What if Elemental ward and Vex armour was one ability

[(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA]

1 hour ago, KnossosTNC said:

It would be incredibly overpowered. Right now, at least you have to keep an eye on your timers and energy. Merging them would turn it into a tank ability to end all tank abilities, with an insane damage boost to boot.

I dont think hes all that tanky compared to some other frames. His damage ability is a thing but even that's not THAT great for general gameplay compared to several DPS abilities.

I get your point though. I'm still just sad that 2 of his 4 abilities are just plain awful.

But, if they did this, I dont know what they would do with the extra ability slot.

[DrBorris]

48 minutes ago, WhiteWolf3500 said:

I agree that it would be a QoL change, however it could be tricky due to energy cost. I would say it can't get lowered when those would be merged and then it could look like a nerf actually since the upkeep costs are already really high and hard to deal with without extra help. However if the energy cost would be lowered, then chroma might become too easy to upkeep. It's already really powerful with little risk. Comparing this to mirage damage buff, she only gets one buff at the time, even if they are more powerful and cost less they still require great deal of positioning. Chroma can get both but his upkeep cost is extremely high. Seems like a balance decision to me. 

Or, hear me out, we just nuke Chroma's entire kit and start from fresh? Make Chroma the KNIGHT he deserves to be.

 

And I honestly don't think the balance would be that bad, as some have mentioned the damage buffs aren't even that useful in normal content. If it is a bit easier to upkeep Chroma during Eidolons... whoop-de-do.

Seriously though, Chroma needs a rework the scale of or even more extreme than Ember's.

[taiiat]

allowing Elemental Ward (and/or Chroma overall per Ability) to change Elements would make things function well but... i mean yeah you could merge the two if you wanted. expect it to get expensive, though. 100E for sure, if not additional costs.

1 hour ago, KnossosTNC said:

Merging them would turn it into a tank ability to end all tank abilities, with an insane damage boost to boot.

i think you overestimate how effective Elemental Ward and Vex Armor are.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

I like Chromas 2 and 3 as is, but there are 3 reasons he needs a rework (a proper one too):

- his 1 is terrible. I would honestly just leave the fire breath gimmick to Effigy (we'll get to that in moment) and replace it with something else. Chroma doesn't really do CC very well, so maybe that would be a good avenue to go down?

- his 4 is terrible. it takes up WAY too much energy per second, it's range is too short and it does nowhere near enough damage to justify that kind of energy cost. IMO it should be buffed energy per second cost reduced and allowed to fly freely towards enemies, like an airborne drone (but made out of skin and hatred). the augment would need changing too, maybe make Effigy able to carry a smaller version of elemental Ward for Chroma and his allies? we don't have a "drone frame" and Dragons can fly so... I think it's work.

- there's almost no reason to play Shock or Toxin Chroma. Hildryn makes a better shield-frame and Toxin Chroma's gun buffs are near useless compared to the armour benefits of Ice Chroma. these versions of Chroma need a total and complete rework, ad I think allowing us to select our chosen element separately - rather than tying it to Energy Colour and limiting our fashionframe - would be nice. no reason why Frost should be allowed red ice while Chroma isn't IMO.

sadly considering Chroma's previous tweaks and his position in the Meta, I doubt DE will bother to look at him, especially since we've had his Prime for a while now.

[KiroTheTraveler]

19 minutes ago, (PS4)robotwars7 said:

I like Chromas 2 and 3 as is, but there are 3 reasons he needs a rework (a proper one too):

- his 1 is terrible. I would honestly just leave the fire breath gimmick to Effigy (we'll get to that in moment) and replace it with something else. Chroma doesn't really do CC very well, so maybe that would be a good avenue to go down?

- his 4 is terrible. it takes up WAY too much energy per second, it's range is too short and it does nowhere near enough damage to justify that kind of energy cost. IMO it should be buffed energy per second cost reduced and allowed to fly freely towards enemies, like an airborne drone (but made out of skin and hatred). the augment would need changing too, maybe make Effigy able to carry a smaller version of elemental Ward for Chroma and his allies? we don't have a "drone frame" and Dragons can fly so... I think it's work.

- there's almost no reason to play Shock or Toxin Chroma. Hildryn makes a better shield-frame and Toxin Chroma's gun buffs are near useless compared to the armour benefits of Ice Chroma. these versions of Chroma need a total and complete rework, ad I think allowing us to select our chosen element separately - rather than tying it to Energy Colour and limiting our fashionframe - would be nice. no reason why Frost should be allowed red ice while Chroma isn't IMO.

sadly considering Chroma's previous tweaks and his position in the Meta, I doubt DE will bother to look at him, especially since we've had his Prime for a while now.

I want them to remove the ability to shed the pelt, he looks boring without it. Let us have those wings on effigy instead! 

[Maka.Bones]

I'd be fine with it, if there was also a way to divide it or make it work differently. 

Like... it would need a condition to apply one, or the other, or both. 

