Khora exalted whip, please don't!

[(PSN)watt4hem]

There's always the option to not make the exalted weapon a toggle, like ivara's 1st and gara's glass lance thing

[FelisImpurrator]

1 hour ago, Mudfam said:

This mostly works for Artemis Bow, or Peacemaker (yuck), but exalted melee is in a bad spot when it comes to modding. Excalibur's Exalted Blade is somewhat of an exception, because it introduces a more unique gameplay mechanic and becomes very powerful with the augment alone, however it still makes good regular melee builds out of the question. Mainly for me the gameplay being reduced to swish swish swish swish swish swish swish swish swish is a huge no.

Of course it's all subjective, I mean, some people like World on Fire... I personally strongly dislike all exalted weapons and how they replace all my chosen weapons in one go, while also locking me out of other gameplay features. Modding aside, I think exalted weapons are generally in direct conflict with warframe's most important gameplay features rather than complementing them.

How is it bad? I take my regular melee build, lose maybe one mod, still deal tons of damage. And I combo with EB when I (rarely) use it. I can use a mod like Dispatch Overdrive without any issues. What's the big deal? Melee is so loaded with power mods that losing one doesn't make a huge difference.Two maybe, but drifting contact adds status chance. What, precisely, are these mods that are supposedly so good and nonfunctional on exalted weapons?

[Flandre_Scarlet_]

1 minute ago, (PS4)watt4hem said:

There's always the option to not make the exalted weapon a toggle, like ivara's 1st and gara's glass lance thing

That would ruin the purpose of the skill, wouldn't it? While Gara's Glass Sword was kind of cool, it didn't feel as satisfying like Exalted Blade.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

to be fair, when we think of Whips we think of an Atterax being flung around cutting up everything in sight. her Exalted whip may have other utilities, such as grabbing enemies and Disarming them or pulling them towards you, or being used like Rip Line as a means of getting around. essentially the Indiana Jones way of whip usage.

it's not an original idea, but if it has something that separates it from all the other exalted weapons, I'm all for it. if not, then it's just another frame with an Exalted Weapon, which I can live with.

[aligatorno]

So far, the only underwhelming exalted weapon is Wukong's , mostly because of its damage type, scalability and stance. Considering that we don't know too much about her abilities besides her being able to summon a kavat and being able to change the IPS of her whip together with her appearance, there's no point in crying wolf as of yet. 

Artemis Bow, Dex Pixia, Exalted Blade and Peacemaker are god level. 

Hysteria is decent level. 

Primal Fury is meh. 

I wouldn't count Gara's 1 as an Exalted weapon just because it takes melee mods in consideration, just like I wouldn't count Atlas's fists as one for the very same reason. 

[Mudfam]

*sigh*

I was pointing out some things that are already widely considered problematic by the community.

Exalted weapons can certainly be viable, even overpowered in some cases. My issue is with how restrictive they are in terms of gameplay.

Weapons and Warframes to me are separate things, part of creating builds, synergies and unique gameplay strategies. Replacing all your weapons with one very specific weapon is not an acceptable mechanic in my opinion.

To me abilities should always be utility things that synergise with existing gameplay features in an active capacity. Replacing huge chunks of the gameplay and making them redundant rather than complementing then is not something that interests me.

I like to use all tools at my disposal in concert, discover and experiment with new ways to circumstantially use and synergise our arsenal. There are many abilities that are not condusive to this, however for me exalted weapons are by far the worst offenders, as they bluntly replace my entire arsenal and roughly remove core gameplay options (and yes, on top of that they even restrict important modding options).

This is my opinion and my preference. Perhaps you are happy with playing the game in a strictly predefined way, I think it's a pointless limitation that can be avoided without taking anything away from anyone. There are whips in the game, almost 100 melee weapons to choose from, and stances, and abilities that complement them. I don't understand the need or motivation for exalted weapons in their current form. I don't think this trend should continue in its current form.

[FelisImpurrator]

2 minutes ago, Mudfam said:

*snip for length*

Again, I asked you a question: What are all of these mods supposedly made unusable by exalted weapons? Maiming strike I don't care for, it's just a heated cheese knife. Blood rush is powerful, but again, the exalted weapons can survive having it slotted.

