i feel like dante is too good ?

[Xzorn]

In my experience easily the fastest changes to a frame I've seen. DE has made it so they can't win either way though.

Change/Fix something quick while there are still decade old bugs in the game. You think Bane mods double dipping DoTs is intentional? It's a bug they never bothered to fix. It was the same deal with old Gas status and Stealth multipliers triple dipping and Chroma dual element double dipping. Speaking of Chroma, two functioning abilities literally since his release. Power creep and time didn't change that. Two of of his skills were DOA and never changed.

They sat themselves in this corner years ago.

[TeaHands]

DE: "We're gonna make some adjustments to Dante."

Dante Players: *Starts writing Will*

I'd recommend waiting and seeing what they actually change on him.

But more than anything the biggest thing that needs to be adjusted right now is Overguard. It can just straight up nullify abilities and mods unless I break away from my Squad. 

I'd really rather not have to make changes to my builds and Warframe choice just in case I come across a frame that can consistently output Overguard.

[Rais808]

All the effort i made for him to build is going nerf! DE You bring something into this game that is a little bit dominant, making players very satisfied and nerf them!! How could you do that to us? It's true that many players who have spent platinum and money on him because they are the best frame to use, now they are dumb!! 

          As always, from lich weapons to frame nerf, DE you made us happy for a short time and made us regret it after a couple of days. Where is the time and effort that we spend on it? If you are thinking of making balance, then why do you bring such DPS things into this game?? Why why........ 

           You might think its balanced after things get nerf but we tenno are not satisfied with your decision. You shouldn't have brought things that are too dominant. DE you made such a massive best game, and you don't know about the balance of things before launching them!!

            And my final question and request is, are we playing this game or DE is playing with us🤔🤔 humble request to DE please don't nerf him too hard😑😑

--- from @Rais808 pc

[Prof-Dante]

1 hour ago, CosoMalvadoNG said:

DE doesn't nerf things that aren't too strong or don't have exploits

So Revenant, Octavia and all others like them don't deserve nerf because???

If DE even has a criteria for balance at all, these two frames should be nerfed to the ground...there is nothing in this game that should absorb 100% damage all the time, or stay invisible 100% of the time while your abilities do all the damage.

 

it's laughably obvious they only nerf based on players yapping about it, like...and with all due respect, you.

[TARINunit9]

6 hours ago, Kaiga said:

Do any of you remember such nerf speed previously?

Styanax was nerfed twice within six days. First was a bugfix that removed an exploit, second was a direct nerf to prevent him from being almost untargetable

[Zaghyr]

15 minutes ago, TeaHands said:

DE: "We're gonna make some adjustments to Dante."

Dante Players: *Starts writing Will*

I'd recommend waiting and seeing what they actually change on him.

Ya the discourse around this is embarrassing. On here, and on reddit. DE says they will do a slight adjustment to ensure he doesn't become dominant, we don't even know what the change is, and everyone is losing their minds. Like WF players get easily triggered when they hear 'nerf', which still baffles me, but all of these posts are just pathetic.

[Sir-Lorkhan]

il y a 4 minutes, Zaghyr a dit :

Ya the discourse around this is embarrassing. On here, and on reddit. DE says they will do a slight adjustment to ensure he doesn't become dominant, we don't even know what the change is, and everyone is losing their minds. Like WF players get easily triggered when they hear 'nerf', which still baffles me, but all of these posts are just pathetic.

Last time they towned down a frame, it was gutted. So they nerf Dante? Ok. Remove the overguard shared to teammates. Dont forget to also nerf Nezha's new augment that is literally brain dead. Can't be more "automated " and "dominant" than that. After all, a Nezha out dpsing a Saryn or Mesa? Wtf

[Mazifet]

bro chill down they aren't turning him into loki. they are slightly tweaking him to make him more inline with other frames. 

[(PSN)rexis12]

4 minutes ago, Mazifet said:

inline with other frames. 

Yeah, like Revenant. 

