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A Grineer VS Corpus PVP could be one of the few PVP gamemodes that could work


-Moctezuma-

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With DE asking players if they would like a "revamped PVP experience", I think one of the few gamemodes that could work would be Grineer VS Corpus PVP

Many people will say

"Oh why would DE focus on making PVP If the warframe community has already shown their dislike towards it!"

Here is the thing, Whenever someone in the Warframe community sees the word "PVP" they dismiss it, why?, because they instantly think of the unbalanced garbo that is Conclave, the Warframe movement is simply not made for PvP mode, the warframes bouncing around from wall to wall, bullet jumping, etc, is simply not ideal for this which is a HUGE turn off for casual players.

But take the more slow paced Movement of Kahl and Veso, polish it a little bit more, and it could be a decent PVP experience, way better than the nigthmare called Conclave, you could have 12v12 "Big team battle" similar to Halo or Planetside even, with lots of gamemodes like Capture the Flag or King Of The Hill

All of these gamemodes below have one thing in common

 - Conclave

 - Solar Rails

 - Conclave rework 

 - Lunaro

 - Frame Fighter

They have the unbalanced, nauseatic Warframe movement, which is fine for PvE, but not PVP, which is why I think DE should try doing something like Grineer VS Corpus, because its something that has never been done before in Warframe.

And for the typical argument of "If I wanted to play PVP game i'd go play one", nobody is forcing you to play this, this could be detached from the main game (Unlike Conclave)

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3 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

With DE asking players if they would like a "revamped PVP experience",

Where exactly are they asking this because I keep seeing these types of post but haven't seen a single thing with any questions in it....

 

I'm still against pvp in any format in the game, I don't actually want them focusing on playable grineer and corpus characters either so throw them two together and I'll be just as anti grineer vs corpus as I would any other pvp format in the game.

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Just now, LSG501 said:

Where exactly are they asking this because I keep seeing these types of post but haven't seen a single thing with any questions in it....

 

Whenever you exit the game, there is a chance of getting  this

wf-survey.png

1 minute ago, LSG501 said:

I'm still against pvp in any format in the game, I don't actually want them focusing on playable grineer and corpus characters either so throw them two together and I'll be just as anti grineer vs corpus as I would any other pvp format in the game.

Any reasoning behind this? or you just don't like PVP in general?, because like I said in the post, nobody would be forcing you to play it, it could be detached from the main game unlike conclave which locks mods and acessories behind it

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6 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

"PVP" they dismiss it, why?, because they instantly think of the unbalanced garbo that is Conclave, the Warframe movement is simply not made for PvP mode

Don't make assumptions, many in the community don't want ANY PvP because it leads to toxic behavior (tea bagging, "git gud" chat DMs, etc). We already have the "git gud" toxicity in the forum community from all the the try-hards that cry for "skill" in the game. Don't need that spilling into game-chat too.

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WF's mobility does work for PvP, it's just something with a massive entry barrier.

But still, Grineer v Corpus PvP is something that players have suggested for years. Now that we actually have gameplay with each faction here's hoping they do repurpose it for PvP eventually.

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Just now, -Moctezuma- said:

Whenever you exit the game, there is a chance of getting  this

Any reasoning behind this? or you just don't like PVP in general?, because like I said in the post, nobody would be forcing you to play it, it could be detached from the main game unlike conclave which locks mods and acessories behind it

Well I've never seen that... clearly I'm not a chosen one...

 

As to why. if I want to play a 'large scale pvp' I can go play something designed around it from day one rather than it being ANOTHER bolted on bit to warframe.  Essentially I'd rather DE focus their dev time on the main game rather than all these little 'add ons' they keep doing.

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1 minute ago, (PSN)isbergen said:

Don't make assumptions, many in the community don't want ANY PvP because it leads to toxic behavior (tea bagging, "git gud" chat DMs, etc). We already have the "git gud" toxicity in the forum community from all the the try-hards that cry for "skill" in the game. Don't need that spilling into game-chat too.

 

Yes PVP may create a more toxic enviroment IN THAT gamemode, but in the PVE  world you prob wouldn't even see them, after all you can mute them or report them for harrasement, then again it's a small con to adding PVP, compared to the good results that it could come from it

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4 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

As to why. if I want to play a 'large scale pvp' I can go play something designed around it from day one rather than it being ANOTHER bolted on bit to warframe.  Essentially I'd rather DE focus their dev time on the main game rather than all these little 'add ons' they keep doing.