What part of these "replace" gameplay? They're toggles. You can literally turn them off with the press of a button. The only one I really dislike is Hysteria because of its long animation and the fact that I don't like straight up invulnerability, but that's specific to Valkyr. Press 4 again and your entire arsenal is back. I treat them as a fourth weapon that has (usually) unique mechanics and enough raw power that it doesn't matter whether all my mods register on them or not... and dip in and out of them for a few seconds at a time, because my builds tend to be for every other aspect of the kit with the weapon being a bonus. So hey, free Melee 2 slot, and all the others usually take only as long as the regular weapon swap animation.

[zornyan]

3 hours ago, Mudfam said:

First off hats off for the aesthetic of this warframe. I'm very hard to please, I dislike the design of many warframes, particularly newer ones, so much that I'll never play them. This looks really great, I'm impressed.

 

Exalted weapons however are just bad. Rolling a frame and weapon into one is a terrible idea, it basically just removes our choice of playstyle and weapon, which are immesurably important. Exalted melee weapons are also vastly inferior to regular melee, because they don't have access to the mods which makes melee weapons good in the first place, and you know, rivens.

I'm further concerned because the frame also has an ability which is a "summon", which also lacks interactivity. This leaves us with just 2 abilities that potentially support the mix of powers, gunplay and melee which makes Warframe gameplay so good. Chances are it won't be enough.

I beg you to reconsider. Give us abilities that have an active role in the gameplay, and don't define how we play. Exalted weapons in particular are extremely restrictive and tend to hugely simplify the otherwise diverse, synergy and option rich Warframe gameplay that makes it special.

 

Exhaulted weapons are also the best in the game.

 

my val kitty slide attack one shots a fully armored lvl 150 bombard (no other melee can do this) 

 

my excal can butcher entire corridors of high level mobs far quicker than any weapon could pray to do.

 

mesa’s peacemakers are by far the strongest ranged weapon in the game.

 

Only wukongs staff is a bit lacklustre in comparison. But as it stands the current exalted weapons are the top of their class.

[Anthraxicus]

Considering this frame will be able to summon kavats, apparently, can we give her Oberon's passive and get something good for him in return?

[Azamagon]

3 hours ago, Mudfam said:

To me abilities should always be utility things that synergise with existing gameplay features in an active capacity. Replacing huge chunks of the gameplay and making them redundant rather than complementing then is not something that interests me.

I can respect this opinion, and I partially agreed (as you could maybe tell from my previous post in here).

But, how would you implement the features that they currently contain, without relying on Warframe-weapon abilities?

Like I already showed:
 

• Exalted Blade could be a melee weapon empowerment, so it adds Bladewaves to any melee used. That's probably the easiest one to "fix".
• Artemis Bow could be made into a ranged weapon empowerment, so it adds horizontal multishot (but with damage reduction, to reduce extreme power) to any ranged weapon.

However, I consider the following tougher to deal with:

• Part of Wukong's design IS his staff. It's kinda hard to disconnect that from him. Sure, you could make it so his ulti empowers ANY melee weapon he wields to grow in range with the melee combo counter (including his Iron Jab). But that's... kinda not how he works. Unless you maybe buff Iron Jab into something more similar to Gara's Shattered Lash, making it a more complimentary melee skill (like Atlas' Landslide), rather than giving him an all out "meleemode" ultimate (which is then a more generic meleerange buffer, among something else?).
• Hysteria could simply be what it is, but letting you use your own melee weapon. The claws are a problem though, but I guess they could become an actual new weapon, as a "signature" weapon for Valkyr (like Tekko for Atlas etc)? But still, I hardly see that happening as the claws are a part of Valkyr, so it's hard to justify this change imo.
  EDIT: Something that could be done is to make Valkyr's Claws a skin for all Claw-weapons, then give all Claw-weapons the same spin-attack as Hysteria currently has (and maybe tone it down a notch), while possibly also making another Claw-stance, based on Hysteria's current moveset.
• Peacemaker feels like an ability, imo, due to the "turret" mode it does, along with the very different aiming. How'd you change this?
• Titania's melee is probably REALLY difficult to program around, so I'd let it be as it is. Or, maybe the melee button could deal with her Razorflies? However, the ranged weapon (Dex Pixia), I don't really see why it couldn't just be using the shrunk version of your own gun, similar to Skywing? Maybe the shrinking is the actual issue?
• Atlas' Landslide is a pseudo-exalted weapon (and so is Excalibur's Slash Dash btw), so I think this (and Slash Dash) is fine.
• Gara's Shattered Lash (and Mass Vitrify) are in a very similar boat to Landslide and are fine, imo.
• Ash's Bladestorm is even LESS of an "exalted weapon" (only affected by attackspeed mods), so I'd let this one pass too.