[Mazifet]

Just now, (PSN)rexis12 said:

Yeah, like Revenant. 

revenant is a good frame, but the only thing really special about him is his mesmer skin. just makes surviving easier. hes popular for that reason, so people can build towards other things than ehp / shieldgating

[Binket_]

28 minutes ago, Unrealius said:

Did you tried to play him on SP without OP  weapons?(just remember) not everyone have all mods and weapons.

Yes, I always play on Steel Path. Everything is way too god damn frail otherwise.
I could sneeze off of Steel Path and everything vanishes.

As for OP weapons? Dude literally comes with the "Slash-Fic Book of Doom".
You can get half the "good" mods I'm using without even looking for them.
^{Next person to tell me "Lethal Torrent is hard to get" is going to give me the inexplicable urge to pelt them with bricks.}

33 minutes ago, Unrealius said:

Full Dante cast route (for just skills)   1  223(better few times)  234   324     no we playing.   CALCULATE it.     10  - TEN casts  Karl!  Ten. And that on repeat.  Hope you have
1)constant energy gain
2)archon shards for cast  (ofc not everyone have it  that is min max gameplay already, and frame its not ok if you NEED use it to play more freely)
3)hope you have   long   skill duration     you think   45 sec its  alot?     9 cast = 9 sec minimum  so you have   36  open sec to play.
Do you want  stay 1-2 hours  recasting it?
4) hope you have strong fingers.

10 casts? That's weak compared to what most have to do.
You say that like it's some DDR dance pad looking thing, I've done casual walks more complex than that.
Vauban has a kit a lot more complex than this-- but the only reason you don't hear people complaining about it is because they got a big "shiny" called "Vortex" to work with.
^{The rest of his kit goes to rot, go figure.}

Are you insisting players need to nuke rooms in half an A-Press? What Parallel Universe are you from?
^{For clarity, this is a subtle joke. The context will inflict psychic damage to you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpk2tdsPh0A}

 

• Constant Energy Drain is a non-issue. There are quite literally DOZENS of mods to get around this.
  We have Equilibrium, Archon Stretch, Exodia Brave, Energy Nexus, Arcane Energize. 
  Hell, even Xata Invocation. A mod that fits quite nicely on Noctua.
• Assuming you're looking for Casting Speed, there's also Madurai School's "Power Transfer" passive.
  Grants 50% Casting for just swapping back and forth from Operator. You can even throw in a Double-Dash for 40% Ability Strength.
  There's also Speed Drift which is an Exilus should that not be enough. Archon Shards are only ONE way of doing it.
• 45 seconds is more than enough. Especially because you won't always be needing some of those buffs to begin with.
  If you want all of them? A mere 54% or so will get you well over a minute of buffs. Easily attainable by a Continuity and Augur Message.
  Other sources by all means exist, this is just ONE way of doing it.
  Recasting buffs is kinda the whole purpose. If it lasted forever, you may as well make THAT the passive instead.
• People have fingers and they use them. Shocking news, I assume.
  Unless you got the bones of rotting twigs, it's not that bad. If you DO have bones of rotting twigs, I think you have bigger concerns.

48 minutes ago, Unrealius said:

That is a payment to be good.

You can't buy skill. You can't buy experience. You can't buy respect.

You CAN however buy your into places you shouldn't be and get swiftly shown what happens when you do.
Use your brain, not your wallet. Don't be like... I don't know-- Elon Musk.

I'll make this clear in case I wasn't already:
Warframe is not pay-to-win. While you can buy all the Prime Gear and stuff?
You'll still be garbage at the game unless you play it a bit.
Gilded garbage is still garbage, it's just shinier to stink all the more.

If you have to spend money? Do it on the Prime Cosmetics.

58 minutes ago, Unrealius said:

Some kind of Little  On\off   will solve many problems.

HAHAHAHAHAhahaha... You'd think that'd be easy. I did too once upon a time.