[Cubewano]

the ability would have to be heavily nerfed in kind, so no thanks. there is a reason de puts off having to touch him, there is no way to spread out his kit without tuning down what he has, much less combing what good things he already has. 

Edited November 26, 2019 by Cubewano

[KnightOwl_]

Merge them but making it so you can’t recast.  Not like 90% of chromas don’t cast them together anyway so I don’t see how combining is OP but yeah. 
 

his 1 badly needs 100% status.  At least then it will have. Minor role as CC.  His 4 augment should be baked in and improved.  He needs a real rework (screw eidolon babies and their mini game) but until then things can be done.  

[KnightOwl_]

Oh and I’m sorry but stupid <expletive> eidolons are NO excuse chroma shouldn’t be reworked for the other 99% of the game.  

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

6 hours ago, CaptainStrawberry said:

True but it could give room for more exciting and creative abilities. 

One...one more ability.

[WhiteWolf3500]

8 hours ago, DrBorris said:

Seriously though, Chroma needs a rework the scale of or even more extreme than Ember's.

I fully agree on that one. 

[zoffmode]

8 hours ago, DrBorris said:

Seriously though, Chroma needs a rework the scale of or even more extreme than Ember's.

I disagree. But then again I believe reworks should be decided on basis of "is there a spot for this frame?" or "is this frame usable/viable?" or "does it absolutely break the game and make it impossible to balance?".

Chroma is way past being viable. He has plenty of spots everywhere. He's played very often by a lot of people. Does he break the game? Well, not that much really.

He is arguably quite boring, yes. But then if you're bored of him, there's plenty of other choices. Besides, definition of interesting differs in people... or some people straight up prefer playing something boring.

So, no. Why would you need to rework him? There's plenty of much more important stuff to work/rework and reworking Chroma is quite a waste of time. Except his 1. Spend a minute to make his 1 at least work with weapons or something.

[Zeiss17]

As a chroma main since beginning of my playtime in u16 sanctuary in 2016 (i bought him by getting full price platinum at the time mind you) i can safely say what I said when his prime came out. His 2 and 3 are fine the way they are. The only problem is the 1 which is never used and his 4 which is niche use at best. They should make his 1 an element cycle ability and his 4 something like an element surge thing. Like you could use it to explode your vex armor outwards and like...damage people around depending on the element you're on.

Tbh 1 and 4 can be literally changed to anything else and it would be an improvement.

[White_Matter]

His 1st ability is completely useless. 2nd and 3rd abilities are self/aura buffs that may as well be combined and what did his 4 do again ? Lol.

So yeah, expect a rework soon. Complete makeover would be the better word.

[SenorClipClop]

14 hours ago, CaptainStrawberry said:

How would you feel if these two abilities were merged into one button.

Then he'd have one ability worth using. 😉 

But in all seriousness, he just needs a bit of a touch-up to get all four of his abilities going strong. His two could maybe use a bit of extra oomph, like a touch of elemental damage buff on weapons or chance to proc that element on enemies within a radius. His 4 is pretty alright but it needs more battlefield presence, like duplicating Chrpma's abilities and acting as a second source for them (imagine a draconic support turret buffing your gunner allies with Vex Armor while you're up front swinging a sword around). His 1 is lackluster and could use a boost to its damage, Status chance or both, but I thin( the most significant change would be to increase its effective range. Its current little AoE feels like a slower, less capable Ignis. Perhaps if it had a quick charge-up and a big wide cone of damage/status, covering everyone remotely in front of Chroma and priming the area with Status procs (bonus points if it covers the terrain for a duration becoming kinda like a mini Ice Wave/ Hallowed Ground hybrid).

[DrBorris]

4 hours ago, zoffmode said:

I disagree. But then again I believe reworks should be decided on basis of "is there a spot for this frame?" or "is this frame usable/viable?" or "does it absolutely break the game and make it impossible to balance?".

Chroma is way past being viable. He has plenty of spots everywhere. He's played very often by a lot of people. Does he break the game? Well, not that much really.

He is arguably quite boring, yes. But then if you're bored of him, there's plenty of other choices. Besides, definition of interesting differs in people... or some people straight up prefer playing something boring.

So, no. Why would you need to rework him? There's plenty of much more important stuff to work/rework and reworking Chroma is quite a waste of time. Except his 1. Spend a minute to make his 1 at least work with weapons or something.

I could not disagree more. Personally I look at what gameplay a Warframe offers over everything else. Cause, ya know, we play the game for the gameplay. To me, Chroma is just as dead as Nyx to me. Sure, Chroma is far better than Nyx, but I have more fun playing Nyx therefore I am more likely to play Nyx. When I do use Chroma it isn't to use Chroma, it is to use Big Number Simulator™.

And if a Warframe is powerful and being often used, that is even more reason for them to offer good gameplay. If you have a sizable portion of the playerbase using a piece of content you would want that content to be good, right? By having Chroma be "good" and "horribly designed" the game is offering a strictly inferior gameplay experience to those that want to min/max. You should not be punished with bad gameplay just because you want to do well in a mission. Playing the game shouldn't feel like a chore.

