I have a question about "New War", i "MUST" upgrade my railjack to play it?

[Kaotyke]

2 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

Talks about tier 1 cetus amps and how easy they are to get and make your operator viable for anything compared to railjack grind which is what your first post implied.

"But achktually fortuna amps are not easy to get and why does the 2% rare drop mod chance have to do anything with what I'm saying when I specifically made ore and wisps farm RNG compared to that?"

You are just jumbling things togheter arent you?

Again, no. I talked about Upgrading. I didnt compare anything about acquiring. Only about upgrading and that OP will have an easier time if they do Upgrade. The avalabilty and methods of aquisition and the rng talk is all on you.

Its now a Mod. It was the Vidar Reactor first, now its a 2% Mod.

Now we are at Mods, people.

[HowDenKing]

Just to add salt to the wound: 

not only no the new war - also no duviri paradox ayy

[CopperBezel]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Silverback73 said:

No,  but you MUST run missions with other crews until all intrinsics are rank 7.

1) One Intrinsics rank. It doesn't matter which. I went into Veil with Rank 7 Gunnery and Rank 4 everything else. Now I have Rank 8 Gunnery and Rank 4 everything else. 

2) Or get taxied by a friend.

Edited December 31, 2019 by CopperBezel

[BornWithTeeth]

@ChaosSabre

 

Please relax and try to let go of this argument. For the record, while you've been a perfectly reasonable poster on other topics, I feel that you're incorrect on this one. The process of going from having no Railjack at all to having a Railjack with a good, functional build is far, far less time consuming and demanding than the process of going from The War Within to having a fully upgraded and combat ready Operator. The most expensive part of the entire process is getting off the ground in the first place.

 

Pining after the very tip top gear in the form of rare drops is not helpful, and to be perfectly honest, those drops are not likely to become the new mandatory any time soon. DE are notoriously bad at gauging the difficulty of their own game. They felt that Empyrean was content which would not be practical to do solo. Boom. People are soloing the highest difficulty levels of the game mode, like three weeks after it came out.

[bad4youLT]

Erra quest is locked behind railjack content and while you can get taxied and get it unlocked by the help of other players were is a good chance that certen part of New War might be locked to solo play .

So yeah I would suggest to invest bit tho no rush , not like its coming out soon , wait for bug fixes if the current condition of railjack is unplayable for you.

[BornWithTeeth]

12 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

I think you are misunderstanding Quest ready operator and Combat ready operator. If you want to go tridolons super fast and effectively then yes you'd need to invest a lot of time farming arcanes and focus plus resources to build the meta amps. But we are talking bout quest ready railjack compared to a quest ready operator. Just build a riplak prism with basic components and your operator will be able to handle umbra no problem. Sure you are not gonna one shot him as someone with tons of gear but he'll still be a joke. With new arcane changes you might even be able to get a higher level magus vigor at a decent rate.

Compared to what you need for Quest ready railjack. To get there you need intrinsic rank 7 and a ship that can survive in veil to finish missions which is at least a mix of mk1 and mk2 gear hopefully mk3 if you got a clan that is active. Most people don't and will have to rely on mission drops. Sure you can hitch a ride on someone's ship to get there now but DE said the newer stuff will be more like a war than a quest. It's safe to assume you'll need at least a mk3 ship with some decent mods to beat those missions once they arrive if they require you to use your ship.

I guess the better way to say it what railjack do you need to get to sentient ship to start the quest. Technically none if you are willing to just hitch rides or cheese the system.

What was said was specifically related comparing operator strength to quests and comparing those to stats of railjack. So no Mk1 railjack is nowhere near as good as a operator with just tier 1 amp for related content.

I am genuinely just kinda mystified as to where it came from, the idea that a player will need a top tier Railjack with maxed out rare-drop-of-a-rare-drop gear in order to do New War missions. That's....daft. You are here, in this exact post, acknowledging that accessing the prelude quest, Erra, requires only Mk 2's. The research cost of clan tech for the Railjack is trivial, and one doesn't need to actually build any of it in order to access the next tier. Like I pointed out one page ago, a person can build the Railjack and then research up to Mk 3 tier of weapons, shields, engines, and reactor without ever actually doing any Railjack missions, and then all they have to do is run some missions to get the resources to build them.

 

Mate, you're not being reasonable right now. People are pointing out that Clan tech is cheaper than wreckage, that accessing it is not at all dependent on RNG, and that it is perfectly suitable for running the highest level Empyrean content in the game right now, and you pivoted right into talking about how the mod drops are impossible, which, also not true. They're rare drops, but do the missions and you will pick up the avionics you need, while getting the resources necessary to build the gear that makes your ship ready for the Veil. Again, Empyrean dropped less than three weeks ago and already people are soloing the Veil. Do you truly believe that the New War is going to come out in the next, I dunno, eight months, and that DE are going to say to the players "Anyone who didn't get this rare 2% drop is not going to be able to do the New War, not sorry,"?

