PC Dante Unbound: Hotfix 35.5.4

[Redrigoth]

@[DE]Megan

Implement the suggestion in this post please. Would make the mode much much better:

 

[Rognyr]

Haven't played yet, but did the LoS get fixed regarding enemies blocked by other enemies?....

Edit: still doesent mean I'm gonna not cast mass mend buttcrack when I'm playing...everyone gets overguard for this nonsense, whether you want energy or not lol

Edited April 5 by Rognyr

[MaxamealianP]

This last pass of nerfs clearly shows us that DE has completely lost touch with us as players. Nerfing a brand new warframe a week after his launch, nuking a new fun build potential for Nezha are just 2 examples of DE wasting Dev time and having NO understanding of how the game is in its current state. 90% of the weapons in the game are USELESS. Over half of the currently released frames need serious help;

Chroma's build makes no sense and never has. Relying on taking damage is completely backwards, you want to absorb damage to do more yourself? Play harrow and press 4, Chroma's 1 doesn't even clear trash mobs at normal levels of play let alone in steel path or netracels or Deep Arch. The numbers on his 2 and 3 are so unnecessary and still make no meaningful effect on your outgoing killing in meaningful content (endgame grinds, or even Basic steel path) His 4 doubles credits......that could be a mod or his 1, but as his Ult it completely sums up the frame. 

Banshee is totally useless as her key ability doesn't work on the enemies you need to kill quick enough to warrant using the ability.

Caliban....enough said

 Limbo is a troll that actively has caused people to quit the game after being matched with someone playing him, he literally says no you're not aloud to play.

Ember being punished for having 90% DR and using her kit as intended.....i loved ember and wish she wasn't so punishing to play.

Frost's entire kit needs a rework, yes his 4 actually does something now with the mod and his bubble defends things at low to mid level but in high steel path or beyond, his bubble is as useless as his 1 and 2 which do nothing even by end of normal star chart

Dagath, sevagoth, oberon, valkyr qorvex all feel half finished like they are just there, fun to play in mid steel path but even with ridiculous investment they still cannot come within a lightyear of the frames that have good/complete kits. Mesa (even with here pathetic 1), Saryn (despite her lackluster 2 ), Revenant, Gauss, Protea....these are frames that not only do the content, but can be built by anyone with budget builds and played right through to the hardest content in the game. So instead of wasting our time with new releases that you're just going to toss out with un needed nerfs immediately, FIX YOUR MISTAKES! I've been playing warframe on and off for nearly a decade, I've seen the great things that can be done. WAKE UP! Before Warframe gets dropped, the way you're dropping us as a community with these Farces.   

[KamuiHyuga]

11 minutes ago, [DE]Danielle said:

Hey Tenno! Sharing here that we also have plans for a Hotfix next week that will address the following: 

• Adding back and formalizing the Status Damage Vulnerability to Dante's "Pageflight". In other words not just making enemies take more Status procs, but also increasing the damage of their Status. 
• Improving the co-op play between Warframes that give teammates Overguard and Warframes that rely on taking damage. 

Full details here: 

 

One minor suggestion I'd have in regards to the LoS on Tragedy.  If an enemy is hit by Dark Verse, flag them as such for the next 10s or so.  Any flagged enemies are then excluded from the LoS check on Tragedy, and the flag is then removed from all enemies that were hit with Tragedy.

[Drake_MPrime]

1 hour ago, [DE]Megan said:

Dante Changes & Fixes 

Tragedy Line of Sight (LoS) Changes & Fixes: 
As a result of yesterday’s Hotfix and the understandable feedback we’re receiving, we wanted to address the clearly broken state of Dante’s Tragedy LoS checks. It was not implemented to our standards, and that is on us. We know that this has been an unpopular change, which was greatly aggravated by the fact that a) it launched in a defective state and b) that LoS checks in general suffer from broad inconsistencies. 

