Support ticket: REFUND

[Digital_Malz]

Hello fellow Tenno!

I have spent 750p on Dante's bundle, plus 140p on Grimoire Mods bundle, and a total of 20 Forma (divided between Dante, Noctua, Grimoira and Companion) to create a build with synergy. 

Dante was not nerfed, he was obliterated and rendered useless. This hotfix didn't hotfixed anything. LoS is still the biggest problem of Dante, and DE seems to continue deaf to our plead to revise this stupid decision.

Based o this, I opened a support ticket demanding refund for all my investment based on false advertising.

Please, if you feel the same, DO it too. It's the least DE can do.

[RainThaBeast]

15 minutes ago, Digital_Malz said:

Hello fellow Tenno!

I have spent 750p on Dante's bundle, plus 140p on Grimoire Mods bundle, and a total of 20 Forma (divided between Dante, Noctua, Grimoira and Companion) to create a build with synergy. 

Dante was not nerfed, he was obliterated and rendered useless. This hotfix didn't hotfixed anything. LoS is still the biggest problem of Dante, and DE seems to continue deaf to our plead to revise this stupid decision.

Based o this, I opened a support ticket demanding refund for all my investment based on false advertising.

Please, if you feel the same, DO it too. It's the least DE can do.

Amen brother

[Wealthywyatt]

I just sent mine off. 

[IggySnow]

Nah. Its pretty common knowledge to not invest a crap ton of resources into content that was newly released for ANY game. I don't like the nerfs either, and its fine to be upset about your resources being used, but DE doesn't owe you anything.

[Divine_Intellect]

When you made your account, you agreed to the EULA, which basically states that DE can do whatever they want and you just have to smile and nod like a good boy. You will definitely not be getting a refund.

[FaraTenno]

1 hour ago, IggySnow said:

Nah. Its pretty common knowledge to not invest a crap ton of resources into content that was newly released for ANY game.

I've never liked this argument much. Newly released content wouldn't be nerfed if people didn't do the amount of investing required to find out just how obscenely powerful said new content can be.

It is on the devs to figure that out beforehand, as they are able to simulate any scenario in the game without risk of wasting hundreds of hours or potential real money.
If DE tested Dante thoroughly enough before his release, they would have known he needed these changes.
Relying on your players to beta test your game for you is a predatory practice when it is being monetized and taking hundreds of hours away with the snap of the dev's fingers.

The problem is that the change is catastrophic to Dante, not just "a minor tweak" that they can shadowdrop like this.

[megastorm]

Tbh, I think the community as a whole have a right to ask for refunds for a broken purchase. DE is not immune to have class action cases held for misrepresenting features and swaying the decision of many who did purchase Dante only to feel regret. 

 

Never in my life have I got caught up in thinking a company ripped me off. That's because reviews mostly save me. But I bought into this one. Not only did I buy Dante, but I bought forma too. I wasted my time with this and found him extremely mid and not what was advertised.

 

I am not the one to start a riot. But if anyone petitions to have a full on refund on his purchase, I am down. And I wish people spoke with there wallets more to show that we are the reason they are where they are. 

 

Stop sucking the damn fun out of it because y'all are too lazy to fix enemies to combat the power we spend money on. For f sake. Stop putting out purchasable content and get to the root of why your team is incompetent on keeping things fun. You keep releasing monotonous game loops but can't let us have fun doing it. You over nerf things to a broken stat. 

 

I didn't even know he was getting nerfed and I literally was shocked after my night rotation. Wtf DE. There are frames in my load out that I can switch to who are just as insane or even more crazy.

 

I sincerely want my money back. I really do not care what anyone else says. I feel like I wasted it and I don't work for you. I use you for entertainment, so entertain me!!!!

 

Edit: I am definitely putting in a ticket for this. Or finding out if I can report this thru steam.

Edited April 6 by megastorm
Not bluffing

[(PSN)thowed]

Where exactly do I file one?  I never wanted to do anything like this but this is setting a bad precedent.  I didn't spend platinum.  I actually paid $15 for the pack.  They knew exactly what he did and how he performed when he released.  I knew he was getting nerfed 5 minutes into the mission.  So are they that stupid or just wanted good publicity to drive sales and up numbers for the update?  Sorry I can't be nice to self aware obtuse people.

