Can Oberon receive some love ?

[trst]

7 hours ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said:

Definitely Oberon, but Trinity?

Nah we're not doing that 

But why not? Trinity offers nothing that can't be provided by other frames and/or a dozen different ways within one's own build.

 

Her passive is worthless when players rarely go down and are more likely to force revive when they do.

Well of Life if a gimmicky indirect heal with a status redirecting gimmick that requires coordination to use (both not happening in pubs and unnecessary anyways). And the augment is made worthless since Eximus were made to drop guaranteed orbs.

Energy Vampire is redundant with all the ways players have to generate infinite/extra energy. Though the augment is probably the only good thing she has going for her just as a way to keep shield gating up.

Link is immensely outdated between having a hard cap on the damage resistance and the armor drain with the augment being hindered by the tiny target cap.

 And Blessing is as redundant as Energy Vampire is while the augment is a worse version of Harrows base Covenant.

 

Meanwhile if we look at other "support" frames we have the likes of Harrow who can restore HP via a combat buff and energy on the go on top of being more durable and buffing the damage of the squad. Citrine who can provide 90% DR to herself and allies with potentially infinite duration, provides free status priming to the entire squad, and litters the map with orb drops. Or even Wisp who isn't a support frame and yet has an ability that offers more practical healing on top of combat buffs.

Trinity is outdated and needs a rework to serve more of a use than hard carrying new players without wiping maps for them.

[Waeleto]

13 hours ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said:

Definitely Oberon, but Trinity?

Nah we're not doing that 

I agree with you, trinity has a very good kit, minor changes would make her even stronger than wisp/citrine but oberon on the other hand needs either a rework or a whole page of changes

[Hexerin]

34 minutes ago, Waeleto said:

I agree with you, trinity has a very good kit, minor changes would make her even stronger than wisp/citrine

She needs a bit more than "minor changes" to be viable in modern play outside specific niche use cases.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

20 hours ago, trst said:

But why not? Trinity offers nothing that can't be provided by other frames and/or a dozen different ways within one's own build.

 

Her passive is worthless when players rarely go down and are more likely to force revive when they do.

Well of Life if a gimmicky indirect heal with a status redirecting gimmick that requires coordination to use (both not happening in pubs and unnecessary anyways). And the augment is made worthless since Eximus were made to drop guaranteed orbs.

Energy Vampire is redundant with all the ways players have to generate infinite/extra energy. Though the augment is probably the only good thing she has going for her just as a way to keep shield gating up.

Link is immensely outdated between having a hard cap on the damage resistance and the armor drain with the augment being hindered by the tiny target cap.

 And Blessing is as redundant as Energy Vampire is while the augment is a worse version of Harrows base Covenant.

 

Meanwhile if we look at other "support" frames we have the likes of Harrow who can restore HP via a combat buff and energy on the go on top of being more durable and buffing the damage of the squad. Citrine who can provide 90% DR to herself and allies with potentially infinite duration, provides free status priming to the entire squad, and litters the map with orb drops. Or even Wisp who isn't a support frame and yet has an ability that offers more practical healing on top of combat buffs.

Trinity is outdated and needs a rework to serve more of a use than hard carrying new players without wiping maps for them.

Yeah I have to agree here, both Oberon and Trinity feel really lackluster lately.

Oberon is moreso due to his ability numbers being so low on top of really annoying mechanics, like the odd height limit on Hallowed Ground or the wonky energy drain scaling from Renewal. Smite could also use some improvements, like having the target hit release additional orbs on death, and Reckoning really needs the Armor Strip it has to be separated from Hallowed Ground. Make Oberon the support who gives everyone just a giant amount of flat Armor with a very low commitment heal and he'll be fine.

Trinity is just a whole different problem altogether, some aspects of her kit are totally broken (EV Trin as an example) while others are far weaker than they should be (her 1 for obvious reasons). I would think nerfing Energy Vampire so it releases Energy at a set rate not affected by Duration, and increasing the ridiculous limitations her other abilities have would make her more well rounded. Maybe give her a Passive that increases everyone's total Health for every active ability on top of the revive Passive. Have Link act like an automatic version of Kullervo's 3 with far less Range and a slightly higher enemy limit. Make Well of Life ... well honestly I'm not too sure what to do with it, but making it act as an additional anchor point for Link or as some kind of CC would be best.

Edited November 13, 2023 by (XBOX)Graysmog

[Marvelous_A]

19 hours ago, Hexerin said:

She needs a bit more than "minor changes" to be viable in modern play outside specific niche use cases.

