Conclave always empty... Whats is missing?

[Etan-gK]

3 hours ago, (Xbox One)Yamanishi1 said:

 

So... My suggestion is let everybody happy! I'm not talking about exclusive important content or items there... Alerts with conclave matchs would be great! Something optional that really rewards you and could be separated by Conclave levels as Sindicate missions does to avoid the situation related to noobs against pros and vice-versa. Regarding ping/host advantage... This already exist in a dozen of other games, PvP players know that they need to deal with this.

"PvP players know that they need to deal with this."

and what about the rest of us huh? I guess the community that doesn't play PvP just doesn't matter then.

 

separating conclave alert rewards by rank like the syndicates would only make it worse since now there would be exclusive PvE content locked behind a reputation grind wall, in conclave

all the veteran conclave players would be lumped together and everybody else would be thrown into one large pool, so you'd end up with a group that only plays PvP and doesn't care about the rest of the game and so doesn't need the higher level PvE rewards, and the rest would be lumped into the laggy rage-fest that comes from forcing PvE players into PvP, these people would be stuck grinding for the lowest level rewards in a game-mode they don't like and don't play

And before you come back with that old "well nobody's forced to play conclave so they can't complain about the game-mode"

it doesn't matter if it's exclusive content or the dumbest looking syndana in the game, if it can be gotten, people will want it, locking anything behind a game-mode nobody asked for is dumb

and yes, I've played those (thankfully) few PvP alerts we did have, and they were laggy rage-fests that nobody enjoyed, like the snowball thing, people played their matches got their reward and never touched the game-mode again * slow clap* yup, really convinced people to stay and breath life into the PvP mode

Warframe is a PvE focused game that just so happens to have a PvP mode shoehorned in that very, very few people play. locking PvE content behind a grind wall in a game-mode nobody plays is a great way to turn players off of Warframe. Leave conclave content in conclave and PvE content in PvE

 

[StinkyPygmy]

3 hours ago, Heckzu said:

You mean 'subjectively'.

Majority consensus isn't always correct.

 

The biggest issue with Conclave is lack of matchmaking. Weapons and warframes are overall very well balanced. But there is huge variation in player capabilities.

It's a catch 22- there's no matchmaking because there aren't enough players to implement it without hour long queues, but there aren't enough players because players often quit after facing someone much better than them and then blame the game for their own faults.

My bad. Thought I was off with that.

I never said majority consensus was always correct. In fact, you cannot have something be a fact when the topic is purely one of opinion and subjective. Which was literally the whole point of what I said . I went to all that extra effort to make that abundantly clear because I knew someone would say that.  Why do I even try?

The point is, most people dislike conclave for various raisins (yeah, I know what i said), ergo, it is subjectively true that conclave is bad, because most people dislike it. And the truth, subjective or not, is not an "old excuse". I'm one of the last people to be running around on the forums treating my opinion as a cold hard fact. I hate it when people do that.

Its definitely a catch 22, but for many people and also in my own experience it wasn't because someone better kept kicking their butts. Its mainly because conclave is rather unbalanced in some areas, clunky as hell, invalidates too much of your gear investment, has an inordinately steep learning curve, and is very hard to break into when you're starting out. I gave conclave a good try, and I mean a damn good try (about 4 months of dedicated playing).

I was ok at it. I could win games when there wasn't constant host migrations and had a fun at times. But more often than not it just wasn't enjoyable. It doesn't play smoothly, it doesn't feel nice, and when you're starting out, due to the small community it has as a result of the previously mentioned issues, you end up getting slammed by vets from day one. If you push through that like I did, for many it feels like the struggle wasn't really worth it in the end because the fun had often didn't measure up.

[(PSN)TertulSee]

6 hours ago, (Xbox One)Yamanishi1 said:

Hi there...

I have being playing warframe for some time in Xbox One and really miss the possibility to do some conclave. The servers are always completely empty and I wonder why that's happening...

