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Why do you destroy Warframe DE?

ingrimmsche

By ingrimmsche,
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ingrimmsche

ingrimmsche

Posted
Posted

ok im playing warframe since the first hour and i still call it the best game out there why?

because it has so many things to offer (the amount of stuff is insane) no other game in the worl can keep up with that and everything for free thats unique in the gaming world

its a long way i walked with warframe i have seen many changes (good/bad) im a person im honest i only see the bad things thats how i am sorry :(

today i want to talk about the changes wich make no sense in my opinion and are the reason i have nearly no fun anymore in warframe

the first thing was the remove of the meeleweapon movement (ceramicdaggerslide) was my personal favorite

then you removed saryn nuke because of to op and then developed a new frame with nuke equinox (hes ofc not op)

then you nerfed the tonkor so it will kill the user all player where happy finally having a explosive weapon that will not kill them selfs and you take it away why i dont get it

really if this where pvp ok but this is pve player against bots so who cares only because some crying kids in the forum said ähhhh they make so many kills

man you can do this with every weapon i did it im not only saying this btw

then you developed the focus system wich was cool this superhero like ability you could use every 2 min or so i think many liked it and ofc the zenurik with the energy regen

finally you could keep up the energyflow and spam your abilitys against the bots it was so much fun for the smart ones coming up with things like

(when you cant play without energy regen then you cant at all) its not about can or can not its about it was fun (why taking away the fun)

omg but then you said hey guys know what the players have to much fun lets take again away the toys from them so they will suffer

i see no other reason you did this why would a normal thinking person take away these things i dont get it

now you have to jump out of your warframe (WARFRAME) to do a stupid voiddash to regenerate energy in the middle of a surv mission sure why not

(maybe you rename the game to: dont stay outside for to long) or something else like that

and that brings me to the last point surv my fav game mode actually the only one i play the only one that makes fun for me

you reduced the mop spawn to a ridiculous amount where i have to ask why not removing all abilitys from the frames cause there not needed anymore for 5-10 mops every 100 meters thats a joke

so i ask you now why do you destroy this game more and more with every update why are you doing this what is the reason do you hate the players maybe because the dont buy platin what

is it i really try to understand why you destroying warframe

pls leave a coment DE 


 
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lulialmir

lulialmir

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Posted

As the other guy said, take a Biiiiiiig breath, summarize it, and try to look at good things too, not the only thing you did there, that was talking about bad things, and saying that something be "gamebreaking is actually gud, since we don't fight players as often"

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Shogunslinger

Shogunslinger

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First and foremost, if DE read this and responded, they would probably look confused as to what they're responding too. Also lacking in the grammar department does not help your argument. Embrace the concept of TL;DR (too long didn't read) and try to keep things organized, short and simple.

Secondly, before making a thread, do some research. Given the points you listed, everything you're upset about was game-breaking and or OP (Tonkor, Mirage Prism etc.) That honestly is self explanatory. It was nerfed to reduce the meta, and to allow others to enjoy the game instead of hogging all the kills and glory. This is a cooperative PvE game, you wanna massacre everything? Go on a low level planet on solo and have fun, no one is going to stop you.

Finally, I'm prescribing you 250,000mg of Chill Pill. Never make an argument against something, let alone any major decisions in a major emotional state. Remain calm, collected and informed before doing something like this. It can save you in the long run.

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theraot

theraot

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Oh, man, I had forgot about a lot of that... listen, the game is not dead. We all know that what is gone is gone. It is not healthy to be attached to overpowered mechanics. Relax a little.

I believe the explanation of why they did all that is two fold:

1. New players
One side of it is that people with super effective builds will clean up maps and leave new players without anything to do, or when they do, it is some strong enemies that is too much for the new player. Then the n 3 r f comes. The other side of it, is that by the power of the n 3 r f new players struggle, then difficulty drops come.

The problem is that DE breaks the balance of low missions by attempting to balance "end game". I do not have a clear solution for this.

2. cheesy mechanics

When completing a mission consist of repeating the same action over an over, it eventually becomes tedious. Much more if evebody goes for the same tactic. Thus, to keep diversity of game play, the "meta" must be disrupted. 