Our first step is improving how LoS checks work with Tragedy to fix the inconsistencies and ineffectiveness. We’ll use our learnings from this incident to review other cases of LoS check issues for a future update.  

• Improved Tragedy’s Line of Sight checks per enemy to be much more forgiving and reliable to fix the many cases players reported of not being able to hit enemies at all. Now, it considers not only the enemies that Dante sees but also those visible on screen/via the camera—so any part of them, big or small, is considered visible/eligible to pass the LoS check.  
  • To break that down a bit deeper: 
    •  Enemies positioned directly behind or in front of Dante 
      • We have made it so that enemies within 5 meters of Dante are automatically considered visible; no LoS checks are required. 
    • Enemies barely in cover or who had just run to cover
    • Enemies positioned at a different height to Dante where they are still partially in view 
  • Enemies that are not caught by the "Is the enemy on screen?" check (behind or to the sides of you) use an improved target detection where we now check for line of sight to the target's head, torso, and feet. Previously we only checked for their torso. This will improve the reliability of hitting enemies even when they are not directly on the screen.
• Fixed Tragedy not hitting/affecting ragdolled enemies that are in LoS.
  • This was a particularly brutal bug considering the number of abilities, weapons, and other effects that can cause enemies to be ragdolled. This issue also contributed to the many scenarios in which Tragedy did not apply at all. 

With the changes above, this is where Tragedy’s LoS should have been originally. As mentioned above, we are also taking what we’ve learned from Dante and will be making general improvements to LoS checks as a whole in a future update. We provided details on how we plan to do that in the post we made today, but in short we will be making LoS checks across the board far more reliable than they are currently. 

Light Verse and Triumph Overguard Increases: 
The second pillar of feedback we want to address is our changes to Dante’s Overguard capabilities. We went too deep with the initial decrease and are, therefore, bumping up the Overguard gain from Light Verse and Triumph to a middle ground between their pre- and post-balance states.   

• Increased the Overguard gained from Light Verse from 250 to 350 at Max Rank.
• Increased the Overguard gained from Triumph from 2000 to 3000 at Max Rank.

We knew we could tackle LoS improvements and Overguard bumps today without hesitation. However, this is just the tip of the feedback iceberg, and we know there’s more that’s been shared beyond what we can accomplish today regarding both LoS, Overguard, and more. So we’ll continue to digest and evaluate feedback, and we encourage you to keep sharing in the dedicated Dante Feedback subforum.

We value your input and how it helps us iterate and improve together. Thank you, Tenno.
 

Deep Archimedea Fixes: 

• Fixed Clients being unable to interact with Void Angels to revive fallen Host for the second time in a mission due to the context action missing. 
• Fixed the Loadout options resetting daily instead of weekly (at usual reset time) as intended. 
  • All conditions for Deep Archimedia are on a weekly reset, so the Loadout Modifiers follow this standard. 
• Fixed the message to defeat the Void Angels to revive downed players lingering on screen for Clients. 
• Fixed [PH] tag appearing in the additional Search Pulses tooltip in the Netracell screen. 
• Fixed a script error that could occur between missions. 
• Fixed a crash caused by recovering from being knocked down in Deep Archimedea. 
  • This was also causing an issue where your Warframe would seemingly “trip” all over the place before crashing. 

Fixes: 

