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Archon Stretch needs to be adjusted. It's far too little benefit for far too much cost.


Nomnivore1

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I see that some people are having great luck getting Archon Stretch to refund lots of energy on high-duration abilities like Tesla nervos and Mote but if your ability doesn't run for 20+ seconds, even if it deals shock damage, the energy returned just isn't enough to matter. 

 

The electric ability synergy mod is useless on Volt, the electricity Warframe. 10 energy refunded for a shock, 20 for a discharge. Flat. 

For a mod that cost half of my total stock, comes from a limited weekly resource, and costs 16 drain, that's criminal. It's a ripoff. I get that infinite stacking of this would be egregious but limited stacking or just better energy regen is needed because as it stands this mod is a total flop, now I have to spend another forma to change my build back and I'm out 40 stock, and a primed mod's worth of credits and endo. 

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The mod is in a strange spot since if you buff the range or energy return it turns itself into a self-contained nuking combo.

Up the range? You just made it become a mandatory mod for nuking 

Up the energy count? You just turns it from a worse streamline into a any spammable ability button

 

I think the mod count should be reduced to 12 capacity instead of the awful 16 it is right now.  Cause I think we have reached the point where even with max forma it is still impossible to slot in a fully min-maxed frame loadout. 

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2 minutes ago, XHADgaming said:

The mod is in a strange spot since if you buff the range or energy return it turns itself into a self-contained nuking combo.

Up the range? You just made it become a mandatory mod for nuking 

Up the energy count? You just turns it from a worse streamline into a any spammable ability button

What about just making it "slightly" better.

Buff range from 45% to ~55%. It would be "just little bit better". 5% isn't too much imho. 10% increase is perfect, imho.

Don't increase energy count too much. Maybe to 3 or 4 energy per seconds. What's more important is change "ABILITIES that deals damage" to "any source of damage" (or at least frame's damage (weapon, abilities, bullet jump mod).

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1 hour ago, quxier said:

What about just making it "slightly" better.

Buff range from 45% to ~55%. It would be "just little bit better". 5% isn't too much imho. 10% increase is perfect, imho.

Don't increase energy count too much. Maybe to 3 or 4 energy per seconds. What's more important is change "ABILITIES that deals damage" to "any source of damage" (or at least frame's damage (weapon, abilities, bullet jump mod).

This would be fine, even allowing the buff to stack up to a limit would be balanced. X energy / second for Y seconds, max Z stacks. At least then it would provide a new way to play some frames instead of being Range but with a negligible benefit for an insane cost.

 

"Volt can discharge infinitely" is definitely a broken mod. 

"Volt can use his 1 on enough targets to build up energy over time" is horizontal progression. That's a new thing you can do. That's good. This would also still benefit every other frame the mod works on now. It would be like an augment for Vauban, wisp, gyre, volt. All of them would have new or at least augmented playstyles. 

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hace 1 hora, (XBOX)elementXGHILLIE dijo:

it's by far one of the better ones, If any get buffed should be Archon Flow. Way too many restrictions for one use.

Definitely. I was testing it by killing with the Orvius and even if I kill 20 enemies at the same time, if a single orb falls it is already a lot.

And as for the topic of this post, Archon Stretch works very well with warframes that already have energy recovery abilities like Gyre and Styanax for example

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8 hours ago, Nomnivore1 said:

I see that some people are having great luck getting Archon Stretch to refund lots of energy on high-duration abilities like Tesla nervos and Mote but if your ability doesn't run for 20+ seconds, even if it deals shock damage, the energy returned just isn't enough to matter. 

 

The electric ability synergy mod is useless on Volt, the electricity Warframe. 10 energy refunded for a shock, 20 for a discharge. Flat. 

For a mod that cost half of my total stock, comes from a limited weekly resource, and costs 16 drain, that's criminal. It's a ripoff. I get that infinite stacking of this would be egregious but limited stacking or just better energy regen is needed because as it stands this mod is a total flop, now I have to spend another forma to change my build back and I'm out 40 stock, and a primed mod's worth of credits and endo. 

Just got the mod this is definitely not the case. This is arguably the best Archon mod. Didn't try it on volt but elemental ward hildryn the shield regen is insane. Ill also mention that Archon Vitality works on her  Blazing pillage augment.

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On 2022-09-19 at 11:34 AM, XHADgaming said:

Cause I think we have reached the point where even with max forma it is still impossible to slot in a fully min-maxed frame loadout. 

Wrong and mathematically impossible if you are fully invested.

Fully invested = Catalyst, Proper Aura, 9(10) xforma + Exilus.

