players complaning about randomized loadouts for deep archamidea

[spider_enigma]

Can you not? Thanks.

Its meant to be hard by forcing you out of your comfort zone, its not a mandatory game mode, you can go play literally anything else in the game. If we made it only stuff you owned people would sell everything they had if they could to optimize the hell out of the mode. People just want to cheese the mode rather then do the intended and collect everything for mastery

Go back to complaining about line of sight OR start building weapons.

[C11H22O1]

I don't mind it but it's definitely not hard at all just makes things more tedious, putting restrictions on us seems to be the way they handle difficulty instead of creating some balance

[Aruquae]

I would rather use things I like then be forced to use things I don’t like

That will always be the case

Also, this is the forums…? People are bound to complain, and that’s fine.

4 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

Its meant to be hard by forcing you out of your comfort zone, its not a mandatory game mode, you can go play literally anything else in the game.

I took that excuse in Duviri, but clearly they are going to be adding that stupid randomized to more modes. This poor excuse doesn’t work anymore. Also “just play anything else” is a poor excuse in itself 

5 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

If we made it only stuff you owned people would sell everything they had if they could to optimize the hell out of the mode. People just want to cheese the mode rather then do the intended and collect everything for mastery

I get weapons I like… and I optimize all of them. The ones I don’t like, I don’t get. Now why do I have to be stuck with a weapon I don’t like… that has the DEFAULT BUILD, that does not do anything at all… no thanks. I would rather have my own gear that I enjoy using. 
As for collecting everything for mastery… what of the people like me? Who don’t want to waste their time in ESO/Hydron leveling up things they hope to never use…? Another reasoning error

 

7 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

Go back to complaining about line of sight

DW bro, I’m already doing that

2 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

Can you not? Thanks.

[ReddyDisco]

I can deal with random loadouts, but mirror defense three times in a row is too much

[Chewarette]

I'm on the "random loadout is OK" side, but your post is just flaming tbh, not sure any constructive discussion can emerge out of that

[spider_enigma]

6 minutes ago, ReddyDisco said:

I can deal with random loadouts, but mirror defense three times in a row is too much

its still very buggy so i can understand the frustration

Edited April 22 by spider_enigma

[kadlis12]

Do you think randomized gear is OK? Well, whatever. I can live with that, as long as each party member has the same options with no opt-out feature. No difficulty feature should ever be personalized.

If suffering, then suffering for all. No carry, no lazy opting out. Just suffering.

[TeaHands]

49 minutes ago, ReddyDisco said:

I can deal with random loadouts, but mirror defense three times in a row is too much

My god the variety is lacking in Archmedia, I didn't think it would be too bad but the way the weekly debuffs and missions are already getting extremely repetitive is a huge disappointment to me.

I really hope they make it so the debuffs and missions don't overlap too much between weeks.

Edited April 22 by TeaHands

[Stormandreas]

40 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

Can you not? Thanks.

Its meant to be hard by forcing you out of your comfort zone, its not a mandatory game mode, you can go play literally anything else in the game. If we made it only stuff you owned people would sell everything they had if they could to optimize the hell out of the mode. People just want to cheese the mode rather then do the intended and collect everything for mastery

Go back to complaining about line of sight OR start building weapons.

Players complaining about players giving constructive criticism to improve the games flow and be allowed to use the gear they want with interesting, challenging content

Can you not? Thanks.

Hard content is not "go grind for stuff for 300 hours, and then we tell you you can't use it". 

You're missing the entire point of the criticism. It is about Randomized loadout not actually making things hard, it makes it unfun and offputting.
Most players do not want to buy 500 slots for Weapons.
Most players do not want to have all 57 warframes in their inventory at all times.
Most players do not want to have to invest tens of thousands of forma into gear just to make sure they have some usable weapons.

It's unreasonable to ask or expect this of players. The fact Deep Archimedian does not do a check on the player to make sure it provides at least 1 item in each loadout slot that the player even owns is bad. That is the bare minimum for a system like this. The way it currently is, players can be fully locked out of the gamemode, simply because they didn't want to invest unreasonable amounts of time and resources into keeping and building everything in the game.

