Wf1999, stamina

[Metalgearfox]

Bring it back.

 

Arthur isn't a warframe. He is probably infected based on his movements in the trailer. 

Removing stamina was a mistake. So was removing self damage on aoe, but that's another topic.

 

Sometimes, making the game more optimized and streamlined makes the game worse.

 

Arthur should play like a warframe in 2014. Warframe Classic. 

[Pakaku]

I think we need more reasons to try the update, not less

[(XBOX)elementXGHILLIE]

30 minutes ago, Metalgearfox said:

Bring it back.

 

Arthur isn't a warframe. He is probably infected based on his movements in the trailer. 

Removing stamina was a mistake. So was removing self damage on aoe, but that's another topic.

 

Sometimes, making the game more optimized and streamlined makes the game worse.

 

Arthur should play like a warframe in 2014. Warframe Classic. 

If any update should've had Stamina it was drifter combat given it's just a normal guy

[Violent_Sneezes]

[Pakaku]

13 minutes ago, (XBOX)elementXGHILLIE said:

If any update should've had Stamina it was drifter combat given it's just a normal guy

I'm loving the idea of a guy, who can barely run and jump to begin with, getting winded just by running down the block

[Tiltskillet]

I don't know what they should do or will do in the final product, but demo Arthur was definitely getting fatigued in a way that was quasi- realistic.  (By video game standards at least.)

[CephalonCarnage]

I'm not sure he was getting fatigued, more that he was dying on his feet.

Stamina was removed for a reason back in the day, as was self-damage from AoE. Bringing either back probably wouldn't improve anything, or solve anything either.

If you want to stop the bullet-jumping macros, add a cooldown. If you want to stop AoE spam, add a recoil-type cooldown between shots. I doubt these will stop people running off into the distance as they have a Laetum with +sprint speed, a mod with +sprint speed, a shard with +sprint speed and abilities like Gauss with +sprint speed. Nerfing bullet jumping will simply stop you from keeping up.

Better way to stop the running off is to make the maps less linear, to have more enemies behind you as well as ahead, or simply to create more chokepoints with gates, unlock areas or mini bosses you can't simply sprint past.

[trst]

Honestly it should come back IF it has reasonable gameplay interactions.

[Metalgearfox]

1 hour ago, CephalonCarnage said:

Stamina was removed for a reason back in the day, as was self-damage from AoE.

It was removed because too many of us are degens who don't want to manage their resources and range. 

[(NSW)Free_Aetharus]

50 minutes ago, CephalonCarnage said:

I'm not sure he was getting fatigued, more that he was dying on his feet.

Stamina was removed for a reason back in the day, as was self-damage from AoE. Bringing either back probably wouldn't improve anything, or solve anything either.

If you want to stop the bullet-jumping macros, add a cooldown. If you want to stop AoE spam, add a recoil-type cooldown between shots. I doubt these will stop people running off into the distance as they have a Laetum with +sprint speed, a mod with +sprint speed, a shard with +sprint speed and abilities like Gauss with +sprint speed. Nerfing bullet jumping will simply stop you from keeping up.

Better way to stop the running off is to make the maps less linear, to have more enemies behind you as well as ahead, or simply to create more chokepoints with gates, unlock areas or mini bosses you can't simply sprint past.

This.

But also.

Stamina is a HORRIBLE idea, because it breaks the flow of every map and also dramatically slows down speedruns.

Newbies will have distinctly LESS real advantages in combat as a given. Do not give them BLATANT disadvantages with mobility, by the Legendary-3 player having twice the speed in relative terms, while the newbie has no means to boost their own speed. This actually CREATES a distinct issue of kill stealing. Because newer players get NO affinity at the other end of the map, and the affinity-share distance will NOT support anybody who's powercrept just for being slow.

Stamina only emphasizes that a newer player may as well give up playing the game entirely, since they will not be respected nor will they be rewarded. They get no "Newcomer" bonus and they get no pity EXP. If they're not playing solo, they're NOT playing.

Stamina ONLY works in a game that utilizes it as a core mechanic for every OTHER core mechanic.

Dark Souls: Strategic dodging, if you spam the dodge you'll be punished. If you spam attack, you'll be punished. If you run like an idiot into battle, expect to be too tired to run like an idiot back out. If you try to do ladder combat, expect stamina to be a factor, too. Yes, you CAN be knocked off ladders.

Skyrim: Same thing but less punishing. Spam heavy attacks and be punished. Shield often to tire your opponent out. Bludgeon your opponent's shield and be punished by losing stamina. Recoil.

Morrowind[Lol]:

You want to be the next Goku? Sorry son, you spammed all those punches and now your asthma is acting up.
You think it's EASY heaving your lungs out, from being so tired all the time? Sweating and beggin' to rest for just one moment? Sorry son, somebody will kick you while you're down until you give up.

The thing about Warframe is that stamina doesn't conceptually work in this kind of game. It's NOT strategic in MOST of its gameplay.

Duviri is NOT dark souls.

1999 is NOT going to be anything like elder scrolls.

Crysis, maybe, but Crysis didn't have a stamina system that forced you to violently breathe like Kahl does.

Legend of Zelda only had a stamina system in certain cases, and introduced a combat-based stamina system only later on. But that was because, ultimately, the game revolved around that system, the stamina did not revolve around the rest of the game.'

Psychonauts-- Well- Every magic system is its own stamina meter. You get tired from performing, you need to rest and replenish. Psychonauts is ALL about managing this system to utilize major abilities. It doesn't GATE your ability to succeed with your basic attack, if at all possible, but it makes you consider playing smarter, not harder.