With Potato you get 60.

The lowest point auras are 7, on a proper slot they are 14.  Steel Charge is 18.  This means at minimum you should have 74 points to play with, 78 with SC.

With you Exilus, you have 9 slots with cost.  The max a slot can cost is 16, but when formad this is 8.

8x9 = 72... meaning in literally every case in Warframe, you would be left 2-6 points to spare.  None of this is to mention 99% of builds do not slot x9 16 pt mods because that would almost 100% lead to some terrible builds....

There is no case in Warframe where you cannot finish your build because of points if you do all the investments needed.  

Your suggestion would, at best, alleviate the need for a single forma.
  

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1 hour ago, (PSN)N7_Dredgen said:

Wrong and mathematically impossible if you are fully invested.

That is why I said I think because I know that it is possible to not be able slot everything in a weapon loadout but was not 100% sure for a Warframe loadout.

 

It most certainly is if you leave two slots without polarities to make use the multiple loadout slots we are given.

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1 hour ago, (PSN)N7_Dredgen said:

Wrong and mathematically impossible if you are fully invested.

Fully invested = Catalyst, Proper Aura, 9(10) xforma + Exilus.

With Potato you get 60.

The lowest point auras are 7, on a proper slot they are 14.  Steel Charge is 18.  This means at minimum you should have 74 points to play with, 78 with SC.

With you Exilus, you have 9 slots with cost.  The max a slot can cost is 16, but when formad this is 8.

8x9 = 72... meaning in literally every case in Warframe, you would be left 2-6 points to spare.  None of this is to mention 99% of builds do not slot x9 16 pt mods because that would almost 100% lead to some terrible builds....

There is no case in Warframe where you cannot finish your build because of points if you do all the investments needed.  

Your suggestion would, at best, alleviate the need for a single forma.
  

My two cents as well,

 

There's many ways to min max a Warframe and have capacity to spare, even a 5 forma Khora can fit everything I could possibly want including archon mods.

The biggest thorn in my a- is that I wasted so many Umbra Formas on Caster frames to fit Umbral Intensify, just to have it outclassed by a Madurai polarity for Archon Intensify as all of my builds have some form of built in healing.

The Archon mods are niche and fit many unique builds, but they unfortunately invalidate Umbral Mods for all frames with the exception of Health Tanks.

 

Though there is one situation where points are desperately needed: weapons.

Most weapons - including kuva and tenant variants - have capacity to spare like Warframes; with the exception of kitguns.

I can never seem to find enough points to invest at rank 30 for the primary Catchmoon and secondary Gaze, they're honestly perfect as is.

Though the min maxer in me still wants to push the envelope as far as it will go with Primed mods, rivens, and Galvanized mods. The 60 capacity is just not enough for a weapon capped at rank 30, and I'm often just leaving the exilus slot empty and opting for Pax Charge, squeezing as much performance as I can out of them.

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On 2022-09-19 at 4:20 PM, (XBOX)elementXGHILLIE said:

Just got the mod this is definitely not the case. This is arguably the best Archon mod. Didn't try it on volt but elemental ward hildryn the shield regen is insane. Ill also mention that Archon Vitality works on her  Blazing pillage augment.

This will most certainly be patched out just like energy siphon was patched out. Hildryn should not be gaining shields from the energy/s mechanic.

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Has anyone checked if Volt's passive can trigger it? I don't think it can, same problem with shock trooper and Toxic Lash on the toxin archon mod. That's annoying. 

 

Edit: the wiki says that residual shock can trigger archon stretch, that's cool. Volt can trigger it once per cast, and afaik his passive which is just shock damage doesn't trigger it, but a kitgun with one of the game's worst arcanes at rank 1 can do it consistently. Cool. 

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On 2022-09-20 at 1:02 AM, Nomnivore1 said:

The electric ability synergy mod is useless on Volt, the electricity Warframe. 10 energy refunded for a shock, 20 for a discharge. Flat. 

Not sure what you're saying here. Every tick of discharge refreshes the duration, Unless you're actively not playing, the buff will be up indefinitely.

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1 hour ago, Olphus said:

Not sure what you're saying here. Every tick of discharge refreshes the duration, Unless you're actively not playing, the buff will be up indefinitely.

The duration of the buff doesn't refresh. At base duration of Discharge (6 sec), you only get two procs or Archon Stretch from it. At 200% duration, you can get 3 procs of Archon Stretch.

OP is incorrect about Shock though, as the electric proc from it triggers Archon Stretch again, allowing it to restore 20 energy.

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