For me... The answer is a easy... it's simply "avoidable"! There is no great specific content or loot that could be found only there and this is why nobody plays PvP. 

I think that you guys from Digital Extreme could create some additional content or event focused in Conclave or at least, increase the lootable items (quantity and quality) in order to drive some players there! 

How about you, Tenno? In your point of view, why we don't have players in Conclave (talking about Xbox One scenario) and how to bring them to PvP? Don't let the amazing PvP simply desapear!!

Thank you!!

 

There is a bunch of reasons why no one plays this mode. Here are some to begin with:

Balance Issues

Lack of a proper player base because this game is advertised as a PvE game.

Players being lazy.

Huge Lag making players feeling cheated.

Players not having the time to play for over 20 minutes (due to attention span)

Those are just the surface of the problems in Conclave.

 

[saltygr33n]

I played warframe because I love to hunt Zergs, Protoss, and Terrans! 

Oh wait.

 

I'll go play some battlefield if I want some pvp.

[Tsunero]

The resources that were put into it are missing lol. Don't get me wrong, I played conclave until I got the rep maxed and got out some nice skins but that's about it. I am not horribly bad at it, more like average but it's just not why I play warframe. Also, what puts me off the most is that matches are waaaay too long. Time limit should be 5-6 mins tops no matter the game mode. When you want to progress but get locked in 10-15-20 mins matches with the same bored veterans every time who farm you is not fun, at least for me.

Edited November 13, 2017 by Tsunero

[-Ryuurei-]

Answer to title only: it's missing players, hence why it's empty.

Smartassery aside: people get told it's bad and don't bother trying. Why do they get told it's bad? Because those telling them cba to put in any effort to learn how to play it properly and they get destroyed by frequent players.

[StinkyPygmy]

2 hours ago, Tsunero said:

 When you want to progress but get locked in 10-15-20 mins matches with the same bored veterans every time who farm you is not fun, at least for me.

The turns have tabled: Now WE'RE THE ONES BEING FARMED.

Ain't that a novel concept, eh?

[Goodwill]

I'd be all for Conclave being worked on, however, not at the expense of PvE content which majority of the players are here for. If they have to push back PvE content update and fixes for a game mode that many may not play, it's just not worth the risk or the resources. My mates and I like PvPing each other, but just for fun. If they can make Conclave a fun mode rather than anything competitive, I think many more would be on board with that.

[AlphaPHENIX]

Il y a 8 heures, (PS4)psycofang a dit :

Some people experience symptoms of nervousness and performance anxiety when they become aware they are fighting a human.

Guilty as charged and I still like Conclave.

Il y a 8 heures, (PS4)robotwars7 a dit :

sorry, but conclave is really just a tacked-on mode to appease the competitive crowd.

Right now, you are looking at a post from a non-competive pearson that is rank Typhoon (the higest one) in Cocnclave...I am just saying.

Il y a 8 heures, ShogunGunshow a dit :

Putting PvE mods in PvP would be a great way to get people to hate DE really fast.

Oh boy, my favorite argument...not.

Warframe is prized for it's great community right? Well to put it bluntly, this could weed out some of the not so nice people in said community. As the founder that you are and surely you've been with us for a long time, do you think this would be bad?

Il y a 8 heures, Etan-gK a dit :

"PvP players know that they need to deal with this."

and what about the rest of us huh? I guess the community that doesn't play PvP just doesn't matter then.

 

separating conclave alert rewards by rank like the syndicates would only make it worse since now there would be exclusive PvE content locked behind a reputation grind wall, in conclave

Do you know the definition of a word called ''optional''?

Il y a 8 heures, Etan-gK a dit :

And before you come back with that old "well nobody's forced to play conclave so they can't complain about the game-mode"

it doesn't matter if it's exclusive content or the dumbest looking syndana in the game, if it can be gotten, people will want it, locking anything behind a game-mode nobody asked for is dumb

Ah, yes...collectors. How to deal with them I wonder...