• Fixed a crash caused by the “Complete an Exterminate mission in 6 minutes” Cavia Bounty challenge. 
• Fixed the Void Angel in the Angels of the Zariman Quest, as well as those in Void Armageddon missions, not having an objective marker.
• Fixed the lighting in the interior of the Orbiter (not on Drifter Camp) changing from bright to dark as you move around when the Dynamic Lighting or Sun Shadows settings are  disabled. 
• Fixes towards some surface artifacting occurring in the Drifter Camp.
• Fixed Secondary ammo pickups in the Simulacrum not charging the Grimoire’s alt-fire. 
• Fixed the splash sound FX from throwing Amphors at Crucibles being heard throughout the level. 
• Fixed given Grimoire to friendly NPC (i.e. Rescue Target, etc.) causing Secondary ammo pickups to stick to the player. 
• Fixed Blueprints that have crafting costs that exceed a player’s owned Credits appearing at the top of the Foundry list when sorted by “State”. 
• Fixed glowing blue orbs appearing on the Conduits in the Armatus Disruption mission. 
• Fixed broken lighting throughout the Grineer Sealabs Assasination (Titania) tileset. 
• Fixed [PH] tag appearing in the TennoGuide when instructed to visit Onkko after completing The War Within Quest. 
• Fixed some hitching when loading into Venus missions. 
• Fixed a crash caused by weapon hit direction. 
• Fixed crashes caused by Keyglyphs being reassigned to players after Host migration. 
• Fixed a script error in Isolation Vault Bounties. 

For list of known issues for Dante Unbound, visit our dedicated thread: 
https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1388578-dante-unbound-known-issues-thread/
 

 

Ok, it's better now! Ty

[max784020]

1 hour ago, MrDerpHerpin said:

@[DE]Meganplease im begging you... nowhere on your site or in game does it say getting a refund on a frame would not also refund the shards.. i just want my shards back...

You can remove the shards with the Helminth

[CjoewD]

You know what, I just don't care what you do with your game anymore. I'm done.

[Theweedle]

1 hour ago, Halo said:

Awesome, Dark Verse is worse now. 

Was not LoS checking before, now it is...

Specifying: Before 5.4, Dark Verse was hitting through walls, now it is NOT...

Allow me to preface the above two statements: DARK VERSE WAS NOT LINE-OF-SIGHT CHECKING BEFORE THIS HOTFIX, AND NOW IT IS...

Nezha also lost all hope in being relevant with an augment nerf. Piece of advice: 
- If you are going to release something then nerf it, don't release it unless YOU YOURSELVES TEST IT FOR THINGS LIKE THIS

Same can be said in regards to Dante, which I can heavily assume you've had weeks if not longer with him longer than us to test for these things. 

If you truly wanted to release a frame with the right specifications... TEST. THIS. CRAP. FIRST. 

Almost Like There Should Be A Test Server For Things Like This, Hmm... 

I digress. Thank you for the hotfix for Deep Archemedia, but Dante is in a sad state. I'll still use him on occasion, but no where near as much as my normal frames. 

Overall take you need to consider: 
- Remove it for Dark Verse and Tragedy. 
- Remove it, for the love of all that is this frame. 
- You made a grimoire / magic caster-esce frame, let the man DO HIS SCHTICK...

Imagine if Saryn's Spores were LoS checking and could not go through rooms, imagine if her Miasma LoS'd and did not go through rooms, imagine if Frost's Avalanche LoS'd and did not hit enemies in other rooms or behind cover, imagine if TOO MANY FRAMES HAD LOS AND MADE THEM WORSE...

All we ask is to remove LoS from these two... How hard is it to pull back from your AOE-Like Nerf for once?!

Do it DE, you won't: 

Edit: If I a not forced to use Dante now for certain activities (Duviri, Arbi Choice, or Deep Archemedia), I will 100% never use him again. 

Everyone, just build for his book, viral it up, and watch everything die, as his 3 and tragedy are beyond saving now. 

DE has proven to us that AoE is still on their hard-nerfing list and never want to deal with it. 

Okay so, I dont actually think you are correct about dark verse having no LoS checks before patch 5.4.. I have a clip from the day dante launched proving it could not go through walls. https://imgur.com/a/Bn9UOCG

If you watch the video, you can clearly see dark verse IS NOT going through walls. This video was taken the day after dante launched, using a 250% range build. Thats not to say it didnt occasionally go through certain walls or obstacles, but it 100% DID have LoS restrictions.

[Zephstrix]

DE,

While I'm happy you have looked at our negative feedback and are re-visiting Dante, and LOS in general, which is more than most devs.

And I do want to thank you for replying so quickly to our negative feedback.

