Welp, R.I.P. Rev.

[FlusteredFerret]

10 hours ago, AzureTerra said:

i'd break out the worlds smallest violin but ive misplaced it again

I find it helps to keep it on a keychain. 

[LupisV0lk]

10 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Why does everyone throw Gara under the same bus as Khora and Rev. Unlike those 2 she’s actually good. She’s a better frost that can actually tank. 

Huh, they're all good. Maybe not Ubermench meta tryhard extraordinaire good but still good.

[SneakyErvin]

11 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

More like one of the worst. Literally only outclassing the absolute bottom tier.

Sounds more like a massive L2P issue in your case. Or is this some reverse psychology to make Rev even more top tier?

Few frames can match his kit. He has most likely the best defensive skill in the game, he has one of the best AoE clears in the game and he has one hell of a mobility option with reave during #4. His #1 serves as a pretty decent CC.

And even though there are people going "well I dont use his #4" it doesnt mean he is bad, if he was then Mesa would be just as bad or worse if someone "dont use her #4". If you use his full kit Rev is a very strong frame and one of the best.

edit: Also Gara a better Frost because "she can tank"? Bwahaha! Frost doesnt need to tank, he simply freezes and one shots whatever he faces.

Edited October 16, 2018 by SneakyErvin

[Aeon94]

14 hours ago, trst said:

The purpose of Revenant's Thralls is for them to die for you not fight for you. Revenant is not Nyx.

If someone can make an argument for Revenant needing further changes without acting like Thralls are intended to work otherwise I'd love to hear it.

My proposed changes and reasons ;

Passive : changed to " Revenant can act like an Eidolon Lure and link to 2 of destroyed synovias. "

• Reason - Passive was useless with existence of Mesmer Skin , its better to give him more thematic passive that would help him to fight Eidolons. He was meant to stop Eidolon threat and keep them coming back as the Warden of Plains after all.

Enthrall : Thralls have 2-3 sec invulnerability period.

• Reason - Enemies can be killed DURING thralling process and no pillars are created when that happens , so cast is wasted. Also Thralls die before spreading enthrall to others. 

Mesmer Skin :

Absorbs the last status proc dealt on itself and applies procs to enemies Reave hits.

• Reason - Revenant is immune to status while this ability is active and Reave's new perk ( below ) has almost no use. Would be useful with this change.

On 2018-10-12 at 4:56 PM, [DE]Megan said:

Revenant’s Reave now also sheds Status Effects on cast and applies them to targets it hits

After losing a mesmer charge, Revenant releases a radial energy wave that staggers all enemies in 10 meters radius. ( still stuns the attacker )

• Reason - We try to keep Mesmer Skin active all the time and shields do not take hit. Passive contradicts with his "block-all-attacks" playstyle and it would be nice to keep it a part of Mesmer Skin with some changes.

Reave : Casting speed is faster.

• Reason - Cast animation is slow even with Natural Talent.

Dance Macabre : Doesn't destroy energy pillars.

• Reason - Pillars are good for zoning and shouldn't be destroyed. They can help Revenant by damaging / destroying enemies above him while Danse Macabre is active.

 

Edited October 16, 2018 by Aeon94

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

3 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Sounds more like a massive L2P issue in your case. Or is this some reverse psychology to make Rev even more top tier?

Few frames can match his kit. He has most likely the best defensive skill in the game, he has one of the best AoE clears in the game and he has one hell of a mobility option with reave during #4. His #1 serves as a pretty decent CC.

And even though there are people going "well I dont use his #4" it doesnt mean he is bad, if he was then Mesa would be just as bad or worse if someone "dont use her #4". If you use his full kit Rev is a very strong frame and one of the best.

edit: Also Gara a better Frost because "she can tank"? Bwahaha! Frost doesnt need to tank, he simply freezes and one shots whatever he faces.

Gara is a better frost because her defense skill can scale indefinitely.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

16 hours ago, Saturmorn_Carvilli said:

Seriously, is this some sort of player conspiracy to see how over powered Digital Extremes will make a frame if we keep complaining it's terrible that we're not in on?

Personally I think it’s the opposite. Everyone here defending Rev saying “he’s on of the beat frames in the game. All his abilities are sooo perfect.” While they couldn’t be further from the truth.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

15 hours ago, trst said:

The purpose of Revenant's Thralls is for them to die for you not fight for you. Revenant is not Nyx.

