Should there be a way to warn/stop MR 1-5 players

[(PSN)NewcastleDisease]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb Oreades:

The problem is MR means literally nothing on it's own. 

right.. i began leveling MR long after Saturn... at that time my loadout was able to deal enough damage to take down lvl 40 enemies...

the MR do not represent a certain progress in your loadout. it just let other know how much of the game you already archived - IF you level it up.... so thats the wrong trigger

[Autongnosis]

To be honest while i agree that putting up a warning transmission from either Lotus or Konzu that goes along the lines of "you sure you're up for this tenno?" would be good, simply restricting access wouldn't do anuthing good. 

For three reasons:

• The game is a power fantasy. Bashing your head against a lv 60 grineer doing next to no damage to it while your team mates evaporate the map is a good experience to drive people to inform themselves on how to get stronger. 
• Seeing long term players and what they roll is good because it motivates people to progress. If the only player you ever see is that low MR mag/excal/volt who plays about as well as you, you won't have much motivation. I remember one of the biggest things thst drove me to get better when i started was seeing veteran tennos flying about killing everything and looking #*!%ing awesome while they were at it, and i was like "DAMN i want to be like that, how do i get there?" 
• The community in this game is amazing. For one low MR leech who just does not interact with anyine and expects to be carried, i've met dozens that are genuinely interested in the game. The short-ish 15mins it takes to complete a Bounty if you don't rush it like a crazy person is enough to chat and ping their interest. I've made many a pal that way, and in general having a good laugh and simply taking a moment to explain some stuff can go a looooong way towards making these players both realise their mistake and start seriously trodding the road to progress. 

I'd rather deal with the occasional bad apple if i can get to help people around most of the time, and get to know fun guys. Also because when you're new everything has that "new and amazing" feeling so i found newer guys in general to be more open towards chatting in general 🙂

[KargorX]

6 hours ago, (XB1)Cooldog234jr said:

From doing High level plains bounties like lv 30-50 and 40-60. Konzu should say something like "Tenno are you sure want to do this, you look unprepared" or "Your weapons are too weak for this Tenno, I suggest you comeback when you have stronger weapons so you can take down these tough enemies"

It might not be that easy -- since "MR" doesn't mean much, the game would have to generally analyze your gear.

However, what's the problem? I'm MR-11, I've tried a higher level bounty, and I won't do it again. People will find out quickly whether they can handle something or not.

And if they add this for bounties, why not add it everywhere else? Tactical Alerts in particular, where I got fooled by the "Level 15-20" attached to it... I've never even considered trying a Sortie, but I saw no problem with the first stage in the Tactical Alert 🙂 I was soooooo wrong.

[SpicyDinosaur]

4 hours ago, wtflag said:

Agreed that MR doesn't really meant all that much. I have 18MR and that is pretty high from what I can see.

But actually I just started playing 58 days ago and just had my first Eidolon kill two days ago. 

There are MR10 that does more damage than I do with my starter amp, zero levels in void strike and zero forma chroma. I'm pretty sure my pug teammates were less than impressed.

I'm hoping to fix that soon by devouring knowledge from youtube and wiki and grind those things up. But I need to leech just a bit longer. 😉

Honestly, if you actually fulfilled Chroma's role and used appropriate powers etc, and maybe even attempted to get the rights stats as close to what is needed as possible, you'd be 100xs better than.every.chroma.I.end.up.in.a.group.with...

[Mr.SpookSpook]

There should be higher MR locks on things, there are too many high level missions with small MR players joining in and just leeching or running around useless and dying every 30 sec...

 

[(PSN)robotwars7]

2 hours ago, (XB1)Danowat32 said:

Don't play pub games.

^^^^^^^^^^^ Jesus, you need to be careful wielding around that much logic man, you might kill somebody!

 

 

[(PSN)CyrrowCyclonis]

Eh, if they start dropping too much I stop reviving. 

[Vgavis]

There should also be a better explaination of the level difficulties of the missions, so that you can just easily determine how hard to is just by look at it. Level 30-36 doesn't really explain much. Maybe some way of determining your own level by the loadout you have eqipped.

[angias]

Il y a 9 heures, Oreades a dit :

The problem is MR means literally nothing on it's own. 

