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Regarding Incarnon Hate...

SnowyZoroark

By SnowyZoroark,
in Weapons

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SnowyZoroark

SnowyZoroark

Posted
Posted

Please, for the love of all that is holy, something needs to be done about the projectiles you fire in Hate's Incarnon form.
Remove the explosion effect and buff the base damage of them, give it an entirely different gimmick instead of the explosive projectiles, hell, I'd even be fine with its gimmick having something to do with Ground Slams.

Just... please. The explosive projectiles fired upon basic attacks are awful. I don't mean in DPS, either. I mean in the fact that they are explosive and therefor stagger you if you're too close when they go off.
There's no Cautious Shot for melee weapons (obviously), so the only way you can avoid being staggered by using your melee weapon is by playing a Frame with invincibility like Rhino or Status Immunity like Voruna.

At this current moment, with Hate's current Incarnon gimmick, you have made a melee weapon that cannot be used in close quarters. 
What the actual hell.

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PhiZero

PhiZero

Posted
Posted (edited)

If you don't have Primed Sure Footed, there are still other options:

1. Unairu's Poise gives you 40 seconds of stagger immunity, and is an incredibly solid focus school from the AoZ rework.

2. Some Warframes can passively resist staggers and knockdown from explosive weapons, such as: Atlas (grounded passive), Titania (Spellbind), Grendel (Hearty Nourishment), Voruna (2nd passive), Nezha (Warding Halo), Oberon (Hallowed Ground) Rhino (Iron Skin), Lavos (passive) and I believe Nekros/Nidus/Trinity if they are linked to another unit.

Edited by PhiZero
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1984

1984

Posted
Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, SnowyZoroark said:

The explosive projectiles fired upon basic attacks are awful. I don't mean in DPS, either. I mean in the fact that they are explosive and therefor stagger you if you're too close when they go off.

Wait what? 

So if you want to rock this mediocre weapon you would need to use either unairu or PSF or frames like revenant to prevent self stagger what the actual hell. lmao

Its not just awful its absolutely ridiculous.

Edited by 1984
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(PSN)Joylesstuna

(PSN)Joylesstuna

Posted
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Honestly I don't see the point of this incarnon. The actual melee attacks will still kill enemies faster and having to aim your melee attacks so the projectiles hit enemies feels extremely strange. A video was posted yesterday and I thought it was going to shoot blades so aiming wouldnt be as important. In actuality, it's a small projectile that comes out. It just feels odd.

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(PSN)slightconfuzzled

(PSN)slightconfuzzled

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More of a curiosity, since I don't have the weapon yet, but I did see a video of this happening, lots of staggers from a person using this weapon. Does this still stagger if y you are aiming at a level or upwards of enemies? The video I watched, the person had their centre pf screen at the ground, so their projectiles were hitting the ground then detonating, but... hypothetically, if your cursor/centre screen was either level or raised towards a higher angle, I am curious if it still staggers you? I can imagine it being frustrating regardless, but yeah, just curious. 

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Kelaris

Kelaris

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Posted

Hate has been my most used melee across all my playtime. Strongly dislike the incarnon self stagger. Feels about as useful as having a meme riven on a launcher that shoots backwards.

9 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

More of a curiosity, since I don't have the weapon yet, but I did see a video of this happening, lots of staggers from a person using this weapon. Does this still stagger if y you are aiming at a level or upwards of enemies? The video I watched, the person had their centre pf screen at the ground, so their projectiles were hitting the ground then detonating, but... hypothetically, if your cursor/centre screen was either level or raised towards a higher angle, I am curious if it still staggers you? I can imagine it being frustrating regardless, but yeah, just curious. 

The projectile stops when it hits an enemy and then explodes a moment later. Angling camera higher helps a bit, but unless you're always missing enemies with the explosive, it'll still knock you down pretty often.

You do block (with your melee weapon) the explosion automatically if it's within 60 degrees of your crosshair, but to make use of that you have to be pretty deliberate in your movement and aiming.