If someone can make an argument for Revenant needing further changes without acting like Thralls are intended to work otherwise I'd love to hear it.

If they’re meant to die then why is all their important synergies tied to when they’re alive?

[SneakyErvin]

42 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Gara is a better frost because her defense skill can scale indefinitely.

It is still a weak skill. As I said frost doesnt need the defense since he simply locks down the enemies and kills them. Only mission where it doesnt work well are on bosses, at which point he has his globe to hide in, which can be stacked to insane health numbers.

[Deejudanne]

who? what?

[Madway7]

8 hours ago, Autongnosis said:

Uh... You wat? The one glaring issue revenant has is about his thralls being made too slowly. The other skills are a complete invulnerability with CC attatched and a nice escape/recovery skill. You think that's "bottom tier"? Wow. 

 

Don't see the issue there?

Tho it's not complete invulnerability as toxin clouds, tar pits, grenades and fire patches/napalms still hurt you.

But playing smart would mean that you shouldn't get killed by these so it's not a major issue.

My major issue is the recovery skill being coupled with a damage mitigation skill making the recovery skill far less usefull for that aspect.

They could have fixed this by making Mesmer Skin only apply to health damage and letting Reave give you shields/overshields from non shielded enemies, but they haven't. 

Instead this has largely remained as it was since release, just with Reaves numbers being affected by Power Strength now. 

If they did this change and streamlined thrall making by giving Enthrall an aoe and ability to spread he would def be top tier in my eyes.

(Also I'm one of those people that think that his cast times def needed a buff.)

But with the last change prob being his last set of changes (seeing as the feedback post was unpinned). I doubt it.

The nerf was also completely unnecesary.

9 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

They took the direct feed back post for him off the forums. No foreseeable changes for him.

It wasn't taken off, it was just unpinned and ended up on another page.

8 hours ago, TheDefenestrater said:

I'll just leave this here.

Revenant is one of the strongest, best-scaling frames in the game.  His 1, 2, and 3 scale effectively to any enemy level.

His 3 has the issue of misleading UI where the numbers only apply to thralls and the number that applies to all enemies is hidden.

His 2 has the issue where some damages still go through it.

His 1 has the issue where making thralls is not fast enough and requires constant targeting with your 1.

I will admit that he's strong, I just wish his kit worked better as a whole.

 

14 hours ago, (PS4)SlyFox5679 said:

so from the sound of this topic, DE beat Rev over the head with a nerf hammer because its 4 was too OP ? 

 

I have a sneaking suspicion DE will give Revenant an Ember style nerf down the line, because since the kneejerk nerf of increasing the cost yhey haven't done anything to make the ability more interactive and the afk playstyle is still possible.

[Diveris]

9 hours ago, TheDefenestrater said:

I'll just leave this here.

Revenant is one of the strongest, best-scaling frames in the game.  His 1, 2, and 3 scale effectively to any enemy level.

That video proves nothing.. in a vacuum situations usually don't hold up in real game play.

[trst]

8 hours ago, SilverRook said:

appreciate that but they may as well just die on enthrall 
The "death reward" for destroying thralls needs a HUGE improvement since most of them get killed by saryns and volts et al, they dont get killed in high traffic areas most of the time so their little tiny AoE column of light is moot.

I'd rather they just explode on the spot with some sort of proc 

You can always just cast Enthrall in a crowd and kill the Thrall but even if the pillar itself isn't being helpful it still fires out homing orbs which do a decent chunk of damage, especially when you have several pillars filling a room. You can also just have them explode on the spot by spamming Enthrall then immediately using Danse.

Complaining about other frames out-killing you or making your abilities "useless" isn't an issue unique to Revenant, it can even happen as Saryn or Volt if you have another on your team doing the same thing but faster or better. If this is an issue then the complaint needs to be extended to about 90% of the roster.

6 hours ago, ChaosSabre said:

If the purpose of thralls is to just die then why is the thrall cast animation so freaking long? It should be instant in that case. And 9/10 times they die instantly to your team fire without being able to even spread at all. Unless you just use it as CC to take that heavy unit out of the fight.

Also Nyx mind control is like thrall but your controlled target can't die. They both do almost no damage while they are alive.