With all due respect - you didn't actually act on or address our main concern.

The overall resounding majority of the community was calling the LOS addition to Tragedy unneeded at all.

As I and many others put yesterday, we have lots of other nuke frames that get away with their nuking and damage much easier and better than Dante.

We really don't see why it was needed at all or how it was an issue in the first place.

If you're not willing to revert the nerf made - I would like to see your reasoning and justification to why Tragedy was hit so we can at least understand the change.

I'm glad you at least saw our concern, but please listen to us, or as I just said explain why.

We as a community really want to understand why it was deserved at all, and a lot of us really want to see you actually address our main concerns directly.

 

Also - to those of you being nasty to the dev team or toxic in general - please stop.

DE will listen to us more if we show we care and we respect them and their game. 

Acting out will not help our situation - reasonable discussion and show of concern will. 

 

Thanks.

Edited April 5 by Zephstrix

[Sin3z]

What is it specifically that you guys have against dante "nuking" enemies. An issue alot of dante players including me are having is the imbalance of attention to his "nuking" capabilities compared to frames that have existed doing similar and in many cases better things to him. At this point you should know exactly who these frames are but just in case you dont, saryn, gauss, kullervo, ,mesa, and volt are currently the most popular ones. Many if not all of them dont require Los and can be equally "disruptive" to squad play by not giving squadmates also playing similar frames to get the chance to even interact with enemies. And just like dante, at higher difficulties when enemies scale to the point of actually being worth proper builds, their immediate nuking capabilites severely diminish without either scaling over time(saryn spores) or requiring some form of set up/primer in order to perform. This also takes time which also gives squadmates the chance to interact with enemies given high enough difficulty is reached, so again why is dante the one being targeted specifically here. His previous "dominance" came from the fact that he was literally a week old, given another week or 2 people would have gotten bored and moved back to whatever frames they like/ wanted to play before his release. Keep in mind hes the first frame released to function the way he does so of course many will want to play him. Popularity should not be an immediate indicator of dominance, but treated as a potential symptom. More time should have been given as he was before jumping the gun to nerf him, again, literally a week after his release. There is no way your data would have been accurate enough so many changes let alone any changes at all besides bug fixes.

TLDR: dante was essentially on par with other ability primary/spam frames  in the game so targeting him with Los nerfs while other similarly "dominant" frames have existed the way they have for years leaves the playerbase feeling rejected especially when so much of the feedback is clearly to remove the Los requirements on him.

Edited April 5 by Sin3z

[Rahlgrim]

The weekly reset of Archi RNG could ruin some player's whole week, if they get the worst kit imaginable. I don't think thats how anyone wants new feature content to go. Maybe the DAILY reset was a great idea. Or maybe the option to reroll your loadout 1 time daily, and that not effect your progress.

 

 

Edited April 5 by Rahlgrim

[Veysheng]

You did bare minimum and pat yourselves on the back, while STILL ignoring the most glaring issues people have.

We. Don't. Need. Your. LoS.

Either revert it, or man up and standardize it. Your golden children should also be subjected.

Also, revert Dante's overguard values, it's still an absurd nerf. It wasn't that good before, and it's still garbage now.

[TheBlackAce21]

I have been keeping a close eye on this the entire time because Dante might be my favorite warframe release in a LONG time. To those talking about LoS revert? You are wrong. He was too strong on release and if you think otherwise, you don't understand enough about how the game works. Even post nerf, his toolkit utility from pageflight and wordwarden alone make him one of the strongest warframes for weapon utility in the game. FULL STOP.

The ability to apply status effects is a major part of the weapon damage meta right now and he has the ability to add status chance and it's multiplicative to base status. That's ABSOLUTELY INSANE. It allows for status chance values that will let you scale heat procs to a stupid level and that's not even counting the effect it has on Gun CO just by itself.

Wordwarden just adds a floating secondary shot that deals a lot of damage for what it is and can be further used to stack status chances you otherwise wouldn't be able to stack with a single gun and companion alone. MORE damage on guns.

