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PSA: Heirloom Collection Platinum Changes & Lessons


[DE]Megan
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3 minutes ago, Lion said:

I'm not sure how to phrase this that'll best get my point across tbh. I've tried rephrasing and that doesn't seem to be working. As it is now I feel fine at $90, I have no issue with the pack or any of it's contents. But if the pack comes out again at $30, then I am not going to feel fine.

 

Then you support the greedy pack 

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1 minute ago, PublikDomain said:

If you wouldn't feel fine if a $30 skins-only bundle were added, then it doesn't sound like you're actually fine at $90...

If it came out at launch that would've been great. I probably would've opted for that instead. But we are past launch unfortunately

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3 minutes ago, (PSN)rexis12 said:

So you admit that the pack is overpriced or inflated then?

I don't think it's overpriced/inflated, I think it's the equivalent of a prime access pack for roughly $40 less. But I'd probably have went with the $30 pack if it had the same stuff in it.

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Just now, PublikDomain said:

There's no need to settle for "unfortunately".

It would be unfortunate for those who already bought, since a cheaper pack retroactively does nothing for them unless they are given the option to downgrade somehow.

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Just now, Lion said:

It would be unfortunate for those who already bought, since a cheaper pack retroactively does nothing for them unless they are given the option to downgrade somehow.

Why would they want a cheaper pack, if you consider the ones we have right now Fairly Priced?

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Imma be honest i would love for a skin only pack with the halos... considering the highest tier of the pack is nearly 140 bucks for me (yay exchange rates being hot trash....). Yet one of my friends insta purchased essentially for the frost halo and maybe the skins... i dont like this pricing and would rather just have the packs removed entirely and everyone who purchased reimbursed since this isnt supporting anyone but tencent.

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1 minute ago, Lion said:

It would be unfortunate for those who already bought, since a cheaper pack retroactively does nothing for them unless they are given the option to downgrade somehow.

If a 4th pack came out for 30 dollars there would be NO PLATINUM OR AYA in it  just the cosmetics and skins so the people who bought the 90 dollar pack shouldn't be mad because they got 2100 platinum and 6 aya the 4th pack is for people who don't want the platinum and aya  they just want the cosmetics and skins 

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16 minutes ago, Lion said:

I'm not sure how to phrase this that'll best get my point across tbh. I've tried rephrasing and that doesn't seem to be working. As it is now I feel fine at $90, I have no issue with the pack or any of it's contents. But if the pack comes out again at $30, then I am not going to feel fine.

 

If you have a problem with a pack that dropped the Platinum and Regal Aya and sold for a lower price, do you also have a problem with me being able to get just the 2100 Plat for half price due to a login reward?  Does me being able to get that part of the bundle significantly cheaper, by forsaking the rest of the bundle, also retroactively change your value assessment of the bundle?

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3 minutes ago, Lion said:

It would be unfortunate for those who already bought, since a cheaper pack retroactively does nothing for them unless they are given the option to downgrade somehow.

Only if you believe that those who already bought are in an unsalvageable situation. Yes, you should be given the option to downgrade. Of course you should, you shouldn't be stuck "screwed out of $60" for the same reason no one should be "screwed out of $60" in the future.

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1 hour ago, Lion said:

I'm not sure how to phrase this that'll best get my point across tbh. I've tried rephrasing and that doesn't seem to be working. As it is now I feel fine at $90, I have no issue with the pack or any of it's contents. But if the pack comes out again at $30, then I am not going to feel fine.

 

 

And we don't care if you feel fine or not. If you paid for a pack with something that you didn't want, then you've overpaid REGARDLESS if the value of the contents matches or exceeds the price. If DE release smaller bundles without the bloat and you would've rather bought them instead if you had the option at the time, THEN STAND UP AND FIGHT TO GET WHAT YOU WANT. What are you, a mindless consoomer? Why do you let a company screw you over, then use you as a shield against any proper changes? This isn't the first or the second time DE does S#&$ like that and the ONLY reason why they backed off before is because of the backlash they recieved. So stand up and fight for what you want, instead of coping with what you got.

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On 2023-09-03 at 12:14 PM, distal.op said:

I took Mag P out for a spin and I have a tennogen on her, and I mentally compared the tennogen prices with the heirloom skins, even if you removed the very, very deliberate bloat.