Because it is capable of propagating to the Thrall cap for free and can also cost no energy. Even if the free propagation isn't "practical" it still exists and has the capability to making the ability grossly efficient. And long animations on abilities that are better off spammed is a recurring issue with Warframes. It's a long standing issue that DE has only ever addressed for Mag.

Exactly, neither do any worthwhile damage (even Nyx in Arbitrations with the +300% buff and Mind Freak does very poor damage) but since Revenant's release a lot of people have wanted Enthrall to literally be a better Mind Control for some reason. Beyond having bodies to draw enemy aggro and being able to selfishly kill them alone with Reave there isn't any worthwhile reason for them to work like Nyx.

2 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

If they’re meant to die then why is all their important synergies tied to when they’re alive?

Important synergies like refreshing Mesmer Skin charges and dealing more damage? Honestly with the exception of Mesmer Skin's stun making Enthrall free his synergies aren't that good.

Although the build @TheDefenestrater pointed out, while maybe impractical, is the only true one-shot build that doesn't use Covert Lethality and can kill several enemies at once. It does make this synergy useful but extremely niche however it does technically make Revenant the single best extreme overkill endurance frame.

[_DapperDanMan_]

Did a 50 wave Arbitration defense yesterday with a Rev, Gara and a Mirage. Rev was 2% off from being top damage.

 

 Seems fine.

[Sannleikur]

22 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

They tried to fix him, but he was too far gone.

*plays “spin me round” on bag pipes*

eh, I initially hated him, but they fixed his 1, 2, and 3, and 4's still very viable.

I use the full sentient build, basically Hunter Adrenaline+ rage for the +75% return of energy on health damage, and I threw on adaptation and an hp mod and 175% efficiency, and a grace.


No forma.

Doesn't die.

Adaptation's a bit too strong pre level 100 on him since he has high shields for this build , so you won't gain energy too often with it. without it you can still keep him alive pretty well too by spamming his 3 while spinning for pretty much the entire duration of any mission, so long as there are mobs to attack you. 

I'll try Adaptation with a dragon key to see if that helps.

Any of his more balanced playstyles are also viable too. his 1+3 can kill any level, his 2 can help him tank any level, tho arbitration drones drain his stacks fast, and his 4 scales with the damage taken to health and I'm pretty sure to his mesmer as well. 

He's just different. His dps potential is higher than most frames, and has survivability to boot. It's just with the level of most content you don't get much opportunity to use his 1 and 4 to kill faster than just using melee, and doesn't map nuke as well your standard map nuker frame.

[(XBOX)Boghadir]

It was a poor concept and poorer execution just for a frame everyone played spin to win.  I'm getting sick of these AoE frames which is just press button to win in an area.

Instead of a Sentient Warframe everyone hyped to death, they made an objectiveless Nyx and Nekros bastard love child with lasers.  Instead of being the Tenno's first attempt at making a new warframe by reverse engineering "lost" Orokin tech that is likely on Lua can be replicated on a Dr. Who special matter maker in everyone's special stealth ship, we have a completely nonsensical crpyt keeper who is used to justify a child's guilt which is absolutely pointless drivel in a story where we're about to get invades by space terminators.

[(XBOX)FOCHOCLTstrfish]

I cant even get his BP.

[SneakyErvin]

48 minutes ago, (XB1)Turaglas said:

It was a poor concept and poorer execution just for a frame everyone played spin to win.  I'm getting sick of these AoE frames which is just press button to win in an area.

Instead of a Sentient Warframe everyone hyped to death, they made an objectiveless Nyx and Nekros bastard love child with lasers.  Instead of being the Tenno's first attempt at making a new warframe by reverse engineering "lost" Orokin tech that is likely on Lua can be replicated on a Dr. Who special matter maker in everyone's special stealth ship, we have a completely nonsensical crpyt keeper who is used to justify a child's guilt which is absolutely pointless drivel in a story where we're about to get invades by space terminators.

But he isnt a spin-to-win frame. Not many play him that way. Most use his #4 for dense groups of enemies and just melee or shoot in between. Heck I just ran a 30min arbitration survival with him and I didnt use his #4 more than once. The rest of the mission was pure melee.

He is a frame with a toolkit fitting every single situation, there is nothing he cant do.

[Phyrak]

I wrote a mild change to his abilities with the emphasis of using the thralls as disposable units, all while having Eidolon based abilities with vampire underpinnings rather than having both themes in equilibrium.