 

And band-aid solutions are a long-term waste of time. Like, look at Nyx again. She got "reworked" but the time spent on her rework was effectively wasted because it did nothing to fix her issues. Chroma has no gameplay, no character, despite being possibly the most interesting "character" in the game (A knight wearing a sentient dragon pelt). Just a few buffs to his 1 won't change Chroma's flaw.

 

3 hours ago, ShaneKahnnigan17 said:

As a chroma main since beginning of my playtime in u16 sanctuary in 2016 (i bought him by getting full price platinum at the time mind you) i can safely say what I said when his prime came out. His 2 and 3 are fine the way they are. The only problem is the 1 which is never used and his 4 which is niche use at best. They should make his 1 an element cycle ability and his 4 something like an element surge thing. Like you could use it to explode your vex armor outwards and like...damage people around depending on the element you're on.

Tbh 1 and 4 can be literally changed to anything else and it would be an improvement.

But... why are they good? Just because something is useful that does not mean it is a good design. Chroma's 2 and 3 are basically one ability, the have the same duration, are recast at basically the same time, act as passive buffs, and you need them active 100% of the time for Chroma to do anything. Look at the big picture of how Chroma's kit works, having to push two buttons doesn't make Chroma's gameplay any more interesting. It isn't more difficult, it is not like you are being tactical when you use each of the abilities, they are basically just Chroma's passive except with the requirement of hitting a button every so often.

Chroma is just a (practically) immortal big number generator, neither of those things change the way you play the game. Hell, if anything they make it so you have to play the game less. Even the meat-sack that is Inaros has more gameplay nuance than Chroma.

[KiroTheTraveler]

I don't see why we take off the pelt, let us become the four so I propose we remove the gimmick of Chroma removing his armour

[Diavoros]

Probably in a chroma rework they would be merged into one ability, since both have the same duration and are kinda meant to be used together, which would also solve the issue with elemental ward not being re-castable when the effect is still up.

[zoffmode]

2 minutes ago, DrBorris said:

I could not disagree more. Personally I look at what gameplay a Warframe offers over everything else. Cause, ya know, we play the game for the gameplay. To me, Chroma is just as dead as Nyx to me. Sure, Chroma is far better than Nyx, but I have more fun playing Nyx therefore I am more likely to play Nyx. When I do use Chroma it isn't to use Chroma, it is to use Big Number Simulator™.

And if a Warframe is powerful and being often used, that is even more reason for them to offer good gameplay. If you have a sizable portion of the playerbase using a piece of content you would want that content to be good, right? By having Chroma be "good" and "horribly designed" the game is offering a strictly inferior gameplay experience to those that want to min/max. You should not be punished with bad gameplay just because you want to do well in a mission. Playing the game shouldn't feel like a chore.

 

And band-aid solutions are a long-term waste of time. Like, look at Nyx again. She got "reworked" but the time spent on her rework was effectively wasted because it did nothing to fix her issues. Chroma has no gameplay, no character, despite being possibly the most interesting "character" in the game (A knight wearing a sentient dragon pelt). Just a few buffs to his 1 won't change Chroma's flaw.

Obviously, in a perfect world, you'd have ability to improve everything and make all frames fun for everyone and the like. But this isn't perfect world.

The reason I say he doesn't really need a rework is because for every fix attempt there's high chance of ruining it. Basically "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". By reworking a frame that a lot of people like and is already in a good place, you actually risk alienating a big part of playerbase. And if it works out, it won't change all that much honestly. So risk vs reward is not worth it IMO.

[KnightOwl_]

19 minutes ago, zoffmode said:

Obviously, in a perfect world, you'd have ability to improve everything and make all frames fun for everyone and the like. But this isn't perfect world.

The reason I say he doesn't really need a rework is because for every fix attempt there's high chance of ruining it. Basically "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". By reworking a frame that a lot of people like and is already in a good place, you actually risk alienating a big part of playerbase. And if it works out, it won't change all that much honestly. So risk vs reward is not worth it IMO.

His “role” is so niche and monotonous that being in a good place means little.  His uses, outside of us stubborn folks who use him because we badly want a dragon frame, is literally 2 boss fights and that’s it. That’s not a good place.  That’s like saying the Detroit lions are ok because the Dolphins exist.  So yes, he is broke.  He has one of, if not the most useless 1 abilities in the game, his 2 and 3 are boring buffs, and his 4 is pathetic.  He needs a rework.  

This is why I hate min-maxed number crunchers because they don’t see the forest from the trees and realize a broken, boring frame can be made so much more fun for the rest of the game because he lets them get a 5x3 instead of a 4x3 or some garbage.  

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

 

Been saying that for while now...

I always hit both abilities while on the move..combining them would allow for Chroma to explore a new power...I vote on it being us riding the Effigy around like the Old Spice Guy.