There are solutions, like the one I mentioned.
Others are, having Elite archi remove the need for the random loadouts, but providing extra challenge, such as no knockdowns AT ALL and level 2k+ enemies, then we have something interesting.
Give both Deep Archis the ability to get all rewards, but each has their own restrictions. Either you engage in the random loadouts, or you take curated loadouts and have to fight much, MUCH harder enemies.

It's a good idea to seperate the idea that Criticism = mindless complaining. The two are not the same.

Edited April 22 by Stormandreas

[0_The_F00l]

I might not like what some players say ,but I will protect their right to say it.

(I will then proceed to beat the ever living S#&$ out of what was said in a civil manner like boxing or krava maga)

[K4RN4]

50 minutes ago, spider_enigma said:

Can you not? Thanks.

Its meant to be hard by forcing you out of your comfort zone.

Random isn't hard. There is a chance that I get my dream loadout every time and it isn't hard at all or it could give me a bunch of equipment that isn't meant for the task at hand.

It's like you have to build ikea furniture and sometimes you get welding equipment and an angle grinder as tools. 

Warframe did a great job of creating game modes with different priorities and creating frames that differ in their comptibility with these modes, giving most frames niches to live in. I don't get why random loadouts should be good here.

[Drachnyn]

vor 22 Minuten schrieb kadlis12:

Do you think randomized gear is OK? Well, whatever. I can live with that, as long as each party member has the same options with no opt-out feature. No difficulty feature should ever be personalized.

If suffering, then suffering for all. No carry, no lazy opting out. Just suffering.

I think that would make the gamemode a lot worse.

[MutoManiac]

For those who don’t like it, just do Netracells. I just did five of them in a row and got four shards in a row with one tau and one melee duplicate. Way faster and better rewards than I ever got doing DA. It’s definitely a mode to test your comfort zone which I think should stay that way.

[Chewarette]

Just now, MutoManiac said:

For those who don’t like it, just do Netracells. I just did five of them in a row and got four shards in a row with one tau and one melee duplicate. Way faster and better rewards than I ever got doing DA. It’s definitely a mode to test your comfort zone which I think should stay that way.

Let's not lie though, rewards in EDA are miles ahead, simply for the fact you get 6 rewards for 2 entries (compared with 2 rewards for 2 entries in Netracells).

[MutoManiac]

Just now, Chewarette said:

Let's not lie though, rewards in EDA are miles ahead, simply for the fact you get 6 rewards for 2 entries (compared with 2 rewards for 2 entries in Netracells).

I haven’t done EDA since I did it solo just to try it out. For DA, I also pick one of the weapons or frame of my choice so maybe that makes a difference. But my rewards were S#&$ty compared to what I get in Netracells since they improved the drops.

[kadlis12]

12 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

I think that would make the gamemode a lot worse.

Did you mean "actually challenging"?

Sure, not worth trying for most of the players, but fair. Equally difficult for everyone.

Edited April 22 by kadlis12

[Stormandreas]

9 minutes ago, MutoManiac said:

For those who don’t like it, just do Netracells. I just did five of them in a row and got four shards in a row with one tau and one melee duplicate. Way faster and better rewards than I ever got doing DA. It’s definitely a mode to test your comfort zone which I think should stay that way.

The rewards in Deep archi are both more numerous for less runs, and higher quality.

5 Rewards, 2 of which are exactly the same as the 2 netracell runs you'd do that you sacrifice to do it, and then 2 more with higher chances for Tauforged shards, and 1 more with no melee adaptor, and only the Legendary arcanes or a Tauforged shard.

Deep archi rewards are far better, especially when you consider there's 3 more Netracells you can do after that for a total of 8 rewards instead of 5

Edited April 22 by Stormandreas

[(XBOX)K1jker]

Complaining about other players complaints is not constructive. 

[AntifreezeUnder0]

Game mod is as hard as worst of un- form`ed picks you get.

About building weapons, there are some reason certain things are mastery fodders and some are braindead picks.

Rest is just copy paste builds for specific weapon type, and generic strenght builds of {inser frame name} here. 

1 dante or styanax in deep archimedia squad = easy mode.

But if people deem the rewards worthy they will put up with the shenanigans the elite deep archimedea give.

On the other hand, why not put on constant modifiers, no gear wheel, no operator, and throw in modless. After all its about challenge and game mechanics, and have nothing to do , rng on biass to lesser used picks- game and individual wise. Like i get punished for using stug a lot that it gets lower chance on appearing in the picks...  What out of comphort is that? 