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1019037-revenant-still-feels-lackluster/?do=findComment&comment=10229748

[(XBOX)ultamite hero]

11 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Gara is a better frost because her defense skill can scale indefinitely.

Have you heard of frost that take advantage of the 3 second invulnerability timer? Frost in technicality can defend indefinitely too as long as he recast the bubble to keep the invulnerability up.

[Diveris]

8 hours ago, _DapperDanMan_ said:

Did a 50 wave Arbitration defense yesterday with a Rev, Gara and a Mirage. Rev was 2% off from being top damage.

 

 Seems fine.

That could just be a Rev with a good gun.. Just because you did one instance with one Rev doesn't make him fine.

Mirage is a Gun frame, and Gara never really ranks high when I've been in group with one.

Loadouts matter and if it was a pug, you really don't know who was using what.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

51 minutes ago, (XB1)ultamite hero said:

Have you heard of frost that take advantage of the 3 second invulnerability timer? Frost in technicality can defend indefinitely too as long as he recast the bubble to keep the invulnerability up.

Youd you’d need some serious energy upkeep tho, Gara just needs to Cast it around a bunch of enemies surrounding the defense target.

[(XBOX)Kavriel]

Revenant is they only frame I've enjoyed playing as much as Volt. Even Umbra was underwelming. I don't understand the complaints because I can generate thralls so fast there's nothing left to kill. Target the strongest enemy around and it'll do the work for you, repeat before they snap out of it and you have an army to follow you through the map. Enemies run out you reave the thralls and move on. Get surrounded hit 4. Nearly invulnerable and with a burst damage primary, magnetic secondary, and viral melee hes unstoppable.

I've been using him to clear nodes on the star chart I never bothered with before because enemies were bullet sponges. Revenant negates that and demolishes even on solo.

[(XBOX)ultamite hero]

1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said:

Youd you’d need some serious energy upkeep tho, Gara just needs to Cast it around a bunch of enemies surrounding the defense target.

max efficiency frost says hi

Edited October 17, 2018 by (XB1)ultamite hero

[Diveris]

1 hour ago, (XB1)Kavriel said:

Revenant is they only frame I've enjoyed playing as much as Volt. Even Umbra was underwelming. I don't understand the complaints because I can generate thralls so fast there's nothing left to kill. Target the strongest enemy around and it'll do the work for you, repeat before they snap out of it and you have an army to follow you through the map. Enemies run out you reave the thralls and move on. Get surrounded hit 4. Nearly invulnerable and with a burst damage primary, magnetic secondary, and viral melee hes unstoppable.

I've been using him to clear nodes on the star chart I never bothered with before because enemies were bullet sponges. Revenant negates that and demolishes even on solo.

Star Chart nodes are low level content. Not an insult at all, but any frame with a decent loadout can wreck the star chart nodes.

Many decent guns can one shot anything under 100. Melee is even stronger. 

It maybe a personal thing tbh. Or maybe I'm a scrub.. But I've never built a gun for magnetic.. Never had to. Viral to half health. Corrosive/slash to strip armor and bleed enemies out. Or gas for corpus. It bypasses shields. But even at sortie and higher levels Corpus die to quickly to be noticed.

Seems weird to attack a shield when I can go straight for the HP.

Edited October 17, 2018 by Diveris

[Diveris]

9 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

But he isnt a spin-to-win frame. Not many play him that way. Most use his #4 for dense groups of enemies and just melee or shoot in between. Heck I just ran a 30min arbitration survival with him and I didnt use his #4 more than once. The rest of the mission was pure melee.

He is a frame with a toolkit fitting every single situation, there is nothing he cant do.

Check it out though.. 30 mins is the bare minimum. Any frame can survive 30, with a decent build. You admit you didn't have to use his damage ability.  And just used a melee.. Wukong can do that to. 

Beyond 5th or 6th rotation solo and his dps will be mostly weapon only because he doesn't scale well. 

In a high dps group in high level content the most useful skill he has is mesmer skin. His 4 falls off to fast, thrawls die to quickly and leave pillars that tickle mobs. And reave is so situational it's silly.

Considering most high level content has you staying in relatively the same spot, and thrawls die as quickly as you make them.. Reave becomes a travel ability.