Honestly? I sometimes prefer the Tennogen more.
While the base skin themselves rarely change at times, they often only need a texture swap to really make it pop.

You also get situations like Volt's Arrestor Helmet.
That one is so iconic it may as well be the default.

On 2023-09-03 at 12:50 PM, Darkbring said:

Tennogen still comes out as a bit cheaper, which would actually be a somewhat honest price to ask for the skins

From what I've been told, they also give a % to the artist.
I'm not sure what this % is exactly, but the fact that the artist is getting paid directly is good enough for me.

Roughly 7 CAD and I get to support the artist, encouraging them to make more skins that would look just as good?
That's WAY better of a deal. Compared to this bundle's "full retail game" pricing for what is effectively a bunch of garbage I don't want.

On 2023-09-03 at 1:01 PM, PublikDomain said:

A regular Deluxe skin on its own is ~165p, which is almost bang on $10. Someone earlier worked out a $17.50 price point for these skins by taking out various bits and premium currencies, which is... drum roll please... ~325p! If DE added these skins to the market for 325p each with idk a 600p bundle for the pair then no one would bat an eye.

Just to hammer the point with an agreement:

Platinum has to be purchased before it can be traded. DE still gets the money either way.

On 2023-09-03 at 1:01 PM, PublikDomain said:

Expensive, sure, but Nidus Phryke's collection is 375p

Let's go even further on this!

Without the bundle? It's 150 Platinum which is 15 less than the standard Deluxe Skin.
Of which- just the skin alone- has:

  • A very intimidating and powerful look for Nidus
  • Evolves as you gain stacks to grow giant metal shoulder plates, armored leg plates, arm blades and a full blown face mask.
  • All of those can be recolored perfectly fine with no stupid texture overlays to scuff it.
  • Emissive Colors to still give that Nidus blood-flow charm.
  • A loincloth Auxiliary Cosmetic that can be used on any Nidus skin.

... and it's cheaper than most deluxe skins.
The only ones to match that price are:

  • Inaros Ramses (which is very grim looking and quite nice, considering it's Inaros.)
  • Atlas Karyst (which has moving parts, various metal textures AND changes the Rumbler models!)
  • Excalibur Proto (one of the earlier Deluxe skins based on Dark Sector's Hayden Tenno.)
  • Nezha Empyrean
  • Revenant Mephisto (which comes with a unique Syandana STRICTLY for him)
  • Octavia Maestro
  • Valkyr Gersemi
  • Vauban Citadel (who has many moving parts, emissives channels all over the place and looks he came out of a game inspired by Nier Automata)
  • Wukong Samadhi
  • Zephyr Harrier

Which is actually a LOT more than I initially thought. Almost half of them, really.

Than you get Nidus Phryke's Bundle which has...

  • Deimos Claw Skins, one of TWO claw skins we can use by the way.
    • The other being from Nightwave and cannot sheath if set to visible when holstered. (Often looks very jarring as a result.)
    • For the purpose of pricing? I'm going to compare to similar "Weapon Category" skins that go for roughly 100 Platinum each.
    • This is because they can be applied to any claws.
  • Nosos Syandana, which has moving parts to it. (Wings)
    • Elaborate or Warframe-themed Syandanas usually go for about 100 Platinum on their own. It varies however.
  • Metus Kubrow Skin, which is one of the best looking in my opinion.
    • As far as I'm aware, the only proper "remodelled skins" that are available are in Deluxe Bundles.
    • That being this bundle and the Kavat skin in Khora Urushu's Bundle. I pity the Kavat that has to wear that atrocity though.
    • As a result, all other skins are gained from Master Teasonai on Cetus... or Nightwave.
    • If you wish to include "Fur Patterns" in this? It would be 50 Platinum.
  • Metus Kubrow Armor, which pairs with it's skin. Can be used on any Kubrow however.
    • All Kubrow Armors are worth 90 Platinum.

So that makes each part of the bundle worth in total...
340 Platinum in extra goodies, 490 if you add the Nidus Phryke's price outside of the bundle.
The current price for the bundle is- as you said- 375 Platinum.

