Do you want more of the open-world module?

[Otaiken]

What I'd like to see in WF is a megacity open world map (maybe Jupiter?). It could be much smaller but denser map and also a rather unique enviroment for open world. WF's movement system would make perfect use of vertically stacked map.

Another enviroment I'd find interesting would be partially infested dense jungle, but that fits WF much less.

One of those would be fine with me, but another flat plane kind of map would be a bit too much I think.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

5 hours ago, Tellakey said:

How do you feel about the topic?

I do enjoy the idea of open world warframe, but we must be aware of everything it entails in the before, during and after processes. Open worlds are great, ambitious and can really inject life into he game, but like so many things it comes with a cost:

in the run up process, starting from the first teasers, everybody jumps aboard the hype train. and why wouldn't you? it's gonna be a massive content update that should give you hours and hours of fun and rewards to work towards. it should remind you why you love warframe. but then after that teaser begins the full dev work process: all the polishing, all the fixes, and getting something than can be shown off in a devstream so that we, the players, can see more of what's to come. of course this takes time, and resources. time and resources that would otherwise be spent on smaller but more frequent updates. the open worlds are big, and DE has to make sacrifices to construct them, and usually it ends up being less other content in the short term. without it, we experience these drought phases where players get bored, where we have nothing to do. boredom leads to frustration, frustration leads to anger, and anger leads to toxicity, which then manifests itself in places like this forum. bugs go unfixed, weapons are held back, everything is pushed onto the backburner until there is no room left on it. DE pours everything into the development of updates like PoE and Fortuna.

but the payoff is worth it right? once it releases? well even after all the waiting, all the boredom, all of the community (or at least a very loud minority) going for each others' throats, when that glorious open world is finally released. it's bugged. well of course it's bugged! everything has bugs when it's first released, and they have to be patched. things go wrong, like how the EU servers weren't downloading the update properly at first. but of course, when things go wrong, it makes us frustrated. frustration leads to anger, and now instead of "DE where Fortuna!?", it's "omg DE Fortuna sucks!?" then there's the grind and how good or bad it is. and of course, time and resources spent fixing the newly released open world to try and stop people panicking about lost progress and glitches and stuff, is yet more time that could arguably have been used for fixing something older, or revamping it a little.

now you might think once the hype dies down and everybody's got everything from the open world maps that that'll be the end of it right? nope. Warframe is always moving forward, and the moment that an open world is finished, functional and where it needs to be, it's straight onto the next one. concepts aren't gonna draw themselves, and because Fortuna improved upon PoE, that means the next one has to be better than Fortuna, and then the one after that has to be better and so on. player expectations are only going to go up and DE has to find a way to meet those expectations. they have to go one bigger every time to prevent things from becoming stale. the higher you set the bar, the more it hurts if it falls on your head.

personally I like the open worlds. it's a big timesink, and that's what I want and need out of warframe: a place where I can spend hours as a magical space ninja slaughtering enemies by the dozen; the power fantasy that keeps most of us here. but not everyone likes open worlds. and some people want older content to be revisited and made fresh again, and to those people, updates like fortuna will come a cross as a massive wasted opportunity. that's why they don't like ti; because they think "what if"? what if the time spent on Fortuna was spent on bringing back raids, or dark sectors? or reworking Conclave in it's entirety? why push forward so hastily when there's so many things in the game that should have been fixed ages ago, and in the event they are fixed, would still bring in players? 

it appears this is a song and dance that we'll all have to go through each and every time an open world is announced, then released, and then cleaned up. and it's not worth it to some people. anyway, it also appears I've rambled on way too much, if you read this far then thanks for your time.

TL;DR. I like open worlds, but it looks like there's going to be this cycle of hype>boredom>toxicity each time we get an open world. it's almost inevitable, most of you know this, but is it worth doing it again and again?

