Instantly Knowing Where The Demolisher is Kinda Kills Disruption

[LRonHoover]

Nice, I haven't had the time to check any of the new stuff out yet but due to some explosions irl when I play the the old disruptions I have been using a second monitor with a spectrogram to find the demolyst and while it's better then nothing, it's not always reliable if something else spikes in the audio in the same rhythm as the demolyst beeping.

[Circle_of_Psi]

1 minute ago, CrownOfShadows said:

Saw the bait. Didn't take it. You only wanted a suggestion so you could ridicule it.

Uh, no?

Where the hell does it say anywhere in the post that I wish to ridicule it, you only copied and pasted responses because most people here don't agree with you with what I can tell anyway.

How else would we change this?

The only thing I can think of is perhaps once you slot in the key, you'll have to actively look around before you can find it and once a player does find it, it shows as a permanent marker, while still forcing players to go hunt for it? 

[Circle_of_Psi]

5 minutes ago, LRonHoover said:

but due to some explosions irl when I play

Uh..

Please PLEASE tell me you mean explosions form the game 

[Aldain]

This really doesn't seem like an issue to me, mainly because the solution previously was just mindlessly ping-ponging from room to room until the beeping got louder and then killing the demo.

[CrownOfShadows]

Just now, Circle_of_Psi said:

Where the hell does it say anywhere in the post that I wish to ridicule it

It says it in your tone. I can already tell you're going to hate any suggestion I make. And that is very obvious bait. You demand that I come up with the solution, and then you try to guilt me into it when I say no? And then you ridicule me? And then you pillory me? Sorry, you're coming across as very bad faith and honestly as a pretty big jerk. Don't ever demand people come up with solutions - and then certainly don't piss on them if they don't have any or don't want to give one. Come up with your own. Or do you care so little about the hearing impaired yourself?

3 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

you only copied and pasted responses because most people here don't agree with you with what I can tell anyway.

Completely false. I pasted responses because people DON'T READ and it directly addressed their issues. When people said something intelligent and on-topic (and in good faith) I replied in kind. Don't troll or bully people just because you don't agree with them.

[SneakyErvin]

33 minutes ago, CrownOfShadows said:

It now operates very differently. It's now run to target. There is no searching.

It actually works more like it did upon initial release before DE managed to bug out parts of the visual help in tracking. There used to be a red indicator of the direction on the minimap when the demo approached the conduit, quite a long distance. So all other places were more or less fixed in this patch, a few years late but atleast a fix none the less. I played most my disruptions with music on, aside from the release event period. At some point in a patch that was ruined since the visual tracker got busted, which resulted in it at times always showing on the minimap, even at ridiculous spawn ranges and sometime barely not at all. 

I remeber on Kuva Fortress where it spawns so close that it drops to the conduit in seconds, and at times neither the tiny arrow nor the red square marker showed the demo before it was on the conduit. In most cases you could safeguard by just staying at the conduit, but that isnt something that really made the mode more challenging or interesting, just tedious with bad flow if you didnt want to use headphones and tweaked sound settings.

[Tiltskillet]

It had to change for accessibility reasons, so I'm pleased about that.  But for my own part, as somebody who doesn't have hearing issues (yet) and enjoys using audible clues, and doesn't mind failing the occasional conduit,   I have some of the same feelings as the OP.   I do feel a loss of urgency in Disruption that I miss.* 

Perhaps it could have been handled a little differently.  Like, instead of a marker, just have a x degree direction cone marked, and only for the player unlocking the conduit,  until the Demo comes close-ish to either a player or conduit.  Or a toggle in options between "visually focused indicators" and "audible focused indicators".   These all sound complex compared to what DE did implement though.   I'm not sure there ever was a solution that would be a great compromise between preserving the old feel, accessibility for the hearing impaired, and the practical needs of game design.