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Voltage

Voltage

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, [DE]Marcus said:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

We’ll review it alongside the feedback about the Soma’s Incarnon form!

Cool! Is it possible to review Zakti and Zakti Prime as well? Their dart clouds cause self-stagger even though the weapons encourage getting up close and personal as they open enemies to finishers.

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1984

1984

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

does ack & brunt incarnon form will be also reviewed by The Team? cuz its special gimmick also inflicts self-stagger on user

edit. Theres also Ceramic Dagger incarnon form that also can inflict self-stagger

Edited by 1984
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(PSN)slightconfuzzled

(PSN)slightconfuzzled

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Kelaris said:

The projectile stops when it hits an enemy and then explodes a moment later. Angling camera higher helps a bit, but unless you're always missing enemies with the explosive, it'll still knock you down pretty often.

You do block (with your melee weapon) the explosion automatically if it's within 60 degrees of your crosshair, but to make use of that you have to be pretty deliberate in your movement and aiming.

 

Much thanks for the answer and details. I was initially hoping that maybe it was just a ground issue, that could be mitigated by just aiming higher (which would still be a bit of a hassle), but that doesn't sound like it helps much either from what you have sad. 

Thankfully as you have probably already seen, DE will be looking into this and sounds like they will be changing it, per DE Marcus post above. 

Once again, cheers! 

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(PSN)Crazy_Mr_J

(PSN)Crazy_Mr_J

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

We’ll review it alongside the feedback about the Soma’s Incarnon form!

Yes thanks, i'm a Scythes enthusiast, especially with my Nekrosmancer, and if i have an other Scythe to play - with a good profile - in place of my Reaper Prime, it's really cool, but i admit the self-stagger on it is so annoying. In the other hand, i like the bubbles' effect who can creates fire dots, so keep it please, but without self-stagger ; maybe during the combo "While Blocking & Moving" (like Forward Block with Stalking Fan Stance) :heart:

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ToKeSia

ToKeSia

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 2023-05-30 at 3:40 AM, [DE]Marcus said:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

We’ll review it alongside the feedback about the Soma’s Incarnon form!

how about zylok incarnon broken ?

On 2023-05-30 at 3:01 PM, Grave.Knight said:

Honestly, Hate Incarnon Genesis isn't that good cause the bombs don't do that much damage nor do they contribute to the combo counter.

if u say this , it applied with Ceramic Dagger and Ack & Brunt as well , the bomb isn't do much damage either , we still not talk about the rest of incarnon melee. if you want Hate to be better , you would have to consider other incarnon melee as well because as currently Hate is top incarnon melee in duviri melee incarnon.

Edited by ToKeSia
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(PSN)Bellhender

(PSN)Bellhender

Posted
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I totally agree that in incarnon melee needs to get this self stagger projectile thing off. Projectiles themselves are too weak to be useful and if attacked from close like melee should it's 2 hits and you're rolling like dark souls rollypolly players. Yes sure footed is one way to correct this, but to every single frame to add it to their build is ridiculous! Same thing with Ceramic dagger's incarnon. 

Please DE fix this👍🏻 I love my hate but I don't want to hate it. 

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bl1te

bl1te

Posted
Posted
В 29.05.2023 в 23:40, [DE]Marcus сказал:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

We’ll review it alongside the feedback about the Soma’s Incarnon form!

In addition to previous replies about other self-stagger weapons, I want to mention the Zhuge Prime consistent self-staggers. Please review this one too.

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  • 3 weeks later...
SupernovaSymphony

SupernovaSymphony

Posted
Posted
On 2023-05-30 at 8:40 AM, [DE]Marcus said:

The Team will be reviewing the self-stagger on the Hate’s Incarnon form - we want you to be able to get up close and personal without the consistent AOE knockdowns. 

We’ll review it alongside the feedback about the Soma’s Incarnon form!

I hope you will also look at the Ack and Brunt self stagger too. I love the weapon, hate the constant staggering from it.

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