I'm surprised that people consider her abilities good, given they probably have the worst synergy among all warframes and you can't build for some abilities without effectively gutting the rest

Edited November 14, 2023 by Marvelous_A

[Hexerin]

30 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

I'm surprised that people consider her abilities good, given they probably have the worst synergy among all warframes and you can't build for some abilities without effectively gutting the rest

At an absolute baseline, the absurdly short durations being raised to 30 seconds across the board would at least make her actually playable. She'd still have an outdated kit, but you'd be able to actually mod her properly since you'd no longer be forced to take up half her mod slots for duration alone.

She just needs a proper full kit rework though.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Hexerin

[schilds]

Don't know why people think Trin is not "viable" or not "playable". Perhaps they mean sub-optimal? Or not meta?

Trin is outdated and her kit clunky by current standards, but she falls into that category of frames that, while not optimal, are more than adequate to tackle any content. She has infinite energy, shield/health regen, DR, and armour stripping. The armour strip may be 3 at a time, but it switches automatically once something dies so any aoe or melee will quickly chew through a pack of enemies.

Back in the day she was considered strong not just in a squad but *on her own*. Her kit hasn't changed since then but there's been major power creep. Oberon is much the same way.

Could they do with a facelift? Sure, but they aren't weak across the board like Hydroid was.

Quote

you can't build for some abilities without effectively gutting the rest

Bit of an exaggeration there. The only issue is her low duration abilities that she needs to keep recasting, and her redundant first ability:

• You don't need to lower duration for EV, just killing the enemy will release all the energy.
• She only needs power range for her 3. Her 4 doesn't need power range as it's based on affinity range.
• She only needs moderate power strength for full DR, full armour strip, adequate healing and adequate energy from EV. Her squad mates no longer need her spamming high strength EV across the map for their energy or shields. The low duration EV meta (that was only necessary in pre-made squads doing events, raids or xp farming) is long dead.
• She doesn't care about efficiency at all.

The only trade-off (thanks to Narrow Minded) is between range and duration for QoL in maintaining her buffs.

[Mazifet]

On 2023-11-11 at 7:10 PM, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

Trinity on the other hand... girl does need a rework, she has zero viable damage dealing capabilities and other frames outclass her in terms of support.

Trinity is still a strong, easy frame though. Having a crap ton of damage reduction with armor strip and infinite energy / health isn't in "need a rework" tier. I run her pretty often solo, and she's just a good frame for making the game easy.

[AegidiusF]

Il y a 1 heure, Mazifet a dit :

Trinity is still a strong, easy frame though. Having a crap ton of damage reduction with armor strip and infinite energy / health isn't in "need a rework" tier. I run her pretty often solo, and she's just a good frame for making the game easy.

I totally agree.

And she is one of the best Eidolon hunters.

Trinity just need some small changes as some more duration, not a rework.

[Aruquae]

26 minutes ago, (NSW)AegisFifi said:

I totally agree.

And she is one of the best Eidolon hunters.

Trinity just need some small changes as some more duration, not a rework.

Sometimes small buffs are the only thing frames need

I remember people complaining about Harrow being weak/needing tweaks. Then DE just gave him a built in preparation, and that was the end of that. 

[Marvelous_A]

On 2023-11-14 at 11:59 AM, Hexerin said:

At an absolute baseline, the absurdly short durations being raised to 30 seconds across the board would at least make her actually playable. She'd still have an outdated kit, but you'd be able to actually mod her properly since you'd no longer be forced to take up half her mod slots for duration alone.

She just needs a proper full kit rework though.

Yes she definitely needs a proper rework, she is indeed in a better place than the pre-rework Hydroid but she is just not fun to mod and play.

Absurdly short duration for both Link and Blessing for a mere 75% DR, WoL is strictly inferior to Blessing, EV being inversely scaled to duration (very weird design choice plus EV is pretty obsolete with how easy it is to replenish energy for everyone now). Link is kinda...pointless? if you have Blessing active all the time. Both of them have high energy cost and lasts just as short.

Honestly she's just a walking Arcane Energize with a pretty mediocre DR support skill. But 75% is not much in whatever scenario that requires DR to survive. All decent tank frames have 90%+ DR. Yeah I get that it's a team ability with huge range that's independent to Ability Range. Still sucks because most meta warframes have some kind of DR built-in, and it's costly to both build for and sustain. Just "nice to have but can do without" tier.

The best version of Trinity was the time she could abuse Link and Sancti Castanas and nuke the whole map. Fun times.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Marvelous_A

[schilds]

Trin has ~94% DR with both Link and Blessing active.

[SneakyErvin]

17 minutes ago, schilds said:

Trin has ~94% DR with both Link and Blessing active.