 

*_{Although ironically enough, I did fail a conduit yesterday.  It was Lua though, and I think that's just my own personal problems with navigating there.  It's always been 10x harder than any other Disruption for me.}

[CrownOfShadows]

13 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

It actually works more like it did upon initial release before DE managed to bug out parts of the visual help in tracking. There used to be a red indicator of the direction on the minimap when the demo approached the conduit, quite a long distance. So all other places were more or less fixed in this patch, a few years late but atleast a fix none the less. I played most my disruptions with music on, aside from the release event period. At some point in a patch that was ruined since the visual tracker got busted, which resulted in it at times always showing on the minimap, even at ridiculous spawn ranges and sometime barely not at all. 

I remeber on Kuva Fortress where it spawns so close that it drops to the conduit in seconds, and at times neither the tiny arrow nor the red square marker showed the demo before it was on the conduit. In most cases you could safeguard by just staying at the conduit, but that isnt something that really made the mode more challenging or interesting, just tedious with bad flow if you didnt want to use headphones and tweaked sound settings.

This may be, I wasn't playing actively at the time.

All I know is that now I activate a conduit and the demolisher appears pretty much instantly and I don't have to search for it at all anymore, I just have to run (or boredly walk) over to it, and that feels... kinda lame.

[Corvid]

I'm not exactly hard of hearing, but I do often struggle with picking out specific sounds from any amount of ambient noise. This change makes Disruption much more playable for me.

[LRonHoover]

41 minutes ago, Circle_of_Psi said:

Uh..

Please PLEASE tell me you mean explosions form the game 

#justrigpigthings

[Circle_of_Psi]

42 minutes ago, CrownOfShadows said:

 Come up with your own. Or do you care so little about the hearing impaired yourself?

Okay, Look I'm sorry if misunderstood something here but I am so confused about your response here

I only asked "Why don't you tell us how you'd change it or hand in your suggestions, I'd love to hear them" I don't have any idea why you'd assume that this has any tone in it, since I was and still am genuinely interested in what you have to offer and say, if it sounded off-hand or sarcastic that wasn't the intention.

Also, I did come up with my suggestion but it seems you just scrolled past with what I can see in the post and again, I only asked not demanded, I honestly don't know why you decided to proceed to go on about bad faith and me being a big jerk, since like I said that wasn't the intention.

 

Hell, you could've mentioned it from the start and asked me to correct it if you honestly deemed it off-hand or sarcastic and I would've edited it with no problem, overall like I said I'm sorry if it came across that way, all I can say now.

 

I think we got off the wrong foot here

Edited March 30 by Circle_of_Psi

[SneakyErvin]

17 minutes ago, CrownOfShadows said:

This may be, I wasn't playing actively at the time.

All I know is that now I activate a conduit and the demolisher appears pretty much instantly and I don't have to search for it at all anymore, I just have to run (or boredly walk) over to it, and that feels... kinda lame.

I havent tried it on old tiles yet. But if anything it is just a good benefit on the old tiles aswell if it shows their spawn direction instantly, since it allows us to get around otherwise horrible bugs, like enemies getting stuck way way way way away and never reaching the conduit.

edit: Plus it is another boon for those that love to play solo and cant speed disruption up by covering 4 directions at all times.

Edited March 30 by SneakyErvin

[Tiltskillet]

14 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Plus it is another boon for those that love to play solo and cant speed disruption up by covering 4 directions at all times.

As somebody who almost entirely plays Disruption solo, I don't regard it as an improvement to my enjoyment of the mode.

[Xzorn]

It's kinda trivial to just listen for the bloop sound. What sucks is when you have music playing and can't hear it as well.

It's kinda a trivial interaction IMO. Music off = Easy to hear. Music on = Harder for no reason.

[UnstarPrime]

3 hours ago, CrownOfShadows said:

You could accommodate the hearing impaired or people who just want music (me) without changing the way it works in the slightest.

Can you elaborate on what this means?  Because I would think that accommodation requires adjusting something in the game, which by definition means you're changing it.

[Daddy.bulbs]

Am i suppose to take this seriously ? You telling me it was more fun to listen to sounds than have a visual indicator bahahahaha . Get out of here you are like 0.1% who is crying about this . They are not changing this nor should they. This is better.

[PollexMessier]

It does sort of make things a bit too easy. I feel like the distance at which it's marked should be halved.

I do understand why they did it, but they definitely overcompensated by a lot.