 

Edited November 4, 2017 by Azamagon

[Mudfam]

14 minutes ago, FelisImpurrator said:

Again, I asked you a question: What are all of these mods supposedly made unusable by exalted weapons? Maiming strike I don't care for, it's just a heated cheese knife. Blood rush is powerful, but again, the exalted weapons can survive having it slotted.

Weeping wounds, Blood Rush, Maiming Strike, Body Count, Drifting Contact, all weapon augments, Rivens...

 

14 minutes ago, FelisImpurrator said:

What part of these "replace" gameplay? They're toggles. You can literally turn them off with the press of a button. The only one I really dislike is Hysteria because of its long animation and the fact that I don't like straight up invulnerability, but that's specific to Valkyr. Press 4 again and your entire arsenal is back. I treat them as a fourth weapon that has (usually) unique mechanics and enough raw power that it doesn't matter whether all my mods register on them or not... and dip in and out of them for a few seconds at a time, because my builds tend to be for every other aspect of the kit with the weapon being a bonus. So hey, free Melee 2 slot, and all the others usually take only as long as the regular weapon swap animation.

They are toggles that replace / disable gameplay. Even when a toggle functions as you describe, I already have 3 weapons that I can choose myself, I don't want a 4th fixed weapon, I want an ability to use together with all and any weapon.

Regardless, the exalted weapon mechanic is that of replacing a customisable arsenal with a premade character in the style of a beat-em-up. One thing that keeps me playing the game after all these years is the endless options, the ability to constantly explore new builds and strategies. Having a prepackaged solution like this seems contrary to the very essence of warframe. The other thing that keeps me playing is the unique mix of varied gun & blade, high mobility gameplay. A new exalted weapon is something I will explore briefly, but it will not keep me engaged for any length of time.

[Marvelous_A]

"Exalted weapons are inferior to regular melee "

While it's true that some mods don't work on exalted weapons all of them have innate special effect or very good stats, or both. I'd compare my EB to any regular or "OP" melee at anytime. And all warframes that have exalted weapons have abilities which can further enhance their exalted weapons.

And please....spoiled players. A weapon not being OP with OP mods doesn't mean it's weak. You can live without BR and MS, and live a good life. We wouldn't have found out many good guns if not our Tonkor and Simulor were taken from our hands.

Edited November 4, 2017 by Marvelous_A

[texrei]

I dreamed about exalted whip, i also dreamed about spider-themed warframe. Kavats are cute, free kavat + my huras kubrow is double cute, Khora looks nice, what else could i wish?

[Mudfam]

8 minutes ago, Azamagon said:

<snip>

You make some good points and suggestions. Personally I'd simply abandon the trend of exalted weapons in future warframe designs, but your suggestions make sense to me. I usually don't see the reason to entirely replace weapons or common gameplay systems when instead they can be augmented, some of these are just standalone mechanics that don't really have anything to do with weapons, the exalted weapons sometimes seem like an unsipired tack-on rather than an actual ability.

 

8 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

While it's true that some mods don't work on exalted weapons all of them have innate special effect or very good stats. I'd compare my EB to any regular or "OP" melee at anytime. And all warframes that have exalted weapons have abilities which can further enhance their exalted weapons.

As I mentioned previously EB is extremely powerful due to the augment, and it behaves in a unique way. In general I don't care for melee exclusive play, which is one of my huge issues with exalted melee. While I don't personally care for it, the mods which exalted melee excludes are those that make it most powerful, above all allowing it to scale far beyond where other weapons can go on their own. Not my cup of tea, but it is an issue for some.

[Marvelous_A]

1 minute ago, Mudfam said:

As I mentioned previously EB is extremely powerful due to the augment, and it behaves in a unique way. In general I don't care for melee exclusive play, which is one of my huge issues with exalted melee. While I don't personally care for it, the mods which exalted melee excludes are those that make it most powerful, above all allowing it to scale far beyond where other weapons can go on their own. Not my cup of tea, but it is an issue for some.