Here is the thing, it wouldn't be an "addon", like say Frame figther, it could be a main update

4 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

I'd rather DE focus their dev time on the main game rather than all these little 'add ons' they keep doing.

After Duviri Paradox releases, they could start working on the PVP gamemode, nobody is forcing you to play it, it doesn't affect you at all

The PVP and PVE could be completely diferent worlds, not forcing PVE people to play PVP to gain weapons or stuff like they do in Destiny

 

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6 minutes ago, trst said:

WF's mobility does work for PvP, it's just something with a massive entry barrier.

But still, Grineer v Corpus PvP is something that players have suggested for years. Now that we actually have gameplay with each faction here's hoping they do repurpose it for PvP eventually.

Yep, I think a Grineer vs Corpus could be good when it comes to casual players, because it's not a very sweaty and intense figthing style like Conclave

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1 minute ago, trst said:

WF's mobility does work for PvP, it's just something with a massive entry barrier.

Well, it can. High mobility arena shooters aren't exactly a new concept, Quake is far faster than Conclave and that's from the 90s! IMO the problem with Warframe's mobility is that it's tied to a long TTK, so good players have a lot of time to use their mobility to break from fights and recover. I feel like this often gets misattributed to modding, which is impactful but not so much more important than skill. There are two options then: reduce the mobility (Grineer vs Corpus or stamina), or reduce the TTK. And since there's no reason to take the mobility away when it's such an iconic feature of the game, the best thing to do is to offer both: work on Conclave's pacing  so it feels better with the game's signature mobility, and add a slower paced Grineer vs Corpus mode that focuses more on combined arms and the non-Tenno conflict in the system.

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22 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

Here is the thing, it wouldn't be an "addon", like say Frame figther, it could be a main update

After Duviri Paradox releases, they could start working on the PVP gamemode, nobody is forcing you to play it, it doesn't affect you at all

The PVP and PVE could be completely diferent worlds, not forcing PVE people to play PVP to gain weapons or stuff like they do in Destiny

 

Seriously... a main update with pvp theme... you might want to look back at lunaro and see how well that worked out long term.

You're right it's not forcing forcing us to play it (unless they stick something behind it if it's 'main update') but taking dev time to work on it would mean it would be longer until I (and others) get update to the existing game content that we do want to play....

If PVP and PVE are different worlds we'll get conclave rewards all over again, not to mention if they're different worlds you might as well just play another game and save the dev's needing to work on it in warframe.  It's not just development on release there will be 'fixes' and 'balancing' needed long term too. 

Like I say I'd rather see DE spend their time on the main game rather than content that has already proven to be limited in it's appeal.

This is coming from someone who found warframe when looking for something 'similar' to unreal tournament, a pvp focused game....

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12 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Seriously... a main update with pvp theme... you might want to look back at lunaro and see how well that worked out long term.

 

Why are you comparing Lunaro, a one dimensional limited ball sport game  (with the same nausatic warframe movement), with Grineer VS Corpus PVP???

12 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

You're right it's not forcing forcing us to play it (unless they stick something behind it if it's 'main update') but taking dev time to work on it would mean it would be longer until I (and others) get update to the existing game content that we do want to play....

Who is "we"?, Yes a part of the community does want PVP, but the other side does, not all the updates have to cater to the same people, there is no need to be egoistic about it

It's been awhile since the PVP community in warframe has recieved any update at all, having this egoistic idea that "no, this game has to cater to me and me only!" isn't helpful to the game

12 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

it would mean it would be longer until I (and others) get update to the existing game content that we do want to play....

This is a very childish and egoistic way of thinking, Warframe isn't ending soon, take a look at ALL the main updates we have gotten in the past years

Veilbreaker - PVE

Angels of the Zariman - PVE

New War - PVE

Heart of Deimos - PVE

Empyrean - PVE

The list goes on and on,  The game has been focused on PVE for a while, and ONE single PVP update bothers you because you'd  have to "wait"? 

 

 

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I honestly find it hard to believe this player base in its majority is truly capable of appreciating or enjoying any PvP. I don't think DE wants to risk the wasted resources either, because when so many vocal people want Conclave just deleted, it's not convincing when they say they would like this sort of PvP, instead.

 

That said, I enjoy Conclave and would definitely enjoy this, as well. PvP is a lot of fun.

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1 hour ago, -Moctezuma- said:

nobody would be forcing you to play it, it could be detached from the main game unlike conclave which locks mods and acessories behind it

This makes it really hard to justify developing it. I mean, they're putting real money into this PvP for...what, exactly? What returns are they getting? How is it monetized? How are players incentivized to spend on the game because of it? At least current Conclave has things like tie-ins to PvE so things like transmutations and forma carry over. And the armour set. It's also proportionally abandoned.