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

9 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

dude Reb isn't Going to plant a kiss on your forehead for this one 

And you think that any of the "(Mal)content creators" you worship will let you get you get your nose nice and brown? 

Wait... They probably would, wouldn't they? Good thing you got that headstart, I suppose. 🤔

 

 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

3 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

Yes but what about people that don't have access to those? What about people that have a life and can't spend hours farming titanium?

Then they probably don't really have the time to engage in a looter shooter, and will ask for a taxi instead. 

Find something else to complain about, it's not a winning position you've adopted. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

4 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

The damn 2% again.

Yes, I bough up the Fortuna Amps because they are still Amps, which is the topic you brough up. Why should they not be included?

OH WAIT:

They are for Mastery Only so they do not count!

Oh sweet baby Jebus! Someone grab the phone!

Because I freacking called it! We are now talking of materials!

Someone give me a cigar.

Can't mail it to you, but I still have a couple direct from the new Partagas factory in Havana. I'll dedicate one to you calling it, later. 👍

[BornWithTeeth]

1 hour ago, ChaosSabre said:

Yes but what about people that don't have access to those? What about people that have a life and can't spend hours farming titanium?

For them only way to get those parts will be the random railjack ones. And yes while sigma is cheaper to repair than those it's arguable that is faster to just farm platinum and rush mk3 parts once you get some drops of those. While you don't NEED the rare avionics drops they accelerate missions and resources farming so much they are almost mandatory if you don't wanna lose your sanity. The difference my railjack had between starting and avionics bundle ones was huge. As I said before I really had bad luck on getting those avionic drops and it felt like slightly tickling enemies without resorting to last stand cheese or just using my archwing.

Well, if those players can only run one or two Railjack missions a week....then by the time the New War is happening, they'll still have all their Mk 3's built. Also, you seem not to realise just how cheap Sigma Mk 3's are compared to wreckage. Leaving aside the issue of plat-purchased repair drones, Clan tech costs significantly less than half the repair cost of same tier House tech. What I am getting at is that the situation you are describing is absurd. In order for a player to be in the position you are describing, they would have to be almost refusing to actually play any Railjack missions. The only way that a player could run several Railjack missions per week (not per evening, per week) and not be able to afford to build any Clan gear is if that player panics and slams the alt-f4 any time they see themselves picking up titanium as a mission reward.

 

I am still not sure exactly what you are arguing from here. Are you insisting that it would be unfair of DE to make the New War remotely challenging? Challenging for who? Challenging by what standards? As I have now pointed out several times, Railjack is less than three weeks released and its highest level content is already being done solo. 

 

ChaosSabre, are you arguing that the New War should be 100% accessible not just to players who haven't put much effort into their Railjack, but to players who actively refuse to upgrade it, even as the game throws them the necessary blueprints and resources? Is that where this is going next?

[BornWithTeeth]

@ChaosSabre

 

Ok. I am feeling, above all else, incredible confusion. Could you please tell me what tier of Clan you're in, and take a quick look in your foundry's Components tab to see how much of the following resources you have: Alloy Plate, Ferrite, Rubedo, Salvage, Polymer Bundles, Nano Spores?

Edited December 31, 2019 by BornWithTeeth

[Kaotyke]

 

4 hours ago, ChaosSabre said:

Why yes mods? Who would even care about  those. Why are you bringing those up? It's not like the best hyperstrike mod that basically triples your damage output only has a 1% chance of dropping. Why does that even matter. Operators have mods that boost their damage too didn't you know? They are at a even lower drop chance. And you need those to make operators viable.

 

Talk about missing the point.

No. You are wrong. You are bringing up excuse after excuse. If one point of yours is debunked, you bring another that had nothing to do with it to try and justify yourself. Emphasis on TRY.

You just want to have the last word.

Then you can have it. If it makes you feel good about yourself.

You will reply to this post. I know you will.

But I wont.

*drops mic*

[Kaotyke]

On 2019-12-30 at 10:59 AM, HugintheCrow said:

I don't understand how is that "pain in the @$$"?

There was no fail state for that "fight", no matter how much health your operator would have, you had infinite respawns and would lose no progress whatsoever when dying.

"Oh no, it took me 5 seconds instead of one" is not exactly what I would qualify as "pain in the @$$".

Now, opposed to that, Railjack DOES in fact have a fail state (as hard as it is to reach it).