They don't work on exalted weapons for a reason. If they works, these warframes will be extremely powerful and what followes would be salty players. For the sake of these players EB has been nerfed a couple of times...so just keep it this way. If you don't like this kind of play style...well these frames aren't for you then which is not a problem at all. Out of 34 warframes only 3 or 4 of them are built around their exalted weapons.

[Mudfam]

50 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

They don't work on exalted weapons for a reason. If they works, these warframes will be extremely powerful and what followes would be salty players. For the sake of these players EB has been nerfed a couple of times...so just keep it this way. If you don't like this kind of play style...well these frames aren't for you then which is not a problem at all. Out of 34 warframes only 3 or 4 of them are built around their exalted weapons.

Yes, and I don't really care either way. This is not an issue for me personally, only perhaps in that it makes the builds less diverse and interesting for me, which in itself I do consider important. In this respect it's not lack the certain mods that bothers me, but rather the lack of diverse modding options and the exclusion of related gameplay systems.

But my fundamental overriding problem is with disabling all my chosen weapons, in having to use a specific weapon to take advantage of a warframe. It's not a circumstantial ability with varied applications, it's switching into a separate more restrictive gameplay system, removing options rather than adding them. I lose all agency in my build and gameplay approach. This completely kills what makes the game interesting to me, and I think it's unnecessary.

[Navarc]

I can't play warframes with exalted weapons, I can take hours finding what weapon I find most appropriate & fitting for the warframes style & my tastes. If I then just click 4 and negate all my choices, what's the point? A weapon buff is fine but not something that just scraps my choices.
I stayed with warframe for the great customization & options we have. Exalted weapons oppose that very directly. 

I mean, optimal excalibur exalted blade builds involve making a build on your melee that is only really viable when you have your exalted blade up, or else it's garbage. The same is the case for most if not all exalted weapons, even ash equips the channeling melee attack speed mod which no one would reasonably use otherwise. It's just not good. The fact that exalted weapons don't take advantage of your augments & rivens even further reinforces the creativity it suffocates.

If Khora has an exalted weapon, I will get her to 30 and bin it. The only tolerable exalted weapon is Atlas 1. To people who say "just dont use it", that's my exact intention. But it feels like a waste of resources to have people in different departments working on this weapon that's limited to 1 warframe that is inevitably going to be ignored by a majority of the community simply because of it being exalted. Don't limit variety in a game that's all about it.

[Marvelous_A]

2 hours ago, Mudfam said:

Yes, and I don't really care either way. This is not an issue for me personally, only perhaps in that it makes the builds less diverse and interesting for me, which in itself I do consider important. In this respect it's not lack the certain mods that bothers me, but rather the lack of diverse modding options and the exclusion of related gameplay systems.

But my fundamental overriding problem is with disabling all my chosen weapons, in having to use a specific weapon to take advantage of a warframe. It's not a circumstantial ability with varied applications, it's switching into a separate more restrictive gameplay system, removing options rather than adding them. I lose all agency in my build and gameplay approach. This completely kills what makes the game interesting to me, and I think it's unnecessary.

 

How do they disable your choice of weapons actually? You don't really care then you don't need to choose your weapon...seriously they don't even restrict your weapon of choice coz only the mods will be carried over. If anything, they only increase diversity in weapons because every single one of them have unique mechanics and is one of its own kind. It's like saying pre-nerf Simulor restricting your gameplay. Yes it was powerful but you always have the choice of not using it and use whatever else you like. Or saying putting Primed Reach on whips to make use of their long reach is restricting your freedom of modding. Again, it's just an option, so do exalted weapons, essentially modding for exalted weapons is the same as modding any other weapons, you make use of their mechanism and maximize their performance.

I mean, the act of putting MS and BR on every single melee weapon available in this game is what we called killing diversity, i.e. the mindset of slapping exactly the same set of mods on every weapons in this game. If I want to maximize the performance of exalted weapons, I mod for them. When I'm not, I mod my melee weapons in other way. Or simply you mod for both weapons, such as CO status build so both of them will get the benefits. EZ.

Trust me, if DE allows acolyte mods on exalted weapons today, tomorrow we will see Red Crit EB and Hysteria and Primal Fury and sliding their way in and out throughout the plain coz that's the only thing 95% of warframe players know in these days.

