

Each weapon in BB feels unique, from design to animations to function. When you use a motherf***ing hammer, you really FEEL that mother f***ing hammer. You feel the power. Enemies you hit react in a way that's satisfying and reinforces the power of your weapon. From how the character animations alter to show that weight to how it affects enemies and the world, it's made clear that this huge weapon really is huge, and it's powerful. Then when you use the threaded cane, it's a different experience-it's light and fast. Completely different in how it cuts enemies and how it handles. Then you have madness in the form of the whirlygig saw. Wat. Yes. YES PLEASE.

Weapons in Warframe have a pleasing aesthetic, but in terms of handling and enemy feedback they aren't there yet. It doesn't feel good when you spin the heavy Fragor prime like a toothpick and enemies shrug off blows that should be crushing them. They don't react to your cuts or your strikes as they should, and your weapons aren't convincing in their weight and handling, which often breaks the immersion.

[(PSN)mr_chainsaw555]

2 hours ago, BulletsforTeeth said:

Dude, calm the hell down. DS may not be your cup of tea, but there are a few things it's good at. The lore itself may not be good, but HOW it's told is. Just little lore bits that you can find anywhere, everywhere. Consistancy is important yes, but that doesn't diminish the method.

I don't particularly like DS either, but it does a couple things right. He's not asking to turn WF into a DS clone, but to take a look at what other games do RIGHT and try to learn from such.

Also, read the title. Titles are important. This one says what could warframe LEARN from DS. Not "WarFrame should BE Dark Souls, the multiplayer game". If you can't do that, and calm down, loosen up, my suggestion is to take a MASSIVE chill pill, cuddle something soft or whatever and water down the salt so it doesn't dessicate everything in a 10 mile radius.

while he isn't saying waframe should be DS, i've seen where this kind of thinking leads to, and it usually leads to a complete bastardization of the original game, having little of it's old personality , for examples, games like the joy of creation: reborn, which is just a slender clone with a FNAF paint job, and resident evil 7, which is more generic indie horror game than classic resident evil

take a look at a game like fallout 4:

while i prefer the elder scrolls (oblivion's "shivering isles" main questline being the best thing to come out of the series) , i can still respect the following the fallout series has (not to mention the absolutely awesome modding community bethesda games have), but unfortunately, with people preaching some variation of "omg why can't bethesda be more like bioware or cd projekt red, aggghhhhh!!!", we eventually got fallout 4, which replaced the freedom when roleplaying and a deep character skill and perk system with a modified version of the plot of taken, the inabilty  to really deal with a lot of situations without a shootout ensuing, and an oversimplified skill system (if you can call it that)

you see, we should focus on what a games does successfully, not just have a game fill some arbitrary quota or answer the question "do you have what this other game has?", i'm not against a game evolving, but if evolution means shamelessly taking things from other games and lose what made it great to begin with, then count me out