370 Platinum by the way is 21.99 CAD, provided you have no coupons of any kind active.

On 2023-09-03 at 1:26 PM, Tahocess321 said:

know how to make plat without having to spend a cent, and that wouldn't fill the pockets of big ol' papa Tencent

Pssst hey.
That platinum has to come from somewhere.
Thought you'd like to know that.

On 2023-09-03 at 2:48 PM, (NSW)Justarius said:

My heart goes out to those frost mains who havent got a good skin since 2017 with harka. (yes its been that long)

Not counting Tennogen?

Personally, I like the Hisame Skin a LOT more. Paired it with Voidshell and I certainly ain't missing the Heirloom Collection.
This one looks rugged and fierce, precisely how I like it.

image.png

Also the Flox Syandana on the back folds up until I take damage.
That costed Platinum, by the way. Not some ludicrous wad of cash.

On 2023-09-03 at 3:10 PM, (PSN)Humblemud said:

And now DEncent sullied his reputation with the heirloom stuff smh

I've been using Mag Orbit myself.

  • Combined with a Sciathin Syandana (Tennogen)
  • Edo Prime Chest Plate (Volt Prime Access)
  • Porta Shoulder Guards (Platinum)
  • Anasa Ayatan Prime Leg Plates (Ivara Prime Access)

People can tell me "Oh, you're just poor" all you like-- I've spent money on this before.
Hell, I even have the Tennocon 2019 stuff, though that was because the funds for it were gifted from a dear friend.
Of whom basically just asked me to grab them an extra set of the weapons from Tennocon Baro if I wanted to thank them back... and I did, because that's what good people do.

image.png

Maybe not the best assortment of cosmetics.
I also got the Voidshell AND Deluxe if I care to swap it around.

Hell, I'd be thrilled to let people try out the Mag Amethyst that came with Discord Nitro.
... which I only got the month of it because of promo they were doing at the time.

image.png Sadly, can't really bring this back since it's third-party related.

On 2023-09-03 at 3:31 PM, Lion said:

I don't think you or other people have the same outrage about kickstarter bonuses, or black Friday deals or try to FOMO the entire store.

Except...

  • Warframe has been around for 10 years. With a history of trying to avoid said "Limited Time" things, often bringing them back in "seasons" if they must.
    • These "seasonal skins" have also been widely accepted as okay and are commonly bought with no fuss. Didn't get it this year? You got next year.
  • Kickstarters are kinda the Founder bundles. You pay this money knowing it could very well flop and you'll never get that money back.
    • In that risk, DE said "Yeah, let's never do that again. Mainly because we don't want to be THAT company that keeps pulling this garbage."
    • Oh, look where we are.
  • Black Friday deals are a notorious evil. In the digital world, it's a lot easier to scope out thankfully and avoid bad deals. 
    • Also, if it wasn't the physical stores constantly looking for loopholes for profit to tip ya off on that?
    • It'd have to be the fact that people would often get TRAMPLED just for these prices. Lives at risk for PROFIT.
    • The whole thing is abnormal chaos that hinges on capitalism running amok. It's actually pretty disgusting.
  • Usually a store having a sale on everything is called a "Clearance", usually because they have too much stock.
    • That or having to move locations or go under entirely. It's not entirely rare to see either.
    • In the latter case where they're going under? A clearance is often a way to mitigate the damages of no longer being in business.

We're mad because DE is doing for abstract reasons that don't benefit anyone.
Maybe a quick buck if all else, but nobody likes that.

On 2023-09-03 at 3:31 PM, Lion said:

Warframe itself is a limited time deal since it won't be here forever, and every dollar we spend on the game will someday just go away, it's not feasible to think this game or the people playing are going to last 100 years lol. 

To be blunt?
I'd be surprised if humanity as it is now lasts another 20 years given our track record.

At that point, I'd rather have the "limited time" I have now be spent enjoying the things I can do.
... but let's be real here, the things that have been set in motion on the scale beyond this game are things we cannot stop on an individual level.
Knowing how people act anyway? I wouldn't ask them to bother, I know they can't.

So I'll take what I can get, if that small amount means I can avoid getting sent to the Reaper's Front Desk all because some folks ask me to avoid that.

On 2023-09-03 at 3:54 PM, staranow said:

Btw DE your forums sucks

Fun fact, there's an option for Dark Mode!
Guess where it is.