I'm still wanting an Auto-Melee toggle.
You know what I got as a reply from DE themselves?
"Just don't Melee, dummy. (:"
Helpful guys, helpful. I'll refer to this next time I have my Melee bug out... again.

Trust me, I've been here since the Pyrus Project. _{Context: https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/The_Pyrus_Project}
There is no chance in hell DE will do something "simple". If they do, look for a Monkey's Paw and you'll see it curl one of it's fingers.

[quxier]

19 minutes ago, Mazifet said:

bro chill down they aren't turning him into loki. they are slightly tweaking him to make him more inline with other frames. 

*loki with his new augment seeing enemies kills each other* Welp, I wouldn't mind that kind of nerfs.

[_Anise_]

2 hours ago, MrDugan said:

I have less than zero faith in you to nerf anything

you got my upvote for this alone, DE are great are making ok stuff unfun or straight up unusable!, example I doubt anyone will EVER subsume eclipse ever again, you need over a 300% str build to make it as good as garuda's passive lol and no one is using it for DR

thats 2 frames in a row I have little to no interest in playing now and I'm not sure their is any point in feeding this to helminth is because the subsume sucks!

2 hours ago, MrDugan said:

the fact that all the rest of the "disruptive" gear and builds will still exist

I litrally seen them nerf stuff while ignoring stuff that does almost the exact same thing!

[trst]

44 minutes ago, Prof-Dante said:

So Revenant, Octavia and all others like them don't deserve nerf because???

If DE even has a criteria for balance at all, these two frames should be nerfed to the ground...there is nothing in this game that should absorb 100% damage all the time, or stay invisible 100% of the time while your abilities do all the damage.

 

it's laughably obvious they only nerf based on players yapping about it, like...and with all due respect, you.

The fact that those frames exist proves that DE doesn't have some strict, if any, balancing criteria. They also have never nerfed due to players "yapping" about something.

Instead the criteria's they've outright demonstrated is to nerf things due to something being unintended, exploited in one way or another, grossly overused, or is detrimental to the game in some other way. And in the case of Revenant him being invulnerable doesn't tick any of those boxes and neither does Octavia since her AFK clearing doesn't instant nuke maps from other players.

Really the only correlation between how strong something is and if it gets nerfs/changes it's because those items become popular. Which that itself is only ever problematic when said popularity reaches the point that it's crowding out other options in those categories. And applying that to Dante DE might finally be willing to read the writing on the wall and is choosing to react immediately to something that'll obviously start crowding out other options instead of their old method of waiting months/years to react to a problem.

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

To all the people that asked for Dante to be nerfed... 

[Numerounius]

Why are still arguing about this ugh. Many things have gotten nerfed in the past that have ended up being just fine afterwards. CHILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2 hours ago, MrDugan said:

And do you know what you did to AOE?  You nerfed it so hard that it's barely worth using any of those weapons.  And people are going to jump down my throat about how it's all still totally viable, but I never see AOE weapons anymore. 

What about the Kuva Nukor that was KING and was never at all touched????????? Huh how come I never see that anymore? Why do we always have to point the finger at the biggest nerfs done and how that is the standard? Can we PLEASE stop pointing the finger at the word nerf and then go on writing paragraphs about how it relates to something?

The fact of the matter is there are multiple ways things can be "Disruptive" or however you want to call it. There isn't a singular best way and that is the beauty of Warframe. I'm sure that DE will create a justification that sits well with many people about the change rather than trying to use it as an excuse to nerf something into the ground leaving him with nothing to use even though people are going to (preemptively) tout this as that's what's happening like you are doing here.