 

 

Edited November 10, 2018 by (PS4)robotwars7

[Loza03]

I'm enjoying what Fortuna brings to the table, and I would like to see more of this in the long run, but not starting until after Railjack and the New War methinks, at least once Fortuna's got all it's content (which took a little while for Plains, so eager to see that kind of thing for the Vallis). We'll have a fair bit of content for the Open World mechanics at that point, so leaving them be for a bit would make it more interesting for when and if they decided to go for a new one. Similar to how if they released a new tileset, that'd actually be quite novel since they haven't done so for a while (Gas City Rework kind of counts, based on how big it is).

So, yeah, I do want more in the long run, but after some time to settle.

[xxdarrenxx]

1 hour ago, LocoWithGun said:

What I'd like to see in WF is a megacity open world map (maybe Jupiter?). It could be much smaller but denser map and also a rather unique enviroment for open world. WF's movement system would make perfect use of vertically stacked map.

Another enviroment I'd find interesting would be partially infested dense jungle, but that fits WF much less.

One of those would be fine with me, but another flat plane kind of map would be a bit too much I think.

Underrated comment. While most of the normal tilesets are structure-ey, it's not really city like. Would love a more immersed jupiter corpus gas city.
Then again, I also see where some will just argue that it's (even more) copied from GTA.

In regards to the thread;

They also want to keep the identity am sure, they could make a warframe trading card game, or implement RTS elements, but is it then warframe?

Innovation is not picked from a shelf. You can sit behind a piano and play random chords and notes for a minute, and it would be 100% unique, but it's without meaning or context and scope. Creating innovatively is by having one foot in what is common and one in the uncommon. The first implementation is always the easiest, because expectations are non existent, after that; warframes are not new, weapons are not, corpus are not, but they are also part of why we were attracted to the game in the first place, so u can't take them out. Again, it's hard to change, but not change too much, an art perhaps.

There are equally people complaining if not more, regarding games that changed too much (why is WoW vanilla a thing again?) And this is far from the only example where people prefer old versions of a game to the newer ones, because of this too little/too much factor.

Furthermore, there's also our stupid human brain. We humans consume content much faster than it takes to develop, and when it's consumed we seem to require an exponential increase to keep same satisfaction levels. This is not even opinion based. Very real scientific studies have shown that brain chemistry changes after 3 - 5 years from a game, to a job, to a girlfriend, to a social media site etc. etc.. It's often a pinnacle where people decide to stick for it indefinitely or feel they need "a change" . Just your genetic make-up heavily biasing it, can't change that with a simple thought, it will keep gnawing and in worst case makes u bitter and negative, been there done that.

To end on a light note:

- Dense complex Forrest open world

- Volcanic hellish world (infested)

- Gaseous slimy no atmosphere, but bio-domes open map (a small moon, dedicated to orokin era infested research, swarmed, infested, half life 3)

yes pls

Edited November 10, 2018 by xxdarrenxx

[(XBOX)calvina]

Personallly, I'd say stop with the open worlds once we get an infested open world, however, that is a part of my hoping Jupiter gets its own open world due to the fact it's open and in the sky, on a series of floating platforms.

Spoiler

Like, imagine having a zephyr/archwing and flying around in a sky-based open map, potential to fight flying eidolons or something.

[Tellakey]

Just woke up to find a lost of well-put answers on both sides of the fence. Bumping the thread for more.

[OniDax]

5 hours ago, LocoWithGun said:

What I'd like to see in WF is a megacity open world map (maybe Jupiter?). It could be much smaller but denser map and also a rather unique enviroment for open world. WF's movement system would make perfect use of vertically stacked map.

Another enviroment I'd find interesting would be partially infested dense jungle, but that fits WF much less.

One of those would be fine with me, but another flat plane kind of map would be a bit too much I think.

I think a Coruscant-like metropolis on Ganymede as the home of the Corpus would be awesome.

[Dr.Pepper23]

More quest story missions would be nice...

But if they changed the open world formula to something more innovative and fun besides it being more of the same bounties/ fishing/ mining, then sure I don't mind more of it.

I'm worried about Railjack. While it might be new, and  innovative, the longevity of it highly depends on the gameplay and rewards. Space bounties? Plz no..