[Korpsite]

7 minutes ago, (PSN)thowed said:

Where exactly do I file one?  I never wanted to do anything like this but this is setting a bad precedent.  I didn't spend platinum.  I actually paid $15 for the pack.  They knew exactly what he did and how he performed when he released.  I knew he was getting nerfed 5 minutes into the mission.  So are they that stupid or just wanted good publicity to drive sales and up numbers for the update?  Sorry I can't be nice to self aware obtuse people.

support.warframe.com

Edited April 6 by Korpsite

[RainThaBeast]

I just submitted a ticket for a refund for my purchase of one of the dante bundles. This nerf was extremely unwarranted and unnecessary. I spent alot of time and in game resources on dante as well. I only get to really play on the weekend because of work, so this is very disappointing to me. Now even if they fix this, and revert him, I still lost all of this time not being able to use him in his fun state. I highly encourage anyone else that spent money, forma, or platinum on him to open a ticket as well, if you feel the same. I will also no longer be spending any more money on the game until they announce a full revert of the nerfs. 

[ReddyDisco]

Been a victim of this bait too many times in the past so now i don't invest into anything new for a few weeks, i was right this time and didn't even add a potato on dante, fed him to helminth chair

[megastorm]

31 minutes ago, ReddyDisco said:

Been a victim of this bait too many times in the past so now i don't invest into anything new for a few weeks, i was right this time and didn't even add a potato on dante, fed him to helminth chair

I built another for helminth. I just don't think DE deserves my money for this crap. I don't support BS!

[C11H22O1]

I'm gonna be honest this refund stuff is dumb, the moment you bought him you should already be aware that this is a game that is bound to receive changes, it doesn't matter if these changes happen now or years later.

They tend to give compensation for when things change drastically from what they used to be, like the Inaros rework, not for nerfs or buffs

Edited April 6 by C11H22O1

[MetalMechabolic]

15 hours ago, IggySnow said:

Nah. Its pretty common knowledge to not invest a crap ton of resources into content that was newly released for ANY game. I don't like the nerfs either, and its fine to be upset about your resources being used, but DE doesn't owe you anything.

So we have to preemptively assume that DE will gut any frame released?  What's the point of hyping up any frame then if it's just going to be hit with the nerf- er, tweak bat?  

[(PSN)Lollybomb]

There's basically no amount of testing that DE can do to catch things like this.  Especially with the level of customization players have at their disposal.  Players (and really public users in general) will always find ways to exploit a system in ways the developers couldn't dream of catching ahead of time.  They have a few hundred employees, the player base is a few hundred thousand players.  It's a war of numbers, and they're vastly outmatched.

[KhajiitDova]

I get why you all are upset, I do. I definitely wasn't happy about how this has been handled thus far. Nor am I trying to talk you out of trying for a refund, if you feel you are entitled to one, go for it. But I will say it is not likely you will get one (regardless of it was cash or resources) as they don't have a history for doing this and when using cash (not sure about platinum but I think so) that it is non refundable.  Anytime you see non refundable be sure that you want the thing regardless of what may happen (not just with this game but in life).

 

Good luck

[UnstarPrime]

4 minutes ago, (PSN)Lollybomb said:

There's basically no amount of testing that DE can do to catch things like this.  Especially with the level of customization players have at their disposal.  Players (and really public users in general) will always find ways to exploit a system in ways the developers couldn't dream of catching ahead of time.  They have a few hundred employees, the player base is a few hundred thousand players.  It's a war of numbers, and they're vastly outmatched.

I cannot overstate how true this is; this is the reality for even the biggest game developers.  Let's demonstrate this with an example:

There's no way DE actually has 100 full-time testers, but let's hypothetically imagine they do.  Let's say that these 100 testers work 40 hours a week and that they're so efficient in what they do that all 40 of those hours go into directly testing the game. Now, let's say they test this content in its final state for 4 months straight (which would equate to 3 updates per year), which is much longer than the average update cycle on Warframe.  And this is the final build, which in reality isn't something testers generally have more than a week or two to test because during development the build is constantly being updated.  So with all of these extra benefits, additional people, additional work, and an elongated timeline for testing, at the end of this, how much experience will these testers have had with the update?

52 weeks in a year, so 52/3 x 40 x 100 = 69,334 hours.

Now let's imagine that DE only has only 100,000 players that login when the update hits.

In the first hour of the update being released, they will have accumulated 100,000 hours of experience with the update, which is already more than DE's inflated super-staff was able to put in in 4 months.  After 2 hours, 200,000; after 3, 300,000.  User experience rapidly overcomes any possible testing a developer can do and then continues to climb, meaning the disparity only grows from there.

This is in no way to say that devs testing is worthless, as they certainly catch a lot of what otherwise might make it through, and that improves the quality of the released product.  But they'll never be able to catch everything, especially in a game with as many knobs and permutations as Warframe.