There is a way to solve this.. DE needs to put the preferences of builds and tactics in strange loop (that is a technical term). That is, tactic A is arguebly better than tactic B, tactic B is arguebly better than tactic C, but tactic C is arguebly better than tactic A. With the ever increasing number of warframes and weapons, this might not be practical. However, if archived, people would naturally cycle over the tactics, in a status of always changing meta.

DE, has been rebalancing content, and there is the pending damage rework. As far as I know the motivation is not the problem I expose here, but perhaps it leads to a better situation.

---

I want to be able to impose a higher difficulty on myself. When I want it.

I got to side with Sargas Ruk:

Cita

Too Easy. I Expected More. I Deserve A Challenge!

All the over powered stuff would not be out of place if the difficulty base line were higher. I understand that not everybody wants a challenge (there is value in the meditation by motion of killing hordes of enemies), and that is good. But how do we prevent it from ruining the game for squad mates? Oh, or to express the problem the other way around: how do we protect you from leechers?

I have no need to ruin the game for new players. It is not my desire. I would opt to handicap myself by some mechanic, in particular one that could give me extra rewards. A handicap that would only be a hindrance for people who choose it.

One possible implementation is simply to add a difficulty selection when joining a mission. The issue with that is that it splits the community, I mean; it makes it harder to find a public squad.

Altenatively, it could be something like the dragon keys that put a negative effect on the player, but giving extra rewards to those who complete a mission - any mission - with them. Even if I am in a squad with people who didn't choose the handicap. The problem with that approach is that if it is optional it does not really solve anything.

Or perhaps the solution is kick the weak players leechers from the squad. Then they do not only get to kill something, they are also harshly expelled. Note: Not talking about afk people.

tl;dr: Some difficulty selection mechanic would be helpful. Two alternatives with drawbacks presented.

---

Progression and balancing the "end game"

Warframe faces the following problem: How to balance “end game”. Steve has admitted that he does not know, and that he went to GDC hoping to learn from the people behind other games how they do it.

If your power scale with the level and the enemies scale with the level, then what is the difference between low level and high level? It makes no sense. If instead your power does not scale with the level, but with other progression mechanics, then you end up with overpowered old players and underpowered new players. Then you have the problem I stated at the start: the old players leave new players with nothing to do.

PvP has a solution for this problem: The noob tube. That is, a mechanic that has good power to skill ratio. Allowing new players to be competitive. But one that is hardly any better with more skill... while the alternative allow players to beat the noob tube if they are skillful enough. Then as new players gain more skill in the game they can migrate to other means of play. Sure, old players will complain about the noob tube, and how these noobs killed them, but that is better than turning players away.

However, PvE? Hmm... We need something that allow new players to kill, regardless of how overpowered and skilled the squad mates are, so that the game is not boring for them (nothing left to kill) and do not feel they do not contribute (when finally they find an enemy alive, it is too strong for them).

tl;dr: DE needs to invent some way in which new players, with low skill and low builds, can contribute to a mission, regardless of overpowered squad mates. I do not know how.

---

tl;dr;tl;dr: DE has - probably - resourced to n 3 r f to avoid: 1) the gameplay to narrow itself on a single game tactic, 2) new players unable to enjoy the game when a op squad mate does everything. To break that trend, we need some form of difficulty selection mechanic, and some way to guarantee that new players can contribute regardless of how op squad mates might be (I have no idea how).

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(PSN)supernova_girlie

(PSN)supernova_girlie

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Posted

I swear I want to kick my laptop and choke my controller. I see things get nerfed and called game-breaking a lot, but in reality, there's like a handful of people out of the total population that were actually doing the game breaking.

For instance and quite recently, I've seen some complaints about Maiming Strike and I'm sitting at my laptop doing the whole mentally-challenged disgusted face girl meme. I have yet to run into someone that has even caused me to notice and think that they might even have Maiming Strike equipped!

Game breaking is Banshee quake. I did not download this game to join missions to watch someone do this move over and over again; then they expect me to keep reviving them because they did not bother to put on any survival mods, because with the new changes to her 4th, they have to forgo them to get the real powerful build. Showing up to a mission, ready to kick some ***, only to not see one enemy; THAT'S GAME BREAKING.

Some dude running around the map whipping stuff to death in a red crit frenzy is not game breaking, if you can't get kills in this situation then you need to step up your game.

