Rest in Peace, Marked for Death.

[Traumtulpe]

5 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

• Fixed base Damage using the Health/Shield Damage dealt and not capped at the Health+Shield the target had prior (e.g. enemy with 5 Health gets hit by 100 damage, and 100 damage is shared in AOE. It should just be the 5).

• Capped Damage multiplier stat to 75%

So now you have to Marked for Death + Finisher two times for the same effect, plus you need to target the toughest enemy variant both times. And they both need to have full health. Unlikely.

The funny thing is, Marked for Death wasn't even that good to begin with. Being restricted by line of sight meant it was very dependent on the levels layout, oftentimes being worse than just attacking in melee.

The ability is also very restrictive in weapon usage, being mostly only useful with melee weapons - using finishers or heavy attacks - since multishot does not apply.

Personally I used it with Ash: Marked for Death and Fatal Teleport. This made Ash's Teleport relevant again - it no longer is. Nor is Marked for Death. RIP.

I tested it now. It is exactly as bad as you would think from the description. 100% useless. It will literally never be used again. Well done. 75% damage transfer (max), my heavy attack killed everything in range with one hit while Marked for Death was active:^{Please let someone else balance your game for you lol.}

[Syln]

Reduce its cost to 25, no casting animation, get rid of the cap damage based on enemy health/shield + go up to 100% for the multiplier cap and the skill would be fairly good.

[Pizzarugi]

I had it installed on Revenant with 250% power strength and 90%ish range, didn't get much use out of it to begin with. Probably will still be effective, it just means builds like Fatal Teleport Ash or Well of Life Trinity can't use it to blow up rooms of enemies.

[Traumtulpe]

1 minute ago, Pizzarugi said:

Revenant with 250% power strength and 90%ish range, didn't get much use out of it to begin with. Probably will still be effective

That does not sound effective at all. Not even a little bit. 9 meters? Just hit them with your melee.

[Savire510]

6 minutes ago, Traumtulpe said:

That does not sound effective at all. Not even a little bit. 9 meters? Just hit them with your melee.

if you used revenant and enthralled an enemy, then activated MfD and reaved through him you would instakill it and everyone in the room with it if you modded for range.

Basically infinite scalling because it scaled with enemy health, and MfD magnified even that, even if it wasnt supposed to.

[Pizzarugi]

8 minutes ago, Traumtulpe said:

That does not sound effective at all. Not even a little bit. 9 meters? Just hit them with your melee.

4+1+3, where 4 is replaced with MfD, is a lot better than mashing melee in high level endurance runs. You've said yourself that the skill is limited as is by level design due to LoS. Plus if I ever bother with getting around to doing Steel Path, it means endurance runs in it will be a little more engaging than spamming E. :P

Besides, there's not a whole lot of other skills that would be good with Revenant. Breach Surge, I guess, would be the next best choice as it does what MfD used to do, except it's 1 spark per victim.

[Kaggelos]

For the first time I'm disappointed with a nerf... 

[Tesseract7777]

7 minutes ago, Kaggelos said:

For the first time I'm disappointed with a nerf... 

Yeah I usually cheer on nerfs, but this was ultra heavy handed and literally killed an abillity. 

Hell I'm usually one of the ones telling people they are using hyperbole to say DE killed an ability or made it useless by nerfing, but in this case... 

[Pizzarugi]

2 hours ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Yeah I usually cheer on nerfs, but this was ultra heavy handed and literally killed an abillity. 

Hell I'm usually one of the ones telling people they are using hyperbole to say DE killed an ability or made it useless by nerfing, but in this case... 

Damage scales up to 75% and doesn't go higher than the victim's life.

The skill isn't useless, just prioritize hitting enemies with lots of life to nuke the trash. For example, Grineer Heavy Gunners have over 3x life of a standard Lancer at level 100 (almost 2x at level 8). 1shotting the HG will 1shot the Lancer. Yes any other heavies may still be alive after the MfD procs, but you still blew an entire room of enemies to smithereens. This nerf just means you can't do that with anyone you see.

[BahamutKaiser]

Don't know why they capped the damage with current health rather than max health... even at 50% conversion it would work way better...

[KlaussKlauss]

As I said in other posts, Helminth System was not needed and is just a lazy baind-aid for some underpowered/useless frames. 

It was overhyped, unnecessary, and came with pre-nerfs. M4D wasn't a good room clearing ability, but made Ash viable as a frame, while it had unintended interactions on other frames.