[RainThaBeast]

13 hours ago, (PSN)thowed said:

Where exactly do I file one?  I never wanted to do anything like this but this is setting a bad precedent.  I didn't spend platinum.  I actually paid $15 for the pack.  They knew exactly what he did and how he performed when he released.  I knew he was getting nerfed 5 minutes into the mission.  So are they that stupid or just wanted good publicity to drive sales and up numbers for the update?  Sorry I can't be nice to self aware obtuse people.

Go to support.warfrsme.com and creat a ticket there. 

[SneakyErvin]

It feels as if none of the players that yell about Dante and/or scream "reeeefunds!" have played him.

I played him when I got him pre-nerf. Enjoyed him, had fun, saw massive killing and immortality. I dropped him, played Kullervo again and tested some Nezha (also a justified nerf) and was happy with that. So yeah reee reee and wha wha starts over the nerfs and LoS. Sure, it sucks with a broken LoS, who doesnt think that right? But hey, they fixed it a day later, cool, so then why all the crying and screaming?

Which made me decide to jump in and try Dante again. And damn am I shocked about the nerfs and LoS, like really, totally mindboggling and breathtaking... that people complain and cry over it and threaten with refunds. Like, could someone hand me a microscope or something so I can actually spot the difference? The actual main thing that made it feel different was the fix to his 3, which was not working like it should on release and ignored LoS. The LoS added to his 4 is unnoticable, since it would practically work the exact same anyways due to the fixes on his 3. Unless for some reason you loved to run around and bleed things all over and then detonate for some reason. 

He is still 100% immortal aslong as you kill, I mean it is practically impossible to die. They could in reality reduce his OG cap to 1k, 5, 10k or whatever and he'd still be just as immortal thanks to killing 24/7 and having constant OG reg.

Another thing that is quite obvious. The complainers are very self centered, or atleast many of them. They claim to consider others and say "remove OG think of da Chroma children! but dont you damn dare to touch mah bleedz and persnol ovragerd!". Which really just reads to me as people oblivious to the fact of OG issues overall and just want to give something they personally dont find important to keep something else. Massive newsflash! Dante is a massive support frame, which was his intent, he also brings some serious damage to the table. Right now the people saying he is suddenly useless have likely not played him, because he is at Kullervo levels of map wiping atm while also bringing immortality to the group. Not to mention the insane usefulness of a floating Noctua granting you additional elemental statuses or insane angry birds going ka-ka and ripping faces and appying debuffs. 

Dante with Nourish instead of his Noctua is bonkers on so many levels. He is up there on Kullervo levels for me when it comes to completely fun and ridiculous damage and survival. The pen is indeed mightier than the sword, hence why I use dual bone axes on both Dante and Kullervo, cos I aint falling for that trick...

edit: When I think of it. The people screaming likely only sat in very low content and probably didnt give a crap about if they hit with his 3 or not, since they simply relied on the regular damage from final verse that is dealt as baseline within range (LoS now aswell). It was afterall 10000 damage with a +100% strength build, so a real lowbie champion skill in such content.

Edited April 6 by SneakyErvin

[sunderthefirmament]

1 minute ago, SneakyErvin said:

tested some Nezha (also a justified nerf)

Not to the degree that it got nerfed.  It's basically only usable in tightly packed areas now, or with a grouping ability... at which point you'd be better off just using an AOE status weapon or melee influence.

 

There has to be a middle ground, but I worry that with all the focus on Dante, this augment is just going to be dead.

[SneakyErvin]

12 minutes ago, sunderthefirmament said:

Not to the degree that it got nerfed.  It's basically only usable in tightly packed areas now, or with a grouping ability... at which point you'd be better off just using an AOE status weapon or melee influence.

 

There has to be a middle ground, but I worry that with all the focus on Dante, this augment is just going to be dead.

It is still insane together with Influence, since every target recieves a hit for each target hit by influence. So 20 enemies in spears results in each target taking 20 hits from a single influence instance. The augment used to be able to spread the initial hits 50m+ aswell, atleast those didnt count as influence hits to chain them back. That is without accounting for the guaranteed slash procs. It also gave some weapons absurd AoE that even puts curse to shame. Grimoire killing everything speared within 50m with alt fire for instance, Phantasma suddenly having a 50m AoE beam etc. While ignoring LoS. Now they are limited to 20-25 meters, which is still insane for weapons, which really means the weapons are covering a total area of 40-50 meters and earlier over 100m in total.