Révélation

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Trading

 

Il y a 8 heures, Etan-gK a dit :

and yes, I've played those (thankfully) few PvP alerts we did have, and they were laggy rage-fests that nobody enjoyed, like the snowball thing, people played their matches got their reward and never touched the game-mode again * slow clap* yup, really convinced people to stay and breath life into the PvP mode

And said rewards were what again, a sigil and a decoration? Ya, because you would be inferior if you didn't get those, right?

il y a 54 minutes, Goodwill a dit :

I'd be all for Conclave being worked on, however, not at the expense of PvE content which majority of the players are here for. If they have to push back PvE content update and fixes for a game mode that many may not play, it's just not worth the risk or the resources. My mates and I like PvPing each other, but just for fun. If they can make Conclave a fun mode rather than anything competitive, I think many more would be on board with that.

If I renember right, there was a team at DE specifically for Conclave...ya I have no idea what they are doing either, aside from balancing and stuff.

Also there is no reall reason to be competive in Conclave...sence there isn't much to compete for aside from who gets the most Oro in a match.

[AshenOne07]

What's missing? Every single damn thing that a PvP mode needs to have.

[PR1D3]

16 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

You mean 'subjectively'.

Majority consensus isn't always correct.

 

The biggest issue with Conclave is lack of matchmaking. Weapons and warframes are overall very well balanced. But there is huge variation in player capabilities.

It's a catch 22- there's no matchmaking because there aren't enough players to implement it without hour long queues, but there aren't enough players because players often quit after facing someone much better than them and then blame the game for their own faults.

^^^ What this guy said. Yes. 1+ ^^^

18 minutes ago, AlphaPHENIX said:

How about having some common sence and I don't know, players realising that maybe they could ask the Conclave veterans for some training sessions? I mean do you renember how many times you would have to tell a noobie where to go to unlock a planet and how to do stuff in general before? Hek it still happens now!

And if everything had the exact same stats as in PvE, Conclave would be even deader. I know, seems impossible right?

ASKING FOR HELP. ASK. FOR HELP. Why is it that people do it for the main game but completely forget about it for PVP. I know I had to help a few of my clanmates. And when I got back into PVP and didn't have someone to directly ask I went to Youtube and found that some PVP players actually had made super short tutorial videos on what to do. Imagine my shock.

[korndolorous]

missing "Balance"
spammer use nikanaprime, plasmor, exposive weapon, ability spam, melee spam,  etc.

[(PSN)reddragonhrcro]

20 hours ago, (Xbox One)Yamanishi1 said:

Of course that the majority enjoy PvE, however... The content was already created and now is completely useless!
What about the guys that, like me, enjoy to put some bullets in their friends sometime? Don't be so selfish...

Not saying it shouldn't exist, its just that I don't find it enjoyable.Played it, was doing rather good but overall it doesn't feel enjoyable and also not to forget that people can be pretty toxic in it.

[Alaizia]

because Conclave sucks that's why.

[Etan-gK]

15 hours ago, AlphaPHENIX said:

And said rewards were what again, a sigil and a decoration? Ya, because you would be inferior if you didn't get those, right?

yes, because me, and everybody else like me, and you know there's a bunch of collectors out there, feel a need to collect everything,

 

like I said, it doesn't matter if it's exclusive content or the dumbest looking item in the game, if we can get it, we want it,

now, I'm willing to put up with no small amount of S#&$ to get an item, but putting PvE items, (especially timed exclusives and decorations), behind a syndicate esque grind wall in conclave is a good way to turn people off of warframe

[phoenix1992]

Well, whatever I am bored and I can speak about that to some extend as a person that had some interest in conclave and gave some *clems* in order to rank up couple of times:

1. P2P - It sucks. It always sucked, but nothing makes you cringe faster than high MS in PvP.
"But Phoenix, there are Conclave servers" - your average player will totally deal with the steps required for that.
2. Gearing and progression - absent in PvP. If you think PoE economy is rubissh, Conclave economy is non existent. You simply don't get the resources needed to progress in the game.
3. Balancing and Meta - Flat out cancer incarnate. In order to research the information, you have to refer to third party sites and docs. In order to have the gear you need to NOT do PvP.
4. Development - if DE does not routinely develop and expand on conclave, it will loose steam. Kinda reminiscent of the trails.
5. "The game is PvE, and no one likes PvP" - strawman argument, that means nothing. I am 99% PvE player in majority of the games, but I do fancy some PvP action if there is any merit into it.
 

[Marvelous_A]

I wish I can buy the conclave skins and syandanas for plat, I'd rather give up on them than getting tilted by PVP.

[Imniscor]

I like PVP and it has a lot of potential in Warframe.
AI in every game is so dumb that only other players are actually challenging.

Some reasons PVP has such a low population :
1. People are not competitive enough or don't like to 'lose' even when they aren't losing anything.
2. PVP gear and PVE gear are different. This is a flaw, consequence of poor damage scaling in every game.
Damage should be a percent of 100% life and not absolute numbers and it would make all weapons useful and they could have the same behavior in both PVP and PVE.
3. There should be 2 different PVP modes : one mode is melee only and the other is guns only.
Then there should be sub-modes DM, TDM, CTF, GVG.
4. Lack of faction Based PVP.
In Faction Based PVP you pick either Grineer or Corpus and have to defend the Mothership in a 64 vs 64 battle in a huge map like Plains of Eidolon.
Small corpus and grineer ships would drop grineer soldier and also come to help. The longer the fight lasts, the higher the level of enemy AI.
Of course besided AI you would also have the 64 enemy players to kill. You would be able to change sides in the next day.

 

[(PSN)watt4hem]

We need dedicated servers, bad. I'm tired of being oneshotted while behind a wall

[(PSN)Stealth_Cobra]

I think the loot system in the conclave is part of the reason I hate it so much. Way too many rewards, very slow xp gains... A bounty system that forces you to play various gamemodes even if you don't particularly enjoy them.

I actually liked the good old, unbalanced conclave 1.0 better, you know the one where you got there with fully powered and modded frames and fought for supremacy... At least it was fun in "what's the strongest frame/build" way... Heck, I also enjoyed Dark Sector conflicts quite a bunch too...It's just this bland mode where all your mods and gear have default stats that pisses me off. At the very least they should have preserved the old mode where you could use your full builds and were matchmaked using your conclave score.

Nowadays, the fact everything is balanced and that so many powers are gimped to the point of being useless pisses me off (yaw, base duration invisibility on Ash), slower weapons, etc. Then there's the fact just like all syndicate, it takes a long time to get to max rank in standing, and contrary to most syndicate, you literally have a gazillion different mods and rewards that can pretty much not be gotten elsewhere, each very expensive to get.

I mean i was already discouraged about the amount of mods I would have to purchase, but when they decided to basically make custom stances for every melee weapon... It was "No way, I'm done"...

If there were less mods to get, or if more mods were given per match, I might consider playing it to complete my mod collection, but honestly, there's just too many unlockable for a mode I don't like.

I also feel there's a big lack of map varietly, and most of the maps are kinda booring... Making it tedious to play.

Edited November 14, 2017 by (PS4)Stealth_Cobra

[AlphaPHENIX]

Il y a 5 heures, Etan-gK a dit :

yes, because me, and everybody else like me, and you know there's a bunch of collectors out there, feel a need to collect everything,

 

like I said, it doesn't matter if it's exclusive content or the dumbest looking item in the game, if we can get it, we want it,

now, I'm willing to put up with no small amount of S#&$ to get an item, but putting PvE items, (especially timed exclusives and decorations), behind a syndicate esque grind wall in conclave is a good way to turn people off of warframe

They are not even PvE items, they are just decorations, there is no versus with anything unleass you count the damn camera angles!