But at the same time it takes DE way too long to develop these things and so far the results when they do come out are boredom within the first day... Then it's split between people being bored and people defending DE saying that it's a free game, we are ungrateful, etc..

Also time gate content with reputation makes things worse. I get that DE doesn't want ppl to farm rep so much but how about diminishing returns like they were planning with the focus system.

I would like to see DE release smaller content more regularly or even fixing the things that they leave half baked such as Archwing , Lunaro, Conclave, Onslaught,  etc.. 

[DissentWomble]

More please. I love the open world part of the game and I can sunk at least 10 hours into that single node alone and I consider that as a success. Pretty sure we'll be getting a new system in the form of that sentient planet so ill also be looking forward to that. Till then its the open world treatment and i think they've done enough to make it different enough to POE with the constraints of a normal mmo brings. I don't see how they could pull off fortuna any better and my expectations have been fully met.

As with baro and the meme primed dissapointment, I'll never understand the expectations people have on a small part of the game. 

[mosaickle]

I've been on permanent WF burnout and came back for Fortuna.

I've been around the place for a few hours and it already feels old.

From randomly generated maps to a massive open world map was revolutionary.

From a massive open world map to a more massive open world map was an upgrade on numbers.

I can't find anything about Fortuna interesting, nothing feels different now.

Fortuna feels like a reskinned PoE.

[mosaickle]

7 hours ago, (XB1)calvina said:

Personallly, I'd say stop with the open worlds once we get an infested open world, however, that is a part of my hoping Jupiter gets its own open world due to the fact it's open and in the sky, on a series of floating platforms.

  Hide contents

Like, imagine having a zephyr/archwing and flying around in a sky-based open map, potential to fight flying eidolons or something.

Have it vertical-based unlike 99.99% of existing horizontal-based environments and it'd be perfect, a true 'sky open world' experience

[Aerionoth]

Warframe has a formula, and the open world sections stick to that formula which is: patiently grind till you get your stuff days/weeks/months from now.

My favorite games of all time are the Fallout and Elder Scrolls series. The worldbuilding is what makes those for me. I cannot get open-world fatigue, because there's always something to find around the corner; a new NPC with quests, a smaller or bigger treasure hunt, a dungeon, etc.

Warframe is an action game, so none of those things are present, or to a lesser degree (cinematic quests, ayatans and curia, etc.), so it's open world, while a nice new diversion, will never enthrall me for hundreds of hours.

I guess, what I'm trying to say, is: make the open world(s) a place where you can do stuff naturally (without needing to extract to keep the loot ffs), or just focus on cinematic quests, which I personally always enjoy.

[Tellakey]

6 minutes ago, Aerionoth said:

Warframe has a formula, and the open world sections stick to that formula which is: patiently grind till you get your stuff days/weeks/months from now.

My favorite games of all time are the Fallout and Elder Scrolls series. The worldbuilding is what makes those for me. I cannot get open-world fatigue, because there's always something to find around the corner; a new NPC with quests, a smaller or bigger treasure hunt, a dungeon, etc.

Warframe is an action game, so none of those things are present, or to a lesser degree (cinematic quests, ayatans and curia, etc.), so it's open world, while a nice new diversion, will never enthrall me for hundreds of hours.

I guess, what I'm trying to say, is: make the open world(s) a place where you can do stuff naturally (without needing to extract to keep the loot ffs), or just focus on cinematic quests, which I personally always enjoy.

This, to me, is the core of the issue. Technically PoE and Fortuna are "open worlds" but shy of amazing visuals and a few activities, there's really not much to do with all that space. Having explored the majority of the caves on Venus, been to every landmark, and done my best to find points of interest, I see this problem persist. There's nothing out there, where there could be quite a lot. Still an awesome expansion.

[Aerionoth]

5 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

This, to me, is the core of the issue. Technically PoE and Fortuna are "open worlds" but shy of amazing visuals and a few activities, there's really not much to do with all that space. Having explored the majority of the caves on Venus, been to every landmark, and done my best to find points of interest, I see this problem persist. There's nothing out there, where there could be quite a lot. Still an awesome expansion.

