Feedback on the recent update

[Melanholic7]

18 минут назад, hazerddex сказал:

who the hell does 5 hour endurance? i do a hour long at most. who the hell has time for  5 hour endurance with jobs, family obligations etc.

“ im not doing it = nobody need this”. Stupid logic. 

and u can do endurance runs doing pause in solo mode and go eat or take a nap or work in between. 

Yes, im running 1h only, but this doesnt mean other people shouldnt do this. 

omg. Half of community are “i dont need this = only idiots need this”. Yeee, sure. 

[(PSN)TertulSee]

The post that screams “you ruined the game” after every update. I highly doubt you’ve actually spent enough time to let change sink in. The problem isn’t that everything is now nerfed, it’s because you lost your way of cheesing the game. You shouldn’t be cheesing the game in the first place. You have never seen struggle and you probably never will. Looking at the broader picture, everything seems more balanced than the mess that was before. Everything seems more orderly and you don’t even have a grasp on what changing builds might do to help you. Eventually some player will create a build that becomes meta and abuses the system just like every major change. I can’t even play the new update yet and I see all these complaints that seem to be about nothing. There is actually content that seems hard now and you complain about how everything is now weak because their weak to the content that’s supposed to be hard. You make cheesing the game sound like a necessity rather than a temporary setback. Be gone from this game if you wish for no one will miss you.

Edited November 2, 2019 by (PS4)TertulSee

[GrimAtrament]

6 minutes ago, Melanholic7 said:

“ im not doing it = nobody need this”. Stupid logic. 

and u can do endurance runs doing pause in solo mode and go eat or take a nap or work in between. 

Yes, im running 1h only, but this doesnt mean other people shouldnt do this. 

omg. Half of community are “i dont need this = only idiots need this”. Yeee, sure. 

your electric company must love you also as some one in pc repair leaving your computer on that long running a game will damage it. pausing it does not stop the resources it's eating. not to mention it's still an online game so if your wifi goes out when your gone your kicked out of the game. it's not stupid logic its simply the fact that to leave your computer running a game for that many hours on ended without stop is not healthy for the hardware.

Edited November 1, 2019 by hazerddex

[XzWasPzX]

hace 4 minutos, Melanholic7 dijo:

“ im not doing it = nobody need this”. Stupid logic. 

and u can do endurance runs doing pause in solo mode and go eat or take a nap or work in between. 

Yes, im running 1h only, but this doesnt mean other people shouldnt do this. 

omg. Half of community are “i dont need this = only idiots need this”. Yeee, sure. 

Hey hey hey... Pls stop. While im in your side i cannot tolerate this kind of behaviours, calling "stupid logic", that doesnt help to your argumentation, its just a way to express rage and insult people. Lets keep toxicity in healthy levels, pls.

And Id like to ask this to "both" sides, pls discuss things with calm, we are all mates, all tenno. 

Edited November 1, 2019 by XzWasPzX

[Yakhul]

So many entitled people, ever since the update launched, heck, even before the update calling the entire melee a nerf and stuff without even having tried it yet.

But hey, at least they provide with good laughing material.

[darkbrick]

il y a 40 minutes, hazerddex a dit :

who the hell does 5 hour endurance? i do a hour long at most. who the hell has time for  5 hour endurance with jobs, family obligations etc.

someone who doesn't have job / life..

[XzWasPzX]

Justo ahora, darkbrick dijo:

someone who doesn't have job / life..

And you want to punish them with less fun? Isn't it enough not to have a job or a life?

[FlyingDice]

ITT: OP whines without playing the game.

 

(Seriously, Ember feels #*!%ing fantastic now, for the first time in basically forever.)

Also ITT: OP whines about losing the most blatantly overpowered mod setup this game has seen in its history. Seriously, CO+WW+BR+MS+Berserker was genuinely disgusting. Powerful, yes, but to the point of completely occluding everything else in the game from viability except for a handful of other outliers. I, for one, am glad that DE are finally starting to rein in some of the idiotic powercreep they've introduced -- and this comes from someone who ran basically nothing except atterax spinning when doing anything other than leveling more melee weapons to drop back into the armory and never touch again. Thank god it's dead, it should have died a long time ago.

[GrimAtrament]

8 minutes ago, XzWasPzX said:

And you want to punish them with less fun? Isn't it enough not to have a job or a life?

i mean they are not the people that de gets money from...to harsh?

 

also pausing eating and sleeping defeat the point of the endurance part of endurance runs.

Edited November 1, 2019 by hazerddex

[Cubewano]

4 minutes ago, XzWasPzX said:

And you want to punish them with less fun? Isn't it enough not to have a job or a life?

Moreso not helping to facilitate what is likely a bad/unhealthy situation, or worse off actively prey on/manipulate that state. 

[XzWasPzX]

hace 1 minuto, hazerddex dijo:

i mean they are not the people that de gets money from...to harsh?

It is not even true this kind of players are "poor". Daniel the Demon made one of the most long runs  I ve ever seen in the Kuva Survival, with a skilled team, youtubers and players that gave money to the game by making the streamings and encouraging others to try. 