Edited November 4, 2017 by D20

[Azamagon]

1 hour ago, Mudfam said:

Yes, and I don't really care either way. This is not an issue for me personally, only perhaps in that it makes the builds less diverse and interesting for me, which in itself I do consider important. In this respect it's not lack the certain mods that bothers me, but rather the lack of diverse modding options and the exclusion of related gameplay systems.

But my fundamental overriding problem is with disabling all my chosen weapons, in having to use a specific weapon to take advantage of a warframe. It's not a circumstantial ability with varied applications, it's switching into a separate more restrictive gameplay system, removing options rather than adding them. I lose all agency in my build and gameplay approach. This completely kills what makes the game interesting to me, and I think it's unnecessary.

 

52 minutes ago, Navarchus said:

I can't play warframes with exalted weapons, I can take hours finding what weapon I find most appropriate & fitting for the warframes style & my tastes. If I then just click 4 and negate all my choices, what's the point? A weapon buff is fine but not something that just scraps my choices.
I stayed with warframe for the great customization & options we have. Exalted weapons oppose that very directly. 

I mean, optimal excalibur exalted blade builds involve making a build on your melee that is only really viable when you have your exalted blade up, or else it's garbage. The same is the case for most if not all exalted weapons, even ash equips the channeling melee attack speed mod which no one would reasonably use otherwise. It's just not good. The fact that exalted weapons don't take advantage of your augments & rivens even further reinforces the creativity it suffocates.

If Khora has an exalted weapon, I will get her to 30 and bin it. The only tolerable exalted weapon is Atlas 1. To people who say "just dont use it", that's my exact intention. But it feels like a waste of resources to have people in different departments working on this weapon that's limited to 1 warframe that is inevitably going to be ignored by a majority of the community simply because of it being exalted. Don't limit variety in a game that's all about it.

Yeah, this is something I can totally understand.

BUT, while your PoV is able to be understood, the next step is then; What would you suggest to do now? (Because just being negative without giving any suggestions won't get you very far. It can even come off as being plain whiny (not that I personally think so, mind you)). I gave a bunch of suggestions a few posts above, but some abilities are quite difficult to fix. What do you think of the ideas I had up there?

[LascarCapable]

If she do get an exalted whip, I just hope it won't be something with so few drawbacks or so powerful that you just basically want to stay permanently with it and never use your other weapons. I think this is what the OP wanted to say : some exalted weapons are just THAT good or kind of mandatory to use, and you usually want to stick with it as much as you can. Thus making your choice of primary a bit moot as long as you are well modded enough so that the energy flows. Most exalted weapon warframes are more or less guilty of that.

Also it does feel good when you don't have to press 4 and suffer an awkward switch animation between your exalted weapon and your primary/secondary. This is why in my case I like warframes like Atlas or Gara better than I love Warframes like Excalibur or Wukong : because they let you use your weapons in conjunction with your punches/stabs really well. Switching between heavy punching and heavy shooting with Atlas feels incredibly good and incredibly fluid. Much more fluid than switching to some exalted fists and then switching back to your primary. This is why I use quickmelee a lot as well.

Basically I just want all of my actions to be as snappy as possible, and exploit as much of my kit as possible. The OP probably shares the same point of view.

 

[ShikiRen]

2 hours ago, Mudfam said:

Yes, and I don't really care either way. This is not an issue for me personally, only perhaps in that it makes the builds less diverse and interesting for me, which in itself I do consider important. In this respect it's not lack the certain mods that bothers me, but rather the lack of diverse modding options and the exclusion of related gameplay systems.

But my fundamental overriding problem is with disabling all my chosen weapons, in having to use a specific weapon to take advantage of a warframe. It's not a circumstantial ability with varied applications, it's switching into a separate more restrictive gameplay system, removing options rather than adding them. I lose all agency in my build and gameplay approach. This completely kills what makes the game interesting to me, and I think it's unnecessary.