Because if you are gamer, you will dislike being "killed" in any form that is not an "Un-winnable Boss fight" trope or something similar.

We had complains about that fight when CoH first came for that very reason. Having people saying they had to run circles around the area even though they knew they didnt have a fail state.

I told someone who was doing The Sacrifice over 6 months back who just returned. He didnt do Saya's Vigil, he didnt meet the Quills. He was doing The Sacrifice. Without spoling anything to him I just said "You know the final fight in CoH? It will be that again if you dont do Saya's Vigil and meet the Quills", he immediatly went to do those 2 "requirements".

Its the mentaility: if they can do well, they WILL want to do well. Even if its a combat that you have no choice but win.

[HugintheCrow]

18 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

Because if you are gamer, you will dislike being "killed" in any form that is not an "Un-winnable Boss fight" trope or something similar.

Guess I'm not a gamer then.

18 minutes ago, Kaotyke said:

We had complains about that fight

We did? God diddly damn...

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, ChaosSabre said:

And yet they'll get a amp faster than they'll build a railjack part. Which was the whole point I tried to make.

If parts just dropped with RNG stats on them then yea it would be a looter shooter. Warframe is a resource grind simulator to build a weapon you want. Combining both of those is not a smart idea. Imagine if in borderlands or diablo or destiny you had to invest other resources each time you got a new drop. That's what Railjack is.

So what? 

 

Did you need to build a Railjack to go on missions? Did you need to upgrade the railjack you didn't build to get to the Veil? Did you need to go through more than a couple of missions to get the quest?

 

Answer those questions honestly and then you can figure out why everyone is telling you to find another dead horse to whip. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

5 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

Of course not.

You don't need to build a operator either.

Till that solo mission comes where you are forced to use it.

Something that hasn't happened in how many years? Something that wasn't required despite how many mainline quests involving solo operators? 

 

Either you aren't speaking from experience, and are a newb complaining about the sky falling, or you are demonstrably arguing in bad faith. Which is it? 

 

[Vox_Preliator]

3 hours ago, ChaosSabre said:

Yes but what about people that don't have access to those? What about people that have a life and can't spend hours farming titanium?

For them only way to get those parts will be the random railjack ones. And yes while sigma is cheaper to repair than those it's arguable that is faster to just farm platinum and rush mk3 parts once you get some drops of those. While you don't NEED the rare avionics drops they accelerate missions and resources farming so much they are almost mandatory if you don't wanna lose your sanity. The difference my railjack had between starting and avionics bundle ones was huge. As I said before I really had bad luck on getting those avionic drops and it felt like slightly tickling enemies without resorting to last stand cheese or just using my archwing.

Again, what are you talking about?  What missions are you even playing that this has been your experience?

It's not uncommon to walk away from a mission with a haul of over a thousand Titanium just from wandering through Asteroid fields while fighting level one fighters, not to mention the chance of even more on mission completion.  Taking a few minutes to actually seek it out after a mission nets plenty.  There is the issue of other platforms not having the most recent patch in which resource drop rates were improved, but that's only a matter of time.

Sure it might be faster to pay for a rush drone after being taxied to a Veil mission, but by a matter of minutes, not even close to hours unless the clan never researched any Sigma things (Which are dirt cheap) or the player in question is actively, stubbornly, nonsensically refusing to use them.

Plus, you're acting as though a player has all the nodes unlocked and rank 7 Intrinsics already, a player kinda has to work through all that normally, and just doing so would net them thousands upon thousands of the resources you claim cannot be collected while "having a life."

The question is:  Is it or is it not reasonable to do Veil missions while decked out in easily-acquired Sigma equipment and common/uncommon Avionics?  It's completely reasonable.  Again, you shouldn't even need to craft more Revolite mid-mission or even reach zero health unless things go very wrong, like ignoring Ramsleds, Crewships, and stationary hazards.

[BornWithTeeth]

4 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

The railjack I played when it launched. Finished all the earth and saturn stuff plus some veil missions and had barely enough titanium to build one sigma series mk3 when we got it done. Is it better now? Saw getting round 1k titanium per run on earth by just particle ramming so it probably is not that bad to get those now.

I just used Sigma mk1 stuff when I farmed veil stuff and that lucky vidar mk3 rushed one for avionics with my railjack and used last stand cheese to actually deal damage with a team that knew what they were doing and rushed the any mk3 parts that dropped during that. My ship is mediocre now but eh I'm fine with it.