Some chick pulling out her internet cable to prevent her 577th bleed-out, THAT'S GAME BREAKING.

When I think about it, old Naramon, my favorite solo crutch, was not really all that game breaking. It helped get to the extraction site when I forgot to get life support. 

This guy's post comes off odd, but I think English may not be his first language; but he is spot on about certain things. For me, something is only game breaking when it prevents other players from participating in the game or if it actually causes game breaking bugs. Someone having a powerful weapon, means I have to step up my game; if I can see the enemy, I can kill it. I may not get the most kills in the end, but at least I got to participate.

Now as far as mops are concerned, it's very important that you get the old school mops. You know the one, that stringy monstrosity you saw the school janitor whip out when Jenny lost her lunch. Don't get fooled by the cheap new mops, they couldn't soak in a tear, let alone a milk spill.

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Voltage

Voltage

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

Right, so coptering, press-4-to-win and weapons OP in their class without justification were essential elements in keeping this game alive. Got it.

Nah. It is more like: Every time some gear setup plays the game better than DE wants, it gets toned down.

It is fine when blatantly overpowered setups are nerfed such as Nuker Limbo, Mag insta-gibbing all Corpus, Saryn Press 4 and map dies, but I would like to play at my pace, not DE's. My pace will always be ahead of DE's, and I am not alone. There is a difference between balance and trying to suppress efficiency (such as Zenurik Changes, nerfing Exodia Contagion, etc).

Adarza Kavat nerf on Amps was a perfect example. It was not overpowered, and a unique combo that made that one companion actually worth using. DE killed it off so that Eidolons are done at a pace DE sees fit. They dislike players being too quick to kill the boss as seen with Shield Disruption and Double Lure Charge changes.

Edited by --Q--Voltage
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SenorClipClop

SenorClipClop

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37 minutes ago, --Q--Voltage said:

Nah. It is more like: Every time some gear setup plays the game better than DE wants, it gets toned down.

It is fine when blatantly overpowered setups are nerfed such as Nuker Limbo, Mag insta-gibbing all Corpus, Saryn Press 4 and map dies

As per this thread's subject matter, this is what I am saying. And that's it.

38 minutes ago, --Q--Voltage said:

I would like to play at my pace, not DE's. My pace will always be ahead of DE's, and I am not alone. There is a difference between balance and trying to suppress efficiency (such as Zenurik Changes, nerfing Exodia Contagion, etc).

Adarza Kavat nerf on Amps was a perfect example. It was not overpowered, and a unique combo that made that one companion actually worth using. DE killed it off so that Eidolons are done at a pace DE sees fit. They dislike players being too quick to kill the boss as seen with Shield Disruption and Double Lure Charge changes.

It's a developer's job to dictate the pace of their game. Not to dictate an individual player's pace (and one could say that optimizing it is a player goal), but to stand back, look at their game and say "how difficult should _______ be for players to do?" Nerfs usually happen either because one element in the game gives the player too much power output for player input (old Saryn Miasma), or because something goes against what the developer wants the player to experience (SD vs Eidolons, Contagion change). In the example of Shield Disruption vs Eidolons, DE designed Eidolons to be bosses with multiple phases, and SD made them one-phase bosses. It's not "players are too efficient", it's "this obstacle doesn't have the impact we want it to have if it's incredibly easy". Contagion's nerf (which I think of as a Covert Lethality nerf) happened because of an unintended interaction between it and CL, because CL is for stealth melee kills, not for sniping groups at range... with a dagger. That was pretty obviously accidental, let's be honest. I'm not sure why you think the changes to Zenurik were a nerf -- since Focus 2.0 I almost never take Zenurik and have more Energy than with the old 1.0 thanks to my squad, and I'll burn a pizza maybe once a week.

DE is still run by humans and doesn't get things right all the time (I too think the Adarza nerf was uncalled-for, and I'd like to see Shield Disruption do something to Eidolons), but generally the toning down of OP stuff is beneficial to the game. If something is designed to have a high impact on the player (like a boss fight) and a player can do it too easily or too quickly, the experience is cheapened and the enjoyment of the game is lessened, save for a lazy power fantasy high and the piece of cheese at the end of the Skinner box.

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