While true doesnt link only provide the DR versus targets that are linked though? Which isnt exactly many targets with the silly low link cap on link, nor does it guaranteed that the DR is active versus the target that it might actually be needed against, since some low damage trash mob might be the linked enemy instead.

[schilds]

No. Link reduces 75% of *all* incoming damage as long as she is linked to one enemy.

Btw. it also prevents status effects and knockdowns/staggers.

Edited November 15, 2023 by schilds

[AegidiusF]

il y a 36 minutes, schilds a dit :

Trin has ~94% DR with both Link and Blessing active.

il y a 13 minutes, schilds a dit :

No. Link reduces 75% of *all* incoming damage as long as she is linked to one enemy.

Btw. it also prevents status effects and knockdowns/staggers.

Yes !!! Totally that !

I just love Trinity and she is my most used frame and Link is her best ability, specially with the augment+Archon Vitality against Grineer.

She can easily get 99,85% damage reduction by just stacking the DR of Link, Blessing, Arcane Guardian and Adaptation. The Blessing+Link+Adaptation are even stronger now with the raised shields DR and Trinity's shields can get up to 99.68% DR.

If needed (or if it's the player favorite gameplay), she can easily shield gate with Blessing and Vampire Leach (Augment).

Eximus can't do much to her (except energy drain), as Link prevents her from getting status effects.

She can easily get red crits with arcane Avanger and Champion's Blessing.

And, at the same time, she protects the whole squad (specially when you use Fosfors).

I can't say how much I love this frame !!!🥰

But... she lacks duration... Of course, with Energy Vampire we she can spam her abilities, as energy is not a problem, but it is a bit boring to recast three of her abilities every thirty seconds...

[Hexerin]

People seriously need to stop defending Trinity's design, or she'll never get the updates she desperately needs.

[schilds]

Perhaps if the people critiquing Trin could get their facts straight they could build a stronger argument about the areas in which Trin actually needs work.

[Xamuswing]

Remove the Hallowed Ground requirement on Reckoning, it's all I ask DE. It's annoying having 5-6 enemies that are supposed to be armor stripped, not be, bcus they were slightly out of Hallowed Ground's range.

[Tiltskillet]

5 minutes ago, Xamuswing said:

Remove the Hallowed Ground requirement on Reckoning, it's all I ask DE. It's annoying having 5-6 enemies that are supposed to be armor stripped, not be, bcus they were slightly out of Hallowed Ground's range.

Although if they had matching ranges at least in length, and HG had some depth, they'd work much better than they do. 

I get why that's a frequent request, but I kind of like that Oberon requires both for his strip.  I just wish both abilities offered more on their own to make up for it, and meshed somewhat better.

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

43 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

People seriously need to stop defending Trinity's design, or she'll never get the updates she desperately needs.

Desperately is a reach and a half.

If I explained a frame that has infinite energy, 100% armor strip, dmg reduction and redistribution, infinite healing and shield Gating, you'd swear it was the most broken thing ever.

Funny thing is she has build diversity that allows her to tank, nuke, support, and dps up to lvl cap and ppl swear she's on the brink.

This community is bonkers 

[Hexerin]

9 minutes ago, (XBOX)zThulsaDoomz said:

Desperately is a reach and a half.

If I explained a frame that has infinite energy, 100% armor strip, dmg reduction and redistribution, infinite healing and shield Gating, you'd swear it was the most broken thing ever.

Funny thing is she has build diversity that allows her to tank, nuke, support, and dps up to lvl cap and ppl swear she's on the brink.

This community is bonkers 

Anything can be distorted to sound like anything if you cherry pick complete generalizations with no context or data. Do better.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Hexerin

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

3 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Anything can be distorted to sound like anything if you cherry pick complete generalizations with no context or data. Do better.

This is exactly what I'm talking about.  

Pray tell, what exactly did I say that was distorted?  

[(PSN)Spider_Enigma]

1 hour ago, Hexerin said:

Anything can be distorted to sound like anything if you cherry pick complete generalizations with no context or data. Do better.

go home ur drunk, trinity is broken just like nyx and i anyone asks or them to be nerfed (reworked) again... the forums will be on fire

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 1 hora, (PSN)Spider_Enigma dijo:

go home ur drunk, trinity is broken just like nyx and i anyone asks or them to be nerfed (reworked) again... the forums will be on fire

I couldn't give an opinion on Trinity because I haven't used it yet, but if you say it's on par with Nyx (a warframe I use), it needs a revision.

[(PSN)Hopper_Orouk]

On 2023-11-12 at 1:09 PM, L3512 said:

Rapid Resilience

you speak of ancient texts! I thought people didn't know this mod existed...it's such a clutch, and it's passive, I don't need to cast abilities or nothin'