..."disabling all my chosen weapons" Dude, and what the F*** does switching to melee do? Right, disable your primary and secondary weapon. What does switching to your secondary do? Exactly, disable your primary. And vice versa. It is literally not any different than switching to your melee weapon. You can switch back and forth as you like, it even takles about the same amount of time, or is actually faster in some cases. Also, all exalted weapon users have 3 other skills and at least 1 which you could build around if you did not want to make an exalted weapon focused build. Hence it actually ADDS options unlike what you are trying to claim; you simply have a 4th weapon. Nobody forces you to bring a weapon as a "stat stick", in 99.9% of the game the exalted weapons work perfectly fine with any build on the corresponding weapon. And if you exclusively played the 0.1% were it actually matters, aka 2 hour + t4 void survivals, you are already limiting yourself to a small number of frames and weapons that can deal with that, so "but the exalted weapon limits my playstyle" would be complete and utter BS. If you do not want to play exalted blade : Don't use it, build around radial blind or javelin or whatever. Don't like Hysteria? Make an eternal war build if you want to use any other melee, and just use Hysteria to top off your hp via built in lifesteal, so you free a slot you'd usually have used for Life Strike. Hate Artemis? Build for invis or sleep arrows, or navigator for a lolz-build. Do not like Wukong's staff? Make an invincibility build. Dislike Mesa's peacemaker? Make a build around Shatter Shield. Hate Titania's archwing mode? Build for max range for her CC, or movement and cast speed for all those juicy auras, etc. The only one that is limiting builds is you and your narrow mind (not the mod).

[Mudfam]

1 hour ago, Azamagon said:

Yeah, this is something I can totally understand.

BUT, while your PoV is able to be understood, the next step is then; What would you suggest to do now? (Because just being negative without giving any suggestions won't get you very far. It can even come off as being plain whiny (not that I personally think so, mind you)). I gave a bunch of suggestions a few posts above, but some abilities are quite difficult to fix. What do you think of the ideas I had up there?

I said I thought your suggestions were good, but I'm not here to discuss exalted weapons in general. This community has put in hundreds of requests with unanimously agreed upon, simple, specific suggestions on how to fix abilities that exist in an utterly broken state. Eternally ignored. Sadly a rework of every exalted weapon in the game is a fairly tale, it has no place in reality.

My suggestion is simple: don't invest in this very unfortunate mechanic ever again.

I don't know the specifics, so can't say anything specific. In broad terms, incorporate those features into the warframe without replacing our weapons and gameplay. Perhaps release it with a unique signature weapon that synergises well. Don't make the frame centred around an ability that also forces us into one ultra specific playstyle, using one and only one weapon, that also basically only has one build.

 

To everyone who says that exalted weapons don't interfere with normal gameplay, that's not the point. I never want an all-in-one character, I want a warframe, then I choose my weapons. I want abilities that can complement and work together with a variety of weapons and playstyles, not a switch that disables absolutely everything except one comprehensive prepackaged gameplay mode. It's generic, it's repetitive, it's not mine, it's not interesting. It's just an override switch that disables this game's most appealing features.

Perhaps you like to just run with a fully premade character, or to grab a well established effective build and run with that. However, a large portion of warframe players love it for its deep customisation, for the almost limitless options to explore and experiment with, the countless synergies and modding possibilities, the fluid gameplay that puts a vast array of diverse tools at our dispoal, discovering how they can be used and what creative tactics we can employ. That's what keeps me and everyone I play with interested, we are constantly discussing and sharing new ways to play. Exalted weapons are not there, there's nothing to discuss, there's nothing to do, the build is pretty much rank it to 30, now go be a clone.

[Terrornaut]

5 hours ago, Mudfam said:

 

3 hours ago, D20 said:

Basically I just want all of my actions to be as snappy as possible, and exploit as much of my kit as possible. The OP probably shares the same point of view.

 

What D20 said was the impression I got or ultimately the thing that would make everything feel best.

5 hours ago, Navarchus said:

I can't play warframes with exalted weapons, I can take hours finding what weapon I find most appropriate & fitting for the warframes style & my tastes. If I then just click 4 and negate all my choices, what's the point? A weapon buff is fine but not something that just scraps my choices.
I stayed with warframe for the great customization & options we have. Exalted weapons oppose that very directly. 

I mean, optimal excalibur exalted blade builds involve making a build on your melee that is only really viable when you have your exalted blade up, or else it's garbage. The same is the case for most if not all exalted weapons, even ash equips the channeling melee attack speed mod which no one would reasonably use otherwise. It's just not good. The fact that exalted weapons don't take advantage of your augments & rivens even further reinforces the creativity it suffocates.

If Khora has an exalted weapon, I will get her to 30 and bin it. The only tolerable exalted weapon is Atlas 1. To people who say "just dont use it", that's my exact inten

Exalted weapons are basically just strong weapons that have their own rivens and augments built in. Seriously.  Its exactly that, its just we don't get to see those 'exalted mods'.  They are identical.  They're weapons that benefit from weapon mods and also from warframe stats.  Just taking from the warframe stats like range and power basically rivenize them.