At the very bottom of the page itself.
*Insert "Graphics Design is my passion" meme here*

image.png

On 2023-09-03 at 4:05 PM, Myscho said:

I dont have a hope that DE make changes to skin pack and introduce "new" one without plat and regal aya for lower price, because players already bought them and they dont wanna go "that is unfair" road

I already mentioned a fix for this here in the second reply:

 

On 2023-09-03 at 6:57 PM, Darkbring said:

The only free plat is the giveaway plat, which is an insignificant amount in the total currency pool.

As far as I'm aware, giveaway plat is like starter plat. Completely untradable.
As a result, this goes back to the phrase of: "PLATINUM MUST'VE BEEN BOUGHT AT SOME POINT."

"Oh, but than people can get this item without paying myehmyehmyeh" I might hear someone say.

To that? I reply with "It's a GIVEAWAY, they just did one for a WHOLE PC.
Plus, the chances of winning are so small that isn't nearly reliable enough to be something worth caring about."

I think the only giveaway I ever won was a community event.
Which is still paid Platinum soooo... ye.

On 2023-09-03 at 9:33 PM, Lion said:

The point being that the people who bought the $90 pack now essentially get screwed out of $60 with very little chance of a refund.

Hey, see that part where I reply to Myscho a little bit up?
Check that. Links to the perfect fix that I already said in this very thread.

Alternatively? It's on Page 70.

On 2023-09-03 at 10:11 PM, Lion said:

I feel like it is too late to implement this without trampling over the people who already bought the pack.

Realistically though?
Those who already bought the pack (which has only been around for 8 DAYS by the way) will have to accept that they bought the FULL thing.

There's always a change they can make, they just have to DO it.
They chose not to, so our annoyance with DE continues.

On 2023-09-03 at 10:37 PM, Lion said:

I'm not sure how to phrase this that'll best get my point across tbh. I've tried rephrasing and that doesn't seem to be working

The only way to phrase it is:

"Because the amount of items in it is the price listed, it's fine."

Which is the problem. It's ignoring that we:

  • Don't care for the Emotes, Color Palette, Glyphs, Sigils, etc.
    • We have hundreds at this point and these add so little to the pile.
  • Think the accolade is dumb. Of which is both filled with hollow meaning and mocks those it's ideal is designed for.
  • Would rather have NO Platinum or Regal Aya, both of which are designed to say "It's fiiiiiine (:" without actually adding anything.
    • I got the Volt Prime Access and Ivara Prime Access accessories. Rest assured, if I wanted Regal Aya? I'd get it.
    • Platinum can be traded, but I'd rather the Platinum be an option rather than a requirement.
    • Including either of these in a bundle that IS designed for those who want to spend a little extra is fine.
    • Not the bundle where we want just the "essentials" for a lack of a better word.

All the extra Platinum did is dismiss every single issue we brought up with the pack besides it's initial value.
That's something a Monkey's Paw would do.
... which now that I think about it? It's pretty on brand for DE, seeing their knack for adding things like the Corrupted Jackal. Still time to change that nonsense.

 

<- Anyway... ->

I never understood how people were like "Limited Time deals are fine!"
Like bruh, I never liked it as a kid when the Gamecube was a thing. I don't like it to this day.

Difference is usually the context AROUND such.