For people discussing the mechanics of new M4D plays: no one cares, even in Steel Path / long endurance we already had better options then the old M4D. 

I am no longer bothering with the Helminth System, it's just another hype-train scam.  

Helminth = Marked for Meh

[DCaedus]

It was sorta good at release, now it's useless with all the nerfs.

[Tsoe]

i still dont understand ho DE act...

we got all kind of bility nerfed being barely useless and no buff for old useles ones

 

i was ok for brahma nerf

 

m4d deserved some tweak but to be destroyed totally

[RazerXPrime]

Helminth system wasn't made to make frames more viable or useful. It was made to add diversity between frames so you could alter current abilities. Whether or not you think that's a good idea is beside the point.

I see so many people negatively discussing features in this game that I'm wondering if they even know what the word "fun" means. You can litterally take any frame with any weapon and do high level content if you put your mind to it. Sure, not every frame will be able to deal a billion damage in a huge aoe. But honestly that's not the point is it. The point is that the game is actually balanced around the content and you can do whatever you want and be succesful. It's the same people that claim Nyx is a terrible frame. Those people are morons because they think in spreadsheet numbers and not actual effectiveness. Sure you can buff up rhino, chroma, Saryn to deal big damage numbers. Sure Nyx cannot do this, but the thing is she doesn't need to. People are so one track minded about what is "good" or "optimal" that anything that is not in line with that is considdered "crap". It's like this with every community that spouts nonsense to eachother to give themselves a good feeling about ineadequacy. People are really heavily affected by nerfs or something that is suboptimal. There's players out there that refuse to use X because Y is slightly better.

The goal of playing a game is to have fun. If your idea of fun is "I need Y to be just as good as X" you're going to be disappointed every #*!%ing time.

[Traumtulpe]

4 hours ago, Pizzarugi said:

1shotting the HG will 1shot the Lancer.

Except I didn't need help killing Lancers. Except even this won't happen at high levels (unless you used a finisher), because the damage is reduced by armor.

Except just use Larva, be fine with Overextended since you don't need strength, spend only 25 energy, and kill everything in one hit.

[(PSN)Stealth_Cobra]

Sorry to be blunt, but this is garbage. Marked for death already had tons of drawbacks, including being really expensive to cast, slow to cast, ankward to target enemies with, other players killing your mark, running out of energy since it require two ability casts per small room clear, requiring a full build dedicated to range AND usage of slow hammers. It also mostly did one thing right... Which was giving Ash a proper Bladestorm rework and making him decent in steel path.

Now, you stealthily nerfed range and made the damage it dealt pathetic... Damage that was needed to handle the bullet sponge enemies of steel path... And you made it even more ankward to use, requiring multiple casts and targeting of the strongest enemies to be even a fraction of what it was... Plus you killed the interaction with Arcane Trickery , which was kinda mandatory for survivability with ASH since you have to slot in tons of range mods and have no room for duration with a Marked for Death build.

Yet another example of you guys nerfing stuff out of peer pressure because a few ppl in the community said it was broken. Meanwhile tons of frames can still aoe wipe entire screens of steel path enemies with the press of a button with zero drawbacks, but sure, you had to nerf the one half decent ability you added with the helminth system before most of the community even had a chance to try it, and put Ash back into the pile of frames that aren't very good in steel path.

[Solarsyphon]

The multiple mod thing I expected because in some cases that was making it deal 50X more to other targets than it did to the base target which was obviously not the intention. It was the same kind of bug that gas damage used to have  and so it was inevitable that it would be removed but capping the damage at 75% of the enemies health is an excessive nerf.  It means functionally that m4d can never 1 hit kill enemies of equal strength to the target and will have diminishing returns on the same group or at low levels. They also took away the arcane interaction which may have allowed it  to act as utility leaving it with very little use.  It is now allot like things such as entropy detonation which do aoe % damage on kills but is a bit worse at low levels because it lacks the base damage that allows those mods to be effective there.  

So now it needs a buff now and there are allot of options of what they could do:

1. Give it a base damage like what mods such as entropy detonation and acid rounds have
2. Uncap the damage before the modifier. I.e if the player hits 100 it does 75. This would basically just give single target attacks an aoe.
3. Give it utility such as carrying over ability effects or triggering arcanes. 

[_Anise_]

its worth mentioning on the stream they said they were going to give mark another pass in about a weeks time (where I assume they might unnerf it some)

[Proscriptor]

yeah i also had an impression they're going to unnerf it somewhat