 

 

[Stormandreas]

14 minutes ago, kadlis12 said:

Did you mean "actually challenging"?

Sure, not worth trying for most of the players, but fair. Equally difficult for everyone.

If you think no difficulty feature should allow personalised gear/equipment/loadouts, and everything hard should just be compeltely randomized, then you're very out of touch with how almost every other game handles difficulty.

Rougelikes are what DE are trying to go for with Circuit and Deep archimedian. Warframe is not a Rougelike.

If you've played any Soulslike, you aren't just given random equipment and told "no, you can't do this boss with a Claymore like you want to" or if you go play FFVII, the game doesn't go "no, you can't use this materia at all for this section of the game".

Difficulty is not tied to just randomizing what people use. Even Rougelikes have a level of personal choice when starting off, usually with a character selection. The randomization comes in item drops, which often times, those games have ways to swap or sacrifice those items in some way in favour of others.

Deep Archimedian does not have this. It is just "use this randomized stuff or lose out. Too bad".

[Drachnyn]

vor 14 Minuten schrieb kadlis12:

Did you mean "actually challenging"?

Sure, not worth trying for most of the players, but fair. Equally difficult for everyone.

No I mean much more boring. Everyone playing 1 of exactly 3 frames. I'd much rather be able to coordinate through a much wider range of randomized gear. What do you mean with fairness btw? Do I get a medal for 37 points? I think it's much more fun cooking up a team with my 3 frames and the 3 frames of someone else.

[SneakyErvin]

1 hour ago, spider_enigma said:

Can you not? Thanks.

Its meant to be hard by forcing you out of your comfort zone, its not a mandatory game mode, you can go play literally anything else in the game. If we made it only stuff you owned people would sell everything they had if they could to optimize the hell out of the mode. People just want to cheese the mode rather then do the intended and collect everything for mastery

Go back to complaining about line of sight OR start building weapons.

But it doesnt succeed in doing that at all.

I've stayed in my comfort zone all 4 weeks without any trouble. The thing that has impacted my choices have been based on the 4 personal modifications, the missions and their respective modifications. I dislike the RNG itemization since it doesnt really do anything in the end since we are always able to pick one thing freely, be it a weapon or a frame, or ignoring a modifier if frames/weapons are already fully to our liking.

[PR1D3]

1 hour ago, C11H22O1 said:

I don't mind it but it's definitely not hard at all just makes things more tedious, putting restrictions on us seems to be the way they handle difficulty instead of creating some balance

Unfortunately asking for balance is bit of a pipe dream at this point. Many of us have been asking for that for years but at the same time there's a group of players that are basically out antithesis and says, "Screw Balance, More Power Fantasy, Balance doesn't matter in a PVE game". There's been a song and dance for a few days now in the forums about this. As much as people complain about the randomizer and how DE needs to make better engaging content the golden question tends to be, how? How do they make something that could last long enough in this environment where they never reigned in the extreme power discrepancies? What do you do when you have players who are using certain loadouts to cause INT overflows cause they're dealing so much damage that they never intended to the point where the game's brain breaks? Do you balance the game and take the absurdity away from them? Cause I'm sure we all saw how the general player base reacts when you take away some insane power from them. See Dante reactions, WuKong and Ammo Change, or even the discussion of bringing back Self Damage to put a leash on the AOE spam meta.

[Kainosh]

5 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

Everyone playing 1 of exactly 3 frames.

What if everyone has their own "3 frames" ?  You get Hydroid, Khora, Nidus.  I get Mag, Loki, Chroma.    Same with guns.

 

Coz "carrying" is real tbh.  Its possible now to unlock all rewards while getting "carried" by someone who will not.   Kinda unfair imo.

[Numerounius]

There are some threads about people pleased the DA difficultly and stuff it has to offer. You might be more suited for those types of threads instead of ones complaining about the loadout randomizer and other stuff that you disagree with.

I'm not playing it because I know I can do it and don't want to risk getting a mission fail but rather because it would be very tedious if 5x Netracells wasn't already. I am still following discussions to see what sort of tweaks DE can glean from it, both on the positive side and negative side.