  • Informercials back in the day had a lot harder time selling the garbage you saw them praise. Only idiots bought 'em.
  • Limited time "collab" you see cross-promoting brands were usually done as a way to try something new.
    • If anything, these being "limited time" was mostly a necessary consequence of the partnership BETWEEN these IPs.
    • The experimentation of it if anything allows more variety and intrigue to become a thing.
    • If the product becomes popular, these companies notice the mutual benefit and can produce more of them.
    • Otherwise? They're effectively the same price usually and you know exactly what you're getting with it.
  • Tech Companies that make their devices with the intent to sabotage them later is a GARGANTUAN issue right now.
    • Especially in the department of "Historical Preservation", where documenting these devices can often have them fail because of intentional flaws.
    • Take Video Games Preservation for instance, it's a highly contentious field. Needing extremely dedicated enthusiasts the preserve them.
      • Nintendo games are notorious for this, having peripherals that are almost REQUIRED for the game to function properly.
    • Outside of preservation? This also means the omen of companies preventing the "Right to Repair" means a lot of customers have to be taxed for a new device.
    • You can't say "Just don't upgrade" when your phone takes literal minutes to load menus. Phones are pretty mandatory in today's age.
  • Even celebratory merchandise is usually given a bit of leeway. As one needs the means to produce these items.
    • In addition, you'll have people who can sell/gift/trade/barter/etc. these "limited items" away.
    • That whole idea of "exchange" is precisely the reason "Trading Cards" get their name. They're DESIGNED for such.
    • You buy them knowing that if a card is coveted? You can use that as a bartering tool to the person who wants it.
    • There's a reason people often hear about those "Holofoil Charizard Cards" from the early Pokemon Trading Cards and perk their ears up.
      • It's because they're no longer in production and most of them are pretty damaged.
      • That ALSO means any that are in good condition are high targets for collectors, since they can acquire them.

Heirloom Skins lack ALL of these reasons.
There's probably dozens more examples I can think of as to why using "FOMO" on these skins is a terrible idea.

Besides, "FOMO" isn't the "Fear of Missing Out" because it's going to be gone.
It's such because it's going to be gone FOREVER. Permanently.

  • We don't call Prime Access FOMO because it will come back.
  • We don't call Prime Resurgence FOMO because it will come back.
  • We don't call Star Days FOMO because it will come back.
  • We don't call Naberus FOMO because it will come back.

On the other hand...

  • We do call Supporter Packs FOMO because they contain items that will vanish permanently.
    • Players dislike these. You don't have to remove them DE, they're just an update bundle.
    • Keeping them around means more people can buy it. Even players who may have joined AFTER that update.
    • ... and with how your game is running? That's a LOT of new players that don't stick around.
  • We do call Third-Party Collabs (Amazon Prime, Xbox/PlayStation packages) FOMO because they will eventually poof into unexistence.
    • Players dislike this, but accept that they vanish BECAUSE of their Third-Party nature. Disappointing, but understandable.
    • Though, if the option arises? Please let us get another chance at 'em.
    • Loki Verv is cool. I'm sure many players didn't even KNOW there was an Amazon Prime bundle for such.
    • Many more probably didn't have Amazon Prime at the time they wanted the biggest parts of it.
  • We do call Operation-Exclusive Emblems FOMO, but as they're very subtle and barely noticable? Most players don't care.
    • In addition, nobody is saying DE can't make more Sekharas like the ones that dropped on Angels of the Zariman.
    • I would actually like more of these buyable with Platinum. I enjoyed the idea of "evolving cosmetics".
  • We DO NOT call participating in said "Operations" FOMO however. It would be nice to have them back, sure-- but that goes against why they're fun.
    • There is however a slight annoyance that the only recurring "Operations" are ones like Thermia Fractures and Ghouls.
    • Stuff we have seen so many times that our automatically phase them out. Are Ghouls active right now? I don't care to even check.
    • We enjoyed the operations of old as a way to entice players to try the new content. Letting those who are fired up and ready to go try for a high score.
    • That whole "Let's get this done for glory!" was a good way to encourage a competition, giving players the reason to improve.

 

- EDIT -
None of the actual text was changed, but the fact that we're missing a few pages says that the "page purging" has already begun.
I noticed this when I realize that THIS is now Page 70.

Who knows, maybe tomorrow it'll be Page 50.
Ya slipping DE. Get a grip.

Edited by Binket_
It's right there, chief. You kinda have to scroll to the bottom where the addendum is anyway.
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18 hours ago, ThisLoliIsDeadly said:

Would be great if we actually get awesome skins because of it's unique changes to the warframe instead of meh skins that is made awesome because it won't ever be available again. imo, removing the regal aya and platinum which are just freebies in the bundle in favor of adding more features to the skins like unique changes to the warframe's abilities like certain deluxe skins does (nidus' phryke skin adding spiky thingies in his abilities) would be the better move instead of ya know.... adding more freebies to increase the value of the "bundle" instead of increasing the value of the "skin". It kind of feels like we were paying for expensive happy meals and being given extra ketchups as compensation for the excessive pricing.

maybe if they reworked older skins and colour palettes instead of drawing and modelling Negative attention

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10 hours ago, Thunderlord_Zinogre said:

Honest to god, nobody cares.