[ShogunGunshow]

21 hours ago, AlphaPHENIX said:

On 11/12/2017 at 4:40 PM, ShogunGunshow said:

Putting PvE mods in PvP would be a great way to get people to hate DE really fast.

Oh boy, my favorite argument...not.

Warframe is prized for it's great community right? Well to put it bluntly, this could weed out some of the not so nice people in said community. As the founder that you are and surely you've been with us for a long time, do you think this would be bad?

Are you seriously asking me if I think it would be bad to deliberately make terrible decisions for the game I supported in the hopes of trying to get toxic people to quit?

The answer is yes - yes, I think that would be a fantastically bad idea. Because it would make nice players that just like playing the game quit as well. Nothing about the above targets toxic players over nice ones. You'd have the same or worse ratio of toxic to nice players as before - you'd just have less people playing the game!

And honestly? It's very rare that I have any negative interactions with anyone in game. Last time was around PoE release when one jerk-butt refused to extract, and I mostly lay the blame for that at the feet of DE for not including individual extraction after a bounty is complete. Because of course people were going to do that :P My experience with the playerbase is nowhere near so negative that I'd consider frigging sabotaging the experience. Like holy whatnow, that's insane.

[Talonflight]

The reason most people dislike PvP is pretty simple.

They don't actually like a challenge, even when they clamor constantly for DE to add in "muh endgame, muh difficulty!". 

The reason that PvP is "too hard" and feels "bad" is because it requires actual skill. its focused on mobility and aiming, rather than on "turn on your 4 on Ember and AFK in Akkad" or "hold down the forward button and mash left click as mirage with a simulor" or on "spam E with excalibur's ulti", or on "get MUH RIVEN and 1shot kill everyone."

Then people complain that "I should have all the power I had in PvE!" instead of realizing that while you're piloting a godlike murder machine... in conclave, you're fighting OTHER godlike murder machines. It SHOULD be an even playing field. Which is why DE balanced it. The balance is a work in progress, but its a hell of a lot better than it used to be.

Then, when DE adds rewards to PvP events, the PvE crowd looses their minds about "B-But muh content locked behind PvP!" Even when the content is NOT game-altering in any way, shape, or form. Its a SIGIL. a SIGIL. Think about that. Let it sink in. Its a cosmetic item with no impact and usually you don't even LOOK at.

There are plenty of possibilities to make the conclave great. Sadly, there is a small but vocal group of players who tried it, disliked it, and proceeded to trash it until trashing conclave became the new cool trend for everyone to do, even if they've never tried it before.

[AlphaPHENIX]

il y a 2 minutes, ShogunGunshow a dit :

Are you seriously asking me if I think it would be bad to deliberately make terrible decisions for the game I supported in the hopes of trying to get toxic people to quit?

The answer is yes - yes, I think that would be a fantastically bad idea. Because it would make nice players that just like playing the game quit as well. Nothing about the above targets toxic players over nice ones. You'd have the same or worse ratio of toxic to nice players as before - you'd just have less people playing the game!

And honestly? It's very rare that I have any negative interactions with anyone in game. Last time was around PoE release when one jerk-butt refused to extract, and I mostly lay the blame for that at the feet of DE for not including individual extraction after a bounty is complete. Because of course people were going to do that :P My experience with the playerbase is nowhere near so negative that I'd consider frigging sabotaging the experience. Like holy whatnow, that's insane.

Good answer. Now do you see how I feel when people say ''Putting PvE mods in PvP would be a great way to get people to hate DE really fast.''?

It just puts us back at square one with the argument. I start to talk about trading again, you say that's not good enough and we get stuck in an endless loop untill a moderator locks the thread or one party decides to not care anymore.

[Talonflight]

And for that guy who's about to post after me claiming its the servers.... several clans host their own conclave servers. In the last 2 months when I've played conclave, I haven't had a single laggy match. So no, it isn't the servers.