Endurance runs and players are a percentage of the playerbase, they exist because the game allows... well, allowed to achieve those records with enough skill. Dont base your argumentation in false stereotypes of poors and richs, because its not true. 

[GrimAtrament]

Just now, XzWasPzX said:

It is not even true this kind of players are "poor". Daniel the Demon made one of the most long runs  I ve ever seen in the Kuva Survival, with a skilled team, youtubers and players that gave money to the game by making the streamings and encouraging others to try. 

Endurance runs and players are a percentage of the playerbase, they exist because the game allows... well, allowed to achieve those records with enough skill. Dont base your argumentation in false stereotypes of poors and richs, because its not true. 

but those youtubers also don't go for 5 hours with no food or sleep so it's no longer endurance run. >_>

[XzWasPzX]

hace 1 minuto, Cubewano dijo:

Moreso not helping to facilitate what is likely a bad/unhealthy situation, or worse off actively prey on/manipulate that state. 

As i said the post before, its not even true, this line of argument is false and leads to false conclusions.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

30 minutes ago, hazerddex said:

your electric company must love you also as some one in pc repair leaving your computer on that long running a game will damage it. pausing it does not stop the resources it's eating. not to mention it's still an online game so if your wifi goes out when your gone your kicked out of the game. it's not stupid logic its simply the fact that to leave your computer running a game for that many hours on ended without stop is not healthy for the hardware.

Hasn't killed my pc yet and Yes, I do long endurance runs from time to time while working 2 jobs, 60 hrs a week.

[XzWasPzX]

Justo ahora, hazerddex dijo:

but those youtubers also don't go for 5 hours with no food or sleep so it's no longer endurance run. >_>

Check by yourself...

 

 

[ant99999]

2 часа назад, ArcadiaRose сказал:

Okay let's entertain this idea. So if newer equipment generally never has better stats, say equal or lower, then the only thing that's going for them is newness and maybe some exciting thing to go along with it (I.e.: the sword beam from that two handed nikana I can't recall the name of at the moment). Newness and some fancy gimmick only have so much welcome room. At some point for a sizeable number of players these principles lose their shine. And if the weapon happens to be weaker than older weapons then it's subject to disappointment from players on launch. Galvacord, Plink, and many others, they're all new weapons, don't fall under power creep and are generally never talked about, barely anyone seems to care. There was nothing satisfying in their release.

 

Relative power creep is nearly inevitable. And if you think there's an alternative or a solution to it then what've you have proposed really isn't it. The thing is true balance is never the answer, everything becomes too similar. In theory, imbalance is okay, so long as certain things can reach the same benchmark. A weapon can be 3 or 5 times more OP than another but it could be acceptable so long as they can both succeed in clearing higher level content. On top of that, not everything can rise to be an endgame killer. As much as I'd love to keep using my first Lato, I know at some point I have to put it down.

That's pretty much what I mean by telling such power creep is inevitable. I know something like this will happen. But to slow it down and keep the older weapons relevant, the devs have to eventually revisit all the old stuff and bring it to the level of the newer one. That won't of course achieve perfect balance (in a game like Warframe nothing would), but it will make the power creep more bearable.

3 часа назад, ArcadiaRose сказал:

"Make Tenora Prime equal to the regular one, or ... make the regular Tenora weaker." Really? That's a pretty hot take. Once again, what's the point? Why even bother with Tenora Prime if overall it's as good as the regular Tenora? Why, because it'll look better? Sound better? Once again, the aesthetic pleasure eventually loses it's welcome and the effectiveness of the weapon will decide it prevails. On the other hand, nerfing the regular Tenora in favor of making the new Tenora Prime more wanted? As if the community wants any more nerfing, let alone one that really isn't needed. Congratulations you've created artificial value.

Ok, I think I chose the wrong wording. By "equal" I mean "equal in effectiveness". It's also called side grade, IIRC. Look at the PvP balance, it's there, and it makes sense to choose a non-prime version over prime and vice versa, which means it could've been introduced in PvE also. But I guess, 

3 часа назад, ArcadiaRose сказал:

At some point for a sizeable number of players these principles lose their shine

 

If you imagine Rivens actually scaling depending on weapon strength instead of popularity, you can say they are basically balance patches, but automated. Although the very concept of Rivens has such unpleasant parts as kuva powered slot machine, a possibility of a "god-roll", breaking the game economy and common sense with hugely overpriced offers, Riven mafia and such.

I honestly don't know why they had to make them so RNG-heavy if their intent was to make weaker weapons viable.

[Goodwill]

37 minutes ago, XzWasPzX said:

This game begun as a fantasy power, now that the power is gone some ask why others complain... Well, just use the brain. The new melee system hits hard on the main core of the game, Im not gonna blame them for "screaming" about this, I would ask the devs this simply: where are you taking us? Whats the goal now?

Reasonable question that even I would like to know.

But Warframe did not begin as a power fantasy game. It began as a ninja shooter and we were nowhere near the omnipotent beings we are now. I wouldn't say DE is trying to go back to Warframe's roots (Vauban and Ember rework focused on making them stronger) but I do see DE is trying to go for the middle ground here. Evident in the melee rework where weaker weapons were brought up while stronger, outlying builds were brought down.