Edited April 6 by SneakyErvin

[sunderthefirmament]

11 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

It is still insane together with Influence, since every target recieves a hit for each target hit by influence. So 20 enemies in spears results in each target taking 20 hits from a single influence instance. The augment used to be able to spread the initial hits 50m+ aswell, atleast those didnt count as influence hits to chain them back. That is without accounting for the guaranteed slash procs. It also gave some weapons absurd AoE that even puts curse to shame. Grimoire killing everything speared within 50m with alt fire for instance, Phantasma suddenly having a 50m AoE beam etc. While ignoring LoS. Now they are limited to 20-25 meters, which is still insane for weapons, which really means the weapons are covering a total area of 40-50 meters and earlier over 100m in total.

On paper.  In practice, it's tiny, and there's no reason to sink so much into range on Nezha when you're better off building for other things.

 

I've seen people saying that this nerf "killed Nezha," which I disagree with, as I think he's an amazing frame, even without the augment in its release state.  The nerf did kill the augment though.  It might have some niche uses, but if you're really spearing that many enemies in a tiny area, they'd be dead by cheaper and less complicated effects anyway.

 

If you're still enjoying the augment, cool.  I hope it gets some improvements though.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 19 Stunden schrieb Digital_Malz:

Hello fellow Tenno!

I have spent 750p on Dante's bundle, plus 140p on Grimoire Mods bundle, and a total of 20 Forma (divided between Dante, Noctua, Grimoira and Companion) to create a build with synergy. 

Dante was not nerfed, he was obliterated and rendered useless. This hotfix didn't hotfixed anything. LoS is still the biggest problem of Dante, and DE seems to continue deaf to our plead to revise this stupid decision.

Based o this, I opened a support ticket demanding refund for all my investment based on false advertising.

Please, if you feel the same, DO it too. It's the least DE can do.

Of course they have to refund everything!
It can't be anything else.... for real life objects there is prison as a punishment! because that is FRAUD!
But what's going on here... is like a mental asylum. people watch advertisements on YouTube. and then you see Dante good performing. then buy dante pack from steam. and then a few days later they get REALLY ripped off!

and that's not the first time! a lot of people invested a lot of mats in bramma and kuva zarr and then they became a laughing stock... and shield gate with the mobs??? yes hf shoot twice. also yes... even pimped weapon doesn't have enough ammo. People who play without a forma or with unmaxed mods or simply leveling can completely forget about the weapon.

[ClockworkDirge]

Is there any way for my friend to get a refund after gifting me a ticket to Tennocon? I got it as a gift the day Dante released and after everything that’s happened neither myself or my friend want to support DE by going to Tennocon this year. Would a support ticket even work?

[FaraTenno]

30 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Like, could someone hand me a microscope or something so I can actually spot the difference? The actual main thing that made it feel different was the fix to his 3, which was not working like it should on release and ignored LoS.
The LoS added to his 4 is unnoticable, since it would practically work the exact same anyways due to the fixes on his 3.

https://clips.twitch.tv/HomelyAggressiveWormPJSalt-XA21cwDUsYU4yVcd

An entire line of enemies not being cleared because Dante was in the way is unnoticeable, huh?
I suppose all of the enemies that would have died when my back was turned previously, no longer being effected at all by tragedy is also unnoticeable.
If you're really going to tell me you can't spot that difference, you must be baiting. 

Note that nobody is complaining about Dark Verse now abiding by it's own LoS rules. It's almost like the problem was Dark Verse being able to hit everything in front of you, not Tragedy nuking everything Dark Verse has touched. But again, in DE fashion, they overcompensated for the issue and added LoS to tragedy just to make sure the limit was as much of a leash to your fun as possible.
The issue here, again, is not the fact that Dante's giant damage burst was taken from him; he technically does still have it. It's that it was unjustly changed, while he has to look on and watch several other frames ignore the rules that he has had placed on him for an ability that required more work for less reward. Tragedy will never compare to Miasma, Peacemakers, or even Avalanche, because those are one button casts. Tragedy requires setup, and a large investment of Energy for damage that is almost comparable to Saryn.
Now that setup is meaningless, because it doesn't matter how many enemies you hit with Dark Verse; it matters how many aren't hiding behind the guardrail of the stairs.

Yet, Tragedy's damage was nerfed for no explained reason. We were in fact told that they were fine with his damage output in a devshort, but then the very next day that was suddenly not true.
The fact that Dante was nerfed so dramatically while Saryn and Mesa can still both hit 4 and wipe entire maps without trying is the problem here. It is a double standard, and doesn't make any sense.

Do not give me that "He isn't DPS" nonsense; it's very clear that Dark Verse and Tragedy are solely damage based abilities and were intended to be from the beginning.