Actually I take that back being sub MR5 means that the player doesn't have access to TWW and therefor doesn't have and AMP and as such can't help at all with the Eidolon shields. Outside of that fairly specific scenario..... I can't think of a single thing that looking at MR will tell you. 

Mr is more or less an Indicator of time investment and wealth.

[fadingtheory]

7 hours ago, LupisV0lk said:

It appears that reading is hard.

That's one interpretation. Here's two more.

1.Reading is easy and you just don't like what I think about your opinion
2. Apparently writing is harder than reading

But sure, be rude. The very things you accused 'elitist' of being.

Did you delete your own post, or did you get modded?

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

3 hours ago, (PS4)LorcSephiroth said:

Eh, if they start dropping too much I stop reviving. 

Same here. I'll carry for a bit but if they go down more than twice then I stop and just focus on the mission.

[(XBOX)DakVoidcloaker]

There is a leeching problem on high level missions.  Strict mastery rank limitations may not be the answer, but something needs to be done as kids are not getting any less entitled.

[1thurts]

OK how about this: a tenno has to beat level N bounty 10 times to have access to level N+1 bounty.

[midtarget]

There's a MR zero guy that was an absolute beast with the zenistar on Mot.

[Oreades]

1 hour ago, (XB1)DakVoidcloaker said:

There is a leeching problem on high level missions.  Strict mastery rank limitations may not be the answer, but something needs to be done as kids are not getting any less entitled.

For me as long as the players I'm grouped with are legitimately trying, I don't mind. 

I do get tilted when people essentially find a hidey hole and only move enough to dodge the inactivity timer. That, bothers me and I wish there was a better way to deal with that specific issue.

[(PSN)Mahd2_7]

10 hours ago, wtflag said:

Agreed that MR doesn't really meant all that much. I have 18MR and that is pretty high from what I can see.

But actually I just started playing 58 days ago and just had my first Eidolon kill two days ago. 

There are MR10 that does more damage than I do with my starter amp, zero levels in void strike and zero forma chroma. I'm pretty sure my pug teammates were less than impressed.

I'm hoping to fix that soon by devouring knowledge from youtube and wiki and grind those things up. But I need to leech just a bit longer. 😉

I'm only Mr11 and I've played 800+hrs... 

[Calistin]

10 hours ago, fadingtheory said:

I'm not going to say that what OP proposed is a good idea, but this is just silly. Gear/Level gates are a staple in MMOs and multiplayer games. They are not elitist.

 

They are a staple in badly made mmos.  Gear/lvl checks shouldn't stop you from a challenge unless the game is just a gear check race over skill.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Calistin

[fadingtheory]

1 minute ago, Calistin said:

They are a staple in badly made mmos.

Declaring the majority of MMOs badly made makes you more of an elitist than any MMO has ever been.

[Calistin]

17 minutes ago, fadingtheory said:

Declaring the majority of MMOs badly made makes you more of an elitist than any MMO has ever been.

Not at all, like most things this is a highly subjective subject and it's all about opinions. I prefer games that let you into content to try it especially if you want a challenge without limiting you to you must be such and such lvl or have such and such gear.. that's elitism. It's saying you can't play because you haven't grinded god mode gear etc ad nauseam.

Sadly many mmo's follow this but many do not as well. Some mmo's allow you to try higher level stuff even if you're highly likely to fail, it's about freedom of choice where as eltism is all about taking away that freedom of choice.

Frankly it sounds like you have a problem with the PUGS and running via public with randoms.  As you get older you will find pugs is like a box of chocolate you never know what you will find inside until you open it..therefore if you're after a specific experience do runs according to what you're after, make yourself a static group etc etc

This is quite possible without limiting others, there no need to take choice away from others because you can't bothered and want to spam public for runs.

It's like people that have been playing/grinding a game for years, have all the best gear, levels, power enhancing "stuff" possible to make themselves basically godmode then cry about power creep and how the game is far too easy...

Edited August 2, 2018 by Calistin
grammar

[Zanchak]

There should only be a "lock" on eidolon hunts. You plain and simple should not be able to connect to or join any hunting squads without having finished TWW at the very least. Period.

[Hohstadt]

How about no because MR has nothing to do with skill? you can drop mucha bucks to get enough to rank up to mr 20 and still be terrible. I've seen MR18s do worse then myself. All mr tells you is how many weapons and frames that person has gotten to 30. nothing more.