I understand Mud and Nav's thoughts though. I play WF for the immense customization, the expertly designed gameplay flow and feel, and to slaughter enemies in the most satisfying ways that so many games fail to come close to.  Still, I'll say a few contrasting things.

This is a roster based game. Yes we can manipulate the abilities of those characters in the roster.  When you have a roster in games, you have some characters that are very easy to pickup and straightforward, some that are very technical and nuanced and niche, and then you have some that are nearly one trick ponies.  There's diversity in that.  Even for these one tricks though, the exalted weapon users you're stating, you still have options, and you still have people playing those.  I see a ton of EB users all the time, and I see a ton of Inaros and other immortal frames that I find boring as hell because there's very little effort or thinking involved to do what they do well...which is totally fine for other people to enjoy!

When I play Mesa for example, I have high effiency+power+ok duration.  This allows me to just pop into PM, blast things when a huge target comes out or somehow a crowd manages to pileup that I didn't deal with.  I don't build to just sit in turret mode.  I run, I bullet jump, slide into PM, shoot, end targets, then immediately switch to primary or melee and keep on going.  I can build my secondary with crit stuff to support PM to take down hard targets or crowds, and then offset that by having some status weapons like a radiation or blast weapon to make the rest of my life easier.  Or I can just build and be a turret bot and not switch and go constantly.

Valk: I can't stand Valk's combos, so I just build for warcry, or occasionally paralysis.  This allows me to be a furious badass that will last long and use my favorite weapons.  If I screw up or things get ridiculous, I can still go into Hyst, though it won't be as crazy as if I built around it.  It will be effective enough though because it always offers me other options (invulnerability to raise people, get through weird/difficult places).  Or I can build for hyst like someone said and slide kill level 150 bombards.  I don't have to do that though, and really, with high efficiency builds you can swap into an exalted weapon, do what you do for a few sec, and then swap out faster than you can switch weapons normally.

Or take my main, Ember.  She doesn't have an exalted weapon so what am I doing here?  Well, you can build her in plenty of ways, plenty of very common and ineffective ways, or you can build her to slaughter with absurd damage, almost incontestable if you have someone else that can help you strip armor instantly.  I do this by building around 1 ability, but her others still have situational uses.  Basically, on this particular frame, I can be a damage buffer, a wof using cc machine that does nothing and contributes no damage, or a damage boosting hype beast that kills constantly and ccs extremely well, or I can be a tanky melee frame that can be extremely effective with some risk - enough left to keep thing exciting.

 

I feel like this is a mentality thing and how you want to look at kit diversity.  You have frames that have useless abilities (zephyr's 2/divebomb, ember's 3/fireblast) and cornerstones that you can build around.  You can do a hell of a lot more with most frames and be effective without one tricking, even on exalted weapon frames.  The community has the tendency to go absolutely brain-dead and lazy when it comes to viewing how some things are op and others are not valid, but that's just the usual lazy thinking that comes with metas.

 

Basically what I'm saying is the exalted weapon warframes don't really have to restrict build diversity to be effective at later levels, depending on how you build them, and moreso, how you play.  Do you think I don't know most people probably went wtf when they saw me say Ember and melee frame in the same sentence?  More is possible in this game than the restrictive 'op' stuff makes it seem, and that is one of the reasons why I love WF, even with its flaws and sometimes questionable decisions and mechanics of DE.  ...but like any family and people you enjoy, you spend time immersed in environments with them, they're bound to get on your nerves and make you go 'uhhhh what?' from time to time, but overall you appreciate and keep going.

 

tangents

Edited November 4, 2017 by Terrornaut

[(PSN)TheHypothes]

I would like to see Rivens start applying to Exalted Weapons at least in some fashion. Maybe make the stats that carry over a locked Disposition so people don't just stat stick a 5* disposition mod? 

 

Like, weapon you're using has a 5* disposition, and the stats do carry over to the exalted weapon, but the stats that DO transfer over are scaled down to a 1-3* range disposition.

 

Right now on exalted weapon frames it feels like you're stuck picking one or the other if you actively participate in the riven system.

[IggySnow]

I like exaulted weapons! they are fun and unique, although they should be balanced better so that you can use all the mods with them.