[Waeleto]

6 hours ago, Roble_Viejo said:

The problem is very simple: Players can't opt out from getting Overguard from Dante

The solution is also very simple: Make it an Augment like Styanax and Frost Overguard

How does an augment solve anything ? frost and styanax also give 60K+ overguard to allies the only difference is that they run an augment to get the functionality itself while dante already has it in his base kit, if you remove overguard from his base kit and make it an augment you'll only leave a sore taste since everyone will have to run a band aid augment AGAIN and he'll still be giving overguard

If you make giving allies overguard at all an augment it'll still be problem because he can just run the augment lmao

The only long term solution is address overguard's interaction with stuff like combat discipline/arcane avenger/vex armor and i HOPE dante's own overguard isn't nerfed because of this 

[CrownOfShadows]

The issue with Dante is that he is oppressive and downright godlike in a way we've never seen before at lower levels, but that he falls off hard at high tier levels (300+).

So it's going to be interesting to see how they approach nerfing him, because he definitely needs a nerf on the low end but he kinda needs a buff at the high end, but this gets into a real meta discussion about overgaurd's place in this game. Dante can erase (non-SP) rooms with one dark verse cast, we've never had another frame who could do that with a non-ult or a lot of setup, oh and then there's Tragedy itself...

Also, everyone who whines "DE doesn't want us to have fun" every time they need to adjust something downwards (aka nerf)... please just give it a rest already. Nerfs are necessary for the health of the game, and YES we KNOW, there's a lot of dumb stuff in WF and a lot of stuff that's never been addressed, that doesn't mean they shouldn't care when things get truly out of hand, especially things they just released, and we should care too, because it is really wrecking a lot of the game at the lower levels.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 1 hora, Prof-Dante dijo:

So Revenant, Octavia and all others like them don't deserve nerf because???

If DE even has a criteria for balance at all, these two frames should be nerfed to the ground...there is nothing in this game that should absorb 100% damage all the time, or stay invisible 100% of the time while your abilities do all the damage.

 

it's laughably obvious they only nerf based on players yapping about it, like...and with all due respect, you.

hace 34 minutos, trst dijo:

The fact that those frames exist proves that DE doesn't have some strict, if any, balancing criteria. They also have never nerfed due to players "yapping" about something.

Instead the criteria's they've outright demonstrated is to nerf things due to something being unintended, exploited in one way or another, grossly overused, or is detrimental to the game in some other way. And in the case of Revenant him being invulnerable doesn't tick any of those boxes and neither does Octavia since her AFK clearing doesn't instant nuke maps from other players.

Really the only correlation between how strong something is and if it gets nerfs/changes it's because those items become popular. Which that itself is only ever problematic when said popularity reaches the point that it's crowding out other options in those categories. And applying that to Dante DE might finally be willing to read the writing on the wall and is choosing to react immediately to something that'll obviously start crowding out other options instead of their old method of waiting months/years to react to a problem.

You're comparing warframes that only have one thing with one that has almost everything and that seems pretty childish to me. 

They don't need a nerf because if you take away what they have they become useless, on the other hand Dante trivializes the game because he can do practically everything. To compare nonsense there are always the crybabies on duty, well the nerf is already confirmed, so have a good luck.

 

Edited April 3 by CosoMalvadoNG

[Xenevier]

10 minutes ago, Waeleto said:

How does an augment solve anything ? frost and styanax also give 60K+ overguard to allies the only difference is that they run an augment to get the functionality itself while dante already has it in his base kit, if you remove overguard from his base kit and make it an augment you'll only leave a sore taste since everyone will have to run a band aid augment AGAIN and he'll still be giving overguard

If you make giving allies overguard at all an augment it'll still be problem because he can just run the augment lmao

The only long term solution is address overguard's interaction with stuff like combat discipline/arcane avenger/vex armor and i HOPE dante's own overguard isn't nerfed because of this 

i dont think dante's overguard for himself will be touched, since the goal is to make it less intrussive, so making him have less overguard wont help in that, it will just be a nerf to him. right now DE seems to be looking for a way to make him work well with others, so i dont think they will change how much overguard he gets for himself, at least not drastically

[johnno23]

OP and Balance are terms I see so often but my view is more more about considering that the Balance aspect is to try and prevent the game devolving into a situation where the majority of players flock to the same weapons and frames. A momentary spike for something new is very normal but when you have a situation where a player enters public missions and using Wukong as an example I would be running Rhino and there were 2 wukongs and that was very common a while back.