I would guess that what DE wants is still a power fantasy game, but a game that they can reasonably develop fun and engaging content around. You can't develop engaging content around mechanics that reward being not engaged. How well they can and will do this is still up in the air.

[GrimAtrament]

3 minutes ago, XzWasPzX said:

Check by yourself...

 

 

hes not doing one mission for 8 hours on that stream hes doing it for 7 since you didn't count the time he was talking.

Edited November 1, 2019 by hazerddex

[XzWasPzX]

hace 2 minutos, hazerddex dijo:

hes not doing one mission for 8 hours on that stream.

 

Ok and what is he doing according to you?

[mraz641]

46 minutes ago, Melanholic7 said:

Give us back old Blood rush or this is a bullcrap. 

And yea, nice part of the game - farm kuva, farm rivens, roll them, efforts and etc aaaand they are gone. Wow, nice rewards for efforts. Nice system. 

And you are right, Kuva liches are just couple new good weapons. thats all. Once u got them - this whole huge system will be not useful. 

New kavat - with useless mods. Why? why cant u add any usefull buff to him? ok, another mastery fodder. 

 

later on with railjack update liches will come help you in space fights that is what DE said. And I am 100% that having liches by your side in upcoming new war is going to be of tremendous help

[GrimAtrament]

1 minute ago, XzWasPzX said:

 

Ok and what is he doing according to you?

a job shift if hes getting paid then it's a job which means hes not one of the jobless lifeless so what was your point agian?

[XzWasPzX]

hace 1 minuto, hazerddex dijo:

a job shift if hes getting paid then it's a job which means hes not one of the jobless lifeless so what was your point agian?

So, if i understand what you say... all the youtubers and streamers making long runs are indeed false prohets that lead bunches of poors and people with no lifes or jobs with toxic gaming habits like the endurance runs? Are you really saying that?

 

So basically, anyone who wants to force their own limit and skills in the game has no life or work, and all these youtubers and streamers are the leaders of this toxic sect. You wanna say that? Rather it seems that you don't understand why someone would put efforts to improve on something they really like. That says a lot about you, and not good.

 

 

[Cha0zb0rn]

I have 2 serious questions for everybody defending the rework and the nerfs:

 

1.) Who benefitted from the rework? 

Is it the causual player? The person how never got past level 100 enemies in the first place? maybe a bit, the basedmg rose quite a bit. 

The "farmer"? The players who spend lots of time grinding for focus and resources? They got gutted. You cant farm higher level content now as easy as before. Still possible but a lot more tedious. 

The high end endurance runner? Those got basicly f*cked. A 2 hour run should not even be possible at this point. A 1 hour run should be extremely difficult by now. 

 

 2.) Why are you even in favor of this rework?

Did farmers or endurance runners ever got in the way of your personal enjoyment of the game? If you are a causual you always had the chance to opt out of a run at the 10 minute mark and farmers usually did farm in solomode anyway so why do you enjoy those players being basicly told by DE that their existence in the game is not wanted? 

 

The game has no endgame. There is literally nothing you can do at some point in the game except from "farming and selling" and "running endurance" for fun. ppl who frequently used the market benefitted greatly from farmers while endurance runners never hurt anybody. So what went wrong in your miserable life that you have to grief those players? There is literally no point in playing this game once you hit level 27. And everything between level 12(-ish, the point where you finish the main story) and level 27 is just grinding exp. You are either just jealous that you never were able to run an endurance run yourself because of the lack of skill or you never put the dedication in the game to reach the point where you were able to get near a million dmg per hit and thus felt inferior. Either way: If you defend the update you are a pretty S#&$ty person. Who in their right mind would defend a nerf that gutted a whole play system by roughly 90%? What sane person would say:"sure, I like small white numbers more than big red numers"? It might "feel better" now, sure, but it has lost its entire purpose. There simply is no reason to go melee anymore. primaries and even secondaries are stronger and safer now. And don't get me started on the "heavy attacks".....those do pretty much nothing aside from wasting your combo counter.

 

 

[GrimAtrament]

Just now, XzWasPzX said:

So, if i understand what you say... all the youtubers and streamers making long runs are indeed false prohets that lead bunches of poors and people with no lifes or jobs with toxic gaming habits like the endurance runs? Are you really saying that?

 

So basically, anyone who wants to force their own limit and skills in the game has no life or work, and all these youtubers and streamers are the leaders of this toxic sect. You wanna say that? Rather it seems that you don't understand why someone would put efforts to improve on something they really like. That says a lot about you, and not good.

so that's what you got from me saying that this was a job since they get paid to do this? that sure says alot about you with your assumptions you made with zero evidence. you seem to be throwing buzzwords like toxic around a lot.

 

 

[XzWasPzX]

hace 1 minuto, hazerddex dijo:

so that's what you got from me saying that this was a job since they get paid to do this? that sure says alot about you with your assumptions you made with zero evidence. you seem to be throwing buzzwords like toxic around a lot.

 

 

Change my mind.