[CrownOfShadows]

Just now, UnstarPrime said:

Can you elaborate on what this means?  Because I would think that accommodation requires adjusting something in the game, which by definition means you're changing it.

Rather than just instantly showing everyone where the demolisher is and where to go, they could keep the search aspect as it is and just add visual feedback to indicate your proximity.

Something as simple as visual dot on the HUD that flashes in sync with the sound pulses or increases it's flash rate with proximity, or something as advanced as a custom sonar or tying it into our radar system, or a meter so you are 'sounding' for it and slowly resolving it's direction visually like any number of other games, or some of the suggestions TiltSkillet made.

All it needed was a visual accompaniment. Just represent the sound notification on the screen by any number of methods. The player just needs to know 'aha - it's probably over in this direction but I need to go further that way to make sure' (and that process should not start at the conduit, just like the audio version, players should have to fish around a little for it)

[zThulsaDoomz]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

It actually works more like it did upon initial release before DE managed to bug out parts of the visual help in tracking.

This 100%

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

2 hours ago, CrownOfShadows said:

Saw the bait. Didn't take it. You only wanted a suggestion so you could ridicule it.

Actually, I was curious about your solution as well. You did suggest DE could've fixed the issue another way, which means you must've had a thought on it. Otherwise, why just say that?

[CrownOfShadows]

Just now, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said:

Actually, I was curious about your solution as well. You did suggest DE could've fixed the issue another way, which means you must've had a thought on it. Otherwise, why just say that?

Maybe it's the toxicity of the forums getting to me but whenever someone says 'tell us how you'd do it' that's a red flag - 99% of the time they don't care and they just want to bash whatever idea you might throw out there. Anyways, just posted some quick thoughts for the wolves to mock and shred a couple posts above this.

[UnstarPrime]

5 minutes ago, CrownOfShadows said:

Rather than just instantly showing everyone where the demolisher is and where to go, they could keep the search aspect as it is and just add visual feedback to indicate your proximity.

Something as simple as visual dot on the HUD that flashes in sync with the sound pulses or increases it's flash rate with proximity, or something as advanced as a custom sonar or tying it into our radar system, or a meter so you are 'sounding' for it and slowly resolving it's direction visually like any number of other games, or some of the suggestions TiltSkillet made.

All it needed was a visual accompaniment. Just represent the sound notification on the screen by any number of methods. The player just needs to know 'aha - it's probably over in this direction but I need to go further that way to make sure' (and that process should not start at the conduit, just like the audio version, players should have to fish around a little for it)

That makes sense, thanks for clarifying.  It makes me wonder if perhaps that's what DE tried to do, but maybe the system is over-tuned in such a way that a barely audible sound that 99% of players wouldn't hear is visualized as a 100% visible waypoint that is impossible to miss?

At present this change does seem like it goes a bit further than simply adding accommodations, in that it seems to have entirely removed the "searching" aspect even that able-bodied hearing players had to engage in in the past.  Hopefully a little tuning can bring that part back, unless it's truly DE's desire that that aspect be entirely removed?  Which seems unlikely...

 

[(PSN)rexis12]

Nah. 

Sorry that I'm not a fan if sweaty, try hard gameplay, where I have to strain my ears that, for most of my life, has had actual issues in determining sound direction in addition to having bad audio equipment limiting my gameplay. 

"But they could have accomidated it better."

 

It's still Disruption, it's still a gear check, it's still reach them before they blow up, and they still don't show up on the map until the beeps sound.

It's just Necramechs in Deimos literally spawn in the next room over instead of other Disruptions. 

[(XBOX)Timidobserver]

What's killing the new disruption is how they don't cleanse anything. It's easy to just lock them down indefinitely. 

[CrownOfShadows]

10 minutes ago, (XBOX)Timidobserver said:

What's killing the new disruption is how they don't cleanse anything. It's easy to just lock them down indefinitely. 

OMG this is TRUE! I didn't even realize it - this has got to be a bug. The status purge field expands like normal from them but it doesn't actually cleanse them!

I searched the Dante forums but don't see a single mention of it. Did you report it?

Edited March 30 by CrownOfShadows