55 minutes ago, PublikDomain said:

Well, it can. High mobility arena shooters aren't exactly a new concept, Quake is far faster than Conclave and that's from the 90s! IMO the problem with Warframe's mobility is that it's tied to a long TTK, so good players have a lot of time to use their mobility to break from fights and recover. I feel like this often gets misattributed to modding, which is impactful but not so much more important than skill. There are two options then: reduce the mobility (Grineer vs Corpus or stamina), or reduce the TTK. And since there's no reason to take the mobility away when it's such an iconic feature of the game, the best thing to do is to offer both: work on Conclave's pacing  so it feels better with the game's signature mobility, and add a slower paced Grineer vs Corpus mode that focuses more on combined arms and the non-Tenno conflict in the system.

Also, this. This plus the emphasis on headshots on cocaine-fueled acrobatic hitboxes pushes it into ridiculous territory. Yeah, a high skill ceiling is good, but when the TTK between a newbie and a veteran can approach something stupid like 5-8x (I forget my calculation but I know the shield gating creates a ridiculous gap), and when said veteran can heal on every encounter to remove even the element of attrition, you're not likely to keep your new players around.

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1 minute ago, Ethorin said:

A game built from to ground up for Corpus v Grineer PvP could be amazing, but I really do think it would NEED to be built from the ground up for it.

Something like Planetside 2 but reskinned to Warframe could be amazing, With 3 factions atleast

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49 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

Why are you comparing Lunaro, a one dimensional limited ball sport game  (with the same nausatic warframe movement), with Grineer VS Corpus PVP???

Who is "we"?, Yes a part of the community does want PVP, but the other side does, not all the updates have to cater to the same people, there is no need to be egoistic about it

You're talking as though everyone is after your version of PvP content yet you're complaining about my reference to other players.... you might want to look in the mirror before saying someone else is egoistic.

 

49 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

It's been awhile since the PVP community in warframe has recieved any update at all, having this egoistic idea that "no, this game has to cater to me and me only!" isn't helpful to the game

This is a very childish and egoistic way of thinking, Warframe isn't ending soon, take a look at ALL the main updates we have gotten in the past years

Veilbreaker - PVE

Angels of the Zariman - PVE

New War - PVE

Heart of Deimos - PVE

Empyrean - PVE

The list goes on and on,  The game has been focused on PVE for a while, and ONE single PVP update bothers you because you'd  have to "wait"?

Oh this explains it all...you're a pvp player 🙄

The reason we've had so many PVE updates is because PVE is the more popular content....the popular content is what pays the bills and enables DE to do more stuff.

I'm not sure what the percentage would be now but the last time we saw percentages fof PvP it was in the single digit percent range, iirc it wasn't even 2%.

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1 hour ago, -Moctezuma- said:

Whenever you exit the game, there is a chance of getting  this

wf-survey.png

Any reasoning behind this? or you just don't like PVP in general?, because like I said in the post, nobody would be forcing you to play it, it could be detached from the main game unlike conclave which locks mods and acessories behind it

Ngl I would love some simulation activities. 

Warframes farming those crops...

I can see it.... 

The premium gameplay we all wanted.

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Just now, (XBOX)Upl0rdYT said:

Ngl I would love some simulation activities. 

Warframes farming those crops...

I can see it.... 

The premium gameplay we all wanted.

Mining, crafting, farming...

We've got explosive Grineer Ghouls...animals...

Only have to let players build a dirt house in the Plains and we can sell Minecraft Warframe to Microsoft for billions!

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But... why.

You are ignoring one very, very significant factor. Making content requires dev time. Why would you prefer DE spend their time on a PvP game mode that has completely different gameplay/systems from the main game. DE working on a Grineer/Corpus PvP mode will, without question, reduce their output of PvE content.

Opportunity cost is a thing. DE is not a small studio, but they aren't massive either.

 

1 hour ago, -Moctezuma- said:

And for the typical argument of "If I wanted to play PVP game i'd go play one", nobody is forcing you to play this, this could be detached from the main game (Unlike Conclave)

This has the same energy as "if you don't like AoE weapons then don't use them." If you want DE to spend time working on something that diverges from the core of the game you better have a better reasoning than "you don't have to play it."

If you want a slow paced PvP game... seriously... go play something else. If DE is going to add something competitive to Warframe it should be built around things the game excels at.

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