Yep, they made nice landscapes and (with Fortuna) some nice interiors, but there's nothing relevant to do there. And the random events that happen on PoE and (maybe, never seen any) Fortuna will never take the place of world building, much like radiant quests (another settlement needs your help) could never take the place of handcrafted stuff in the aforementioned games.

An empty building with some wild decorations and a terminal with a creepy story make exploration a blast; a complex building with some enemies that you see a million times all over the place and nothing unique is, sadly, not worth the time.

I love Fortuna's theme, I liked the Eidolons, and I always enjoy new content in Warframe, but DE's strengths don't seem to lie in world building, and although they do make great cinematic quests, those are tragically few and way too far between.

[(PSN)Zero_029]

Well as DE learns more from making such content the development will get smoother & faster.

Folks forget DE wasn't solely working on Fortuna.

They were working on Fortuna, Railjack, Chimera, Sacrifice, Melee 3.0 (and previous rebalances), Weapon Revisions, Frame Reworks, implementing Tennogen, new weapons, new UI, & Arbitrations.

That's a full plate.

That said. I do want more Open World.

Each open world shifts the dynamic of the game. While missions were fun, Warframe needs to keep evolving. Going back to corridor tile sets will have the same effect that ESO & Arbitrations had.

Which is that folks would tire out quickly of it as it's more of the same, just with tweaked gameplay.

Even if they did a 2.0 remake of each planet to make the tile sets unique to each world (I want this) the corridor shooter aspect woild remain dull.

But...some players like that, so DE shoild probably divide resources between those 2 modes. Open & Corridor.

To answer the OP. I want more Open World.

Feel more adventurous, the planets feel more alive, the immersion is better.

The regular corridor gameplay just wears out its welcome after 2 or 3 missions.

[OfPowerOfWant]

I personally want nothing until a permanent resolution to the cyst plotline is ventured upon and resolved honestly, and am definitely not interested in an Infested open world.

Haven't been to eris in years for a reason, a fair mix of boredom, annoyance and disgust.

Have never done plague star either, if lotus and her sheep want to watch infested boils hurdle through space and let them hit a planet while being in a spaceship, with access to archwings "for science"... Why am i killing them?

If another hundreds or thousands of hrs must be invested i'd definitely prefer expansion of the current open worlds and plots. As well as the resolution and alll out annihilation of threats that should have been gone but have been strung along for far too long #nukeEris and the OD

[Vox_Preliator]

I feel that this is exactly what I hoped Plains of Eidolon would be like.  Yesterday I spend hours out there, wandering around, capturing a few animals, doing a bunch of mining, fishing here and there, doing a bounty occasionally, practicing K-Driving, bouncing between a whole bunch of activities to the point that I lost track of time.  There's just so much to do, and it's pretty much all satisfying.  I like the new mining.  I like fishing on Venus.  I like tracking animals.  The bounties all have their unique twists on regular mission types as well as improvements over Plains bounties (such as Caches having highly-visible clouds of smoke).  I'm not good at it yet and I think the initial investment is way too high (5k per part plus 5k to rank up plus even more and then I can start modding my K-Drive?) but just getting from point A to B is enjoyable.

So, more open worlds like the Plains?  Ehhhhh.  More open worlds like the Vallis?  Oh heck yeah.

[Solarsyphon]

Yes I want more Fortuna like updates. DE has long been criticised for having a short attention span.  Fortuna is the solution to that. Its a combination of content similar to what we would have got in updates but designed to go together instead of be apart. A cohesive whole like Fortuna should always be the end goal.  

It's also kind of a false dichotomy to say open world or mid year updates. DE can find a balance and there are allot of side options such as breaking an open world into pieces. 