Then overguard. Doesn't even matter what state it's in, he has overguard regen and that mechanic has it's own gating outside shields. It's strong as hell on its OWN. And yet we are focused on the fact that he doesn't get a stupidly op range nuke ability as well? It still functions as an AoE coneless expedite suffering. AND it has damage of it's own. It's stupidly strong even with LoS and the fact that it sparked a return to addressing LoS bugs is GREAT for the health of the game.

 

DE I know you are getting a lot of flak right now, and I want you to know that there are people like myself clapping at how this is being handled. I'm overjoyed to see the direction this whole thing has gone. Dante feels strong and balanced. Plus LoS is getting a solid look. I couldn't be happier right now.

Edited April 5 by TheBlackAce21
typo

[Gaxxian]

hace 28 minutos, [DE]Danielle dijo:

Hey Tenno! Sharing here that we also have plans for a Hotfix next week that will address the following: 

• Adding back and formalizing the Status Damage Vulnerability to Dante's "Pageflight". In other words not just making enemies take more Status procs, but also increasing the damage of their Status. 
• Improving the co-op play between Warframes that give teammates Overguard and Warframes that rely on taking damage. 

Full details here: 

 

Oh! Then next week when you address OG interaction with Rage, you will revert ALL the nerfs to Dante since they will be completely unnecesary, right?

[Roble_Viejo]

REMOVE THE LINE OF SIGHT !!!

What's going on? Why are you so stubborn about this??? 

[BoredFinno]

Once again, you tackling the LoS is pointless in the 1st place as it shouldn't be a thing because:

1. Condition for the nuke is to have a DoT status
2. Easiest way for applying that status is an ability that ALREADY has LoS and can be pointed in a direction
3. Damage depends on the amount of DoT statuses applied, which, again, is usually done with directional methods(shooting the enemy, dark verse)

Adding another condition/check for a skill that is already very conditional is stupid and bad game design. It removes satisfaction in a game that is all about it. You are not developing dark souls game, you are developing a power fantasy one. Im not saying there shouldn't be challenge or to let a single frame dominate, but considering how an ability feels should be your priority. And big part of Tragedy feeling good was the fact it had no LoS.

[Halo]

9 minutes ago, Theweedle said:

Okay so, I dont actually think you are correct about dark verse having no LoS checks before patch 5.4.. I have a clip from the day dante launched proving it could not go through walls. https://imgur.com/a/Bn9UOCG

If you watch the video, you can clearly see dark verse IS NOT going through walls. This video was taken the day after dante launched, using a 250% range build. Thats not to say it didnt occasionally go through certain walls or obstacles, but it 100% DID have LoS restrictions.

Then this is even worse...

I swear on my Nidus Prime that it was prior to this, that or it was right before 5.3. 

DE just had to break the golden rule: "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"...

[Gandalf_White]

12 minutes ago, Theweedle said:

Okay so, I dont actually think you are correct about dark verse having no LoS checks before patch 5.4.. I have a clip from the day dante launched proving it could not go through walls. https://imgur.com/a/Bn9UOCG

If you watch the video, you can clearly see dark verse IS NOT going through walls. This video was taken the day after dante launched, using a 250% range build. Thats not to say it didnt occasionally go through certain walls or obstacles, but it 100% DID have LoS restrictions.

Yea Dark Verse always had LoS. It's the sole reason why I'm so against LoS on his Tragedy as well. There doesn't need to be a double LoS check. It just makes Tragedy clunky to use.

[AleteiaHogryff]

1 hour ago, OggerAZ said:

Nothing on the ridiculous nerf on nezha's divine retribution :(

"ridiculous nerf" hahaahahahahhahaa this is Warframe not grandchase..

[Theweedle]

3 minutes ago, Halo said:

Then this is even worse...

I swear on my Nidus Prime that it was prior to this, that or it was right before 5.3. 