Again if your clan has sigma stuff researched. And stuff for that is dirt cheap for active clans. We had to actually do some farming to meet the last few requirements. As I said not every clan has tons of stockpiled resources and has stuff built in first few days. As I said before I wouldn't even complain bout this if these blueprint were just sold by some railjack  vendor that levels up each time you clear a proxima zone.

Could you please tell us what tier your clan is, and how many active members there are?

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

6 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

And you think that any of the "(Mal)content creators" you worship will let you get you get your nose nice and brown? 

Wait... They probably would, wouldn't they? Good thing you got that headstart, I suppose. 🤔

 

 

Not at all after all I gotta focus on my own content creations 😞 sucks alot I'd love to sniff on AGGP like youd love for Reb to notice you and your valiant efforts to shift all blame to the community. The community created will stand forever. Wf could end today and they could make another game if they wanted to. Shut down the servers and poof

[CarstairsTV]

22 hours ago, CopperBezel said:

I don't know it it'll require even that. But if so, yeah, that's going to be it. You'd still need someone to taxi you to Veil to break a crystal at minimum, but even grinding intrinsics to get to Veil yourself doesn't require being in a clan with a drydock and completing Rising Tide, so I doubt The New War will, either.

You're forgetting that cinematic quests are solo though. So yes, you WILL need to do everything yourself since you need your OWN Railjack to play solo. Sure, someone can carry you to get the crystal for Erra, grind intrinsics, or get unique rewards, but they cannot carry you for a cinematic quest. In the end, you will need to make your own Railjack and be competent enough to solo the missions which will likely be on the level of Veil Proxima.

[CopperBezel]

Yeah, I just genuinely don't think that's going to happen. I could easily turn out to be wrong, but I just don't think we have good reason to assume that those things will be required for the quest, while of course we know Erra is.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

6 hours ago, ChaosSabre said:

Oh now it's not hard to get a operator tier 1 amp to do those easily eh? Which I was saying from start it was easier to get than railjack parts.

And it's also totally unnecessary to get one of those. 

People did it with the mote. Just like you can get to the latest without a single mkiii anything. 

4 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Not at all after all I gotta focus on my own content creations 😞 sucks alot I'd love to sniff on AGGP like youd love for Reb to notice you and your valiant efforts to shift all blame to the community. The community created will stand forever. Wf could end today and they could make another game if they wanted to. Shut down the servers and poof

I'm sure that you think that you are making a point in that rambling you did. But like so many other "malcontent creators" it's all just worthless hot air and clickbait. You're not edgy enough, and you're certainly not saying anything worth listening to. 

Have fun screaming into the void. 

[DoomFruit]

32 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

And it's also totally unnecessary to get one of those. 

People did it with the mote. Just like you can get to the latest without a single mkiii anything.

By analogy, that would be doing this hypothetical quest by taking your railjack, driving 10 kilometres directly away from the objective, getting out and doing it with Amesha on foot.

This basically makes railjack a complete waste of dev time - all this effort spent on making a new game mode with everything attached to it, and the barrier to entry is so high that people just don't bother with it.

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

Well its not a quest they called it an actual "war"

 

With that said I think the New War is going to be a "World tier" system along the lines of The Division 2, where the Entire Star Chart will increase in level and introduce Sentient Enemies....with the tile set. 

We could have to clear each system ad they are invaded, like a legit war and then launch a "counter attack" against the Sentients to gain there tileset in the Origin System. Repel the Invasion and then attack the Tau system which would then be the next "world tier"

 

I think if they did that it could increase difficulty and even have worthwhile endgame content tied to lore.

That's my hope for this. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

By analogy, that would be doing this hypothetical quest by taking your railjack, driving 10 kilometres directly away from the objective, getting out and doing it with Amesha on foot.

This basically makes railjack a complete waste of dev time - all this effort spent on making a new game mode with everything attached to it, and the barrier to entry is so high that people just don't bother with it.

No. It is literally asking for a taxi directly to the objective. 

 

The barrier to entry is literally "do you want to play a game?"  It seems that there are people who would rather whine about having something to play, than put a modicum of effort into it. 

And let's not kid ourselves, you don't need a Railjack to participate in the game mode. You don't need to have a single piece of mkiii gear to get to Veil proxima. Players can take all the time they need to advance. They can collect materials at their leisure and research and build it all. 

 

And best of all:

1 hour ago, DoomFruit said:

This basically makes railjack a complete waste of dev time - all this effort spent on making a new game mode with everything attached to it, and the barrier to entry is so high that people just don't bother with it.

Do a simple poll. I'm fairly certain that all of the most vociferous whiners are playing the heck out of the game mode. The same people who are whinging about the low drop rates and RNG, are exactly the ones that are grinding hard AF to try and get the best of the best. But that's not required by the game mode at all.