[fadingtheory]

10 minutes ago, Calistin said:

Not at all, like most things this is a highly subjective subject and it's all about opinions. I prefer games that let you into content to try it especially if you want a challenge without limiting you to you must be such and such lvl or have such and such gear.. that's elitism. It's saying you can't play because you haven't grinded god mode gear etc ad nauseam.

Sadly many mmo's follow this but many do not as well. Some mmo's allow you to try higher level stuff even if you're highly likely to fail, it's about freedom of choice where as eltism is all about taking away that freedom of choice.

Frankly it sounds like you have a problem with the PUGS and running via public with randoms.  As you get older you will find pugs is like a box of chocolate you never know what will find inside until you open it..therefore if you are after a specific experience do runs according to what you're after, make yourself a static group etc etc

This is quite possible without limiting others, there no need to take choice away from others because you can't bothered and want to spam public for runs.

For one, I think I'm older than you think I am. For two, I'm not calling for a MR gate - I have no problem with gating, but MR simply isn't set up for it. I'm MR18, but if MR truly was 'skill based,' I'd put myself somewhere around MR5 as far as good players go.

As for gates in general for Warframe, I'm not sure its worth considering, since the only content that would really warrant it is sorties (Which are already gated, though the gate is trivial), eidolon hunting (Which is 100% premade, as I understand it), and the Cetus max level missions (Which is the subject of the thread, roughly). I'm not sure one thing (The last one) is worth $&*^ing around with the concept and creating a new gate metric for.

My previous comments were about gating in general, which is not elitist, and in many cases very reasonable. There are many MMOs with huge disparities in player knowledge and gear where such gating is appropriate. FF14 comes to mind (Since its the last 'traditional' MMO I played). There would be no 'challenging yourself' by unlocking trials and dungeons in that game, only poisoning the well for everyone else because those players have zero chance of participating in a meaningful way.

EDIT: As for what I expect from pugs personally... I expect everyone I play with in this game and others to be absolute garbage, and for the most part, they live up to that. Luckily, in warframe, for every two miserable, lazy, non-participating pugs theres one in an overpowered 'Everything dies within a 50 meter radius of me' mega pug who carries the whole shebang anyway.

Edited August 2, 2018 by fadingtheory

[Calistin]

12 minutes ago, fadingtheory said:

For one, I think I'm older than you think I am. For two, I'm not calling for a MR gate - I have no problem with gating, but MR simply isn't set up for it. I'm MR18, but if MR truly was 'skill based,' I'd put myself somewhere around MR5 as far as good players go.

As for gates in general for Warframe, I'm not sure its worth considering, since the only content that would really warrant it is sorties (Which are already gated, though the gate is trivial), eidolon hunting (Which is 100% premade, as I understand it), and the Cetus max level missions (Which is the subject of the thread, roughly). I'm not sure one thing (The last one) is worth $&*^ing around with the concept and creating a new gate metric for.

My previous comments were about gating in general, which is not elitist, and in many cases very reasonable. There are many MMOs with huge disparities in player knowledge and gear where such gating is appropriate. FF14 comes to mind (Since its the last 'traditional' MMO I played). There would be no 'challenging yourself' by unlocking trials and dungeons in that game, only poisoning the well for everyone else because those players have zero chance of participating in a meaningful way.

Well sounds like we agree on some things, funny you mention FF as that was one I was thinking about with gates. The thing you need to understand is that FF was created with gates because it targets new mmo players and the gates are a way of teaching those new to mmos. This was talked about quite a lot back when it first came out! 

As for huge disparities there will always be some both in gear, levels and skill there's no way around this and I feel gates is a cheap way to do things when devs just can't be bothered barring some games like FF14 that intentionally want them for various reasons.

 

 

Edited August 2, 2018 by Calistin

[(PSN)Hiero_Glyph]

4 hours ago, angias said:

Mr is more or less an Indicator of time investment and wealth.

Not at low mastery ranks. There are plenty of items available from the market that new players should be using that will boost their MR up to a decent level. Once you get to MR 8 things start to slow down slightly but unless someone has an alt account or is restarting on another platform low MR is a good determining factor of skill and familiarity of game mechanics.

At high MR your comment applies however.

[Dreadwire]

Well at least they try.

 

Then see limbo in rift doing mot survival for 20 min. Check progress he only kill 3.....

Mfffffff