DE just had to break the golden rule: "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"...

Im totally with you on them reverting the LoS restriction added to tragedy. I just wanted to clear any misconceptions that people might have about dark verse. It ALWAYS needed LoS. Yes, its LoS checks are very forgiving, and at times it can feel like it goes through walls.. But there are definitively LoS checks on it and there always were.

[Beryliberries]

5 minutes ago, Halo said:

Then this is even worse...

I swear on my Nidus Prime that it was prior to this, that or it was right before 5.3. 

DE just had to break the golden rule: "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"...

It has no LOS for containers/breakables. It does for enemies. It was like this prior.

Edited April 5 by Beryliberries

[Museigen]

Done some tests, ten minutes of steel path mot, and my partial considerations are:

- First, about Tragedy. It's actually functional, now. But there's still bugs and unintended things happening, like enemies that are covered by our warframe by the camera perspective being not hit and some other inconsistencies. I think they are still getting cover by they own allies sometimes, but I'm not sure. All in all, still in a rough state, should be more tested and perfected before implementation from the very begining, but at least this band-aid is better than letting completely broken like it was on the 35.5.3 hotfix.
- About Triumph and Overguard. Now is less of a hassle to deal with. But I still feels it's really lacking. My suggestion is to buff the overguard buff  that gives og by kill, maybe double its effect. It's way more interesting to maintain the overguard with killing than with renewed casts, yet we will still need to renew the buff.
- Wordwarden. Nothing great, but it's ok. My build intend to use all the frame, so I didn't helminthed my exalted and I actually use it to kill some things. Didn't notice anything great here. It's working how it was working, and that is ok. This is not a weapon platform frame.

-Pageflight I really think the nerf was completely uncalled for. Its only niche is to deal with single tanky unites, the dot amplification was good for that. You take it out and the only thing it does is prime one unit at a time slowly. This is useless and not how a primer should work. Without aoe, there's no primer.

That is it for now. I really think you should have taken the nerf slower, instead of recovering him to form slowly. If you had an intention to make LoS better, make it better and only then apply it to Dante if needed. There's a lot of other frames in desperate need of attention right now. The tweak should be a ±10% performance at a time to see how things go. Not to cut off the frame's legs and see how it walks with a walking stick. Again, your initial approach of saying one thing and doing another was wrong to begin with.

EDIT: Just saw the news that pageflight will be returned to form. This is another step in the right direction. Thank you.

Edited April 5 by Museigen

[VibingCat]

1 hour ago, [DE]Megan said:

Fixed the Loadout options resetting daily instead of weekly (at usual reset time) as intended. 

• All conditions for Deep Archimedia are on a weekly reset, so the Loadout Modifiers follow this standard. 

 

That would have been a great idea, actually.

For a comparison, loadouts rotate many times per day in Duviri and most of the time we get weapons that simply can't handle high-level content. I barely managed to make it through Deep Archimedea with an Incarnon Soma.

[XioValency]

33 minutes ago, [DE]Danielle said:

Hey Tenno! Sharing here that we also have plans for a Hotfix next week that will address the following: 

• Adding back and formalizing the Status Damage Vulnerability to Dante's "Pageflight". In other words not just making enemies take more Status procs, but also increasing the damage of their Status. 
• Improving the co-op play between Warframes that give teammates Overguard and Warframes that rely on taking damage. 

Full details here: 

 

So half of the self synergistic and impactful support effects Dante ever had that flowed, made logical sense and had fair targeting limitations was not intended as such and a fair chunk of this warframes support capabilities was a genuine mistake? I'm actually baffled if this is true. you actually caught lightning in a bottle and smashed the bottle, I'm glad you a reverting because this is how parkour 2.0 came about.

[Siic07]

9 minutes ago, Roble_Viejo said:

REMOVE THE LINE OF SIGHT !!!

What's going on? Why are you so stubborn about this??? 

It's a very simple change but it seems like they aren't looking at the feedback, players don't exist for them