Then they will suffer.

I'm tired of this garbage that we were told would get better, but it's been getting worse for the past 6~ years.
Either they fix it, or the ship sinks.

 

Make sure this topic stays at the top.

Exactly ^

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vor 11 Stunden schrieb Thunderlord_Zinogre:

Honest to god, nobody cares.

Then they will suffer.

I'm tired of this garbage that we were told would get better, but it's been getting worse for the past 6~ years.
Either they fix it, or the ship sinks.

 

Make sure this topic stays at the top.

Yep they refuse to actually address what is wrong with the heirloom collection and instead hide behind the whales they have already hunted. If DE actually cared to make the situation better they would face that anger and offer refunds to anyone who wants to downgrade to a lower pack.

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16 hours ago, Lion said:

I already acknowledged that DE probably should've launched the pack without the regal Aya and platinum, however I think this is no longer possible without risking the people who've already paid requesting refunds / doing charge backs, as it would be pretty insulting if a pack later launched for $30 after the fact. So honestly I think DE chose the best option going that they had left available at the time. 

If people start to want refunds, then it's absolutely on DE on this one for not thinking this carefully by bundling the skin with potentially unwanted content trying to justify the high price for just two shiny, albeit-good looking skins and some palette and profile accolade. At the expense of the player possibly leaving, DE could possibly deny those refunds too because companies had been changing deals or releasing products that are similar to their predecessor; with something what the consumers actually wanted in the first place. I don't hear lawsuits flying around with those topics, and I can probably bet my 2 cents that they would be classed as frivolous lawsuits.

Their option currently screws over players who wanted the skin for a cheaper price/just wants the skin. Not really a good solution either, and not that good if you see a lot of players yelling about it compared to players who are satisfied with it.

7 hours ago, Binket_ said:

Personally, I like the Hisame Skin a LOT more. Paired it with Voidshell and I certainly ain't missing the Heirloom Collection.
This one looks rugged and fierce, precisely how I like it.

image.png

This is what I meant by alternatives. I am satisified with Frost Prime's base look and for alternatives, I have the hisame one. Didn't know about the voidshell skin, though but Hisame helmet is just good for that White Album cosplay. Mag though, I'm still looking for what I'd give her...

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hace 9 horas, Binket_ dijo:

Pssst hey.
That platinum has to come from somewhere.
Thought you'd like to know that.

pssst hey.

That somewhere could be a platinum purchase of a random 9 years ago, maybe even with up to a 75% discount, that has been circulating through the market, which I assure you the suits dont give a crap about compared to the revenue they surely expect from the heirloom packs.

Thought you'd like to know that.

 

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On 2023-08-30 at 9:08 PM, [DE]Megan said:

We do not feel it would be fair to those who purchased an Heirloom Collection already with the understanding that they were time-limited to now remove that element.

But you did the same for the Proto Excalibur skin which was also supposed to be a timed exclusive when I bought it.

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1 hour ago, Tahocess321 said:

That somewhere could be a platinum purchase of a random 9 years ago

And yet, it's still in use.
Still money that has to come from somewhere.

Gotta remember, for every person buying Platinum?
There's plenty more newbies using the very same Platinum to bolster their slots.
There's plenty more folks rushing Forma with it.
There's plenty more perplexing people who buy inexplicable things. (Like 270k Argon Crystal Decorations and gift them to someone)

Platinum isn't just tossed around from player to player, y'know.
That new Platinum has to come somewhere.

... and giveaways prevent trading it.

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1 hour ago, Tahocess321 said:

pssst hey.

That somewhere could be a platinum purchase of a random 9 years ago, maybe even with up to a 75% discount, that has been circulating through the market, which I assure you the suits dont give a crap about compared to the revenue they surely expect from the heirloom packs.

Thought you'd like to know that.

 

 

Plat usually doesn't last that long, with the sole exceptions or riven traders and old whales. The game is also pretty good at burning through the overall pool of currency, and lets not forget that some people who REALLY have too much plat usually burn through it to do wacky S#&amp;&#036;, like buying hundreds of roombas. Still remember good old days when Shy's inbox was full of gifted Mags.

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