I had missions where the majority of the time it was wukongs or Kuva Ogris on the field. I have run Dante myself but whilst he is strong and a great support for other team players I personally like other frames more. Is he OP? possibly but not to the point he overshadows other frames. I expect that DE will tweak things but I do not expect to see any major nerfs.

there are so many frames and whilst I would love to see DE give some love to frames that are trailing they are a company that needs to make money on a game that is free. So new frames I assume take precedence over reworking older frames. Many frames in todays game are OP if built right and many frames are lacking and need attention but overall I think Dante is in a good place.

[Numerounius]

Null Star is the closest thing there is that is from recent history but I'd say that is understandable with flying under the radar as it was buffed due to be under-used with leveling not really having tiers of content that makes lesser used strats as useful.

 

I'd say the problem is two-fold for Dante. The first being the DOT statuses having no cap limit. Watching Brozime's Dante-Nezha build concoction and that was the thing that stood out to me.

And the other is Overguard. If DE is going to continue down the rabbit hole of deathless content then they really need to beef up everything rather than having one frame doing to the job of the squad. If people are going to be seeing massive Overguard numbers on themselves with no relationship of where they came from then someone has it way too easy on abilities. There are many frames with this but at least with the current offerings, minus Dante, there is some sort of reactionary way of using said buffs whereas Dante with Overguard you have it on for good. I'd say here the biggest problem is people seeing massive Overguard numbers on themselves and not really doing anything about it.

 

This is a problem with DE going off the deep end with Overguard as their Design philosophy right now. At least for enemies and existing abilities it was bearable since we could piece together how it could work but it doesn't work when you try to give us new ways of using it while at the same time trying to justify the newest and hardest content that Overguard is supposed to be used for. So it either ends up as being way too weak or way too strong based with little middle ground based on that pairing so that is how it ended up being on one of the two wrong ends of the spectrum.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

hace 49 minutos, Mazifet dijo:

revenant is a good frame, but the only thing really special about him is his mesmer skin. just makes surviving easier. hes popular for that reason, so people can build towards other things than ehp / shieldgating

They simply don't reason, that's why they make comparisons with Warframe that only have one thing (Revenant, Octavia, etc.) with Dante who can practically do everything. They are so blinded with a overpower thing that they don't understand how ridiculous they are.

[Stomno]

hace 13 horas, [DE]Megan dijo:

Hello! I'm popping my head in here to provide some dev insight related to this conversation. 

As Dante Unbound nears one full week since its launch, the team has been reading and collecting feedback in all areas, including Dante himself. 

To remind us of our nerfing philosophy, we do not nerf things unless it AUTOMATES PLAY, is DISRUPTIVE to a squad, or is DOMINANT in states.

We are currently happy with how favored Dante is and recognize that nerfs typically have a negative connotation. With that in mind, we are reviewing early stats with an open mind to ensure we don't leave room for disruptive or dominant play styles. Any tweaks done to Dante will be to ensure he is still performing strongly, just not disruptive or dominant. 

 

A shame. I'm not going to use anymore if you nerf it. Test your warframes BEFORE release. Stop doing this to all players.
I play this game since launch and this always was the problem with this game. There're currently bugs in Void Cascade that hasn't been resolved since launch of that mode and other things needs atention but you guys that not play the game nerf things <3

Justo ahora, Stomno dijo:

A shame. I'm not going to use anymore if you nerf it. Test your warframes BEFORE release. Stop doing this to all players.
I play this game since launch and this always was the problem with this game. There're currently bugs in Void Cascade that hasn't been resolved since launch of that mode and other things needs atention but you guys that not play the game nerf things <3

I like people buying Dante and then this happens haha

[ReddyDisco]

Well done, success, good job. asked for a nerf and DE shall deliver. Some people just can't have fun it seems.