Warframe is ALL about playing as a bio-technological legend that people prey to for protection. You were manufactured to succeed and a MINUTE of running should pale in comparison to an actual boss fight. And some warframes technically shouldn't get very tired in the first place, such as Wisp, who floats, or Caliban, or even, I should assume, Excalibur.

One floats normally. They have no 'feet' in base. They do nothing BUT fly. They should not tire for going a little faster, as this is almost their mentally-perfected state of being.

One is debatably not able to tire that easily, if they even tire.

One is literally depicted as the first warframe, a 'pseudo-ninja' archetype, uses SWORDS as their gimmick and have all the telltale signs of somebody[dash not an initial consideration] who might ENJOY the thrill of a chase. No way Excalibur tires out without giving it some real effort.

And all missions take, let's assume in-game is 4x the speed of real-time, around an hour or two. Warframes were built different, they really were. They had to, they were created as a trump card against the sentients. They were forged to be the orokin's ultimate military. And the ironic part of that fact is, the tenno EASILY eradicated the orokin for that SAME reason. Warframes were not built to lose. When they DO lose, it's not because they were weak, but because they were ultimately out-witted. Nothing can beat a warframe, physically... but intellectually, a Warframe is only as competent as its operator.

[Joezone619]

I agree, i really want stamina back on warframes, but i'll settle for warframe 1999.

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

2 hours ago, CephalonCarnage said:

 

Better way to stop the running off is to make the maps less linear, to have more enemies behind you as well as ahead, or simply to create more chokepoints with gates, unlock areas or mini bosses you can't simply sprint past.

The problem is then people will crutch aoe even more to deal with those enemies while using high speed omni-directional frames like Wukong or Titania. 

Even if mini bosses were with specific weak points people are still going to pull a high damage weapon to deal with it asap.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 3 horas, Metalgearfox dijo:

Bring it back.

 

Arthur isn't a warframe. He is probably infected based on his movements in the trailer. 

Removing stamina was a mistake. So was removing self damage on aoe, but that's another topic.

 

Sometimes, making the game more optimized and streamlined makes the game worse.

 

Arthur should play like a warframe in 2014. Warframe Classic. 

For me, he is simply wearing armor that is mutating inside his own body, which causes side effects, you know what is normal with viruses; fever, pain, tiredness, dizziness and things like that.

The infested armor is simply eating him slowly.

The harness that arthur wears, maybe it will become a cosmetic for excalibur:

[AlexMercer]

4 hours ago, Metalgearfox said:

Bring it back.

 

Arthur isn't a warframe. He is probably infected based on his movements in the trailer. 

Removing stamina was a mistake. So was removing self damage on aoe, but that's another topic.

 

Sometimes, making the game more optimized and streamlined makes the game worse.

 

Arthur should play like a warframe in 2014. Warframe Classic. 

No

[Petergeist00]

Please no, i remember when stamina was a thing in the game. the only thing it was good at was making the game feel more clunky and unfun, i still remember how walking on a wall was frustrating af with it

[Alguien]

Most people already hate stamina in slower modern shooters, adding it to a fast-action game like Warframe is even worse. There is a reason stamina doesn't exist in games like Doom or Bayonetta.

[khazlol]

Maybe it´s time for Warframe Classic™.

Spoiler

 

 

[(NSW)Free_Aetharus]

14 minutes ago, khazlol said:

Maybe it´s time for Warframe Classic™.

  Hide contents

 

 

I miss the simpler times.

[Genitive]

You failed to explain why this would be a good idea and why removing it was bad.

[Anemone.Antimony]

13 hours ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

For me, he is simply wearing armor that is mutating inside his own body, which causes side effects, you know what is normal with viruses; fever, pain, tiredness, dizziness and things like that.

The infested armor is simply eating him slowly.

The harness that arthur wears, maybe it will become a cosmetic for excalibur:

tactical ass enhancement!!

[(PSN)robotwars7]

congratulations, this might be the worst take I've seen in a long while: you've earned this!

Stamina is never a good or fun mechanic in any way, and the Kahl missions proved that limiting mobility is a non-starter for warframe players: If I want to move slow AF in my looter-shooter, I'll just go back to Borderlands. I was relieved when I saw arthur pull off a bullet jump, if the guy is wearing a warframe suit/ is heavily mutated, he should be enhanced, not hindered. dude's already coughing and wheezing so there's already a trade-off of for whatever it is that's made him Proto-proto-Excalibur.

[(XBOX)Player244024418]

On 2023-09-02 at 8:21 PM, (NSW)Free_Aetharus said:

Newbies will have distinctly LESS real advantages in combat as a given. Do not give them BLATANT disadvantages with mobility, by the Legendary-3 player having twice the speed in relative terms, while the newbie has no means to boost their own speed. This actually CREATES a distinct issue of kill stealing. Because newer players get NO affinity at the other end of the map, and the affinity-share distance will NOT support anybody who's powercrept just for being slow.

Stamina only emphasizes that a newer player may as well give up playing the game entirely, since they will not be respected nor will they be rewarded

^^^ well said

They could simply put a cap on speed. Any additional speed mods would be wasted.

How is this even a problem anyway?

[Chewarette]

Heh it's 1999 also, so please remove some pixels and let us play in glorious 240p so we have the full experience

[Currilicious]

If this is about bringing the stamina bar back into the game, hard pass.

I like it quick and agile. When it got removed, the game played so much better.

So, thanks but no thanks.

[(XBOX)Hellsteeth30]

No, Warframe has enough fun limitation mechanisms already. 

Having emphasema is one I can live without.