 

[Xgomme]

Yeah for sure, and now they made 2 of them I'm pretty sure they can speed up the production of later ones. They can also find some easier openworlds to do between ones needing more work... (Example : "Space Openworld", with a lot of AW exploration and some meteors/ships you can visit here and there. "Uranus Openworld" a big ocean with underwater caves and life, with some grineer bases, pirate grineers, boats and why not a sentient kraken)

 

But I would really love an infested one on Eris, and one based on acolytes/stalker too (kitframes !  )

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

I wouldn't mind a "Open World Jupiter.".. but for Rail Jack...Sail the Jupiter skies while maybe throwing in some monsters lurking under the clouds at a  certain height..because c'mon we need a giant space squid cruising under the clouds...Have some major ports like those giant floating refinement centers you can sail to where some are hostile while other are ports of commerce...I can see that happening...

 

 

[Guest]

Really diggin' Fortuna this far, didn't like Plains all that much.

I'm not against them making more open worlds in the future but I think they should make something else for the next two years or so.

[Lost_Cartographer]

19 hours ago, Erytroxylin said:

We still need an infested and Orokin open world.

Infested need an overhaul first, Orokin would probably be Lua if not some huge temple in the Void.

But I think it's pretty much a shoo-in the next open world will be Mars, and they'll probably ratchet up the "war" theme that's going on on Mars by additionally making it some form of competitive PvE - Tenno get to take sides and help the team of their choice push and take territory.  Kind of like invasions, only across the surface of a planet.

[FunJester]

After reading comment after comment, the sum of the story is 'people got bored of fortuna rather fast because their mechanics are very familiar to the grind of PoE'. And seriously, I dont blame them because Obs Vallis does introduce similar grind just like PoE (mining, fishing, bounty, etc.) but it does improve a lot of the mechanics where we as the players find it annoying during the PoE release. But as I see this trend continues, I can foreseen the danger where the Open World formula might do more harm than good to the Warframe experience if it is left unchecked. Many veteran (like myself) is feeling the 'Warframe burnout', not bcz of the open world expansion; But rather we have felt a deja vu from the PoE experiences, which is the progress of the Open World do not translate well to the overall gameplay.

In the Star Chart, there are 18 different types of resources to grind. Although there are several planets to farm for them, you are only able to grind 4 different (non-exclusive) resources from each respective world. This is VERY CONVENIENT for the players since they can casually acquire them during a quick run mission without them feeling that they are forcefully playing for it. But, unlike the Star Chart, the PoE require different method to acquire different types of resources (i.e: fishing and mining). It is very time consuming and it really drains the whole experience as you are PRAYING TO RNGesus so that you can get some rare materials from mining (heart nyth, radian sentirum) and fishing (murkray, cuthol, etc.) in order to start building. And to add insult to injury, these materials are only exclusive to blueprints that are found in PoE. If DE is following the same formula to create more Open World, it means: 

 

More new Open World for each planets => 

More new resources (mining and fishing) to grind =>

More taxing for newer player to keep up and More annoying for veterans to keep track

 

It would spell out disasters since DE is busy building unnecessary grinds to the game that nobody asked for while sacrificing consistent new update. 

Now, dont get me wrong, I did not say that I against for a new Open World expansion. As a matter of fact, I am looking forward to see open world with Orokin, Infested or Sentients theme. 

But what I am against is unnecessary Open World expansion with SIMILAR enemy theme (i.e: Grineer and Corpus) for EACH and EVERY planet on the Star Chart. To emphasis my point even further, ONE open world expansion for each enemy faction is more than enough.

Once DE have release an open world for each and every enemy factions, my only hope is that DE would expand and improve upon the foundation that they have build for PoE and Fortuna with new quests, new bosses and bigger map rather than building repetitive grind without any meaningful content.

Edited November 10, 2018 by FunJester

[Guest]

4 hours ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

Well as DE learns more from making such content the development will get smoother & faster.

Folks forget DE wasn't solely working on Fortuna.

They were working on Fortuna, Railjack, Chimera, Sacrifice, Melee 3.0 (and previous rebalances), Weapon Revisions, Frame Reworks, implementing Tennogen, new weapons, new UI, & Arbitrations.

 

The development of Fortuna was pretty fast, actually. The first time they showed us Fortuna stuff was less than 9 months ago (in Devstream 107), and it was just some concept art and a short video showing off the hub.

Edited November 10, 2018 by Guest